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Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
53
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Posted - 2013.01.22 14:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
http://www.warpdriveactive.com/2013/01/22/the-monster-dust-514-beta-review/
I wanted to stick this here for EVE folks since there are many out there who are considering giving DUST a whirl. It's a long read, sorry about that. :) Anyway, I'd like to think the things I was looking for in DUST mesh with those of the average EVE player so I tried to look at what DUST brings to the table with that perspective in mind. Enjoy, comment, agree/disagree, share, etc., it's all good.
Oh, and yes I would love to have done this in podcast form, but it wasn't in the cards.
Mods, if you feel the need to move this around to a different section, I give you my permission to do so. 
warp drive active |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
6977
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Posted - 2013.01.22 14:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
FIRST IN A WINTERBLINK THREAD!! <3
Also as much as I like the game currently (and suck at it) I would love it even more if it was made available on PC tbh. And I'm excited to see when they will ramp up the gfx.
/c
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Alice Saki
28329
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Posted - 2013.01.22 14:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
Second?!
What did I win?
Come to OOPE, 99% Troll Resistance |
Whitehound
428
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
Interesting read.
Needs a video.
Inappropriate signature removed. - The Pope, ***, CIA and CCP. |
Cowboy Nuggets
Sardaukar Merc Guild
General Tso's Alliance
17
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:00:00 -
[5] - Quote
Where are the stars? I usually just scroll down to the stars... |
Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
58
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
Chribba wrote:FIRST IN A WINTERBLINK THREAD!! <3
Also as much as I like the game currently (and suck at it) I would love it even more if it was made available on PC tbh. And I'm excited to see when they will ramp up the gfx.
/c
Threads by me are few and far between these days, hey? I too am also curious when and if they'll be able to do anything with the visuals. Unreal engine games are hit and miss that way, sometimes they can look great and other times are unoptimized messes even when handled by really capable devs. It's the platform that hurts it he most I think, a PC version would be something I'd love. :)
Alice Saki wrote:Second?!
What did I win?
A hug* from Chribba.
* May contain nuts.
warp drive active |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
I was playing the game yesterday and really think it needs a lot of changes before being released still.
My impressions are that I still don't have the feeling when playing the game that I am a part of the epic eve universe, the game world still feels disconnected, and if they fix that then that is the main selling point.
And also, CCP really needs to drop all of the Eve modules and skill tree system and overhaul the entire interface to make it more console friendly. Navigating that thing is a nightmare and I know how eve works so I have a head start, I can only imagine how daunting all of it is to a new players who has never played eve before. |
Alexandros Balfros
Liberty Rogues
13
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Seems like a fairly honest review of the game, you point out all the flaws of the game without pulling any punches and i agree, from my experience playing the game its very unpolished and the PS3 doesn't have much left in it anymore, graphically the game is bad even by console standards but again you're working with 6+ year old hardware, the sony content delivery network leaves a LOT to be desired as it can take literally hours to download anything from it, you also pointed out the lack of respawn protection and how long it takes to get back in to the action, literally i have experienced getting killed and then getting killed again before you even finish the fade from black on the respawn when was highly annoying
The tech making it work with a live connection to TQ is i'll agree impressive but sadly tech doesn't mean much to the average console owner who is far more interested in running and gunning, to be fair even the FW stuff will be lost on most of them, all in all i say it was a good "attempt" and it will teach them a lot for the future but without some serious work Dust is a doomed project with a limited lifespan and very little to keep you interested, shame really but PC would have been the far better place to release this game as they could then have atleast fixed the framerate and graphics quality issues |
Eli Green
The Arrow Project
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 15:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
Rebecha Pucontis wrote:I was playing the game yesterday and really think it needs a lot of changes before being released still.
My impressions are that I still don't have the feeling when playing the game that I am a part of the epic eve universe, the game world still feels disconnected, and if they fix that then that is the main selling point.
And also, CCP really needs to drop all of the Eve modules and skill tree system and overhaul the entire interface to make it more console friendly. Navigating that thing is a nightmare and I know how eve works so I have a head start, I can only imagine how daunting all of it is to a new players who has never played eve before.
and what turn it into CoD clone 4593? try again.
wumbo |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
1663
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Posted - 2013.01.22 15:38:00 -
[10] - Quote
Alexandros Balfros wrote:
The tech making it work with a live connection to TQ is i'll agree impressive but sadly tech doesn't mean much to the average console owner who is far more interested in running and gunning, to be fair even the FW stuff will be lost on most of them, all in all i say it was a good "attempt" and it will teach them a lot for the future but without some serious work Dust is a doomed project with a limited lifespan and very little to keep you interested, shame really but PC would have been the far better place to release this game as they could then have atleast fixed the framerate and graphics quality issues
You speak as if it were released and all content present - not just freshly into an open beta phase with barebones content.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |
Othran
Route One
441
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Posted - 2013.01.22 16:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:
You speak as if it were released and all content present - not just freshly into an open beta phase with barebones content.
The salient point you seem to have missed is that CCP are running out of time with Dust. Should have been finished years ago, not towards the end of the lifespan of the PS3.
/me shrugs and ambles off  |
Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
60
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 16:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Alexandros Balfros wrote:
The tech making it work with a live connection to TQ is i'll agree impressive but sadly tech doesn't mean much to the average console owner who is far more interested in running and gunning, to be fair even the FW stuff will be lost on most of them, all in all i say it was a good "attempt" and it will teach them a lot for the future but without some serious work Dust is a doomed project with a limited lifespan and very little to keep you interested, shame really but PC would have been the far better place to release this game as they could then have atleast fixed the framerate and graphics quality issues
You speak as if it were released and all content present - not just freshly into an open beta phase with barebones content.
Indeed, right now it's tied only to a handful of FW systems. When things go fully live and are integrated into nullsec territorial disputes things should get a bit more interesting.
That being said, to the DUST player this is just window dressing on what is basically just a console shooter. The fact that it affects something going on in EVE is cool, but I doubt the average player will see beyond the individual match and the rewards they give.
warp drive active |
Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
78
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Posted - 2013.01.22 16:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Othran wrote:War Kitten wrote:
You speak as if it were released and all content present - not just freshly into an open beta phase with barebones content.
The salient point you seem to have missed is that CCP are running out of time with Dust. Should have been finished years ago, not towards the end of the lifespan of the PS3. /me shrugs and ambles off
OTOH it has improved a lot with each iteration so far |
Jess Maine
Kaesong Kosmonauts
Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
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Posted - 2013.01.22 16:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
I'd like to here some numbers from CCP, such as current amount of active accounts, total online players on average during the week. Thats the only way we'll see if people are actually bothering or if its the same 250 players regurgitating through the queue. |
Stegas Tyrano
GLU CANU
Open Space Consultancy
150
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Posted - 2013.01.22 16:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
Looks like the biggest fixes CCP need to make are sorting out grenade spam out, bunny hopping, and making Orbital Bombardment's more epic. At least IMO.
[PROPOSAL] INGAME ADVERTS FOR PLAYERS |
Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
60
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Posted - 2013.01.22 16:35:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:OTOH it has improved a lot with each iteration so far
It makes sense to quantify this with specifics. They have added new items, tweaked weapon balance and behavior, added new maps, etc. but the core issues with the gameplay that I wrote about are just as bad as the first time I booted the beta up. That's the thing I'm most concerned about going forward.
warp drive active |
Google Voices
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2013.01.22 17:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:Othran wrote:War Kitten wrote:
You speak as if it were released and all content present - not just freshly into an open beta phase with barebones content.
The salient point you seem to have missed is that CCP are running out of time with Dust. Should have been finished years ago, not towards the end of the lifespan of the PS3. /me shrugs and ambles off OTOH it has improved a lot with each iteration so far
Yes, at this rate they may release it in time for the new decade....
I am the voices of Google! Want answers? Learn to read...... |
Othran
Route One
441
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Posted - 2013.01.22 17:59:00 -
[18] - Quote
Winterblink wrote:the core issues with the gameplay that I wrote about are just as bad as the first time I booted the beta up. That's the thing I'm most concerned about going forward.
Disclaimer : I don't really do FPS games now. I did for several years and I ran a few servers in the UK which were full 24/7 so I do understand the mindset.
Everyone I know who's tried Dust and has never tried Eve thinks its garbage.
The main complaint is it takes way too long to work out skills/items/setup. Bunny hopping was one of the better parts of their comments as it took them back a decade so it was fun for a while.
This market genre is cut-throat and Dust doesn't have what it takes to be successful on PS3. The console is nearing end of life (cell cpu production sold last year IIRC) and CCP don't have the time to polish Dust enough.
Should have done it for your core market guys - Eve players who play on PC and MAC. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3379
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Posted - 2013.01.22 18:17:00 -
[19] - Quote
Othran wrote:Winterblink wrote:the core issues with the gameplay that I wrote about are just as bad as the first time I booted the beta up. That's the thing I'm most concerned about going forward.
Disclaimer : I don't really do FPS games now. I did for several years and I ran a few servers in the UK which were full 24/7 so I do understand the mindset. Everyone I know who's tried Dust and has never tried Eve thinks its garbage. The main complaint is it takes way too long to work out skills/items/setup. Bunny hopping was one of the better parts of their comments as it took them back a decade so it was fun for a while. This market genre is cut-throat and Dust doesn't have what it takes to be successful on PS3. The console is nearing end of life (cell cpu production sold last year IIRC) and CCP don't have the time to polish Dust enough. Should have done it for your core market guys - Eve players who play on PC and MAC.
Respectfully Othran, according to the information we have so far it is a relatively trivial matter for CCP to release a version for the PS4. In this respect DUST works more like a PC game than a console game... which is a marked advantage and allows for frequent content updates as well.
Obviously they would take the time to optimize DUST for the capabilities of the newer box, but they will have the specifications for the PS4 to work with long before any of us will.
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Winterblink
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
60
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Posted - 2013.01.22 18:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
Othran wrote:Bunny hopping was one of the better parts of their comments as it took them back a decade so it was fun for a while.
I don't disagree with any particular point of your post, but the bunny hopping thing cracked me up. Reloading is slow as hell and one might storyline that as a result of wearing a pressurized armored dropsuit. But then we can jump around like we're on a trampoline without any impact on landing. It's just off.
warp drive active |
Othran
Route One
442
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Posted - 2013.01.22 19:12:00 -
[21] - Quote
Winterblink wrote:Othran wrote:Bunny hopping was one of the better parts of their comments as it took them back a decade so it was fun for a while. I don't disagree with any particular point of your post, but the bunny hopping thing cracked me up. Reloading is slow as hell and one might storyline that as a result of wearing a pressurized armored dropsuit. But then we can jump around like we're on a trampoline without any impact on landing. It's just off.
People I know say the game reminds them of PS beta (purple guys, I can't remember name) for "bouncing" and the rest is a bit like FPS from 10 years ago.
I don't have any axe to grind here as I'd quite like Dust to work. Even with all these flaws it would have worked but not on a different platform to the "golden goose".
We'll see what we see..... |
Jame Jarl Retief
Murientor Tribe
Defiant Legacy
979
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Posted - 2013.01.22 19:41:00 -
[22] - Quote
It's the same old argument.
Dust has the "hook" that it is linked with EVE. But take a big step back, and picture yourself as a console FPS player who never played EVE, nor ever plans to. What possible meaning would this person attach to a Dust<->Eve link? NONE!
If you doubt me, imagine CCP introduced a link between EVE and WoW, where your WoW daily quests affected FW sovereignty, and EVE players can pay WoW players to raid Molten Core. Would it make you play WoW? Chances of that are slim, right? Would it make you care about EVE, if all you've been playing for the last 8 years is WoW? Again, chances are slim to none. So, what does such a link mean for EVE or WoW? Precisely d***! And yet CCP somehow hopes it'll work for EVE and Dust?
The second thing they did wrong was go with PS3. Yes, there were many reasons to do it. And many reasons NOT to do it on PC - namely the game being F2P and rampant cheating/hacking/aimbotting that would inevitably occur in such a game. See Crimecraft, APB, etc., all shooter MMOs where there's probably more aimbotters than straight players. At least your average console bunny lacks the cranial capacity to find and deploy a program like that, unlike the average PC gamer.
Shooter with complex fittings and skills? Where 90% of other shooters have loadouts that can be modified while a 20 second respawn timer is running down? Actual loss on death, even when death is due to lag or other non-player issues? Yeeeah, that'll go over very well with today's FPS gamer community.
Not to mention the shooter portion itself is...well...outdated! Realize that Dust has to compete for FPS-time with titles like Battlefield 3, which by now is well over a year old now. And that game has stunning graphics and animations, head and shoulders better than Dust's, plus destructible environments, plus many more vehicles, very nice cover in terms of vegetation and particle engines, large number of maps and a solid fan player base going back to series originator BF1942 back in 2002. And of course FPS games are being released like crazy. Case in point, Battlefield 4 is expected late this year.
Look, I don't have an axe to grind with Dust. I don't own a PS3, and I never will, so Dust to me a moot point. But I just don't see it succeeding. I mean, the game just went into Open Beta today. Has anyone noticed? I've seen more commotion for open betas of Vindictus and Dragon's Nest than I've seen for Dust.
Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. Because if I'm right, that's another few years of development time and countless man-hours down the tubes, just like Incarna in its currently ongoing state. Just a total waste. My only hope is that if the game does flop, whoever came up with this brilliant idea isn't allowed to make any more design-related decisions. |
Whitehound
432
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Posted - 2013.01.22 21:59:00 -
[23] - Quote
Jame Jarl Retief wrote:It's the same old argument. ...
Look, I don't have an axe to grind with Dust. I don't own a PS3, and I never will, so Dust to me a moot point. But I just don't see it succeeding. ...
Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. ...
You have successfully turned "EVE is dying" into a "DUST is dying".
Inappropriate signature removed. - The Pope, ***, CIA and CCP. |
Morphisat
Millard Innovation Inc
The 20 Minuters
25
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Posted - 2013.01.22 22:57:00 -
[24] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Jame Jarl Retief wrote:It's the same old argument. ...
Look, I don't have an axe to grind with Dust. I don't own a PS3, and I never will, so Dust to me a moot point. But I just don't see it succeeding. ...
Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. ... You have successfully turned "EVE is dying" into a "DUST is dying".
For Dust to be dying, it first must come to life ! I don't see that happening any time soon.
|
Frozen Eddie Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
42
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Posted - 2013.01.22 23:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
Winterblink wrote:Ruskarn Andedare wrote:OTOH it has improved a lot with each iteration so far It makes sense to quantify this with specifics. They have added new items, tweaked weapon balance and behavior, added new maps, etc. but the core issues with the gameplay that I wrote about are just as bad as the first time I booted the beta up. That's the thing I'm most concerned about going forward.
These are problems a lot of us have brought up in beta, with the few fanboys going "ADAPT OR DIE!" but a lot of people agreeing with. The closed beta has been going on for a year now, and there have been very little improvements on the important things. There have been plenty of small tweaks and new weapons, but the gunplay, core mechanics, and such haven't really been changed much for the better.
If they've done so little in a year, it's hard to imagine they'll magically pull all of this great stuff they hyped out of their ass in the next year. Sadly, DUST really feels like INCARNA to me at this point. Tons of hype and promise, but horrible delivery of the actual product that goes live. |
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
1088
|
Posted - 2013.01.23 05:13:00 -
[26] - Quote
Frozen Eddie Johnson wrote:These are problems a lot of us have brought up in beta, with the few fanboys going "ADAPT OR DIE!" but a lot of people agreeing with. The closed beta has been going on for a year now, and there have been very little improvements on the important things. There have been plenty of small tweaks and new weapons, but the gunplay, core mechanics, and such haven't really been changed much for the better.
If they've done so little in a year, it's hard to imagine they'll magically pull all of this great stuff they hyped out of their ass in the next year. Sadly, DUST really feels like INCARNA to me at this point. Tons of hype and promise, but horrible delivery of the actual product that goes live.
Yes, I definitely remember the early beta playing just like this build!
I do however need to wiggle the network and power cables a bit to induce the horrible lag and weird crashes that kept us from finishing 3/4 of our matches, and for some reason people today seem to think the swarm launcher is supposed to point away from your feet.
This reminds me of some wise advice to programmers; never show prototypes to non-programmers (managers, customers, etc), cause they'll be expecting you to ship that rotten piece of **** after a bit of polishing.
You, the above poster, are that type of a person.
Nyan |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration
Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2258
|
Posted - 2013.01.23 07:27:00 -
[27] - Quote
It lacks "zazz."
It needs more zazz.
zazz.
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Frozen Eddie Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
42
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Posted - 2013.01.23 10:52:00 -
[28] - Quote
Rakshasa Taisab wrote:Frozen Eddie Johnson wrote:These are problems a lot of us have brought up in beta, with the few fanboys going "ADAPT OR DIE!" but a lot of people agreeing with. The closed beta has been going on for a year now, and there have been very little improvements on the important things. There have been plenty of small tweaks and new weapons, but the gunplay, core mechanics, and such haven't really been changed much for the better.
If they've done so little in a year, it's hard to imagine they'll magically pull all of this great stuff they hyped out of their ass in the next year. Sadly, DUST really feels like INCARNA to me at this point. Tons of hype and promise, but horrible delivery of the actual product that goes live. Yes, I definitely remember the early beta playing just like this build! I do however need to wiggle the network and power cables a bit to induce the horrible lag and weird crashes that kept us from finishing 3/4 of our matches, and for some reason people today seem to think the swarm launcher is supposed to point away from your feet. This reminds me of some wise advice to programmers; never show prototypes to non-programmers (managers, customers, etc), cause they'll be expecting you to ship that rotten piece of **** after a bit of polishing. You, the above poster, are that type of a person.
Yes, because network and game stability have anything to do with core gameplay features. Derp. If you could read, you'd see we're talking about game systems that haven't; really changed much not network performance. Beside that, the hit detection/lag is still not particularly good considering the small battle scale + how bad the game looks, but that kind of thing is expected in a beta, and not what people are talking about. |
Alice Saki
28509
|
Posted - 2013.01.23 11:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
Winterblink wrote:Alice Saki wrote:Second?!
What did I win? A hug* from Chribba. * May contain nuts.
Meh Good Enough
Come to OOPE, 99% Troll Resistance |
Optimo Sebiestor
The Society
Calyxes
144
|
Posted - 2013.01.23 11:18:00 -
[30] - Quote
I just got wtfpwnd by getting my car dropped on my head. It made it all worth it. It could be that i was smash drunk after the pub. :P |
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