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Corey Fumimasa
The Advent of Faith
50
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Posted - 2013.01.23 05:19:00 -
[1] - Quote
Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance?
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Black Legion.
1004
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Posted - 2013.01.23 07:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
Strong + active leadership, a critical mass of "core" membership which is active and loyal long term regardless of alliance fortunes, and some element of distinction which aids in their notoriety/recruitment/opportunities.
I'm sure there's more, but it's hard to name a successful alliance without those three elements. "Alekseyev Karrde: mercenary of my heart."-á -Arydanika, Voices from the Void
CSM 4 vet, CSM7 Hero Noir./Noir. Academy Recruiting: www.noirmercs.com |
Commander Ted
Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance
451
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Posted - 2013.01.23 16:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
They all were level 4 mission farming corps in high sec that built up their skills enough to take sov. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec. |
Corey Fumimasa
The Advent of Faith
52
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Posted - 2013.01.23 16:20:00 -
[4] - Quote
Commander Ted wrote:They all were level 4 mission farming corps in high sec that built up their skills enough to take sov. Your idea about separating highsec with lowsec is great. And give massive bonuses to faction kill missions along with massive bonuses for inter-empire trade. That would be a great conflict driver. Conflict pilots at a personal level instead of trying to motivate house cat herds.
As for the lev 4's, do you mean all great alliances or just Test and Goons?
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Meridius
Destructive Influence Northern Coalition.
7
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Posted - 2013.01.23 17:16:00 -
[5] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance?
I'll try to give you the good background for BoB.
In the early days RKK, BNC, EVOL, ATUK (later DICE), and to a certain extent m0o flew and roamed allot together and pretty much dominated every point in Null sec. Stain Alliance would be considered todays "Goons" and they were targeted heavily by these force. If you think PL, Goons, TEST and etc. are a dominating force, you should see how it was in the back then. Because of this close friendship they created an Alliance which most of what I mentioned join in except for ATUK (created its own The Five alliance but later joined BoB under DICE banner) and m0o (decided to stay solo corp). Then later that same group recreated a new alliance calling it Band of Brothers aka BoB and that's how BoB was known to have that dominating force all combined under 1 official banner.
Today that force is now all split-up. 401K has RKK, EVOL. Raiden. has Finfleet and whoever else, and then NC. has DICE.
The BoB days are over that's for sure but the relationship that sprung from it will always last.
Much love and respect to RKK, Evol, BNC and the rest |
Piraal
Noir. Academy Black Legion.
0
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Posted - 2013.01.23 17:30:00 -
[6] - Quote
When it comes to Goons, Test, and even PL the key to their success has been to blue everyone. Blue or make non-invasion pacts with anyone competitive, If you don't have to fight, you don't have to lose. Key to their success. |
Murk Paradox
Dvice Shipyards No Value
243
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Posted - 2013.01.23 17:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Strong + active leadership, a critical mass of "core" membership which is active and loyal long term regardless of alliance fortunes, and some element of distinction which aids in their notoriety/recruitment/opportunities.
I'm sure there's more, but it's hard to name a successful alliance without those three elements.
And poaching. Good headhunting skills is indeed essential. "I say tomato, you say tomaCCP BAN ALL TOMATOES THEY ARE HARASSING ME I WANT TOMATO FREE HIGHSEC."-á -TheGunslinger42 Proud enforcer of the Code, see [url]http://www.minerbumping.com[/url]-á for details. |
DeadDuck
Macabre Votum Northern Coalition.
29
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Posted - 2013.01.23 17:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
The core of the alliance I guess.
All the great alliances in this game had very black moments and still managed to survive:
. PL loosing all their space in Fountain and still managing to reborn, . RZR evacing twice from the north in the midle of a tremendous disaster (D2 collapse and later the NC collapse) and still having the stamina to return . Goons beinng evicted from Syndicate and being chased all across the galaxy . Red Alliance that continue to reinvent them selves and returning . CVA and their quest for a civilized Providence
To name a few.
All the other ones that did not survive, like BOB, The Five, had such an influence in game at certain periods that they earned their place in EVE's game history. Specially BOB... damn I loved to dislike those guys and tbh I think EVE is lacking an alliance like them.
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Charles Case
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
346
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Posted - 2013.01.23 18:08:00 -
[9] - Quote
DeadDuck wrote:
Specially BOB... damn I loved to dislike those guys and tbh I think EVE is lacking an alliance like them.
I agree we should have one alliance where all the long winded egotistical douche nozzles can go and circle jerk about how great and powerful they are.
We keep mittens though. |
Skex Relbore
Space Exploitation Inc Get Off My Lawn
217
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Posted - 2013.01.23 18:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance?
http://themittani.com/features/running-your-empire-part-two-culture
Cultural identity combined with competent leadership. You see that in the long standing high sec organizations such as RVB or EVE-UNI as well or other non SoV holders like Agony Empire. Cultural identity is the glue that binds the social relationships that are required to maintain a successful and vibrant organization. It's the common bond that forms the core of the Esprit de Corps that creates an emotional investment in the membership.
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Ventro69
Manson Family Corcoran State
112
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Posted - 2013.01.24 07:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote: Intrepid crossing
Trololololololol... Ventro69: There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. Some kind of high powered mutant never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.
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Lucy Oreless
Raptus-Regaliter EntroPraetorian Aegis
104
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Posted - 2013.01.24 07:49:00 -
[12] - Quote
Piraal wrote:When it comes to Goons, Test, and even PL the key to their success has been to blue everyone. Blue or make non-invasion pacts with anyone competitive, If you don't have to fight, you don't have to lose. Key to their success.
Lol... you seem a tad bitter There is a few more things to it than blueing everyone... _____________________________________________________________________________________ Do you wanna PVP? Join us -> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=162144 |
BobZumda
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
10
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Posted - 2013.01.24 07:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
Hard work, timing, shared adversity, accidents and, most importantly, luck.
For example: in 2006 no one liked GoonFleet except BOS and maybe some other dudes who had to because BOS did. BoB really didn't like us because of perceived future status (I base this mainly on old DigitalCommunist tripe) or because we were pretty insensitive about smoske or just because we were an easy and tempting target. People like LV piled on because they were just sycophants for the popular kids.
The whole train started because we joined up with some down on their luck French (TCF) and a bunch of Russians no one else liked (Red Alliance). There was a lot of of stuff that happened after, but it's largely immaterial.
The point is, I suppose, that people forging relationships and potentially the next "great alliance" are just observant and jump at opportunities. RedSwarm Federation was the Goonies (the 80s movie, a bunch misfits) of the EVE world because a bunch of overlooked, unlucky, discounted groups got together and worked hard.
Make friends. Learn to recognize positive qualities in other corps or alliances and take notice when someone in your corp or alliance has qualities that stand out. Don't judge someone by whether they have space or not, or if the community thinks they are turds. Find people you like, people who you can live next to and people who are willing to learn and get better with you. you don't have to all be the best of the best and you don't have to win every fight.
Don't assume you have to be beholden to current powerblocs and don't assume those powerblocs will exist forever. You don't have to be friends with the big kids and you don't have to try and fit in. Just do what you want to do and see if it works.
And try and make friends in EuroAsian and ANZAC timezones. That's important for a lot of reasons and you will end up enjoying the accents. |
Charles Case
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
349
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Posted - 2013.01.24 10:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
BobZumda wrote:Hard work, timing, shared adversity, accidents and, most importantly, luck.
For example: in 2006 no one liked GoonFleet except BOS and maybe some other dudes who had to because BOS did. BoB really didn't like us because of perceived future status (I base this mainly on old DigitalCommunist tripe) or because we were pretty insensitive about smoske or just because we were an easy and tempting target. People like LV piled on because they were just sycophants for the popular kids.
The whole train started because we joined up with some down on their luck French (TCF) and a bunch of Russians no one else liked (Red Alliance). There was a lot of of stuff that happened after, but it's largely immaterial.
The point is, I suppose, that people forging relationships and potentially the next "great alliance" are just observant and jump at opportunities. RedSwarm Federation was the Goonies (the 80s movie, a bunch misfits) of the EVE world because a bunch of overlooked, unlucky, discounted groups got together and worked hard.
Make friends. Learn to recognize positive qualities in other corps or alliances and take notice when someone in your corp or alliance has qualities that stand out. Don't judge someone by whether they have space or not, or if the community thinks they are turds. Find people you like, people who you can live next to and people who are willing to learn and get better with you. you don't have to all be the best of the best and you don't have to win every fight.
Don't assume you have to be beholden to current powerblocs and don't assume those powerblocs will exist forever. You don't have to be friends with the big kids and you don't have to try and fit in. Just do what you want to do and see if it works.
And try and make friends in EuroAsian and ANZAC timezones. That's important for a lot of reasons and you will end up enjoying the accents.
Another awesome thing about RedSwarm Federation was that all the major corps spoke different languages. A very small fraction of the Russian players spoke any english and yet we slowly but relentlessly started moving south to the region we had decided would be ours. Goons really respected the Russians. Motherfuckers ride bears! In a much buggier, much laggier, and all around much shittier EVE the Russians were pr0.
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StevieTopSiders
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
92
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Posted - 2013.01.25 05:03:00 -
[15] - Quote
The key to a successful alliance is to tirelessly recruit top=tier posters to keep morale high and to produce excellent spin so that others see you as always winning. |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1363
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Posted - 2013.01.25 05:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
Meridius wrote: The BoB days are over that's for sure but the relationship that sprung from it will always last.
Much love and respect to RKK, Evol, BNC and the rest
Yeah. Considering the poison they were all spitting at eachother on the way out the door I'm pretty sure you have on some rose colored glasses here.
RKK and Evol may have stayed friendly, but Finfleet and several others seem to be pretty frosty. Good communication is ultimately the core of any good alliance. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3284
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Posted - 2013.01.25 06:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
StevieTopSiders wrote:The key to a successful alliance is to tirelessly recruit top=tier posters to keep morale high and to produce excellent spin so that others see you as always winning. Goodposters are always in short supply Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Tinu Moorhsum
Random Events
128
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Posted - 2013.02.20 17:28:00 -
[18] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote: Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups?
The common thread in every decent corp or alliance I've seen in this game are what I call my 3 F's
Focus Funds Fleets
Without Focus (a plan, an identity, organisation and visible leadeship) you're going no where. People can say whatever they want about Goon, for example, but the level of organisation at levels where it matters is impressive.
Funds: Money (or any other appropriate resource) makes a HUGE difference in your capabiliities. The one thing that makes every big alliance in this game different is that they're stinking rich. They can absorb losses, they can wait out a seige, they can pay other people to fight for them (or to stop fighting).
Fleets: Whether it's mining fleets or PVP fleets or whatever, this "F" stands for doing things together. Bonding in the rank-and-file and a sense of working on a common initiative (goes back to Focus) for the good of all (goes back to Funds) is the glue that makes it all work.
The key to Goons recent rise in visibility, getting back to this specific point, however isn't their own doing. I guess in a way it was because they ducked under a rock and hid while the DRF tore the NC a new one and waited to counter attack until the timing was just right. This was very clever although in the process they blamed NC complacence for Goons tactical passive stance and in the process set the scene for people who wanted to stay in "their" space to join Goons (like WIDOT, for example) while alienating the rest and causing a fracturing of any possible block of resistance. It was brilliant and I'm sure from a Goon perspective it looked like cuting off the arm to save the body but either way the NC got in a blender between DRF violence and Goons passiveness with Goons coming out the big winner.
Eventually that will change again. 18 months ago all of EVE thought the DRF had the end game in their hand and now they're scattered and fractured . Every time an coalliion looks too big to beat, someone comes and cuts them back down to size.
T- |
Proletariat Tingtango
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
335
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:27:00 -
[19] - Quote
We may have an outside membership pool to draw from, but we could still be pretty insignificant if our Dear Leaders hadn't managed the thing properly.
The Mittani wrote an article somewhere on empire building. It's honest and straightforward, I just can't find it right now.
The essence of a strong corp or alliance is a group of people who are loyal to each other. The easiest way is to form alliance along cultural lines. This is why TEST and Goons stay solvent, as well as national groups like Pangu or Finfleet. Culture is everything, and a random hodgepodge of players who barely tolerate each-other just so they can increase their internet wang-size usually collapse under pressure. |
Signal11th
The Retirement Club
902
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Posted - 2013.02.22 10:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Strong + active leadership, a critical mass of "core" membership which is active and loyal long term regardless of alliance fortunes, and some element of distinction which aids in their notoriety/recruitment/opportunities.
I'm sure there's more, but it's hard to name a successful alliance without those three elements.
Knee pads and a reacharound are another two. God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!" I came fifth and won a toaster. |
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Dheeradj Nurgle
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
275
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Posted - 2013.02.22 17:25:00 -
[21] - Quote
Piraal wrote:When it comes to Goons, Test, and even PL the key to their success has been to blue everyone. Blue or make non-invasion pacts with anyone competitive, If you don't have to fight, you don't have to lose. Key to their success.
Still biiter obout being hellcamped by the Goons? |
Jensaro Koraka
Serenity Prime Kraken.
23
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Posted - 2013.03.05 12:14:00 -
[22] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance? BoB wasn't an alliance. They were T20's personal mercenaries he hired with T2 BPOs. "Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -H.L. Mencken |
Hemmo Paskiainen
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
407
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Posted - 2013.03.06 11:25:00 -
[23] - Quote
An alliance you can define as a oranasator of corporations. There are 2 types of allainces, democratic ones and dictatorships
1: The democratic ones have leaders from differant corporations where they discuss and decide on democratic ways. 2: The dictatorship ones have a handfull of people often form the same corp (not always in that case they have a binding element example like machoshism or equal lever of high level intelliganzed douchbaggary)
A good allainces is build with stong leadership where the alliance tasks are spread out organized amoung many people. A good 0.0 allaicne is build out of multible strong corporations that have all the coreect elements sorted out properly (activity, tasks, recr, diplo, and FC's).
To have a stong allaicne is crucial that the corps withinin are communicating and have trustwordy command that can preform alliance tasks. (otherwise burn-out happen, afk leadership ect)
Im kinda tierd of typing my bad grammar, ehh meh you get the point. Success is communicating and a very thin line bewteen delegating, controlling, mutal benefits and social interaction. Most these parts have a higher attribute that bypasses all, thats personal gain and greed. Thats why the moongoo has always been a wrong choise. CCP FIX BLACK OPS FFS
[url]http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9679/whatihavedoneineve.jpg[/url] |
KuroVolt
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
29
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Posted - 2013.03.06 12:18:00 -
[24] - Quote
See, when a mommy corp and a daddy corp love eachother very VERY much... |
Carrelle Rouppon
Air Red Alliance
69
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Posted - 2013.03.06 15:55:00 -
[25] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Strong + active leadership, a critical mass of "core" membership which is active and loyal long term regardless of alliance fortunes, and some element of distinction which aids in their notoriety/recruitment/opportunities.
I'm sure there's more, but it's hard to name a successful alliance without those three elements.
Nailed it. Their Leadership give an immense amount of hours to building Corporations and Alliances. Without operations like mine it would be impossible for certain Alliances to conduct a respectable war. There are three basic types of arms deal: white, being legal, black, being illegal, and my personal favorite, gray. |
Arronicus
Vintas Industries Mistakes Were Made.
309
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Posted - 2013.03.08 11:35:00 -
[26] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance?
"Great alliances" "Goons. Test. PL. NC. Wallpaper (WHO?). Get off mylawn. IRC."
You accidentally used the wrong word here. You typed great, and meant to type "large"
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General Windypops
The Littlest Hobos Whores in space
22
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Posted - 2013.03.11 21:58:00 -
[27] - Quote
Legendary forum warriors + nice biscuits, like maybe hobnobs.
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Theangryhobo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
162
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Posted - 2013.03.13 00:15:00 -
[28] - Quote
Arronicus wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance? "Great alliances" "Goons. Test. PL. NC. Wallpaper (WHO?). Get off mylawn. IRC." You accidentally used the wrong word here. You typed great, and meant to type "large"
Same thing in EVE. If everyone is in your alliance, you're the best alliance. . |
Inquisitor Kitchner
Galaxy Punks Executive Outcomes
882
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Posted - 2013.03.13 02:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
Theangryhobo wrote:Arronicus wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance? "Great alliances" "Goons. Test. PL. NC. Wallpaper (WHO?). Get off mylawn. IRC." You accidentally used the wrong word here. You typed great, and meant to type "large" Same thing in EVE. If everyone is in your alliance, you're the best alliance.
Is that why Goonswarm let in all those J4Gs? "If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared." - Niccolo Machiavelli |
Theangryhobo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
162
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Posted - 2013.03.13 02:25:00 -
[30] - Quote
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:Theangryhobo wrote:Arronicus wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:Seems like Goons and Test came to Eve from outside. But what of alliances like PL, RnK, NC, Wallpaper, Intrepid crossing, Get off my lawn, BoB, and Razor? Is there a common thread required for the creation of these groups? Or is it just serendipity and circumstance? "Great alliances" "Goons. Test. PL. NC. Wallpaper (WHO?). Get off mylawn. IRC." You accidentally used the wrong word here. You typed great, and meant to type "large" Same thing in EVE. If everyone is in your alliance, you're the best alliance. Is that why Goonswarm let in all those J4Gs?
We didn't just let them in. They had to, you know, apply first. It's rather complicated. . |
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