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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
RavageurMTL
Lasting Forge Holding Rebel Alliance of New Eden
1
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Posted - 2013.01.04 03:10:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hopefully, I'm in the correct index for this discussion.
I brought this as a petition into Eve game. Was answered back to post here for debate among pilots and catch the CCP's Developers.
Hi,
I was wondering if there was any sort of work or planning in progress for any defenses against players cloaking and camping a system 24h a day for several days ?
There should be a game mechanism for the owner of a system to be able to defend against such neutral or red status, etc, where that mechanism could be by triggering a module to uncloak any player for a specific lenght of time, once or twice a day.
This will give the defending player to be able to scan for the cloaky ship and have the possibility to remove the threath from the system.
What about Cloaking Jammer module fitted on a ship or in a system to prevent any sort of cloacking nearby or within the system.
Cheers, Rav |
Katie Frost
Asgard. Exodus.
120
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Posted - 2013.01.04 03:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
Oh my god... I think you are onto something! Not only is this thread original and very well written/proposed, but your solution is so novel and well just faultless... I say yes to everything the enlightened OP has suggested. CCP should hire this guy immediately!
/sarcasm
Now that you drained my weekly supply of sarcasm, you must be either so new that you missed multitude of threads discussing this exact topic, or you are just plain ignorant.
Please use the forum search function and you will see just how recycled and debated to hell and back your issue and proposed solutions are. |
Tsobai Hashimoto
FATAL Warfare Hopeless Addiction
70
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Posted - 2013.01.04 04:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
[quote=RavageurMTL] Hopefully, I'm in the correct index for this discussion.
I brought this as a petition into Eve game. Was answered back to post here for debate among pilots and catch the CCP's
was this ISD Troll? cuz that GM. punked ya if he said you should start a new threat on the fourms! lol PS: my phone screwed up the quote!
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AFK Cloaker
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
79
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Posted - 2013.01.04 07:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
. |
Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
70
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Posted - 2013.01.04 07:39:00 -
[5] - Quote
How about nullsec pilots try to grow a pair as big as the ones highsec pilots have for flying in space with no warning mechanism to warn them of griefers? |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
383
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Posted - 2013.01.04 08:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
Maire Gheren wrote:How about nullsec pilots try to grow a pair as big as the ones highsec pilots have for flying in space with no warning mechanism to warn them of griefers?
Insinuating that high sec pilots have balls...
lol |
Zoe Panala
Blobcats
93
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Posted - 2013.01.04 15:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:Maire Gheren wrote:How about nullsec pilots try to grow a pair as big as the ones highsec pilots have for flying in space with no warning mechanism to warn them of griefers? Insinuating that high sec pilots have balls... lol
Insinuating Shadow "bring more logis/carriers than they have combat pilots" Cartel's opinion matters... |
Bane Nucleus
The Kairos Syndicate Transmission Lost
283
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Posted - 2013.01.04 15:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
I have never been killed by a cloaked ship, as they cannot fire, tackle, or do much of anything while they are cloaked. If they want to cause you any harm, they have to decloak, which leaves them as vulnerable as any other ship.
I am so smart. Alliance CEO, Diplomat, Recruiter |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
160
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Posted - 2013.01.04 15:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Oh no, this thread again. Is a nightmare |
Ohishi
Apocalypse Reign
1
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Posted - 2013.01.04 16:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
Considering that the 4 main empires have such a module that stops enemies from cloaking in their space, I think that there should be a sovereignty mod that allows null sec alliances to do the same thing. |
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Bane Nucleus
The Kairos Syndicate Transmission Lost
283
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Posted - 2013.01.04 16:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Why should they? Cloaking is harmless. Alliance CEO, Diplomat, Recruiter |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1013
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Posted - 2013.01.04 16:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
@OP
Chew on this awhile. Will save you some time
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=188644
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Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
160
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Posted - 2013.01.04 16:44:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ohishi wrote:Considering that the 4 main empires have such a module that stops enemies from cloaking in their space, I think that there should be a sovereignty mod that allows null sec alliances to do the same thing.
Sure. And onsidering that 4 main empires have CONCORD too why null sec alliances shouldn't have it too against their enemies? So they don't have to bother to stop their afk farming to put some effort in their space devence? So finally this bug will be fixed and finally null sec will be not only 100% safe by real threats but also any simply psycologic/potential threat would be removed.
Glad to see finally someone openly asking to improve high sec game mechanics in null sec :)
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IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
301
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Posted - 2013.01.04 16:47:00 -
[14] - Quote
OP luckily every ship ingame has a cloaking defense. It is actually 100% effective, no cloaked ship can do you any harm what so ever! How awesome is that! complete immunity! Try it out sometime |
Princess Nexxala
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
251
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Posted - 2013.01.04 17:36:00 -
[15] - Quote
What is this I don't even... QCATs is recruiting https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=146180 |
Machiavelli's Nemesis
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
48
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Posted - 2013.01.04 18:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
I think anyone who flies a drake should be made to fit a special module that makes your name flash pink in local so we can all mock you |
Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch The Bloody Ronin Syndicate
344
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Posted - 2013.01.04 20:08:00 -
[17] - Quote
there is way to fight against cloack ships, do not undock. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
1361
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Posted - 2013.01.04 21:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
"Nerf AFK cloaking" thread #OMFGCLOAKEDSHIPSCANTKILLYOUANDONLYEFFECTBOTS. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1064
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Posted - 2013.01.04 21:51:00 -
[19] - Quote
Is the search function broken again?!?!?! Huh... damn thing seems to break every single day.
Every single FRIGGIN' day.
Cuz, there hasn't been an AFK Cloaker thread here in, what--- 2 days? "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." -á --- Sorlac |
Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
1202
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Posted - 2013.01.04 23:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
cloaked ship cant do anything to you, thus dont need to defend against it. |
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Ohishi
Apocalypse Reign
2
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Posted - 2013.01.05 01:24:00 -
[21] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:cloaked ship cant do anything to you, thus dont need to defend against it. Actually, a cloaked ship can scout you and report on your activity, ship class, numbers, movements...A cloaked ship provides the greatest weapon of them all to your enemies, information.
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Kirkwood Ross
AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
29
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Posted - 2013.01.05 04:46:00 -
[22] - Quote
Cloak, Stealth, Invisibility mechanics, etc in most games are terrible and favor those who can use it. Those who cannot use it or do not use it often complain about it. Eve is no exception.
Cloaking Modules should reduce a ship's signature radius by 85% while active. Cloaked ships should also be able to be probed out by combat probes. Most ships would reach the "Unprobable" status and require a prober with max skills and a virtue implant set to get a 100% hit. |
RavageurMTL
Lasting Forge Holding Rebel Alliance of New Eden
1
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Posted - 2013.01.05 07:15:00 -
[23] - Quote
Kirkwood Ross wrote:Cloak, Stealth, Invisibility mechanics, etc in most games are terrible and favor those who can use it. Those who cannot use it or do not use it often complain about it. Eve is no exception.
Cloaking Modules should reduce a ship's signature radius by 85% while active. Cloaked ships should also be able to be probed out by combat probes. Most ships would reach the "Unprobable" status and require a prober with max skills and a virtue implant set to get a 100% hit.
This is what I'm talking about. A way to scan out a cloaked ship. A way to defend against cloacky spies in your system. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
13409
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Posted - 2013.01.05 07:33:00 -
[24] - Quote
RavageurMTL wrote:Kirkwood Ross wrote:Cloak, Stealth, Invisibility mechanics, etc in most games are terrible and favor those who can use it. Those who cannot use it or do not use it often complain about it. Eve is no exception.
Cloaking Modules should reduce a ship's signature radius by 85% while active. Cloaked ships should also be able to be probed out by combat probes. Most ships would reach the "Unprobable" status and require a prober with max skills and a virtue implant set to get a 100% hit. This is what I'm talking about. A way to scan out a cloaked ship. A way to defend against cloacky spies in your system. What are you willing to give up, in order to keep balance?
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Dracvlad
Saints Among Sinners Intrepid Crossing
29
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Posted - 2013.01.05 16:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
First of all for those discounting the threat, its not so much the ship itself but the real threat is whether the ship will be a cyno for a Titan bridge or for a BLOPS fleet, if your stupid enough to take that as being a trival risk then sucks to be you. In terms of an offensive ship a SB can take down a BS if a BS is taking damage in the site, so again it is a risk, same is true of recon ships, if you think otherwise sucks to be you.
First of all I have no issue with cloaky fags, if they engage I kill them, if not I work out when they are really active, we also work on the basis of them being active and fleet up and fit accordingly, risk is always there, you just have to manage it. Another thing is to modify how you run CA's plan to take no damage so when that single SB uncloaks you can tank him and kill him. I had one attack me three times in the same CA and as I knew that he had no backup around I just tanked him and set my drones on him driving him off, a day later he left system, that was in Querious...
In terms of the idea, some time ago I wondered whether having a system wide effect from a Sov module, but the rub was to make it have penalties to use, so it had to be something that made people really think before using it, so I was thinking an immediate 50% reduction in shields of anything in system when it was activated, stations, TCU's, IHUB's, POS's and ships, so it was really only used by people with guts. I thought that was a bit heavy so contemplated having an effect on all resistences for two hours after it was operated as a lessor but still nasty impact of using it. What you do not want to have is people just being able to de-cloak at a whim, but something that people can use in dire need, in other words continious AFK faggotary
Personally I like it how it is, because at the end of the day everytime the system I am currently in got an AFK cloaker I just went out and PvP'd, I thanked one of them for giving me the push to do so and he left about an hour later, was funny. So I understand your frustration, but work around it, have multiple ratting systems if you can.
One problem for you is that these cloaky AFK'rs target people who are renters, they know that if they stop you from operating you will not be able to pay your rent and you will have to leave, if that happens just go and run incursions and then just post every so often how much your earning doing incursions, they will soon go elsewhere... |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
161
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Posted - 2013.01.05 16:47:00 -
[26] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:First of all for those discounting the threat, its not so much the ship itself but the real threat is whether the ship will be a cyno for a Titan bridge or for a BLOPS fleet, if your stupid enough to take that as being a trival risk then sucks to be you. In terms of an offensive ship a SB can take down a BS if a BS is taking damage in the site, so again it is a risk, same is true of recon ships, if you think otherwise sucks to be you.
I suspect here everyone perfectly understand the potential "risk" related to having someone cloacked in a system.
The point is: "is a potential risk, yes, and...?"
In other world: why risk (in this case only potential) should be removed? After all is null space, was not suposed to be a safety farming haven. Currently 0.0 is already too safe, often safer than high-sec, already secured against direct risks, why should be secured also against simply indirect or potential risks?
It's a matter of different mindset toward the game.
Dracvlad wrote: One problem for you is that these cloaky AFK'rs target people who are renters, they know that if they stop you from operating you will not be able to pay your rent and you will have to leave, if that happens just go and run incursions and then just post every so often how much your earning doing incursions, they will soon go elsewhere...
Yes, and...? I suspect this is one of the reason of AFK cloacker. Why is this "wrong" and should be prevented by game mechanics?
And yes, if someone cannot psicologically deal with a quote of potential risk probably shouldn't live in null and move to run incursions in high sec.
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Dracvlad
Saints Among Sinners Intrepid Crossing
29
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Posted - 2013.01.05 17:15:00 -
[27] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Dracvlad wrote:First of all for those discounting the threat, its not so much the ship itself but the real threat is whether the ship will be a cyno for a Titan bridge or for a BLOPS fleet, if your stupid enough to take that as being a trival risk then sucks to be you. In terms of an offensive ship a SB can take down a BS if a BS is taking damage in the site, so again it is a risk, same is true of recon ships, if you think otherwise sucks to be you.
I suspect here everyone perfectly understand the potential "risk" related to having someone cloacked in a system. The point is: "is a potential risk, yes, and...?" In other world: why risk (in this case only potential) should be removed? After all is null space, was not suposed to be a safety farming haven. Currently 0.0 is already too safe, often safer than high-sec, already secured against direct risks, why should be secured also against simply indirect or potential risks? It's a matter of different mindset toward the game.
Well lets put it from the other prespective, what risk does the AFK claoker have for creating a large risk element for those in the system, little to none. I could accuse you of having the same mindset, AFK cloaking is risk free PvP, simple as! Its always been amusing to me that Gank bears are the most risk adverse people in Eve and AFK cloaking is one area where it shows.
For example I loved listening to the whining of the easy mining ship ganking brigade at the buff to the mining ships, but as such little really changed, mainly because most miners fit for yield rather than tank, but at least the miners have an option, now they can tank a skiff and be relatively secure, but most chose not to, but before I could only mine in a ship with the tank of a wet paper bag, so therefore I did not, now if I mine I have a Skiff that is tanked to hell and back, yield comes second to making people work for it, is it wrong for gankers and griefers to have to work for it?
There are certain areas of 0.0 that are very secure, take CFC space, but a lot of 0.0 is not like that, just because Deklin is very secure does not mean all 0.0 is secure!
Sura Sadiva wrote:Dracvlad wrote: One problem for you is that these cloaky AFK'rs target people who are renters, they know that if they stop you from operating you will not be able to pay your rent and you will have to leave, if that happens just go and run incursions and then just post every so often how much your earning doing incursions, they will soon go elsewhere...
Yes, and...? I suspect this is one of the reason of AFK cloacker. Why is this "wrong" and should be prevented by game mechanics? And yes, if someone cannot psicologically deal with a quote of potential risk probably shouldn't live in null and move to run incursions in high sec.
I never said it is wrong, those people are always going to be targetted first as they are locked in and are the easiest target and I suspect that the OP was one of them, my suggestion was to use other income streams and make sure the campers know it. |
Kirkwood Ross
AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
30
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Posted - 2013.01.05 17:51:00 -
[28] - Quote
As apposed to the [b[potential[/b] risk the cloaking ship is in? Like I stated earlier, stealth mechanics in almost all games are terrible and favor those who use them. I love to use my PvP guy to cloak around in a Legion and **** people over. Shut down systems by my mere presence, or force those living there to take extra measures 24/7 to ensure their safety while I can afk and come back and wait out targets. There's no risk for me and I enjoy the sheer impunity of it. Doesn't mean I don't think it's stupid or broken but I will use it because it's stupid powerful.
@Mag's
I'm willing to give up my cloaking Legion's ability to **** around cloaking with impunity to stop other people from doing the same thing to get some balance. It is very very rare for someone to have max probing skills, max skills in a probing ship, and then a full virtue implant set. Doesn't mean they can't just land on top of them and boom they're decloaked but they'll have an idea of where they are and if they use their brain they might be able to catch the ship.
If my idea when through the reverse side of this is. I'm cloaked. A ship appears 3km off me. I know that pilot has billions in implants and max skills. It would want me to pretend that i'm an afk cloaker so I can bait him out and kill him with my squad. It would be a great reversal and comedy gold. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
13411
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Posted - 2013.01.05 18:42:00 -
[29] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:Well lets put it from the other prespective, what risk does the AFK cloaker have for creating a large risk element for those in the system, little to none. I could accuse you of having the same mindset, AFK cloaking is risk free PvP, simple as! Its always been amusing to me that Gank bears are the most risk adverse people in Eve and AFK cloaking is one area where it shows. They have exactly the same risk as the others in local. Even though you may not like it, the fact is while he remains cloaked, he cannot lock you or light a cyno.
Dracvlad wrote:For example I loved listening to the whining of the easy mining ship ganking brigade at the buff to the mining ships, but as such little really changed, mainly because most miners fit for yield rather than tank, but at least the miners have an option, now they can tank a skiff and be relatively secure, but most chose not to, but before I could only mine in a ship with the tank of a wet paper bag, so therefore I did not, now if I mine I have a Skiff that is tanked to hell and back, yield comes second to making people work for it, is it wrong for gankers and griefers to have to work for it?{/quote]But they are having to work for it. If you didn't have the all seeing eye, they wouldn't have the need to try and work to subvert it's intel. The difference is locals intel is guaranteed, whereas the psychological effects from AFKing are not. Dracvlad wrote:There are certain areas of 0.0 that are very secure, take CFC space, but a lot of 0.0 is not like that, just because Deklin is very secure does not mean all 0.0 is secure! One could argue local makes null safer than high sec. At least you know who your enemy is in null. Any nerf to cloaking without a change to local, would mean it becomes far too safe. [quote=Kirkwood Ross]As apposed to the [b[potential[/b] risk the cloaking ship is in? Like I stated earlier, stealth mechanics in almost all games are terrible and favor those who use them. I love to use my PvP guy to cloak around in a Legion and **** people over. Shut down systems by my mere presence, or force those living there to take extra measures 24/7 to ensure their safety while I can afk and come back and wait out targets. There's no risk for me and I enjoy the sheer impunity of it. Doesn't mean I don't think it's stupid or broken but I will use it because it's stupid powerful. @Mag's I'm willing to give up my cloaking Legion's ability to **** around cloaking with impunity to stop other people from doing the same thing to get some balance. It is very very rare for someone to have max probing skills, max skills in a probing ship, and then a full virtue implant set. Doesn't mean they can't just land on top of them and boom they're decloaked but they'll have an idea of where they are and if they use their brain they might be able to catch the ship. If my idea when through the reverse side of this is. I'm cloaked. A ship appears 3km off me. I know that pilot has billions in implants and max skills. It would want me to pretend that i'm an afk cloaker so I can bait him out and kill him with my squad. It would be a great reversal and comedy gold. The problem you are having, is you're not seeing the whole picture. You don't even take local into account, when deciding upon any change. That was the mechanic my question related to.
Answer me this. When someone is AFKing, what mechanic are they using to interact with you?
The fact that you can AFK without a cloak and cause the same psychological effects, should speak volumes. But I have a feeling it's falling on deaf ears.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
72
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Posted - 2013.01.05 18:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:Maire Gheren wrote:How about nullsec pilots try to grow a pair as big as the ones highsec pilots have for flying in space with no warning mechanism to warn them of griefers? Insinuating that high sec pilots have balls... lol More than nullsec pilots who can't cope with not recognizing all the names in local.
This is 0.0 we're talking about. The place that newbies whisper of in hushed tones of terror. And the people who live there can't even defend against seeing a name on a list? |
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