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ISK Sinks - The Rich Man's Curse

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Wreckage	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:04:00 - [1] Maybe it has been said and I just missed it, but I think it deserves being repeated if it was mentioned. ISK Sinks need only be applied in a way to affect the very very rich. This is not a plea from a poor man, I myself am a billionaire so don't think this is some poor bums appeal for mercy. It's only the people with the billions that are creating the problem with the current eve-conomy, and as such it is they(we) who should be burdened with the sinks. If sinks are applied to the poor, say goodbye to those players. Besides it's supposed to be something to help balance the economy for the poor. From a rich persons point of view they see no problem with the economy they can already afford any damn thing they want anyway. Some may ask, why only burden the very rich. Let's put it simply I remember being poor and I'll tell you right now, after becoming a billionaire there isn't too much I worry about anymore. I feel the very rich surely can handle one little burden. After all, the poor basically live hand to mouth. Remember that any of you rich fools? Flame On!
fairimear	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:07:00 - [2] look man there is 3 posts as it is on this. Most of the arguments about agents and crap giving isk are being addressed in the upcoming patch AND YOU KNOW IT. give it a dam rest. untill we can see the affect of the next patch this topic is pointless rabel. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
Mad Muller	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:07:00 - [3] I think this is the 4th isk sink thead in the past 2 days To be serius tho i agree some of the prices on market and escrow lista are a bit over the top.
Wreckage	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:12:00 - [4] Edited by: Wreckage on 23/06/2005 22:14:52 You miss my point. It is becuase of the abundance and long drawn out pages that I posted a new one. Everyone's suggestions for these sinks seem to be ideas that are going to affect the majority of the player base rich and poor equally which will accomplish nothing. Yes I could have posted this on one of those threads but if any of the people who read these forums are like me they stop reading and switch to another thread after the first or second page. I only started a new thread so hopefully I would be heard. Something that won't happen if my post sits at the bottom of page 14 of the other threads on this topic. My bad, just wanted to be heard. Won't happen again unless accompanied by gunfire.
fairimear	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:24:00 - [5] ok even on a seperate subject i would say no cus frankly targeting players who put time in to get what they have is nastie just cus you cba. any way as i said this is a wasted thread and any isk sink discussion even on who they target is a mute point with the patch so near brining in some really expensive stuff. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
MooKids	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:32:00 - [6] This isn't because of Falzone and myself bragging about our billions in chat, is it? -------------------------------- CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity.
High Performance	Posted - 2005.06.23 22:48:00 - [7] Well question is then what should be done that would only affect the rich people and not the poor. I think it would be kind of hard to do something that would only affect the rich. I guess the only solution would be to limit the ways of which one single player or small group could generate isk in vast amounts.
nahtoh	Posted - 2005.06.23 23:03:00 - [8] Originally by: fairimear ok even on a seperate subject i would say no cus frankly targeting players who put time in to get what they have is nastie just cus you cba. You kinda prove his point with this...ISK sinks that don't really effect the already rich but screw the not rich (I would call them poor as its just a game) don't solve anything. But what would the lvl be is the big question? "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
Wrangler	Posted - 2005.06.23 23:11:00 - [9] I am proud to present CCPs newest ISK sink, me! If you transfer all excess money to me you will feel a lot better! [Read the Rules!] - [Email the Moderators]
fairimear	Posted - 2005.06.23 23:27:00 - [10] Edited by: fairimear on 23/06/2005 23:34:05 ok fine. you maybe happy wanting the rich to be burdened. most are not and they have spent time getting what they have to. they all went passed the same isk sinks as the poor now but with alot of grind and effort got hwere they are. the poor can to now. And if you are having a guilt trip on how much isk you have ask 1 of the dev's by forum post to take it all and randomly distribute it between newly created acounts. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
sableye	Posted - 2005.06.23 23:35:00 - [11] Originally by: Wrangler I am proud to present CCPs newest ISK sink, me! If you transfer all excess money to me you will feel a lot better! transferred all I could spare to you
bsspewer	Posted - 2005.06.23 23:50:00 - [12] Originally by: Wrangler I am proud to present CCPs newest ISK sink, me! If you transfer all excess money to me you will feel a lot better! 'sploit!
Miri Tirzan	Posted - 2005.06.24 00:10:00 - [13] This game does not need any ISK sinks! Why the crap would anyone play a game that hurts you for being good. This is the kind of hosed up logic that is keeping several countries economies in the crapper in RL and is not needed in a game. If this game start requiring me to support other players because the other players want it and not because I feel like it. Well, move over gankers, it is time to create a whole new class of needy poor! svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
Wrangler	Posted - 2005.06.24 00:19:00 - [14] Originally by: sableye transferred all I could spare to you Thx.. [Read the Rules!] - [Email the Moderators]
Sergeant Spot	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:12:00 - [15] Originally by: Wreckage Maybe it has been said and I just missed it, but I think it deserves being repeated if it was mentioned. ISK Sinks need only be applied in a way to affect the very very rich. This is not a plea from a poor man, I myself am a billionaire so don't think this is some poor bums appeal for mercy. It's only the people with the billions that are creating the problem with the current eve-conomy, and as such it is they(we) who should be burdened with the sinks. If sinks are applied to the poor, say goodbye to those players. Besides it's supposed to be something to help balance the economy for the poor. From a rich persons point of view they see no problem with the economy they can already afford any damn thing they want anyway. Some may ask, why only burden the very rich. Let's put it simply I remember being poor and I'll tell you right now, after becoming a billionaire there isn't too much I worry about anymore. I feel the very rich surely can handle one little burden. After all, the poor basically live hand to mouth. Remember that any of you rich fools? Flame On! Good points. A point to remember: For an isk sink to really work, it must involve isk being transfered to NPCs. While I'm against simply "taking" isk from anyone, a few more special and high priced items available only from NPCs should help, especially if they are designed to tempt, but not unbalance, the richest players.
ezzle	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:15:00 - [16] Show me one mmo where ISK sinks work.
Darkrydar	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:17:00 - [17] Yeah, progressive socialism 4TW...
Sergeant Spot	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:23:00 - [18] Originally by: Darkrydar Yeah, progressive socialism 4TW... That would be either "taking" isk from rich, and/or transfering it to the poor. Both very bad ideas. But some tempting, but not unbalancing items available only from NPCs would remove some isk from circulation.
Hllaxiu	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:24:00 - [19] I think that the next major expansion should be called "EVE: War on Poverty" We implement a system where there is a progressive tax paid to concord. For every transfer of isk that gives you money, a percentage is taken out. For the top 1% of players, that percentage would be 34% + whatever your alliance and corp set as their tax rate. For the poorest - there would be no tax, and at the end of the month all of the 20% poorest people get the money from the tax split evenly. That is - after CONCORD takes out their modest fees for military operations, including some wars based on questionable incidents and objects that may or may not exist/have happened. (previous post was in jest and any implication about political alignments are WRONG, thank you. )
nahtoh	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:34:00 - [20] Originally by: fairimear Edited by: fairimear on 23/06/2005 23:40:34 Edited by: fairimear on 23/06/2005 23:34:05 ok fine. you maybe happy wanting the rich to be burdened. most are not and they have spent time getting what they have to. they all went passed the same isk sinks as the poor now but with alot of grind and effort got hwere they are. the poor can to now. And if you are having a guilt trip on how much isk you have ask 1 of the dev's by forum post to take it all and randomly distribute it between newly created acounts. AND like i said before. the other posts about there needing to be more isk sinks are rushing on arguments they know will be hit by the next patch like agent whoring dumping isk in and so on. I am far from convinced that ISK sinks should be added, but then again I don't think replacing/buying ships/mods is a isk sink at all you get something from it and for the really good stuff you are buying from players then the ISK is moving not sinking... If they do add more ISK sinks then yes I do belive they should hit the ISK hoarders more than the less ISK flush players simply because they made their pile before the sinks were introduced. Oh and Darkrydar a fair amount of of your corp ***** about lvl4 missions or is that more of I made my pile screw everybody else? "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
Allen Deckard	Posted - 2005.06.24 01:58:00 - [21] I am not rich. But Why would I really care if you are? How does it effect my game play? It doesn't besides maybe you can afford to loose more than I can. annnnnnddddd? So what. Again how does it effect me? If I make something your buyin it right? You got isk right? I want to see more rich fools that will pay 200% over price because they dont want to jump 2 jumps to get it cheeper. I love ya all.
Darkrydar	Posted - 2005.06.24 02:08:00 - [22] Agents and instajumps really perverted this game. Sorry if you havent been around long enough to realise this. Imo, these agents have almost turned Eve away from makes it so great into just another cookie dutter MMOG. They require no interaction and virtualy no risk and net more income than any other activity, espicially solo activites.
H0ot	Posted - 2005.06.24 02:25:00 - [23] Originally by: Darkrydar Imo, these agents have almost turned Eve away from makes it so great into just another cookie dutter MMOG. They require no interaction and virtualy no risk and net more income than any other activity, espicially solo activites. Yup, I remember 2 years ago thinking to myself "Wow, a MMO with no grind.. can't wait to play it" Guess I was wrong.
Cutter John	Posted - 2005.06.24 03:20:00 - [24] The problem is not the super rich people. If i have 100 billion isk, what does that mean? not a whole lot, unless i spend it all at once. Otherwise, that 100 billion is basically just burning a hole in my pocket, doing nothing more than effectively REMOVING money from the game and making isk for everyone else more valuable(Just like hoarding diamonds IRL and dumping them on the market would drop all the prices). No, isk sinks need to apply to all. Certainly not the same rate for all, but there are many ways to insert money sinks than just a tax. My personal favorite way to introduce money sinks would be to remove bpo's altogether and only sell rechargeable bpc's(so you could still research them). 1 bil for a 100 run bs bpc.. each bs costs 10 mil to make, just for licensing fee's. Or creating an operating cost on ships.. crew salaries, fuel, food, whatever.. Make making money cost money. My Idea Thread Give Drones Love!
nahtoh	Posted - 2005.06.24 03:20:00 - [25] Originally by: Darkrydar Agents and instajumps really perverted this game. Sorry if you havent been around long enough to realise this. Imo, these agents have almost turned Eve away from makes it so great into just another cookie dutter MMOG. They require no interaction and virtualy no risk and net more income than any other activity, espicially solo activites. I run lvl 4s and don't make anywhere near the amount the naysayers say you should/can make...a ISK grind is nowhere near as bad as a XP grind Imo... a XP grind you have no choice you have to takepart to compete a ISK grind is a whole other kettle of fish you don't need to if you don't want to... This is just my opinion of course feel free to disagree... Its must keep up mindset that makes lvl4 missions such a contentous subjectand that in its self is not the fault of lvl4 missions... Its just ISK its not items or XP... "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
nahtoh	Posted - 2005.06.24 03:22:00 - [26] Originally by: Cutter John No, isk sinks need to apply to all. Certainly not the same rate for all, but there are many ways to insert money sinks than just a tax. My personal favorite way to introduce money sinks would be to remove bpo's altogether and only sell rechargeable bpc's(so you could still research them). 1 bil for a 100 run bs bpc.. each bs costs 10 mil to make, just for licensing fee's. Or creating an operating cost on ships.. crew salaries, fuel, food, whatever.. Make making money cost money. This the problem I see the haves won't care and the have nots get nailed... "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
Brej Donierik	Posted - 2005.06.24 04:23:00 - [27] Edited by: Brej Donierik on 24/06/2005 04:25:15 Originally by: Cutter John Make making money cost money. Well, they can change all the agent rewards to objects only. You only get RP and faction, and you can turn in the RP for stuff (modules, ships, hopefully not anything manufacturable). No more ISK entering the system. The thing they don't have control over is trying to make people spend their ISK. If the guy doesn't want to spend, he doesn't want to spend, what can you do? Deleting the cash from his wallet will feel unfair; doing that strikes a direct blow to the way MMO's have player retention. You mess with a character's accumulated skills and/or accumulated wealth, forcing something that the player doesn't want, and you lose the player. The only way a sink can be effective is if it's a fun activity. Look at casinos, RL.
Allen Deckard	Posted - 2005.06.24 04:28:00 - [28] Originally by: Cutter John The problem is not the super rich people. If i have 100 billion isk, what does that mean? not a whole lot, unless i spend it all at once. Otherwise, that 100 billion is basically just burning a hole in my pocket, doing nothing more than effectively REMOVING money from the game and making isk for everyone else more valuable(Just like hoarding diamonds IRL and dumping them on the market would drop all the prices). No, isk sinks need to apply to all. Certainly not the same rate for all, but there are many ways to insert money sinks than just a tax. My personal favorite way to introduce money sinks would be to remove bpo's altogether and only sell rechargeable bpc's(so you could still research them). 1 bil for a 100 run bs bpc.. each bs costs 10 mil to make, just for licensing fee's. Or creating an operating cost on ships.. crew salaries, fuel, food, whatever.. Make making money cost money. Well since every isk I have in the game is tied up in bpo's as this is one of the aspects in the game I enjoy can't say I like your idea. I ain't rich by any means
Sweetpain	Posted - 2005.06.24 04:52:00 - [29] the best isk sink in the world, Nice trinkets only the very rich one can buy. While we are at the topic :) Advertising :) A few more of those nice bulletins that are by the gates, one by each station, corps with office in the station could rent space for advertisement inside the station it might be sales or recruitment, beats those thousand cans floating around any day :)
Typherin laidai	Posted - 2005.06.24 06:44:00 - [30] Look I saw someone post something about taking from the rich and giving to the poor ? what a damn good idea.. look heres a final solution to this problem. Typherin Of Loxly(sp) (Or Typherin Hood) all old players please donate ALL your isk to me apart from a few billion.. and I promise that i will donate it evenely to the poor And It means I can start chating even more silly crap within the game... Typherin Hood Typherin hood Roaming through the gates Typherin Hood Typherin Hood What A Lovely man Will he nuke you ship ? or will he say hello ? TYPHERIN TYPHERIN TYPHERIN Arrrrrr I love my idea allready... start donating people !!! !! [Disclaimer] All goods donated to Typherin of Loxley might be impounded should he belive that the previous owner falls under the description of Care or Tard. Originally by: Eris Discordia gives Typherin some loving

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