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Mr Raine
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Posted - 2005.07.15 11:45:00 -
[61]
yes i am whoring this topic,
what about ecm jammer strength/range implants also. for the other caldri boat. ?
why not. ????.. another thing that has been left out i wonder,
raine,
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Drommy
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Posted - 2005.07.15 11:47:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Seramis
Originally by: Drommy AND!.... turret users damage is cut even more. ever heard of transversal velocity? WELL I HAVE! u only have to worry about sig radious and speed. turret users have to think about transversal aswell
Stop talking ****. If u fire with 425mm at a ceptor 100km away u will hit, and u will kill him with 1 volley. And your have all the tech II stuff for ages now, tech II launchers are in game for how long? 1 week? less? And where are the tech II damage mods? and where are other support mods like Tracking computer/enhancer for gun users? I can tell you, if i fire a torpedo/cruise missile at a ceptor 100km away approaching to me in direct line i will hit with damage like 10 - 30hitpoints, if you do the same with your 425mm guns the ceptor is dead, i tried this with 1400mm Howitzer and i needed 2 shots (i tried to activate all 5 turrets, but after the 2nd the ceptor was already dead).
an eagle couldnt even hit my assault most of the time at 50km let alone a cepter trying to keep the transversal high. and how many cepters u seen attack a battle ship at 100km range so dont start flaming me till u know what ur going on about. and actually missiles are tons better now. just cos u fdont have the 'i win button' against smaller ships anymore. _______________________________________________
A good leader takes their people where they want to go A great leader takes their people not where they necessarily want to go, but ought too. |
ShadowlordUK
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Posted - 2005.07.15 12:53:00 -
[63]
Originally by: yourmama45
Originally by: Venture
It will eventually be fixed. Until then get in to your Inty/HAC and have some fun until they fix the missile problem.
...Unless its a crow/cerberus.
Would just like to point out that a friend of mine is still happily solo'ing level 4 missions after the patch in a cerberus without any real problems...
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Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 12:54:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Seramis
Originally by: Atina Palada Previos was writen by me!
400 torps to kill 4 frigs. And the real problem is not a frig the real problem is cruisers. It doesent matter what you fire cruises or torps. Time to kill one cruiser is like time to kill BS's. This is realy stupid ( every non caldary BS's will do this 5 time faster ). In PvP all frig and cruisers will never use Mwd and in that case cruisers will be realy undestructable for Raven pilots. Dont mention for HAC.
I hit Cruisers up to 600damage with torpedos, Cerberus eats cruisers like before the patch, but now it eats them on very long distance too.
And you hit them for 600 damage consistently? The only time I get those hits are when the NPC decides to (stupidly) MWD to me.
My average hits are about 120 damage. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Thor Darkwing
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:09:00 -
[65]
Oh my god! i just fired 1500 large projectils with my 1400mm on a frig and didn't even hit it!! i takes like 100% more time then to kill a bs.
get some perspective before you whine....
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Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:15:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Thor Darkwing Oh my god! i just fired 1500 large projectils with my 1400mm on a frig and didn't even hit it!! i takes like 100% more time then to kill a bs.
get some perspective before you whine....
And what range was this at?...
Turret users can kill frigs at long ranges...missile users can't do it at any range at all. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Thor Darkwing
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:22:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Vilserx
Originally by: Thor Darkwing Oh my god! i just fired 1500 large projectils with my 1400mm on a frig and didn't even hit it!! i takes like 100% more time then to kill a bs.
get some perspective before you whine....
And what range was this at?...
Turret users can kill frigs at long ranges...missile users can't do it at any range at all.
my point is taht large wapons isn't ment to kill frigs (or smaller cruisers for that mather) and all classes have free anti-frig weapon: drones baby, drones.
and fast frigs that can actually cause you some trouble is quite hard to hit even at huge ranges with the 1400. the small slow ones you can hit you don't even need to kill most of the times:p
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Haros
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:28:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Drommy Edited by: Drommy on 15/07/2005 09:04:50 jesus stop wineing u ever seen my 425 rails kill cepters? i think not. and apart from anything else, if u turned ur attention to the other battleships, which is what battleships are suposed to do, ull see u now do more damage to them cos uve got dmg bonus skills and stuff now, PLUS there's no dmg lag which u always used to ***** about. the fact that u can still hit cepters is unreal so stop wineing and welcome to the world when u have SUPPORT to take the smaller stuff
wow i didnt know b i t c h was frowed upon as a sware word
These is the kind of post i love. It so happens that I use 425s on my mega and yes i have killed ceptors with them. With 2 tracking comps u can kill ceptors at 30k+ even if they are orbiting someone. U dont know what the capabilities of ur own guns are n yet u come here to post about missile capabilities. |
Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:33:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Thor Darkwing
Originally by: Vilserx
Originally by: Thor Darkwing Oh my god! i just fired 1500 large projectils with my 1400mm on a frig and didn't even hit it!! i takes like 100% more time then to kill a bs.
get some perspective before you whine....
And what range was this at?...
Turret users can kill frigs at long ranges...missile users can't do it at any range at all.
my point is taht large wapons isn't ment to kill frigs (or smaller cruisers for that mather) and all classes have free anti-frig weapon: drones baby, drones.
and fast frigs that can actually cause you some trouble is quite hard to hit even at huge ranges with the 1400. the small slow ones you can hit you don't even need to kill most of the times:p
And my point is proven by your second paragraph.
Whilst guns won't take down frigs at close ranges, they have the potential to fry them at longer ranges - missiles don't have that potential. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Stuart85
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Posted - 2005.07.15 13:42:00 -
[70]
Yep, I can't believe people are still debating this. Missile users have had their ability to hit smaller targets nerfed AT ALL RANGES. Whereas gun users can still operate EFFECTIVELY at longer ranges. This really is a massive disadvantage. Now it wouldn't be a problem if it was balanced by making the Raven the best anti-battleship platform...
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Grey Area
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:02:00 -
[71]
To all those (turret) users who are whining so hard that other (missile) users are whining so hard...
From memory, there was mucho whining done on forums to the tune of "OMG the Raven is SO overpowered I'm gonna cancel all my squillion accounts if you don't nerf it".
And you know what? You were right. The Raven WAS overpowered. I'll admit right now that it could stroll into any level 4 mission, pick targets and kick arse. The nerf was required.
But it's gone too far...so many people complained about so many different factors of the Raven's uber-ness, that CCP chose to nerf them ALL. Stop telling us to train the skills, use drones, fit target painters...we are doing all that already, and we are learning very quickly, and in some cases in a very expensive way, that we are now flying the weakest battleship in the game.
Should Torps be able to hit frigates? No. Should a Battleship be able to swat a frigate like a fly...possibly. Should a frigate be able to orbit a battleship all day with no fear of being harmed? No. And as someone said, frigates actually aren't the problem, it's cruisers...we have weapons that seem to hit for random damage on them, and no one class of weapon that will give us an acceptably rapid kill.
Turret users say their weapons have ALWAYS been random...true, but;
1. Not random as in terms of "150 points down to 25"...even medium turrets can wrecking hit for 500+ 2. You've always complained that our consistent damage was one of our advantages...now we have lost that along with everything else!
Lastly, consider that with so many individual threads on "whinging about the missile nerf", you might have to consider that there IS actually something wrong. Even if not, we're just using the method you originally used to get us in this position in the first place.
Call it Karma. ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * ========================================= |
wilson 2shoes
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:05:00 -
[72]
Edited by: wilson 2shoes on 15/07/2005 14:11:25 Edited by: wilson 2shoes on 15/07/2005 14:11:14 s
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Mr Raine
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:16:00 -
[73]
heh, ,, i am the die hard caldri user u speak of,
i have caldri,, frig, cruser, bs, lvl 5.. i have jamming skills at lvl4 and the one that determines the jamming strength is lvl5. i also have standard, heavy, and seige missiles lvl5. rapid lauch will be lvl5 tommorrow.
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Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:21:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Grey Area Edited by: Grey Area on 15/07/2005 14:06:16*snip* But it's gone too far...so many people complained about so many different factors of the Raven's uber-ness, that CCP chose to nerf them ALL. Stop telling us to train the skills, use drones, fit target painters...we are doing all that already, and we are learning very quickly, and in some cases in a very expensive way, that we are now flying the weakest battleship in the game.*snip*
Good post.
Whilst missiles can work well as a secondary weapon on turret ships, it doesn't seem to work the other way around.
Only a webber seems to increase drone and gun damage on frigs to a satisfactory level, but then that gimps our supposed purpose - i.e. long range combat with cruise missiles etc.
However, missiles on turret ships don't require a webber or a painter to use effectively on frigates. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Grey Area
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:29:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Vilserx
Whilst missiles can work well as a secondary weapon on turret ships, it doesn't seem to work the other way around.
I know some Minmatars who would argue with you.
I think you'll find missiles USED to work well as a secondary, for all the reasons that turret users used to complain about them...guaranteed damage, the "fire and forget" nature and their immunity to turret jamming etc.
With the new changes, I have heard just as many posts from secondary missile users who are disappointed, and that's notwithstanding the new skills they will have to train for what is for them, an ancillary weapon. ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * ========================================= |
Rick Dentill
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:35:00 -
[76]
I think it is funny that people are saying caldari ships have been ruined by the missile changes. MY one complaint is not having my ninja kessie anymore.
However I flew a ton of missions in my ferox last night and have rediscovered the joys of guns and drones. My tactics are certainly different. No more bulldog charges into the centre of 30+ rat frigates but a mixture of lasers (yep you heard right) assault launchers and drones ate up all oppositon, infact Only a bunch of drones caused me problems. a pair of really fast ones close up with scrammblers, so I got my own drones. It also only took a few minutes to "adapt" to this new kit so stop complaining already!
_______
Save me Jebus!
http://x-universe.kiwi.nu/dd.php |
Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:39:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Grey Area
Originally by: Vilserx
Whilst missiles can work well as a secondary weapon on turret ships, it doesn't seem to work the other way around.
I know some Minmatars who would argue with you.
I think you'll find missiles USED to work well as a secondary, for all the reasons that turret users used to complain about them...guaranteed damage, the "fire and forget" nature and their immunity to turret jamming etc.
With the new changes, I have heard just as many posts from secondary missile users who are disappointed, and that's notwithstanding the new skills they will have to train for what is for them, an ancillary weapon.
That's possible.
My reasoning was that turret users could fit 2 assault launchers on their ships and deal with frigs easily, without losing much damage output. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:42:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Rick Dentill I think it is funny that people are saying caldari ships have been ruined by the missile changes. MY one complaint is not having my ninja kessie anymore.
However I flew a ton of missions in my ferox last night and have rediscovered the joys of guns and drones. My tactics are certainly different. No more bulldog charges into the centre of 30+ rat frigates but a mixture of lasers (yep you heard right) assault launchers and drones ate up all oppositon, infact Only a bunch of drones caused me problems. a pair of really fast ones close up with scrammblers, so I got my own drones. It also only took a few minutes to "adapt" to this new kit so stop complaining already!
Ferox is overkill for dealing with frigates.
It's a Battlecruiser, not a Destroyer, which is what you are using it as. It's normal missile setup would be with 5 Heavy Launchers, not 5 Assaults.
It's like saying my Raven easily kills cruisers...which it can do if I fit it with 6 Heavy Launchers, but that's not its purpose. ---------------------------
VSX EVE Design |
Mr Raine
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Posted - 2005.07.15 14:58:00 -
[79]
ps... i am tempted not to stop complaining until i see t2 balistic mods on the market, end of story rant all you want, check my history and previos posts, bar today i dont complain on these forums and always adapt. and that i have, but give us the tools to use the modules correcty and i will be happy
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