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goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
186
   |
Posted - 2013.02.09 15:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
Having run Incursions for over a year I can now say that they are no longer better ISK that running LVL-4 missions.
When I first started doing Incursions I would:
1. Move my ships and the necessary item to the nearest active Incursion system. (30 minutes to 2 hours)
2. Wait for my friends to arrive. (never could tell)
3. Start a fleet that would toil on till we ran out of online members. (4 to 8 hours)
4. Then log off and the following day start up with a fleet the same friends and do it again till the Incursion Mom site is done.
This would net me about 100 mil an hour for my time online.
Lately I have been doing the same thing but different.
1. Move to Incursion.(30min to 2 hours)
2. Start or get into fleet. Watch fleet grow from VG to AS to HQ
3. See all communities get scared that the other community is going to do the MOM.
4. See MOM get completed
5. See Mail for incursion completed
6. See Local explode
7. Move again.
Time from start to finish, 6 hours, and total earned was 300 mil give or take.
Same time invested in LVL4 missions netted me 390 mil in bounties and Mission rewards, plus 375 mil in loot, not to mention the standings from completing 3 storylines.
Total gains from missions 765milion ISK, as well as two 2% and one 8% Amarr Standings Boost.
I guess this is more a statement that a question. So letGÇÖs add a question Anyone else getting tired of the never ending space convoy to earn less ISK for more work.
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
Scott Webb
Scott Webb Corp
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
Hi Goldiee, totally agreed matey. We need the FUN and BANTER back, EVE is not a job and if it is the pay sucks :) |
Kranyoldlady
European Nuthouse
10
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
goldiiee wrote:Having run Incursions for over a year I can now say that they are no longer better ISK that running LVL-4 missions.
When I first started doing Incursions I would:
1. Move my ships and the necessary item to the nearest active Incursion system. (30 minutes to 2 hours)
2. Wait for my friends to arrive. (never could tell)
3. Start a fleet that would toil on till we ran out of online members. (4 to 8 hours)
4. Then log off and the following day start up with a fleet the same friends and do it again till the Incursion Mom site is done.
This would net me about 100 mil an hour for my time online.
Lately I have been doing the same thing but different.
1. Move to Incursion.(30min to 2 hours)
2. Start or get into fleet. Watch fleet grow from VG to AS to HQ
3. See all communities get scared that the other community is going to do the MOM.
4. See MOM get completed
5. See Mail for incursion completed
6. See Local explode
7. Move again.
Time from start to finish, 6 hours, and total earned was 300 mil give or take.
Same time invested in LVL4 missions netted me 390 mil in bounties and Mission rewards, plus 375 mil in loot, not to mention the standings from completing 3 storylines.
Total gains from missions 765milion ISK, as well as two 2% and one 8% Amarr Standings Boost.
I guess this is more a statement that a question. So letGÇÖs add a question Anyone else getting tired of the never ending space convoy to earn less ISK for more work.
The first part of your post is not valid anymore due to e-peen and ego farming all around these days.
Before the e-peen and ego farming there was something called an agreement, this was between armor and shields, now we have to much groups and to much ego running around so a new agreement is not possible anymore hence no one gets to make isk like they did.
So yes i agree, and also im afraid this will continue till the ego's are putt down again and people realize that no one can tell someone else how to play even in high sec. |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
598
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
You do realize all this added moving around is directly attributed to your ISN don't you? When there was an agreement to keep up the Incursion until withdraw amongst all the HI SEC communities returns were greater. Now your reaping what you sowed lol
Ripard Teg-á for CSM 8 |
goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
189
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:You do realize all this added moving around is directly attributed to your ISN don't you? When there was an agreement to keep up the Incursion until withdraw amongst all the HI SEC communities returns were greater. Now your reaping what you sowed lol
Yeah I totally agree, and know what caused this, It has me so wound up I can't even trust myself to get on comms for fear of losing what little composure I have left.
I also Know that it is not JUST ISN, this is happening wether ISN is doing an HQ fleet or not.
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
Situation: Normal
1123
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
Kranyoldlady wrote:The first part of your post is not valid anymore due to e-peen and ego farming all around these days.
I think that is why the first part of her post says :
Quote:When I first started doing Incursions I would:
|
Kranyoldlady
European Nuthouse
10
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:You do realize all this added moving around is directly attributed to your ISN don't you? When there was an agreement to keep up the Incursion until withdraw amongst all the HI SEC communities returns were greater. Now your reaping what you sowed lol
Its not my ISN, for 1 thing and secondly i cant tell ISN what to do, like i cant tell you to write something that actually helps on the forums
:) |
goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
189
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
I don't think I need to defend myself, but anyways when comms goes nuts with MOM,MOM,MOM,MOM I am always the first to say 'NO not yet, lets try make some of the ISK so we can do something other than f1, f1, f1, f1, f1 ...
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
189
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 16:59:00 -
[9] - Quote
My daughter just made a suggestion, we (the Incursion FC's) war dec each other, the last Incirsion FC standings get to chose when the MOM site gets done and by whom for a period of 45 days then we do it again.
The idea was just crazy enough that I wanted to pass it on.
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
Hamatitio
Aperture Harmonics
K162
94
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 17:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
You used to make 100 mil / hour running incursions.
You now make 50 mil / hour running incursions.
You just made 127 mil / hour running missions.
127 mil > 100 mil an hour.
It doesn't seem to be a problem with incursions as they are now, if you made more isk / hour with missions before what I assume was the VG nerf.
To add something constructive to this, get more friends and don't wait in line for pubbie fleets? |
goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
189
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 17:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
Hamatitio wrote:You used to make 100 mil / hour running incursions.
You now make 50 mil / hour running incursions.
You just made 127 mil / hour running missions.
127 mil > 100 mil an hour.
It doesn't seem to be a problem with incursions as they are now, if you made more isk / hour with missions before what I assume was the VG nerf.
To add something constructive to this, get more friends and don't wait in line for pubbie fleets?
I dont run with pub fleets, and my actual ISK per hour when in Fleet wether I am FC or not is closer to 140 than 100, but as an average over time including tavel and form up I am saying 100 mil/h
My OP was more to point out that even though I thouroughly enjoy the content, the current e-peen makes it more of an annoyance to attempt than the ISK is worth.
Knowing that I can log in and create a VG fleet with 10k DPS within minutes still doesn't motivate, as it just seems to escalate to HQ and MOM everytime. If not by us, they by another group concerned that someone else might do it.
On a sidenote: After the VG nerf we dropped to 60 mil/h then min/max'ed to 80 mil/h, then CCP 'fixed' them and we got back to 110 mil/h assaults at 130, HQ's between 130/h to 150/h. (Average FC with mixed fleet comp)
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
Sae Eto
State War Academy
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 20:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
PUG raiding drama. Great. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
Situation: Normal
1123
|
Posted - 2013.02.09 23:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
So is there a purpose, beyond just being annoying? (which is a valid tactic in much of EVE). I mean ending the incursion ends it for both the shield and armor groups, causing everyone to have to move. |
Nadia Gallen
Advanced Engineering and Research Division
8
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 07:28:00 -
[14] - Quote
As Goldiee explained..
Paranoia, is a powerfull ally... or something..
People are affraid that they dont get the MOM kill, and can brag that they killed a mothership. But mostly I think it is just ego's getting in the way.
Personally I dont mind just having them open so we can get back to the core of things, making isk. |
Annunaki soldier
Segmentum Solar
Nulli Legio
66
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 09:52:00 -
[15] - Quote
its all actually.. incursion community fault. They started a race when it comes to mom. And the funny part was people laughing about being able to pop mom first. As as darth mention there was an agreement before that some communities just broke and make fun of it. Now there shouldn't be crying out at all. All they have to do is gather and make a new one , and this time actually follow it
Ride hard, live with passion-á |
goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
190
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 10:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
Probally trying to put a fire out with gasoline here but ISN has done one mom in the last month, could be wrong, memory is the second thing to go.
The agreement was flawed, and all considerations for amendment were discarded due to poor impulse control, and fear.
I don't know why I keep trying to prevent the ganks and greifing, perhaps they are right, it is better to sit back and watch it all burn.
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
599
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 11:32:00 -
[17] - Quote
goldiiee wrote:
The agreement was flawed,
Well all agreements are flawed in the sandbox we defecates in in because it is imposible to include everyone... I accept that & understand your PoV... it was alot more stable then the old 4 hour MOM kills but less so then the1-2 day MOMs we see now.
When Incursions first started armour had a social advantage in the MOM fleets believe it or not due to early organization but farmers were able to forge the MOM takedown agreements after the flawed invincible MOM site that & since then shield fleets took precedence & the Escalation nerf REALLY put armour fleets at a GREAT disadvantage [ efff U CCP for not seeing that & I hate you for it :'( and will forever be a bitter vet because of it ]
Only way I see a great shakeup for Incursions now is if a new pirate Incursion is started TBH because agrueing over current Sansha sites is a meta gamebest left forthose null lords on the CSMwhom don't give ashiteabout Incursions especially now that the Incursion communities have been decimated
& yes I'm a lil drunk & bitter posting right now at almost 4am but my heart is in the right place: IMHO INCURSIONS NEED A SHAKEUP SOON BEFORETHEY BECOME WHAT HAPPENED TO FW and numbers take a second& final nose dive unless we get a lil help like FW did with a FW CSM
Ripard Teg-á for CSM 8 |
Lipbite
Express Hauler
607
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 14:23:00 -
[18] - Quote
ISN appearance made TVP much more effective - fleets complete sites literally 3-4 times faster now. I like it. As for chaotic mom popping and lowered income - it's relatively simple:
1) unite *all* communities to queue mom popping and
2) for me incursion fleets are fun and until L4 will be re-created I won't return to them no matter what. |
Thur Barbek
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 23:25:00 -
[19] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:You do realize all this added moving around is directly attributed to your ISN don't you? When there was an agreement to keep up the Incursion until withdraw amongst all the HI SEC communities returns were greater. Now you'er reaping what you sowed lol
You realize that DIN started most of it right? And their "agreement" was to never let ISN get a mom site, it rotated between TVP and DIN.
seems fair |
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
43
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 07:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Would be nice if ALL communities can agree to not run MOM sites until its in withdraw, but when it is then its fair game. No rotation business, there are too many communities for that. How you get everyone to agree and adhere to that I have no idea. Probably impossible.
Or CCP can just make the mom not appear until its withdrawing, and make withdraw take 2-3 times as long as it does now. Then we get longer incursions and less traveling, then a mad dash at the end to pop mom. It kills the roleplay reason of clearing out incursions as fast as possible to 'vanquish evil sansha and restore hisec to its proper glory!' But the players don't seem to care about all that. |
Annunaki soldier
Segmentum Solar
Nulli Legio
66
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 08:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
Unezka Turigahl wrote:Would be nice if ALL communities can agree to not run MOM sites until its in withdraw, but when it is then its fair game. No rotation business, there are too many communities for that. How you get everyone to agree and adhere to that I have no idea. Probably impossible.
Or CCP can just make the mom not appear until its withdrawing, and make withdraw take 2-3 times as long as it does now. Then we get longer incursions and less traveling, then a mad dash at the end to pop mom. It kills the roleplay reason of clearing out incursions as fast as possible to 'vanquish evil sansha and restore hisec to its proper glory!' But the players don't seem to care about all that.
not going to happen. Too much of an ego inside this game's players. Love the incursion community about a year ago though
Ride hard, live with passion-á |
Lag Amplifier
Antigamers INC
7
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 11:49:00 -
[22] - Quote
I would love to see incursions run for more of their natural life. Some people run incursions purely for isk, other people do it because that's what they enjoy. But I'm sure everyone can agree that moving Incursions as much as everyone has isn't recently isn't fun.
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SkyMarshaller
SkyMarshaller Corp
13
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 10:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
It amuses me when I see a post appear about incursions, that it inevitably turns into an anti-ISN rant. C'mon guys that is almost as tiresome as the constant travelling the OP was pointing out.
I wish people would actually read what the OP stated, because several valid points were made. Unfortunately, I can see no end in sight or a solution for this dilemma.
I too find the constant travel tiresome, but as someone else said this will seemingly continue until the ego-factor is removed from the equation. The only way I can deal with my dislike of all the travelling is to "rotate" my EvE time between several different focuses. That is a real shame, as incursions re-invigorated my passion for the game - don't ever forget that's what this is.
If someone can come up with a simple answer for this problem, then you deserve to be called a genius. |
Franceen Qua
Unleet Industries LLC
Lunar Industries Partnership
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 07:20:00 -
[24] - Quote
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/33089879.jpg
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
202
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 03:44:00 -
[25] - Quote
that is pretty much my conclusion. for the most part I did enjoy the community, but if I log in every few days when I have time to play and have to go 20 jumps (yea yea HTFU 20 jumps pansy) and hopefully there is a fleet up... it just kills it for me. I'd rather ship spin and forum warrior.
now if i was multiboxing a vg sized fleet (or maybe more)... missions wouldn't be a consideration and of course I'd move around for incursions. ~6 hours and every account is plexed, another few hours and heaps and heaps of isk that I don't think I could possibly spend... (personal super carrier fleet!?) |
March rabbit
player corp n1
536
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 17:04:00 -
[26] - Quote
Unezka Turigahl wrote:Or CCP can just make the mom not appear until its withdrawing, and make withdraw take 2-3 times as long as it does now. Then we get longer incursions and less traveling, then a mad dash at the end to pop mom. It kills the roleplay reason of clearing out incursions as fast as possible to 'vanquish evil sansha and restore hisec to its proper glory!' But the players don't seem to care about all that.
trolling aside: is there any reasons CCP should intervene?
You make less ISK than lvl4s? Great! Some people will run away. Those who stay will have more. Supply&Demand at work.
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goldiiee
Tax and War Haven
204
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 17:27:00 -
[27] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Unezka Turigahl wrote:Or CCP can just make the mom not appear until its withdrawing, and make withdraw take 2-3 times as long as it does now. Then we get longer incursions and less traveling, then a mad dash at the end to pop mom. It kills the roleplay reason of clearing out incursions as fast as possible to 'vanquish evil sansha and restore hisec to its proper glory!' But the players don't seem to care about all that. trolling aside: is there any reasons CCP should intervene? You make less ISK than lvl4s? Great! Some people will run away. Those who stay will have more. Supply&Demand at work.
No CCp should not 'Step in' I made the post more to point out the Non ISK farming portion of Incursions.
After reading several other forum threads calling for a stop to ISK faucets, and primarily pointing out Incursion runners as the biggest ISK faucet of them all, I felt that some posts pertaining to true Incursions Isk rates was appropriate.
As an afterthought; I agree that Incursion Runners have probably drove up the cost of Machariels, Nightmares, and Vindicators but I don't think the Exploration Toons are complaining, as far as that goes I feel confident that most of the ISK from Incursions is primarily sunk back into Incursion ships, modules, ammo, and PLEX. (less the ocasional PVP ship I lose)
Reason and logic never wins over Stubborn and Convinced-á (But-áI still try..) |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
613
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 16:30:00 -
[28] - Quote
Well it looks like we're going to soon have a incursionless weekend with the lastone in withdraw now
Ripard Teg-á for CSM 8 |
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