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ArthurSlartibartfast
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Posted - 2005.07.06 15:43:00 -
[1]
My torps now do less than one fifth damage... This is totally wrong. Why would anyone "dumb-down" their weapons???
What skills do I need to train now?
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Zhuge Liang
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Posted - 2005.07.06 16:12:00 -
[2]
Missile changes were in the Patch Notes and have been on the forums in this thread for many weeks now.
There are lots of new missile skills you can buy now, try the markets in Caldari Regions such as The Forge, Citadel and Lonetrek.
___________________________
If you find something in need of moderation mail [email protected], we have a fine selection of anti-troll products including the impressive Troll BegoneÖ (89% bleach), and the deadly Supa-XL MKII BanstickÖ. |
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ArthurSlartibartfast
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Posted - 2005.07.06 17:23:00 -
[3]
That does NOT answer my Question. I trained for months to reach the ability to fly a Raven and use Torps. CCP took that away from me and hundreds of other LOYAL players. EVE was fine except for repetitive missions and a need to fight back in safe space without retribution from CC. All else seemed fine, even stability.
At the near imminent release of Star Trek Online MMORPG, this was not a good time for CCP to release a DOWNGRADE.
There are many in the world of Eve that feel the same way I do.
Also, the new skills do NOT mention Torpedoes, only Misiles. Do the creators of Eve consider a Torpedo to be a missile?
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SirSpectre
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Posted - 2005.07.06 17:32:00 -
[4]
These changes were announced months ago. You had plenty of time to hear about it. Missles are now comparable to turrets. Train up the new skills and all will be well. Dont stress over it. Now you know how us turret users feel.
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Morbeus
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Posted - 2005.07.06 17:36:00 -
[5]
I agree with ArthurSlartibartfast.
By the logic of the new missile system a man in a spacesuit would have the explosion from a Purgatory Torpedo pass right over him because he's a small target.
Now accuracy reductions for size on turrets is fair enough but something not takeing damage from an explosion because of it's size is ridiculous.
Take damage away from missiles because of speed fine I can see the reason in that, but size?
Pointless.
Captain of the Firemist
Morbeus |
Alacrity
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Posted - 2005.07.06 17:40:00 -
[6]
I agree we did read the notes but its not just a matter of training up new skills, we have been set back ie; pre patch my arbs were 10.8 ROf now there 12.18 even if i train the new skills it will be lacking even my shield boost seems to be lower. Im not moaning but after spending a lot of time training to use a particular ship this seems like a kick in the you know wheres.
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Terrible Tina
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Posted - 2005.07.06 22:46:00 -
[7]
Yes yes yes we all knew the inevitable was coming but we had no idea how extreme. No one could have prepared me that my torpedoes were in many cases doing 730 points of damage and now doing 40. I also get it that we get to train new skillsą.again. If anyone has noticed these skills do not train fast so weeks and months from now I will finally be back to square one again which was taken away in an instance. Okay itĘs just a game and itĘs only time and money and of course donĘt forget the poor turret people got it before we did I get all that butą..I play Eve to have enjoyment not irritation, I play so that I feel I am getting somewhere. I hate the thought of finally reaching a point and having been set back at the beginning again. The worst part is that I can set aside all of the above but not the trust part. I feel as if CCP will now decide whenever its coffers are low that we need some new skill to train and they donĘt care how many weeks or months we as the paying customers are set back. What if it is the shields next time, or speed or any one of a million other little things that can be taken away just to make us spend more time trying to get that carrot? I have noticed subtle changes too that I donĘt remember anyone mentioning like the power and CPU changes. Many new online games are popping up all over the Internet. The reason we chose Eve was because it was the best online game. In my opinion it just dropped a few notches and I really donĘt see myself continuing on if these extreme changes keep occurring where I am set back to noob levels.
On a positive note I noticed the graphics are much sharper and was amazed by some of the new missions. We now can underline and bold our text so in some respects things just got better.
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Astarte Nosferatu
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Posted - 2005.07.07 13:00:00 -
[8]
Then go play Star Trek Online if you don't like the changes.
Adapt or quit, it's as simple as that.
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Follower of the Blood Revolution.
Sani Sabik. |
ArthurSlartibartfast
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Posted - 2005.07.07 13:45:00 -
[9]
The point here is that CCP took away what we trained for months to attain. Would you like it if your cable provider(or satellite) decided to give you a "new and improved service" but your farvorite networks no longer worked and you had to expend time and resources(like new equipment) to re-attain what they took away?
Think about it, if you can think. Many, if not ALL Caldari players were affected NEGATIVELY by this DOWNGRADE.
With changes like these, the Eve Title EXODUS will likely take on a whole new meaning.
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Everlyn
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Posted - 2005.07.07 13:50:00 -
[10]
I hate reading this ever and ever again, but now my first answer:
It's just a matter of balancing.
Everyone screemed: Oooooo Mega Pulse II do much to much damage. look there is an instantgankgeddon, run, ect...
They nerfed the Mega Pulse so they are like the other large turrets and noone has an advantage ot disadvantage, everything is fine.
Same for Missiles: why was EVERYONE running lvl 4 missions in a Raven and not in a Mega or Temp or whatever?
Because instantgankfrigandanythingelse, they done UBER-Damage against small targets, so this get fixed, everything is fine, is it?
Just think on Cruise Missiles, with them you hav still an nice damage on small fast targets and an really nice range, turret-user don't have anything like this, but you still crying:
"Ooohhooo they nerfed my UBER-Raven i spend 62356 trillion ISK for"
So, plz stop flaming, it's just a matter of balancing, and everything is fine now, just wait for the next nerf...
Everlyn
Brave New World
CEO
German Gaming Community
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Everlyn
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Posted - 2005.07.07 13:52:00 -
[11]
And btw, do you really think they just do it because they hate the evil  caldari and they want every single caldari to quit the game, just to get rid of them?
Everlyn
Brave New World
CEO
German Gaming Community
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LodeArm
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Posted - 2005.07.07 13:54:00 -
[12]
^ ^ Durr
Same trouble with large guns, so its not like your being messed over, just pulled down to the same leavl as us mortal turret users. So come on grow up, cant always have your cake and eat it.
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Morbeus
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Posted - 2005.07.07 14:55:00 -
[13]
Pulled down to the level of turret users? Ridiculous.
I use turrets and missiles and I'm now finding that my missiles are hitting rogue drones for 18 damage instead of the 108 they used to and my turrets can't hit them at all because I'm using medium turrets and they get too close for them.
If missiles needed their damage nerfed wouldn't it have been much simpler and caused much less anger to have just reduces the amount of thermal damage inferno torps do? Or kinetic damage juggernaughts do? damage according to size means that the biggest explosion can't kill the smallest thing and that's not right.
Please CCP put missiles back.
Captain of the Firemist
Morbeus |
Caldorous
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Posted - 2005.07.07 15:59:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Caldorous on 07/07/2005 15:59:39
There is something called irradiance that defines how much energy recieves an object from the radiation of a star. Well this concept can be translated in the missiles too. If an object is smaller, it recieves less energy and the damage dealt is lower. Maybe this can explain why the smaller objects get less damage from explosions of great radius
-----------------------------
2005.03.13 01:11:29combatYour 350mm Railgun I perfectly strikes Asteroid (Veldspar), wrecking for 0.0 damage.
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Caldorous
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Posted - 2005.07.07 16:01:00 -
[15]
Maybe this can explain why the smaller objects get less damage from explosions of great radius.
Sorry for the double post, but the forums dont let me edit the posts
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2005.03.13 01:11:29combatYour 350mm Railgun I perfectly strikes Asteroid (Veldspar), wrecking for 0.0 damage.
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ArthurSlartibartfast
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Posted - 2005.07.07 16:08:00 -
[16]
Everlyn, if you care to investigate, my character is Gallente. I was using a Megathron fitted with very nice turrets. My 425mm Rails were doing over 650 damage at times. I went to the Caldari ships for something a little different. Then the patch happened. Balance?
Not an issue. I will be trying my Mega out again to see if the rumors I've heard about turrets being affected is true.
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Minyamar IIV
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Posted - 2005.07.07 16:11:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Minyamar IIV on 07/07/2005 16:14:37
I play a long Time EVE, have seen a lot of Waepon nervs, but this is a little bit to haevy, i can trash my Raven now.
Have Torps on Level 5 + Torps Spezial and my Torps makes LOL Damage on BS and other Ships now. The range is to low, the skills doesen¦t work realy, or the Info is bugged.........
All in all i¦m a little bit Angry, the Raven is a Ship ,that was at no time easy to fly, you must have best engenering skills,because the Shields needs a lot of Power, and the CAPA is to low, and so you can only make a lot of Damage in short Time, to live a little bit longer. My other BS have not of this Problems, only the Raven. And now you can put the Raven in the Trashcan. Please CCP balance the Missiles new. I will skill all the new Skills, but i thing, this will never compesate all the Changes, it will make the Caldari ships to the worst ships in eve.
And Missiles are Missiles and no Turrets  You cant liken this
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Astarte Nosferatu
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Posted - 2005.07.07 16:36:00 -
[18]
 Originally by: ArthurSlartibartfast
Would you like it if your cable provider(or satellite) decided to give you a "new and improved service" but your farvorite networks no longer worked and you had to expend time and resources(like new equipment) to re-attain what they took away?
Quite funny you use this RL analogy to make a point. I live in Belgium, where starting in September the 2 biggest providers of cable are introducing digital television. A whole bunch of channels will only be available after you buy a decoder that costs about Ē300, channels I have now for 'free'. So I'll have to buy that decoder if I want to watch BBC World for instance, or Discovery channel.
Btw, I have a Caldari character, I use the Raven, I'm 'hurt' by these changes to, but do you hear me complain? No, cause I adapt to the changes instead of whining to reverse them.
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Follower of the Blood Revolution.
Sani Sabik. |
MortyHax
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Posted - 2005.07.07 16:59:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Astarte Nosferatu
Btw, I have a Caldari character, I use the Raven, I'm 'hurt' by these changes to, but do you hear me complain? No, cause I adapt to the changes instead of whining to reverse them.
You cant really compare you haveing an alt caldari character(if that is what u ment) to someone who just is caldari. because now they cant do anything but spend a few months training the new skills hopeing that at the end they will be back to what they had a few days ago.. and if they want to change like use some other race's ships they have to spend months still training up new ship skills gun skills and probably armor skills.. so its really no comparison you haveing a character that is caldari and someone who just is.. i think they have a right to complain but not to expect the complaint to do much.. not a complaint just an observation..
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Bohoba
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Posted - 2005.07.07 17:32:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Everlyn
And btw, do you really think they just do it because they hate the evil caldari and they want every single caldari to quit the game, just to get rid of them?
Yep :) hehehe
Get Into the Game it makes it fun for all |
Mannakin
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Posted - 2005.07.07 19:07:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Mannakin on 07/07/2005 19:11:40
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Uchigatana
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Posted - 2005.07.07 20:17:00 -
[22]
Want to add new skills? I have no problem with this.
Want to create new challenges? I have no problem with this.
Want to ADD to the game? Fine by me.
Unfortunately, what you have done is not ADD to the game, (in my opinion). What you have done is taken away from the players, or at least a good number of them.
Rather than give me new skills to work toward, in order to improve my character's abilities, you have given me new skills that must be trained in order to REGAIN the abilities that I had already spent many many hours to obtain, and which you have taken away.
This is not a positive action. This is a negative action. You have given little. You have taken away much... namely, TIME.
This entire endeavor, from the beginning, revolves around time. TIME is really what you are selling, and when you take from me what I have already paid for, it strikes me as somewhat dishonest. For example, a car dealer doesn't reposess your car while you are making timely payments.
Perhaps you think I am "over reacting" to something that is "just a game". Maybe so. However, in this case it is also a business. As a "customer" of your business, I feel that I have been somewhat cheated.
I don't normally write complaints such as this. When I am not happy with a "supplier", I simply stop buying from them. This is, in fact, what most customers do. I hope you understand that many of your customers will simply quit, without a word.
Where this game is concerned, time is money. I have paid for the months it took to aquire certain skills. Now I find that those skills are no longer what I paid for, however, for another $60.00 or so, (at $15.00 per month), I can buy myself back to where I was just a couple days ago.
Want to put the guns on equal ground with missiles? Fine by me. RAISE THE DAMAGE OF THE GUNS!. I have no problem with this.
For those of you who want to call this "whining", that's also fine by me. I find it more than just a little humorous how people like to WHINE about so called "whiners".
Great job CCP.
Star Trek Online sounds REAL good right now...
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Chidori kun
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Posted - 2005.07.07 21:24:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Uchigatana
(snip)
Great job CCP.
Star Trek Online sounds REAL good right now...
Bye !!
"Are you Living in the real world?" |
Messerschmitt facility
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Posted - 2005.07.07 21:30:00 -
[24]
Can I please have the stuff from whoever leaves?
thanks 
_________________________________
A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking...
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Terrible Tina
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Posted - 2005.07.08 03:05:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Terrible Tina on 08/07/2005 03:06:47
Wow Astarte Nosferatu adapt or quit why thatĘs brilliant! Did you think that up all on your own? Perhaps you could create a policy for world peace next. YouĘre a real genius and I pray to God you donĘt drive an automobile in my neighborhood because I would be scared you would not know the difference between drive and reverse.
I just donĘt understand why we as Caldari canĘt whine and complain a little bit? We were robbed and you know it and you should have a little sympathy. Try to remember back when you were human once and actually cared about anotherĘs pain. Your cable problem sucks and it isnĘt fair and I hope it works out for you.
Maybe it is a matter of balancing as I admit I donĘt use turrets but please try to acknowledge that this was a huge blow for us and that is all we are trying to convey. Morbeus I feel your pain and empathize with you and thank you for your input. Caldorous, interesting scientific explanation. Minyamar you are exactly right. The Raven is a pile of crap now. I fitted my Scorpion with lasers because they do more damage how pathetic. MortyHax you hit the nail on the head an alt does not count and it would take months to change to another ship and let us think for a moment, change to another ship? This takes me back to my original argument which no one has addressed how could we trust CCP ever again. What they call balancing I call NOOBING.
Uchigatanaą.Well said and an excellent argument. Time is what is sold to us and time is what was taken away disguised as balancing. CCP could have easily raised the firepower of guns and I doubt anyone would have complained save for Astarte Nosferatu but you canĘt please everyone. I stupidly paid ahead and now have to try to convince CCP that I should get a refund so I can go elsewhere. Yep I was a moron for paying months in advance and I deserve much flaming for that one. Evil is not the reason they did it, I think we should call it what it really isąąąąąąą.. greed. 
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ArthurSlartibartfast
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Posted - 2005.07.08 03:26:00 -
[26]
The fact that you, Tina, paid months ahead showed a level of trust in CCP. I can understand your anger and symphathize with you.
Thank you for YOUR input on this matter.
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lobo twover
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Posted - 2005.07.08 04:43:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Uchigatana
Want to add new skills? I have no problem with this.
Want to create new challenges? I have no problem with this.
Want to ADD to the game? Fine by me.
Unfortunately, what you have done is not ADD to the game, (in my opinion). What you have done is taken away from the players, or at least a good number of them.
Rather than give me new skills to work toward, in order to improve my character's abilities, you have given me new skills that must be trained in order to REGAIN the abilities that I had already spent many many hours to obtain, and which you have taken away.
This is not a positive action. This is a negative action. You have given little. You have taken away much... namely, TIME.
This entire endeavor, from the beginning, revolves around time. TIME is really what you are selling, and when you take from me what I have already paid for, it strikes me as somewhat dishonest. For example, a car dealer doesn't reposess your car while you are making timely payments.
Perhaps you think I am "over reacting" to something that is "just a game". Maybe so. However, in this case it is also a business. As a "customer" of your business, I feel that I have been somewhat cheated.
I don't normally write complaints such as this. When I am not happy with a "supplier", I simply stop buying from them. This is, in fact, what most customers do. I hope you understand that many of your customers will simply quit, without a word.
Where this game is concerned, time is money. I have paid for the months it took to aquire certain skills. Now I find that those skills are no longer what I paid for, however, for another $60.00 or so, (at $15.00 per month), I can buy myself back to where I was just a couple days ago.
Want to put the guns on equal ground with missiles? Fine by me. RAISE THE DAMAGE OF THE GUNS!. I have no problem with this.
For those of you who want to call this "whining", that's also fine by me. I find it more than just a little humorous how people like to WHINE about so called "whiners".
Great job CCP.
Star Trek Online sounds REAL good right now...
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predorianis
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Posted - 2005.07.08 04:52:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Astarte Nosferatu
Then go play Star Trek Online if you don't like the changes.
Adapt or quit, it's as simple as that.
thats a dumb understatement, i trained also my torp skills to fly a raven, and the months and months ago doesnt aply to me as i play only 2.3 months now
so unless u dont have anything usefull to say go fish in the mean time
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Morbeus
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Posted - 2005.07.08 05:06:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Minyamar IIV
Edited by: Minyamar IIV on 07/07/2005 16:14:37
it will make the Caldari ships to the worst ships in eve.
I have to agree. Caldari ships rely heavily on missiles, some ships using nothing but them.
Gallante arn't too badly hit since they rely on drones like Caldari do missiles.
Minmatar I don't know enough about to judge weather they were badly affected or not.
Amarr probably least hit. They always relyed mostly on turrets more than anything else.
So most Caldari players are probably going to have to A) Fly around in a substandard ship.
B) Get a ship from another race
C) Quit eve until CCP changes missiles back to what they were.
Captain of the Firemist
Morbeus |
Erin Araii
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Posted - 2005.07.08 06:54:00 -
[30]
Originally by: LodeArm
^ ^ Durr
Same trouble with large guns, so its not like your being messed over, just pulled down to the same leavl as us mortal turret users. So come on grow up, cant always have your cake and eat it.
So by your logic, a cruise missile hitting a tank should do the same amount of damage a bullet would do? Make less sense please. Missiles equal devastation, thats the whole point of them.
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