well Humor me, i dont sit around this forum all day


What are the reasons?

well Humor me, i dont sit around this forum all day


What are the reasons?

This system has many draw backs...


You have your system open to cynos so anyone can come in if they want to, and since using this mod will cost the same if not more a month then the cyno jammer most alliances wont spam it

IT also gives time for cloakys to leave the system.. if they are really around.


IM telling you its not reasonable to have someone come into a system and cloak and then go to work, that isnt risk vs reward at all. Thats ZERO Risk for untold amount of economic damage.

If the best thing you can come back at me with is "well local lets you see them" then your not reading.

But you also have local giving the local economy zero risk, as regarding PvP vulnerability.

Short of a blob overwhelming the system, your miners and ratters are never at any risk.

You misrepresent the cloaked vessel causing this damage, when it is in fact the stalemate between both sides.

It is a failure of objectivity to not place an equal amount of blame on the pilots hiding from combat, enabled by the same local that tells the hunting pilots that they are present to be found.

The solution requires a sacrifice from both sides, not just one.

This system has many draw backs...


You have your system open to cynos so anyone can come in if they want to, and since using this mod will cost the same if not more a month then the cyno jammer most alliances wont spam it

IT also gives time for cloakys to leave the system.. if they are really around.


IM telling you its not reasonable to have someone come into a system and cloak and then go to work, that isnt risk vs reward at all. Thats ZERO Risk for untold amount of economic damage.

If the best thing you can come back at me with is "well local lets you see them" then your not reading.

And giving up your ability to cyno jam a system/ Giving the cloaky a huge amount of time to leave the system ahead of time/ Making this cost around a billion a month to jam the system Isnt giving enough up?

IM telling you its not reasonable to have someone come into a system and cloak and then go to work, that isnt risk vs reward at all. Thats ZERO Risk for untold amount of economic damage.

If the best thing you can come back at me with is "well local lets you see them" then your not reading.

And giving up your ability to cyno jam a system/ Giving the cloaky a huge amount of time to leave the system ahead of time/ Making this cost around a billion a month to jam the system Isnt giving enough up?

I will say 1 thing tho, you atleast offer Constructive Feedback <3

And giving up your ability to cyno jam a system/ Giving the cloaky a huge amount of time to leave the system ahead of time/ Making this cost around a billion a month to jam the system Isnt giving enough up?

I will say 1 thing tho, you atleast offer Constructive Feedback <3

Whether the blob comes in by a titan bridge or the regular gate, nothing short of this blob of ships can effectively threaten the PvE pilots.

They can get safe before the first hostile gets on grid, every time.

Your system will give them the ability to clear the system of all hostiles, effectively restoring operation to the economy.

Stalemate over, winner PvE defenders.

they are quite trivial costs. and if the cloaker is forced to leave, why isnt there a way to force the PvE player to leave?

I started put this in another thread but i thought it would be better for everyone to see it and offer Constructive feedback

i just really hate this AFK cloaky aspect.. I have no problem with people raiding supply lines and causing problems but logging in and going to work does none of these objectives other then to shutdown a system for No risk to the cloaky pilot

I see your point, but you dont think the alliance that owns and is entrenched in that system/region should have a slight advantage?

And Again, it wouldnt be such a problem if people didnt abuse the mechanic. If someone is at there computer and wants to sit in a system cloaked it really doesnt bother me.

Its these people who think its a legit Tactic to cloak in a system and then go to work.. your not even playing the game and this is what i want gone..

The only reason people hate on that is because normal humans dont want to sit in the same system cloaked for 12 hours a day every day, its boring. so thats why people log in and cloak and go to bed etc etc.

I see your point, but you dont think the alliance that owns and is entrenched in that system/region should have a slight advantage?

And Again, it wouldnt be such a problem if people didnt abuse the mechanic. If someone is at there computer and wants to sit in a system cloaked it really doesnt bother me.

Its these people who think its a legit Tactic to cloak in a system and then go to work.. your not even playing the game and this is what i want gone..

The only reason people hate on that is because normal humans dont want to sit in the same system cloaked for 12 hours a day every day, its boring. so thats why people log in and cloak and go to bed etc etc.

You do have a way to force the pvers to leave, Take the space... They wont be ratting if you take that space

i also believe cloaking should not be undetectable, it just shouldn't be blatantly obvious when they are around (for one, they are cloaked). personally i mixture of nerfing local and cloaks together is my desired outcome.

Not just stare at our prey in the goldfish bowl that a POS is so reminiscent of.

If that isnt enough to give up then i really have no idea what to tell you

I would Even go far enough to say...


the mod is 1billion isk a month in sov cost... The upgrade is quite big and 500mill

You can only have 2 of them per region AND You cant have a cyno beacon or Jump Bridge anchored in the same system as the cloak jammer.


So now, you forcing people to hand light cynos AND They have to use the stargate to get there...

If that isnt enough to give up then i really have no idea what to tell you

I see your point, but you dont think the alliance that owns and is entrenched in that system/region should have a slight advantage?

The difference with the Forever MWD Inty/Thrasher with a hard to scan down setup is.. You can just point your D-Scan towards them and watch.

But atleast you have the ability To scan them down/watch them on D-scan... And you know if they are active because they will start looking for something to gank vs the system we have now where you can cloaky camp without even being at the computer

Also honestly 1b a month for the mod isnt that bad for 0.0 alliances


And with the changes to no JB or Cyno beacon, you can cloaky the fk out of the systems around it to your hearts content and **** all the ratters moving to and fro

so your saying the only way to kill people in 0.0 is cloaky?

No

so your saying the only way to kill people in 0.0 is cloaky?

No

if ur PvP capable why dnt u draw the cloaker out and shoot him?

are u so alone u have no friends that can back u up as well? arent u in an alliance or something?

It's not that the average pilot is unwilling or unable to PvP, it's that this is not the accepted response. If you don't have enough to form at least a small fleet for defense, along with approval of your leadership, your hands are pretty much tied.
[,,.]
Fighting back outside of a few isolated incidents is difficult when accepted practice is to avoid.

Really? And is an eve mechanic issue or is a nullbrear mindset?

Then explain me: why when I enter an enemy FW home system local they UN-dock to chase me away or to prevent any my activity there instead of docking scared?

Why I can fly, as I do, in 0.0 and ratting or doing anomalies in YOUR system where everyone is hostile to me and I dunno the local and you cannot rat and do anomalies in YOUR OWN systems if there's a neutral in local? In the systems you're suposed to "own".

I want a Docking Jammer. It's an anchorable device like bubbles, that prevents nullbears from docking once activated. Also works for POSes, their bots would just bounce off the shields like they had no password.

The mindset will automatically subscribe to the mechanic, since it dictates the path of least effort required.
When is the last time someone deliberately overpaid for groceries, or fuel for their car?
I am not talking about buying better quality, just adding money that was not required.

You need to raise the bar, AKA change the game mechanic, if you expect players to change how they play.

I know how it works, and how this come mostly from group/corporation/alliance directives more than individuals mindests.
But the problem here is that what is asked in this thread as in 100 others is to change the game mechanics to fit even more these indifiduals or groups mindset, to totally remove ANY risk from null, eve only a simple chance for something different to happen occasionally and definitivaly consolidate the stagnant safe area that is became in the last years.

I have to call bullshit on that statement.

What is clearly being asked for time and time again, is some realistic and workable option for active players to actively use as a potential counter. Not an "I win" button. Although in the case of the cloaking device and mechanics as it is, the activation of the cloak is more often than not an I win button. It's absolutely stunning the arguments from people about the need for "risk" while doing so from the side of the cloaked player. That is the player who is in fact the one who is more often than not, getting away with risk free game play. If you can even use the word play or player, as that would indicate some input and activity from the person which we all know is often not the case.

L33t pvpers arguing for the absolute need for risk while sitting 100% safe behind their cloak... until they decide to head out for the day leaving their character completely unattended but still 100% safe. Say it... you know you want too. EVE is harsh. HTFU! What a crock of ****. .

L33t pvpers arguing for the absolute need for risk while sitting 100% safe behind their cloak... until they decide to head out for the day leaving their character completely unattended but still 100% safe. Say it... you know you want too. EVE is harsh. HTFU!

What a crock of ****.

.

What is clearly being asked for time and time again, is some realistic and workable option for active players to actively use as a potential counter. Not an "I win" button.

And how can someone counter your docking or hiding behind a POS shield? Who created the stallmate? Do we have a way to know if you're docked AFK or not? Do we've some kind of fantasy device allowing us to force you out of the POS or to undock? Do we cry for this to be implemented? Then why not a new dock timeout that after, let's say, 1 hours automatically eject you from the station?

There's nothing bad in wanting to a system or a region, but this have to come from residents effort. If one wants coming from premade mechanics there's high sec.

a one-sided argument

You guys act like cloaks are the only way to do anything in 0.0...

Maybe that's why i'm frustrated with the cloaking mechanic? They are there, they can hurt me but there's nothing I can do to them but on their terms except use the same lame arse mechanic in their space...

again, the only response you have is i must be a bear.... No not at all. I rat a few hours a month at most and most of the time its running a plex and not sanctum ratting.


again you still think, that the only way to stop people from making billions of isk is cloakies.. and im telling you thats not true... Go camp them into a station with a fleet... put up gate camps between systems.. Put up small bubbled and bomb the **** out of people like pizza have been doing.


But no you wont even think about doing any of the 9000 ways to kill people beside cloakys. its just gotta be a cloakies because all of these ways somehow involve other people comming to kill you and thats what scares you.

So many times it's been said... you agree to pvp when you undock. Yet there's one bazaar exception to that rule and that's a cloaking device that can be fitted with next to no training on anything from a disposable rookie ship to an expensive killing machine.... And there in lays the main issue. There's no way to tell and that gives them a real advantage with requirements of almost no training or investment or risk assuming you aren't flying what you can't afford to loose.

Games flourish with activity. Games die with inactivity. Hell, if it was public how many people online were alts this game probably would die. Human nature.

Not even in the same zipcode as your computer and still effecting people in the game i believe is broken.

Not even in the same zipcode as your computer and still effecting people in the game i believe is broken.

Please tell me exactly how a player who isn't at the computer is doing anything to you or your operations


Hint: he isn't. He is by definition incapable of having any effect on what you're up to.

If you think "but theres a risk..." and choose to not do something, then that's on you. Choosing to dock/pos up is a choice, it's a valid one too - if you think there's a risk you can't face, or don't want to right now, it's perfectly reasonable to 'get safe' instead. However, you seem unwilling to accept your own actions, and are asking CCP to let you have your cake and eat it too.

Just go back to highsec, little bear.

Yup again, the only thing you can come back with is, You must be a carebear.


So much constructive feedback...


IF you are honestly going to sit there and say having 2 systems you cant cloakie in a region max... Assuming the have the mod in and active, is overpowered... i have no words.

You must be the person doing the camping or your delusional.

Its not just this idea but almost every idea EVER with cloaks and somehow making them detectable has been shot down. Is it because they are truly bad ideas? yea sure some of em are pretty bad.. But alot of them are more then fair.. you people just hate on them because your the ones doing the camping..


"OMG THESE BEARS WANT TO MAKE IT SO I MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO CLOAKY CAMP 24/7 IN 2 SYSTEMS IN A REGION WITH 50 SYSTEMS OMFG OVERPOWERED"

I feel in a Region your alliance owns, its your space and as such i think it almost every way you should have the homefield advantage.


So i dont think people comming into an alliances space should be on even ground. Now granted we already have advantages such as cyno beacons and jump bridges.. i will concede this.

But i feel that alliances need an IRON grip over the systems they own and pay for.

you believe that both Attacker and defender should be even, sorta like it is now.. its a stalemate.

I do believe its fair for a system or 2 in a region have the ability to be cloak jammed as long as the alliance is willing to pay a good amount for it and they have a trade off for something.. in this case they are trading off the ability to cyno jam the system and the ability to have a JB and/or cyno beacon in the system. along with a good amount of isk per month.. this is all for the ability to stop cloaks.. Nothing else. Its not stopping a 50 man fleet from camping the system its not stoping people from camping the ways in and out, all it does is stop people from cloaking.

The mod would be put outside the shields just like a cyno jammer and can be incapped if someone really wanted to do it.

You said the one and only way to attack ratters income is to cloaky camp them...


so im going to ask you why cant you take a 20man gang and just camp the system and force them to stop ratting.. why do you focus on the cloakies being the only way to stop ratters

Iyou turn it on and after 30 mins it deactivates all cloaks within the system and they cannot be reactivated till the mod is turned off.