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Sentinel Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
122
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Posted - 2013.02.15 18:53:00 -
[1] - Quote
In the Rookie systems rookies are supposed to be protected. Yet there are people baiting and griefing on the systems that connect the starter system, to the career agent system..
Take this guy for example -- http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Alejandrom777
Almost all he does is bait and grief noobs.
Even in Noob systems, he was providing Logi for other members of his corp trying to kill rookies outside the Clellinon gate (against the rules.. nothing seems to happen) just a few days ago.. And his he's got loads of kills in Clellinon over the past few months.
He gets reported all the time, by myself, and others. Nothing seems to happen.
As it stands now he gets himself all flashy yellow, has a noob alt/friend shoot him in a noobship, and target locks the new players as they head towards the gate..
So whats the point of the rules ? Rookies need to leave Noob systems to just get to the Career agent system, not to mention to complete the career agent missions ( belts are mined out in at least Clellinon after just a few hrs.. ) and they are being baited and griefed.
So pick a side. Either Rookies are protected, or the sandbox rules apply and they aren't. Cause what we have now is a half-assed system that does no one any good. They still get baited, griefed, and killed completing rookie missions. Or just heading to the career agent system for the first time.
Honestly I don't care which way it goes, I just want the rules to make sense. Because currently they don.t |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Air The Unthinkables
3058
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Posted - 2013.02.15 18:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
More proof that NPC corps don't protect newbies in any way and should be removed. PvE alts of aged veterans should be expected to defend themselves at some point. |
Ankles McGlashan
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
3
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Posted - 2013.02.15 18:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
inb4 thread hijack oh... |
Sol Weinstein
Lunatic Warfare Federation
72
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Posted - 2013.02.15 18:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:More proof that NPC corps don't protect newbies in any way and should be removed. PvE alts of aged veterans should be expected to defend themselves at some point.
I have the utmost respect for you and this expressed opinion.
Thank you.
The Savior of EVE https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=205546&find=unread |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
2166
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Posted - 2013.02.15 19:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Instead of hiding in his impeneterable fortress of NPC corp and simply standing idley by and watching this happen, OP has decided to take matters into his own hands and form up a corp to combat this scourge and in the process further the EvE community by recuiting the new players he helps and/or giving them friendly advise or actively helping them to avoid this kind of bait.
oh wait.... he kind of went with the complete opposite and posted in GD. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Sol Weinstein
Lunatic Warfare Federation
73
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Posted - 2013.02.15 20:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote: EvE
Failure to comply with the Respect the EVE directive. Your soul is in jeopardy. The Jovian will use your frozen corpse for experimentation.
Thank you.
The Savior of EVE https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=205546&find=unread |
Trendon Evenstar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
112
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
This is the part where you- as a concerned citizen, take matters into your own hands |
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
895
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
I've seen this before and CCP's response was to the effect of "can baiting is kosher so long as it isn't done in the exact same station your toon is born in." Since that is not the tutorial agent station (EVA sends you to the tutorial agent station at the end of her own tutorial) it's considered "fair game play."
Not saying I agree with this, just saying CCP does. EvE Forum Bingo |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3561
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:29:00 -
[9] - Quote
Sentinel Smith wrote:In the Rookie systems rookies are supposed to be protected. Yet there are people baiting and griefing on the systems that connect the starter system, to the career agent system.. Take this guy for example -- http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=player&name=Alejandrom777Almost all he does is bait and grief noobs. Even in Noob systems, he was providing Logi for other members of his corp trying to kill rookies outside the Clellinon gate (against the rules.. nothing seems to happen) just a few days ago.. And his he's got loads of kills in Clellinon over the past few months. He gets reported all the time, by myself, and others. Nothing seems to happen. As it stands now he gets himself all flashy yellow, has a noob alt/friend shoot him in a noobship, and target locks the new players as they head towards the gate.. So whats the point of the rules ? Rookies need to leave Noob systems to just get to the Career agent system, not to mention to complete the career agent missions ( belts are mined out in at least Clellinon after just a few hrs.. ) and they are being baited and griefed. So pick a side. Either Rookies are protected, or the sandbox rules apply and they aren't. Cause what we have now is a half-assed system that does no one any good. They still get baited, griefed, and killed completing rookie missions. Or just heading to the career agent system for the first time. Honestly I don't care which way it goes, I just want the rules to make sense. Because currently they don.t Can baiting noobs in a noob system is off limits, pretty much everything else goes (including suicide ganking them, etc.).
If they are getting baited next door, then they aren't really just innocently going over a couple of systems to get to a career agent... if they were then they wouldn't be falling for this. No, they are venturing out on their own for the first time... which is great... but they have to learn not to be stupid at some point. Or at least learn to keep their safeties on and pay attention to the warning messages that pop up until the get a handle on what is going on.
At worst it's simply pathetic, but likely not a major issue in the grand scheme of things. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2718
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
Sentinel Smith wrote:So pick a side. Either Rookies are protected, or the sandbox rules apply and they aren't. Cause what we have now is a half-assed system that does no one any good. They still get baited, griefed, and killed completing rookie missions. Or just heading to the career agent system for the first time.
Inside a Rookie system, rookies are protected*. Outside of a Rookie system, nobody is protected.
*Which is problematic, because non-rookies are not protected there, leading to confusion as players have no means to reliably tell who is a rookie and who is not.
Which is why, last time this topic rolled around, I suggested that, quite simply, everyone be protected in Rookie systems with the same protective rules as rookies. Makes it easier to enforce, too. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3561
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Sentinel Smith wrote:So pick a side. Either Rookies are protected, or the sandbox rules apply and they aren't. Cause what we have now is a half-assed system that does no one any good. They still get baited, griefed, and killed completing rookie missions. Or just heading to the career agent system for the first time. Inside a Rookie system, rookies are protected*. Outside of a Rookie system, nobody is protected. *Which is problematic, because non-rookies are not protected there, leading to confusion as players have no means to reliably tell who is a rookie and who is not. Which is why, last time this topic rolled around, I suggested that, quite simply, everyone be protected in Rookie systems with the same protective rules as rookies. Makes it easier to enforce, too. I expect the same people who spent the last thread on this shouting at me, claiming that I want the change in order to further my supposed agenda of griefing newbies, to be back shouting at me in this thread. Hmmm, but don't you think that would lead to dense populations of "Super Carebears" in those systems? To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Air The Unthinkables
3069
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:53:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Hmmm, but don't you think that would lead to dense populations of "Super Carebears" in those systems?
Quote:Rookies need to leave Noob systems to just get to the Career agent system, not to mention to complete the career agent missions ( belts are mined out in at least Clellinon after just a few hrs.. ) and they are being baited and griefed. "Lead to"? Try "continue". |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1116
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 20:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
Instance NPE. |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
297
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Hmmm, but don't you think that would lead to dense populations of "Super Carebears" in those systems? Just ban exhumers and mining barges from rookie and adjacent systems and move the first agents at least two jumps out. Lazy is going to win.
Remove insurance. |
HellBent KillingSpree
Republic University Minmatar Republic
75
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
I just read the title of this thread and thought "that sounds like fun, ill give that a try" . I could not be bothered to read your posts tho. "Dont let your kids play on the weekends unless you like exposing your children to several thousand drunk and drug addicts" An unbiased Amazon players review |
RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2719
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:03:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Hmmm, but don't you think that would lead to dense populations of "Super Carebears" in those systems?
They're welcome to their 1hr/day of small rock Veld mining, no belt rats, and no missions in a "station" that "undocks" you 15km away from the docking ring if you want to leave. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3561
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:18:00 -
[17] - Quote
Fair points. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Renzo Ruderi
State War Academy Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:21:00 -
[18] - Quote
It'd be nice if people, some day, began realizing how stupid they sound using the word "noob." |
Charlepetit LaJoie
Trust Me Ltd
273
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
I do hope some RPers notice your post and form a Space Ranger protective society to hunt down the miscreants. Sounds like a fun job for some new-ish players in cheap frigates. |
Kathern Aurilen
19
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:38:00 -
[20] - Quote
Renzo Ruderi wrote:It'd be nice if people, some day, began realizing how stupid they sound using the word "noob." Ace Ventura style, "NOO-OO-BER" I am a chat alt, unskilled in the ways of pewpew -á:(
I named my mining frig adVenture time!! |
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Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
161
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 21:38:00 -
[21] - Quote
Newies should learn from day 1 what this game is about. New CQ prototype |
Solstice Project
Brave Newbies Inc.
2748
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 22:06:00 -
[22] - Quote
If you really cared, you'd actually deal with the bastard picking on them.
But besides him being a bastard, there's no way to tell if he's not actively recruiting that way.
And yes, many actually do that.
Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire |
Ankles McGlashan
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 22:09:00 -
[23] - Quote
Bagrat Skalski wrote:Newies should learn from day 1 what this game is about.
not shooting stuff? |
Sentinel Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
125
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 23:29:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: Can baiting noobs in a noob system is off limits, pretty much everything else goes (including suicide ganking them, etc.).
If they are getting baited next door, then they aren't really just innocently going over a couple of systems to get to a career agent... if they were then they wouldn't be falling for this. No, they are venturing out on their own for the first time... which is great... but they have to learn not to be stupid at some point. Or at least learn to keep their safeties on and pay attention to the warning messages that pop up until the get a handle on what is going on.
At worst it's simply pathetic, but likely not a major issue in the grand scheme of things.
Actually messing with Noobs in any way in a Rookie System is technically against the rules, according to the GM's that have posted on the forums..
Also this is not venturing out on their own.. many of them are leaving the Starter System ( Where Aura is, where you first spawn ) to the Career agent system where you go to get your first missions.. Both are rookie systems, there is one system in between that isn't. It's a system a new player can't avoid going through the first time.. they jump in, warp to the next game, and get painted by a flashing yellow ship that has another one shooting at it..
On your first day(s) playing the game that would probably get you rattled too.
Also by the second or 3rd mission in several of the paths you need to leave, since people do come and mine out the system within the first hrs after downtime.. It's not that they want to venture out, it's that they have no choice, that or make sure they wake up in the first 4hrs after DT..
Now I'm the first to say I don't know the solution. I don't think Rookies should be harassed early on in and around the career agent/ rookie systems. That said I don't want to make a carebear safe haven either.. Each "solution" I think up has it's fair share of drawbacks too.. I mean this is a PvP game, but people griefing on newbies have no place here imho.. grow some balls and face people that actually can fight back, and know what is going on. |
Sentinel Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
125
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 23:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:If you really cared, you'd actually deal with the bastard picking on them.
But besides him being a bastard, there's no way to tell if he's not actively recruiting that way.
And yes, many actually do that.
I'm an Industrial Char, I have limited combat skills. I have alts that sometimes get involved, but he has corpmates, logi, more sp, and better ships than I.. plus he does it on a regular basis.. so he's better at it than I.
And when it does face more than he can handle, he hides till they go away and them comes back and starts again. |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
572
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 23:44:00 -
[26] - Quote
Bagrat Skalski wrote:Newies should learn from day 1 what this game is about.
I should agree with this guy. I really think there are not enough people exterminating that fresh vermin.
It's a very good way to spot uninteresting guys to fly with, corp or do whatever with.
It's a very good way to ruin vet's day by killing their new spy/unknown scout alt/cyno.
Kill them all !
Scam them all !
Save EvE !!
*removed inappropriate ASCII art signature* - CCP Eterne |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
572
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 23:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Sentinel Smith wrote:And when it does face more than he can handle, he hides till they go away and them comes back and starts again.
You just figured the true colors and face of EvE pvp, everything is done to promote this kind of behavior and protect/reward them.
*removed inappropriate ASCII art signature* - CCP Eterne |
Takseen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
224
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 00:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
He's just welcoming people to Eve, I don't see the problem. Happens in WoW all the time.
He also gives fitting advice.
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=18843735 |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
2771
|
Posted - 2013.02.16 00:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
Easy solution to these guys...make a character designed to bait him into action so he can't jump the gate, then crush him with real PVP ships. If he brings logi, bring snipers. Surely all you white knights of high sec can muster a half-dozen ships to counter one guy. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |
Dessau
117
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Posted - 2013.02.16 02:31:00 -
[30] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Surely all you white knights of high sec can muster a half-dozen ships to counter one guy. I admire your optimism.
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