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Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
   |
Posted - 2013.02.14 23:21:00 -
[1] - Quote
started this amarr character after I had extremely bad karma with my trial account caldari.
anyway my current goal is while I level some basic skills which I want is to do some agent 1/2 security missions.
I got the free coercer from advanced military career agent and I should be able to fly it in few hours.
Currently I fancy myself with punisher and some basic equipment.
as I've failed to find online a satisfying answers... few questions,
1. I've seen the Dragoon which looks like extremely fun ship to fly with the fact it's drone ship with the option to utilize guns and\or missiles.
But I have yet to train any drone or missile skills.
it will benefit me to take the dragoon over the coercer for my choice of missions? if so which rank of skills you think I should train before I'll take it?
2. let's assume I'll fly the coercer for my missions of choice in order to save Q time for skills I want to train erlier,
From the last mission of the advanced military career agent I've seend that I have major range problem with pulse laser (on my punisher is upto 4.5 km) should I use beam laser instead as the destroyer is slower?
3. upon recommending 1 of this ships please advice on decent non expensive low sp based fit for my missions of choice please :) |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
Damu'Khonde
630
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 00:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
The whole point of the dragoon is energy neuting. Since energy neuting is more or less useless against NPCs, the Coercer will always be better.
Quote:2. let's assume I'll fly the coercer for my missions of choice in order to save Q time for skills I want to train erlier,
From the last mission of the advanced military career agent I've seend that I have major range problem with pulse laser (on my punisher is upto 4.5 km) should I use beam laser instead as the destroyer is slower?
If you train up your gunnery skills you'll get more, and with t2 pulse lasers you can load Scorch ammo. With small focused pulses, good gunnery skills and Scorch, you can hit up to about 20km.
as far as a fit, I like this
[Coercer, T1 pve]
Small 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
'Skadi' Coolant System I
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Limited 1MN Afterburner I
Small Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 200
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
[Empty Rig slot]
[Empty Rig slot]
[Empty Rig slot]
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Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 00:34:00 -
[3] - Quote
I've got some rigging skills,
any kind of cheap entry rigging which I could add to your recommended fitting?
and thanks for the help! |
Chris Slayter
Cypher Mortalis
Aureus Alae
10
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 01:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
Kahega already mentioned the important stuff about what you should train for etc.
Here is an example fit:
[Coercer, MissionRunner]
Small Armor Repairer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
1MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Small Anti-Thermic Pump I
Small Anti-Thermic Pump I
Small Anti-EM Pump I
Rigs are used for tank in this case, though roughly 300 DPS with Scorch should suffice to melt anything before it starts to cause serious damage. I am not a huge fan of capboosters in PvE, hence the recharger (pulsing repper really is enough most of the time, so no permatank needed). The booster might help you early on with little SP in capskills but since you are flying Amarr, you should max them asap. (or at least to 4 in case you want to max other skills first, i.e. t2 lasers)
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Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
Damu'Khonde
631
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 02:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
Nalelmir Ahashion wrote:I've got some rigging skills,
any kind of cheap entry rigging which I could add to your recommended fitting?
and thanks for the help!
Armor resist rigs against the rat type you plan on fighting wouldn't be unwelcome. However, for level 1 missions the fit as it stands is way more than enough, so I'd fit two range rigs (small energy locus coordinator) and one damage rig (small energy collision accelerator). These will increase the powergrid need of your guns, however, and depending on your fitting skills and rigging skills this may put you over the limit on powergrid.
Quote:Rigs are used for tank in this case, though roughly 300 DPS with Scorch should suffice to melt anything before it starts to cause serious damage. I am not a huge fan of capboosters in PvE, hence the recharger (pulsing repper really is enough most of the time, so no permatank needed). The booster might help you early on with little SP in capskills but since you are flying Amarr, you should max them asap. (or at least to 4 in case you want to max other skills first, i.e. t2 lasers)
If you only need to pulse the repper occasionally on your fit, then you will only need to use a cap injector occasionally in my fit. Cap rechargers are ridiculously inefficient. The only time it makes sense to use cap recharge modules is when you have enough spare slots that you can stack them. This applies often at the battleship level but certainly not on a Coercer with only two mids. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
202
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 03:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'd fit damage rigs and use a passive omni resist mod in the lows as most level 1s wont do very much damage (and in the coercer you should be able to kill the rats before they can even get in damage range).
this is pretty much the fit I used (yay you can use an ab on it now \o/) looks like it has a bunch of extra fitting so it should work with lower skills. I like beams just so you can hit at longer ranges with t1 ammo, if you can use t2 pulse, well scorch gets pretty damn awesome. plus in most lv1s stuff spawns kinda far away so I like being able to hit it as soon as I can.
[Coercer, Pve]
Heat Sink II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Small Armor Repairer II
Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 200
1MN Afterburner II
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Dual Light Beam Laser II, Microwave S
Small Energy Burst Aerator I
Small Energy Collision Accelerator I
[empty rig slot]
as for dragoon I dunno it might be not too bad. functionally I would think it would mostly be a smaller faster arbitrator (hmm according to eft arby is faster with a (appropriately sized) mwd, they are about the same with ab, and dragoon is a bit faster with no prop mod). although arbitrator should be able to fit a medium rep (effectively 2 smalls) and has an extra low so an extra drone damage amp.
the biggest negative that I can think would be the time it takes you to train drone skills... although imo that is also a huge positive since nearly everything can use drones in some way. it just might be something you want to put off a bit more. |
Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kahega Amielden wrote:
[Coercer, T1 pve]
Small 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
'Skadi' Coolant System I
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Limited 1MN Afterburner I
Small Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 200
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I, Multifrequency S
[Empty Rig slot]
[Empty Rig slot]
[Empty Rig slot]
ok I went for this fit as the T2 ones still require lots of skills and for this one I managed to fit all of them on my coercer except the Micro Auxiliary Power Core I which for it I still train my skill (1:30 hours left until I can use it).
unfortunately I lack power to activate all this modules on the same time. with current stats I managed to power up all modules except the 2 mids + the repair module on the low slot.
the Micro Auxiliary Power Core I should help me activate them all together? what is the minimum skill (core power wise) you had in mind for using this fit?
meanwhile I'll power down some of the laser guns until I'll train some more. |
Zhu Khan
Tritanium Industries and Technology
High Rollers
21
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:43:00 -
[8] - Quote
You're probably running into powergrid issues with the lasers. The MAPC provides a +bonus to your total powergrid. It is a fitting module. |
Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
added the mpac and i can now power up all modules except 2 laser turrets.
there is a cheap rig to increase the power so I'll be able to use them as well? |
Zhu Khan
Tritanium Industries and Technology
High Rollers
22
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
To what level is your Engineering skill trained?
I think you need Jury Rigging I to fit the Small Ancillary Current Router I, in case you don't have it. |
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Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:56:00 -
[11] - Quote
right now I train to mechanic 3 then jury rigging. my engineering is 3, to train it to 4 will take 20 hours and I can train crap loads of other skills which I use in those 20 hours so I train them first then I q'd the engineering 4. |
Goldensaver
Marsuud And Sons Industries
138
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 18:36:00 -
[12] - Quote
Engineering, Electronics, Weapon Upgrades and Advanced Weapon Upgrades are probably the 4 best skills you could train up. You don't necessarily have to do them all at once, but they are all fantastic skills which allow you to fit your ships more efficiently. When you get a chance, I'd suggest training up the first 3 to 4 or 5 (if possible) as quickly as you can. Later when you have a bit more time, they are all a fantastic skill to have at level 5.
Also, I'm not certain, but it's quite possible that by training up Engineering IV you'd be able to activate the last 2 guns. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
Damu'Khonde
631
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 18:44:00 -
[13] - Quote
Engineering and Electronics in particular are extremely important skills, I'd get them to 5 as soon as you can.
Anyway, until then you could just downgrade the guns to dual lights (for the same meta level, you'd want dual anode light particle stream I). You'll do a bit less damage with a bit less range, but better tracking and you'll have absolutely no problems fitting everything. If you do this, you may also be able to remove the Micro auxiliary power core and replace it with something else.
Another option, as said before, is a small ancillary current router rig, though this will cost you a couple mil. |
Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
so far I am with 6 out of 8 guns and they do pretty decent damage in the tutorials (1-shot anything) so it's not a problem.
as soon as I'll get level 1-2 in some other basic skills my character is lacking I'll level the ones you've recomended to 4.
thanks! |
Indira Himesama
Andorianisches Bergbaukonsortium
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 11:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
A Coercer was also my first ship when I came out of academy. Back then I had fitted it just any beam and pulse lasers the rats had dropped, and the ship had sucked... I had cap troubles and there was not much volley I could point. So it came to an predestinated end when I came into a site/mission with web, scrambler and a more frigs as I could kill before the tank buffer was overstressed. I therefore had hestitated for a while to buy a new one, but when I did I heared about the advice to go for pulse lasers and had some basic skills for capacitor size and recharge (as an Amarr, you simply need them) this new destroyer makes really fun. It really kicks ass, makes frigs go boom with 1 volley and stuff.
For range... you are in the advantage of stopping weapon, klick on diffrent ammo and instantly shoot at double range or for double damage. I usually carry a set of multis, ultraviolett and microwave while the ultraviolett is usually my default one currently, standard would prabably also be a nice option. You will see almost always multis or tech 2 for fitting on that board, but I beleave for a low skill player something around standards will give you: more range and much less cap issues. Just give it a "shot". ;)
Why pulse? Pretty much as a beginner using a little speed tanking and not moving that much/perfect at start you simple need the tracking... you can't compensate with skills (motion prediction was one of my first skills at IV) at the start. There is no use in damage potential that isn't applied, simply because you are a noob and are not familar (yet) with the tracking/tanking/kitting mechanics. :) Also looking at the marked prices, you probably don't want the meta 4 (modulated) one... there are like 5 times the price for like 10% boni. Even having a much larger budget by now I often ditch them for the meta 3 (anode) ones as suggested earlier.
De Kus
Love hurts, love strengthens... |
Indira Himesama
Andorianisches Bergbaukonsortium
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 11:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
oops, quote instead of edit... please remove :)
De Kus
Love hurts, love strengthens... |
Nalelmir Ahashion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 12:57:00 -
[17] - Quote
hmmm tested it with Small Focused Anode Particle Stream I and my current skills:
1. Multifrequency S S = 13 km \ 9 km | 65 dps
2. Microwave S = 30 km \ 24 km | 32.5 dps
interesting .. (cluster of 6 guns btw...) |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
301
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 12:24:00 -
[18] - Quote
Nalelmir Ahashion wrote:1. I've seen the Dragoon which looks like extremely fun ship to fly with the fact it's drone ship with the option to utilize guns and\or missiles. But I have yet to train any drone or missile skills. it will benefit me to take the dragoon over the coercer for my choice of missions? if so which rank of skills you think I should train before I'll take it?
Dragoon is a lot of fun indeed. Even at low skillpoints. Light missile launchers are a nice extra. But it is a kiting setup. And you do want t2 light drones for decent damage. Most everything takes place at 20-40km, very basic missile skills for 18km and below.
Most level 1 missions are boring easy and Dagan is a solo with a character less then a month.
Edit: Forgot to mention salvage drones. Launch them and go afk for a short break. Lvl 1 salvage isn't worth a lot, but you get to make a couple of millions without much hassle with those drones. Perfect thing for a new player.
Remove insurance. |
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