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Standard Belt Frig vs. Sacraledge LOL

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X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.12 20:56:00 - [1] well goes like this. Run to my buddies house at lunch and log in with my sac pilot. we team up for gits and shiggles to head on into some .5 system just cuz it was easy and close on limited time to just blast a few small ships. He used a 3 heavy pulse beam 2/3 arbie heavy launcher setup I was using a 4 heavy beam 2 setup. he dives in with his close range pulse missle combo and I hit from a bit of range. Keeping in mind we got a network setup at his place so we can pilot real time same room and team up. Now I'm blasting away and pop pop pop goe the frigs but he keeps saying I'm missing I'm missing. As he was in close range using heavy pulse 2's and has 10 mill accomplished in his gunner skills. EVERYTHING is at 5 except for traj analasis 4. Target was pianted, target was webbed, was a standar frig. I stop shooting and sit back to watch his screen. Low and behold if he could not hit that webbed/painted standard frig with his tech 2 pulses. so after about 5 minutes of constant misses with his heavy guns and next to no damage with heavy missles and support skills trained to 3 and heavy missle 5, he decides to dock puts on 2 medium pulse 2's on to use small weapons to small ship. thinking that'll do it. I'm still ing belt watching this notarious standard frig and all I can do is nos it. buddy warps back in and locks that standard frig again, webs hims, paints him, and proceeds to unload using one heavy pulse beam and 2 small sized pulse beams(the fastest tracking gun for small laser), and his 3 heavy launchers and I kid you guys not that it took him 20 minutes to bust that frig. I was late returning to work being I was so disgusted that I had to see how long it takes. Any idea why small guns or even medium guns on a painted webbed standard frig don't hit? What is going on with the skills CCP and are they going to be addressed in tomorrows patch? Are all the missle skills bonuses working? Are the missle nerfs affecting the turrets too. Before patch we both could waste frigs in our sacraledges if target was painted and webbed even if it was an inty. Something seems really really fubared. Sorry.
Ohotnik	Posted - 2005.07.12 21:01:00 - [2] something he was not doing right. I can hit belt frigates, intercepters and drones just fine from my Prophecy with tech 1 Heavy Pulses. Just need to web them and stop your ship or make your ship to "Keep the distance" so transversal is low. If you try to orbit around them, you will miss all the time though. Don't get too close ether. If they are too close, even little movement generates high transversal speed. aka (Siroc)
Sentani	Posted - 2005.07.12 21:10:00 - [3] 2 words: Tracking Disruptor
MineallMine	Posted - 2005.07.12 21:24:00 - [4] yup definately a disruptor, ran into one on a mission rat the other day. Couldn't hit a Maller with my Autocannon Wolf until I was bumping him.
Drutort	Posted - 2005.07.12 22:36:00 - [5] you mean to tell me that they didnt say anything and put in disruptors on npcs now? WTF is that? that is messed up its like having npcs all fitted with defenders and not one of your missiles getting a hit mind you that with the new changes they do ** anyway support Idea: QuickInfo** an alternative to ShowInfo my MoBlog
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.13 00:47:00 - [6] I dunno about that. Keep in mind I stayed in belt and kept the frig there and in attention. he docked and came back. I was still closest to frig when he came back and proceeded to web him, paint him, and shoot him. and that is not the only one that did that. He's having all kinds of close call issues with his sacri in lvl 3 missions. keep in mind this is a char with 30 mill SP and very skilled in piloting for missions with just over ten mill in laser gunnery alone and specifically. he still couldn't hit that frig even tho that frig was targeting me at time he warped back in so that so called disrupter on him doesn't totally make sense. Something really doesn't seem right on his ship and that doesn't include that he was using 3 heavy launchers on that ship and doing 10 damage with various missle types even tho that frig was stopped and painted with all new missle skills to lvl 3. telling me disrupter affect heavy missles now too.
Captin Biltmore	Posted - 2005.07.13 01:11:00 - [7] My corp mate lost an apoc to this bug. His setup: 4 megapulse, 4 heavy pulse II, 2 Tracking Computer II, 2 Target Painter II's. He was in a mission with 20 frigs and 10 cruisers. Warped in and locked and painted a cruiser....he couldn't hit it with his heavy pulses. From what I heard Target Painters are bugged. If you are painting a target with a MWD running it either REDUCES the sig radius or has 0 effect. From the sounds of things lately, sounds like it is reducing the sig radius of the target ship if the target has a MWD running. And since NPC's got MWD sig penalty after this patch it's happening to them too. First they blow the sig radius up to the size of a moon, now they reduce it to the size of a gnat. Common........
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.13 01:57:00 - [8] one thing he is finding atm. web a structure or deadspace building and his average hits go up a LOT nice to know that painting a structure has no affect but if you web that non moving structure your damage total go up. CCP your loosing me man. Overall thought the overall playability of the patch was pretty good but man you realy really gotta double check ALL the skills and their bonuses to make sure they apply accordingly as something very very strange is going on. it almost appears that if you use turrets and launchers, some the missle nerf affect is carrying over to the turrets. Something is definitely very very screwy QA manager. How do ya feel about Eve now? everyone make sure to fit webs to melt them pesky high speed structures.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2005.07.13 04:14:00 - [9] I use medium afocal beams w/ultraviolet against belt frigs in Querious, and they work just fine. Must have been a tracking disruptor. -- Want your POS to make money? Call me up. I've designed POSs that make upwards of 50m a day.
Urfin	Posted - 2005.07.13 09:41:00 - [10] Well if it was a tracking ruptor he would see the progress bar, no? Anyway, I'm hearing weird things too concerning NPC, frigs especially. It does look like something's really broken. _____________________ Heatsink - Ship efficiency calculation proggie

Slithereen	Posted - 2005.07.13 11:06:00 - [11] You're orbiting close to a target frig. Don't. Fly in a straight line away from the frig. Let it follow you. Shoot. You minimize transversal velocity if you do this. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Seraph Demon	Posted - 2005.07.13 12:19:00 - [12] well my experiences so far with my named T1 target painter on 0.3 serpentis frigate rats has been nothing but exemplary I have a geddon with 7 megapulse, 1 tracking enhancer II, and 1 PWNAGE painter, engaging at 15-50 km (changing crystals to suit range) I regularly get light/normal hits without the painter, and with it they're normal/excellent. Maybe the T2 painter is bugged?
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.13 15:26:00 - [13] he was using pwnage painter as well. and after he refit the small guns and rewarped to me he was 15 out and the frig was orbiting me. Even at 15 out he was miss miss miss. and since when does a WEBBED AND PAINTED standard frig not get hit with small energy pulse beams which are the fastest tracking small energy gun with multi in and gun ship braught to optimal for multi and stopped sitting still. he couldn't even hit it when he was sitting still and the thing was WEBBED and PAINTED. It seriously took him 20 minutes to kill that frig. I could get my beams to hit it, he was screwed. the only real difference is I do not have any launchers on my sac. I use 4 beams 2 nos. I too have seen great results with painters and LARGE guns but this was small and medium guns which should have ripped apart that frig by itself let alone the 3 heavy missles per volley smacking the taste out it's mouth. Watched him run lvl 3's all night in his sacraledge and he finished many with hull damage and he was using two T2 medium rippers. ON A SAC for lvl 3's with uber skills for it. something is not right with it.
Funa's Sister	Posted - 2005.07.13 16:20:00 - [14] I have run into the same problem with webbing/painting Sansha frigs as they approach. I was using 125mm IIs with a Harpy and was tearing them apart. I put those same guns (literally) on my Raven to overcome some of the missle changes and couldn't hit to save my life. The Sansha frig was webbed/painted on it's approach and then began orbiting within 100m of my optimal. I know it was orbiting, but with the web, the transversal velocity was VERY low. Personally, I believe there was some kind of sign change (+)(-) on the sig radius for web and scram that is screwing things up. Also, there seems to have either been some Stealth Nerf Bat use, or Cold War changed some of the fundamental programing and adjustments will be made.
BIRDofPREY	Posted - 2005.07.13 16:27:00 - [15] Originally by: Funa's Sister I have run into the same problem with webbing/painting Sansha frigs as they approach. I was using 125mm IIs with a Harpy and was tearing them apart. I put those same guns (literally) on my Raven to overcome some of the missle changes and couldn't hit to save my life. The Sansha frig was webbed/painted on it's approach and then began orbiting within 100m of my optimal. I know it was orbiting, but with the web, the transversal velocity was VERY low. Personally, I believe there was some kind of sign change (+)(-) on the sig radius for web and scram that is screwing things up. Also, there seems to have either been some Stealth Nerf Bat use, or Cold War changed some of the fundamental programing and adjustments will be made. In an attempt to save my Raven from complete nerfing, I put 2 tech II 650's on for cruiser damage - they were for the most part, a pair of empty slots. But I thought that maybe Tech II rails would do a better job. No such luck. they were no better than the 650's. I've not tried to use painters or webbers. They would gimp my shield tank, so I avoid them. Still can't figure out why my ship couldn't lock my corp mates Wolf. It just wouldn't do it... Dead in space and no ecm or sensor damping... I also have a problem with rockets at the moment. I am well within range of my skills, they will be hitting for damage, then abruptly stop and simply disappear at the target. This was a problem before and after the Wednesday Patch. Your 650mm Artillery Cannon I perfectly strikes Serpentis Guard, wrecking for 340.0 damage
Funa's Sister	Posted - 2005.07.13 20:53:00 - [16] I'm going to check the Bug Reports and Q&A, but with what everyone is saying: tracking for turrets is buggy (mostly hybrids and small lasers I have noticed), missle damage varying so wildly (though I think Tomb answered that one), and most importantly the randomness of it all; it seems there has been some core patch issues that need to be tweaked. I think the focus for Cold War was getting it online smoothly, and less time was available to adjust and re-check the values ( i.e. tracking speed changes, sig radius conflictions, etc) of the changes.....I'm not gonna tell the Dev's how to do their jobs, but it WOULD be nice to hit frigs with frig guns..... I just downloaded the hotfix, let's see how it goes.
Bob Smackalof	Posted - 2005.07.13 21:34:00 - [17] Very surprising , i can hit the normal frigs with mega pulses with only a web on them, and btw, ym gunnery skills are crap. -------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------- (\_/) (O.o) (> <) Bunny says Hi.


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