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Hi/Low Fantasy vs. Sci-Fi

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Arduemont Tempest Legion 1207	Posted - 2013.02.11 18:19:00 - [31] - Quote Diesel Phumes wrote: I, personally, love high-fantasy type MMOs above sci-fi type MMOs. If there was a game in existence, which was both a high-fantasy game and had the culture of Eve Online, I would probably be playing it instead. World of Darkness. It will happen eventually, but I wouldn't hold your breath. Not unless you can hold your breath for more than a year without dying, then you can hold your breath if you like. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice."
Unsuccessful At Everything The Troll Bridge 2027	Posted - 2013.02.11 18:23:00 - [32] - Quote Diesel Phumes wrote: Do sword-and-board MMOs have t.... Lost interest right about there. *Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?*
Karrl Tian Exiled Assassins 184	Posted - 2013.02.11 18:40:00 - [33] - Quote Mire Stoude wrote: Clearly CCP wants to add vampires and werewolves to Eve online eventually. I think there's already plenty of folks with pale skin and excessive facial hair in this game.
Warpshade Warped Industries 39	Posted - 2013.02.11 18:43:00 - [34] - Quote Imo Sci-FI vs Fantasy is not much of a factor when you look at the past of the industry. Back in 2004 SWG was the highest subscribed MMO with about 400,000 subs peak roughly. When WoW came along, imo it was a very important time in the Industry, It was Sandbox vs Themepark. SoE could of worked and improved on their sandbox, but as we all know they saw the quick success of WoW and tried to imitate Blizzards formula, forgetting their current customer base, and favoured the pursuit of new customers. You cannot beat WoW, at being WoW! If SoE had stuck to their guns and worked on keeping true to their own Sandbox formula, plus some other shenanigans within SoE; like keeping hold of Raph Koster, I think we could of seen a totally different set of MMO events than what we have had. WoW had a long time with little competition, to polish and polish their product, all newer MMO's Sci-Fi and Fantasy, pretty much fell on their faces due to the fact, most companies were under the heavy burden of men in suits making the calls; WoW makes Cash, ergo make a WoW clone. Also most games being rushed and being as complex as MMO's are to make, they were buggy as hell, folk don't like bugs! The common fallacy forward is; "but WoW has had X amount of years to get that good!!!!", Well so what, you don't compare the history of what a product was like, you compare your product to what the competition currently has. If I started a Car company and wanted to compete against Ford and I started selling a 4 wheel vehicle using a steam engine (well you get the idea) simular to those back in 1806, but charge the same price, then screamed "but Ford has had decades to design theirs!", it just wouldn't wash, and evidently it hasnt washed with the MMO base. Just look at new games like Minecraft and DayZ, ok they aren't MMO's, but they're Sandboxes and they have become massively popular, for many of the mainstream MMO folk, it's like they just discovered the creation of the first Sandbox. So to answer your question without a doubt a Sci-Fi MMO could dominate the industry, be it Eve (some day) or another game. Could be Sandbox or Themepark, or hell some totally new format out of my comprehension. Just aslong as it's a quality product that fills the criteria to keep folk entertained. WoW won its right to capture its portion of the market, but for WoW in my mind, it really was a matter being in the right place, with the right elements that were required at the time, and Blizzard invested in its fan base; Blizzard during the WoW beta, pretty much targeted and scouted leaders of known guilds, and invited them to the beta. Capture the mind of a leader, and they naturally are going to have some kind of charisma or power to interest his members to follow. All in all, I don't know the hard numbers on which has the highest interest; Sci-Fi, Fantasy or fans that like both genres, but when it comes to the MMO industry I really think it comes down the products we have been offered and not so much about their genre. p.s. However I am greatly appreciative that CCP has made the quality product that is Eve and is fun to play! tl;dr I think the history of MMO's effected the popularity, more so than genres.
Dheeradj Nurgle Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 221	Posted - 2013.02.11 18:48:00 - [35] - Quote ChromeStriker wrote: Say NO to Orks in space!!!!!!!!!!! Never enuff DAKKA!
Grimpak Midnight Elites Echelon Rising 744	Posted - 2013.02.11 19:14:00 - [36] - Quote Dheeradj Nurgle wrote: ChromeStriker wrote: Say NO to Orks in space!!!!!!!!!!! Never enuff DAKKA! ALWAYS MOAR DAKKA! [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img] [quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
Felicity Love STARKRAFT 231	Posted - 2013.02.11 19:33:00 - [37] - Quote Diesel Phumes wrote: The big one: Could a game like Eve Online ever receive more subscriptions than a game like WoW? Could a sci-fi MMO ever dominate the industry? Very much doubt it.... WoW uses dozens and dozens of distinct servers. Some are dedicated to PVE, some PVP and others are dedicated to geographic regions (for whatever technical and/or customer-driven reasons). To the best of my knowledge, EVE prides itself on using the "one server, one world" approach. To get anywhere even close to WOW's sub levels CCP's whole corporate "game plan" might need an overhaul.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 7593	Posted - 2013.02.11 19:40:00 - [38] - Quote Tippia wrote: Since scifi is a subcategory of fantasy... NO! Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717&find=unread
Diesel Phumes State Protectorate Caldari State 18	Posted - 2013.02.11 19:45:00 - [39] - Quote Unsuccessful At Everything wrote: Diesel Phumes wrote: Do sword-and-board MMOs have t.... Lost interest right about there. That's alright little man, you stay in your little world.
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3437	Posted - 2013.02.11 20:03:00 - [40] - Quote Malcanis wrote: Tippia wrote: Since scifi is a subcategory of fantasy... NO! YES! Even the most 'realistically justified' SF is considered to be of the fantastical. There is over 50 years of critical thinking and analysis to back this up. See Brian W Aldiss' "Trillion Year Spree: A History of Science Fiction". http://www.amazon.com/Trillion-Year-Spree-History-Science/dp/0689118392 My other favorite parallel along these lines is that regular Cinema is actually a subset of Animation. Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Warpshade Warped Industries 41	Posted - 2013.02.11 20:21:00 - [41] - Quote Krixtal Icefluxor wrote: Malcanis wrote: Tippia wrote: Since scifi is a subcategory of fantasy... NO! YES! Even the most 'realistically justified' SF is considered to be of the fantastical. There is over 50 years of critical thinking and analysis to back this up. See Brian W Aldiss' "Trillion Year Spree: A History of Science Fiction". http://www.amazon.com/Trillion-Year-Spree-History-Science/dp/0689118392 My other favorite parallel along these lines is that regular Cinema is actually a subset of Animation. Science Fiction and Fantasy are both sub genres of fiction, no matter how hard you try to play with the semantics.
Corey Fumimasa Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive 101	Posted - 2013.02.11 20:28:00 - [42] - Quote People play fantasy MMO's to escape from RL for a while. People play Eve to plan revenge. SWtoR tried to capture the escapist crowd, but those guys want something easy to "work" towards, end content that is clearly labeled and reachable without a whole lot of immersion shattering setbacks. Bioware tried to split the difference with some PvP and an open ended storyline. In Pen and Paper RPG's sci-fi is a small fraction of the market. And hard sci-fi is a small subset of that fraction. There is currently a movement called OSR, or Old School Renaissance, older table top gamers who support rules light, DM fiat, dangerous games. As far as I know its all fantasy based rules to this point. But it does mark a shift in the market away from "balanced" rules sets and the complexity that comes with them. If table top games still serve as a precursor to MMO's this movement may indicate the potential for a fantasy based sandbox. This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories.
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3438	Posted - 2013.02.11 20:31:00 - [43] - Quote Warpshade wrote: Krixtal Icefluxor wrote: Malcanis wrote: Tippia wrote: Since scifi is a subcategory of fantasy... NO! YES! Even the most 'realistically justified' SF is considered to be of the fantastical. There is over 50 years of critical thinking and analysis to back this up. See Brian W Aldiss' "Trillion Year Spree: A History of Science Fiction". http://www.amazon.com/Trillion-Year-Spree-History-Science/dp/0689118392 My other favorite parallel along these lines is that regular Cinema is actually a subset of Animation. Science Fiction and Fantasy are both sub genres of fiction, no matter how hard you try to play with the semantics. True they are both fiction. But the posting is still correct. Without 'playing' with semantics. EDIT: unless you are trying to say SF and Fantasy are equal which would be fallacious and ridiculous. Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Ginger Barbarella Caldari Provisions Caldari State 1147	Posted - 2013.02.11 21:05:00 - [44] - Quote Diesel Phumes wrote: For a reference, see baseball v. volleyball; some things are just more appealing to more people than other things. end edit Let's see.. Very fit young ladies is extemely tight bikini wear lunging around in the sand playing volleyball under a bright sun... Marginally overweight dudes throwing a ball around and spitting tobacco juice all over the place... Hmmm... "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." -á --- Sorlac
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3439	Posted - 2013.02.11 21:08:00 - [45] - Quote Ginger Barbarella wrote: Diesel Phumes wrote: For a reference, see baseball v. volleyball; some things are just more appealing to more people than other things. end edit Let's see.. Very fit young ladies is extemely tight bikini wear lunging around in the sand playing volleyball under a bright sun... Marginally overweight dudes throwing a ball around and spitting tobacco juice all over the place... Hmmm... Overweight ? Where ? They all have to be able to run like hell. A different word maybe ? Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Davith en Divalone Aegis Coalition Logistics Eternal Syndicate 61	Posted - 2013.02.11 21:35:00 - [46] - Quote Outside of MMOs, science fiction and fantasy games seem to run neck and neck in sales. In the MMO world, WoW is the curve-busting singularity.
Fredfredbug4 The Scope Gallente Federation 404	Posted - 2013.02.11 22:03:00 - [47] - Quote Generally the setting alone isn't the largest factor on which games have more players. While some people prefer fighting aliens and shooting lasers to fighting goblins and swinging swords and vice versa, the structure of the game is what drives people in the most. The reason why WoW has significantly more players is because it's gameplay is a lot more appealing to the general public. The game is an on-rails MMO which basically means that you are going to be directed to play the game in a few different ways. This means that players will rarely feel lost as to what they are suppose to do and will find the fun a lot quicker. EVE is a 99% open sandbox. Botting, glitching, and RTM are basically the only things that aren't allowed in EVE. Everything else is alright with a very small number of exceptions. This means players don't really have a direction other than their own, which means it can take a while to find the part of the game you actually enjoy. Money making methods and skills are also extremely long term in EVE making it a more "hardcore" game for the lack of a better word.
Aracimia Wolfe Fade To Darkness 171	Posted - 2013.02.11 22:08:00 - [48] - Quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"" Arthur C Clarke Sci Fi or Fantasy the setting is immaterial, you could take WoW's lore and back story and reweave it into a far more brutal game, full gear loss, player crafted armour being the norm, much larger worl space but spawned missions instead of quests. Safe zones being a million times bigger than just the capital cities and starter zones. (And even they aren't always safe on a pvp server) It's the game mechanics that make it not the settings. So yes EvE could become larger than wow, if it utterly destroyed itself in the process. Praise be to CCP that it does not. Malcanis for CSM 8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717 \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ m8m8m8m8m8m8m8 o7
Super spikinator Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 86	Posted - 2013.02.11 22:54:00 - [49] - Quote ChromeStriker wrote: Say NO to Orks in space!!!!!!!!!!! But a 40k space game would be the best game. Nothing gets the blood running like jury rigging an asteroid for re-entry. Nothing better than the fact that the same jury rigging makes a good ramming boat. ORKS DA BEST.
Aracimia Wolfe Fade To Darkness 171	Posted - 2013.02.11 22:56:00 - [50] - Quote Space Orks yes. Space Orcs, No You 'orrible Gitz Malcanis for CSM 8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717 \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ m8m8m8m8m8m8m8 o7
Crumplecorn Eve Cluster Explorations 243	Posted - 2013.02.11 23:17:00 - [51] - Quote Quote: Even the most 'realistically justified' SF is considered to be of the fantastical. The distinction between Sci-Fi and Fantasy has little to do with the plausability. [img]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sig.php?r=rnd[/img] Desusigs can be seen on the terribad new forums using bbcode enabling script (scroll down to my post for sig rotation)
Dheeradj Nurgle Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 223	Posted - 2013.02.11 23:21:00 - [52] - Quote Aracimia Wolfe wrote: Space Orks yes. Space Orcs, No You 'orrible Gitz Oi Boyz, This one 'ere is a Giblet!
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3440	Posted - 2013.02.11 23:25:00 - [53] - Quote In the world of published literature, Fantasy started outpacing SF around 1985. Remember in 1978 even Anne McCaffrey's "The White Dragon" was a #1 NY Times Bestseller like forever. (My bag is SF though) Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3440	Posted - 2013.02.11 23:44:00 - [54] - Quote Aracimia Wolfe wrote: Space Orks yes. Space Orcs, No You 'orrible Gitz W T H(eck) ? Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Aracimia Wolfe Brave Newbies Inc. 175	Posted - 2013.02.12 00:41:00 - [55] - Quote Krixtal Icefluxor wrote: Aracimia Wolfe wrote: Space Orks yes. Space Orcs, No You 'orrible Gitz W T H(eck) ? I refer you sir to the standard parlance of Orks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ork_(Warhammer_40,000) The only time it's acceptable to say "It's not easy being green" Malcanis for CSM 8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717 \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ m8m8m8m8m8m8m8 o7
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3440	Posted - 2013.02.12 00:44:00 - [56] - Quote Aracimia Wolfe wrote: Krixtal Icefluxor wrote: Aracimia Wolfe wrote: Space Orks yes. Space Orcs, No You 'orrible Gitz W T H(eck) ? I refer you sir to the standard parlance of Orks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ork_(Warhammer_40,000) The only time it's acceptable to say "It's not easy being green" Ah ! Got it. Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's
Mars Theran Red Rogue Squadron 1626	Posted - 2013.02.12 01:41:00 - [57] - Quote I can't believe you called WoW high fantasy. That really should be a crime. zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Aren Madigan EVE University Ivy League 71	Posted - 2013.02.12 01:46:00 - [58] - Quote Mars Theran wrote: I can't believe you called WoW high fantasy. That really should be a crime. Well, its high on something.
Shamus O'Reilly Gungnirs' Point I Know Right 78	Posted - 2013.02.12 02:05:00 - [59] - Quote Ever think that the game is not "popular" due to its niche or gameplay style, but due to the lack of marketing and the amount of people out there that KNOW of the game? Lets face it: Who here tried EVE Online because they saw a TV advert on the sci-fi channel? I see WoW commercials around at every release date for an expansion. I also see it in the gaming isles of computer stores. If i was a fantasy MMOer i'd know of WoW and try it out. If i was a sci-fi gamer... I wouldn't know of EVE other than through word of mouth. The reason i began playing EVE is through a guy i platooned together with on World of Tanks ffs... He talked to me about it and introduced me to it. I was instantly HOOKED line and sinker. But until I started last year I have never even heard of the game. Hell when he first started talking about EVE one day i thought it was another fantasy MMO i wanted to steer clear of Until i heard the words ---> Space, ship, pew, and sandbox in one sentence. Blizzard started WoW off a budget made from the success of two EXTREMELY successful gaming series. (I had heard of WoW the week it came out...) CCP started nearly from scratch. I have to say if CCP had the budget of Blizzard and the current mindset of where the game should go you wouldn't be seeing only a solid 30,000 to 50,000 online daily but much more and much better server management and much more streamlined everything Edit: Whether CCP with a Blizzard budget made EVE on the popularity level of WoW did the world would never know Edit 2: You may also see WiS fully developed by now also
Krixtal Icefluxor INLAND EMPIRE Galactic 3441	Posted - 2013.02.12 02:22:00 - [60] - Quote Shamus O'Reilly wrote: Edit 2: You may also see WiS fully developed by now also Pro-bab-ly. You did get me to thinking though. I discovered EVE sometime in mid-2008. But upon further thought, I have absolutely no recollection of where I found out about it or anything of the sort. Really. I never, ever click banner ads and I knew nobody who played, so it's become a complete mystery as to how I even became involved. And although I spent many an afternoon from 1978 till 1982 watching friends play D7d, I never ever touched an RPG, much less an MMORPG. It is an enigma for me how I came to be a now 3 year player. Weird. Be yourself; everyone else is already taken.-á-á-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde - 1870's

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