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Jelosavich
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Posted - 2005.08.01 18:43:00 -
[1]
So my friend and I were doing some level 3 missions, me running a tanking setup and him running gank. I would go in, aggro all the guys, and then he would come in and start blowing up things. A couple times while we were doing this, the NPCs switched over to attacking him. I've never seen the NPCs switch before, anyone know why?
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Jocca Quinn
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Posted - 2005.08.01 18:53:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Jocca Quinn on 01/08/2005 18:58:16
NPC's retargeting came in with the NWO patch. This only seems to happen in real space missions. Deadspace rats and Complexes don't seem to have this "feature". If you watch your overview you can see the flashing yellow indicator when the rats retarget. It seems to be totally random, not depending on distance from the rats, type of ship or even if your buddy is not aggro'ing at all (medic). Its a little annoying as now I can't take younger members of the corp along on missions for experience and isk.
JQ
none of us are free
as long as one of us is chained
none of us are free |
JoeSomebody
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Posted - 2005.08.01 19:30:00 -
[3]
they change target simply because new one is closer and they too far to attack primary.
____
When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..." |
Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2005.08.01 20:36:00 -
[4]
NPCs may retarget only if they haven't yet started *firing* at you. Once they're all flashing red, everything's fine.
_______
I tried strip mining, but I lost and it's cold flying around in space naked. |
MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.01 21:41:00 -
[5]
Well a corpmate had this on a ge lvl4 (deadspace) A guy in a raven was tanking a group they were all firing on him then my buddy attacked and most if not all of the agroing ships attacked him. He was further away from the rats than the tanker and there was another that was closer but the guy in the raven said they stopped tageting him.
Dont think this was in the patch notes so is this a petitionable bug? He wasnt ready for them and he lost his ship.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.08.01 22:34:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: MacMillan
Well a corpmate had this on a ge lvl4 (deadspace) A guy in a raven was tanking a group they were all firing on him then my buddy attacked and most if not all of the agroing ships attacked him. He was further away from the rats than the tanker and there was another that was closer but the guy in the raven said they stopped tageting him.
Dont think this was in the patch notes so is this a petitionable bug? He wasnt ready for them and he lost his ship.
Its not a bug.
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MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.01 22:40:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Originally by: MacMillan
Well a corpmate had this on a ge lvl4 (deadspace) A guy in a raven was tanking a group they were all firing on him then my buddy attacked and most if not all of the agroing ships attacked him. He was further away from the rats than the tanker and there was another that was closer but the guy in the raven said they stopped tageting him.
Dont think this was in the patch notes so is this a petitionable bug? He wasnt ready for them and he lost his ship.
Its not a bug.
Didnt think so but still it would be good to know what the "rules" are
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Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2005.08.02 00:08:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
NPCs may retarget only if they haven't yet started *firing* at you. Once they're all flashing red, everything's fine.
I withdraw this remark. I just lost nine drones without any of the NPCs even changing targets: they were targetting me, and killing off my drones.
New rule for missions: don't deploy drones. They're worse than useless.
_______
I tried strip mining, but I lost and it's cold flying around in space naked. |
Yazoul Samaiel
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Posted - 2005.08.02 07:35:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
NPCs may retarget only if they haven't yet started *firing* at you. Once they're all flashing red, everything's fine.
I withdraw this remark. I just lost nine drones without any of the NPCs even changing targets: they were targetting me, and killing off my drones.
New rule for missions: don't deploy drones. They're worse than useless.
Signed i just had the same problem also with Destroy the supply line mish , i let lose my drones to nail the frigs and i found that the 30 cruisers have split into 2 groups 20 cruisers shooting me and about 10 killing my drones all were lost except 1 hammer head from the total of 7 coz by the time i relaised that last frig was dead and my drones are beign squished it was too late . But i think i know the reason why the switch , it depends if the secodn entity fires at all , coz it also happend to m8 of mine on Silence the infromant , once he starts shooting the rats split in 2 groups and shoot one person each. I already stopped taking noobs with me on missiosn coz i lost a guy in a Moa on another mish.
"What ever that doesnt Kill me just makes me stronger" |
Yeggstry
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Posted - 2005.08.02 10:01:00 -
[10]
erm...... does this issue also happen with NPCs in belts as well? :|
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IcedBach Jr
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Posted - 2005.08.02 10:40:00 -
[11]
Happened to me with the drones too and since I had spent 150 mills setting up a nice Dominix lv4 setup this ****es me off. Now my Raven is gimped, Dominix is worse than useless, I have to say Im gettin real tired of the game not being able to do anything solo anymore except mine or pirate. Still nothing happens to the Apoc users, how about some nerf there too.
Praeludium to success |
Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2005.08.02 11:11:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Yeggstry
erm...... does this issue also happen with NPCs in belts as well? :|
Probably. It's not such a huge problem since belt groups tend to be smaller than these honking great mission encounters, but you'd better be on your toes.
_______
I tried strip mining, but I lost and it's cold flying around in space naked. |
Jaketh Ivanes
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Posted - 2005.08.02 11:19:00 -
[13]
Originally by: IcedBach Jr
Happened to me with the drones too and since I had spent 150 mills setting up a nice Dominix lv4 setup this ****es me off. Now my Raven is gimped, Dominix is worse than useless, I have to say Im gettin real tired of the game not being able to do anything solo anymore except mine or pirate. Still nothing happens to the Apoc users, how about some nerf there too.
Apoc's have been nerfed with the Pulse nerf.. and before you say "Thats only a balance", so is the missile "nerf". And i've heard of many in Ravens who solo lvl 4's. Think you should try a new setup on the Raven.
About drones getting killed, I've never had that problem, but havn't really done many missions since patch, other than lvl 3s. But I use my Sac in those, so not much use for drones :)
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ic35t0rm
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Posted - 2005.08.02 11:52:00 -
[14]
yes it happens in belts too i let the rats come right in and are all shooting my brutix b4 i bring out my drones
first time they switched to my drones as soon as they started shooting the rats next time they didnt switch and it happened a second but i noticed that all the rats were shooting me except 1 which happened to be the one i had initialy targeted since then have made sure all of them had me targeted and were fireing b4 bringing out my drones havent had a problem since.
i think its because if one isnt targeting you and you bring out drones it tells the others hey guys look drones
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Jocca Quinn
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Posted - 2005.08.02 11:59:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel
I already stopped taking noobs with me on missiosn coz i lost a guy in a Moa on another mish.
Yup same with me, funny this feature along with the balancing of missiles has changed my lvl4 missions from being fun corp/group encounters with different ships having different roles into a solo, cruise spamming bore fest.
Wait .. wasn't that suppose to be the other way around ??
JQ
none of us are free
as long as one of us is chained
none of us are free |
Rick Dentill
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Posted - 2005.08.02 12:02:00 -
[16]
I use drones alot. Either as a compliment to weapons in missions or as the main weapon when mining. I have only ever lost 3, 1 to a corp mate when I forgot to call it off the other two were by the bug thing that stops them from attacking multiple targets without orders.
We used them heavily last night in an extravaganza mission with no losses, and I did not notice any target switching in any of the level 2 missions I did before I joined my mate.
_______
Save me Jebus!
http://x-universe.kiwi.nu/dd.php |
MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.02 12:31:00 -
[17]
Its definatly wierd. Some guys i know have a buddy joing mission to support the main killing machine. That could change now cos ur support ship could get targeted by the group.
Drones were helping to combat the missile balance but now if the group decides to take out ur drones your pretty much stuffed.
Didnt want this to be about the "nerfs" as Im quite happy to adapt but when this sort of "stealth nerf" comes in with no idea how or why it happens it really makes adapting a bit tricky.
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Profess0r Mansechs0r
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Posted - 2005.08.02 14:34:00 -
[18]
Never had a problem with NPCs switching targets once they are all shooting at me. Just warp to belt, shoot the bs, everything comes at you, let them all turn red (ie all shooting you), drop drones, bbq. From my extensive experience they never target drones unless you drop drones before they are all SHOOTING you.
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Caroline 888
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Posted - 2005.08.02 15:08:00 -
[19]
Any Chance of getting an official response to this so we know exactly what the rats are up to ??
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MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.02 15:17:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Caroline 888
Any Chance of getting an official response to this so we know exactly what the rats are up to ??
Ive done an "Ask a Question" but the last one i did was 8 days ago and nothing but autoreplys since. Could take a while 
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Caroline 888
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Posted - 2005.08.02 15:44:00 -
[21]
lol - you wouldnt think its that hard to post a thread - even if its just a link to an official thread with the updated behavior info on it ????
Ahh well....
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Yazoul Samaiel
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Posted - 2005.08.03 07:03:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Jocca Quinn
Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel
I already stopped taking noobs with me on missiosn coz i lost a guy in a Moa on another mish.
Yup same with me, funny this feature along with the balancing of missiles has changed my lvl4 missions from being fun corp/group encounters with different ships having different roles into a solo, cruise spamming bore fest.
Wait .. wasn't that suppose to be the other way around ??
JQ
LOOOOOL it is just funny when CCP say in the end that LVL 4 missiosn were not meant to be solo and then they claim afterwards that they are solo , and finaly now if u want to do them in groups u have to have very adanced ppl with u (BS , Hacs pilots) so if u have any noobs in ur corp they r doomed to mine till after cpl of months they can drive a hac with good setup or a BS.
"What ever that doesnt Kill me just makes me stronger" |
MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.03 12:44:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel
Originally by: Jocca Quinn
Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel
I already stopped taking noobs with me on missiosn coz i lost a guy in a Moa on another mish.
Yup same with me, funny this feature along with the balancing of missiles has changed my lvl4 missions from being fun corp/group encounters with different ships having different roles into a solo, cruise spamming bore fest.
Wait .. wasn't that suppose to be the other way around ??
JQ
LOOOOOL it is just funny when CCP say in the end that LVL 4 missiosn were not meant to be solo and then they claim afterwards that they are solo , and finaly now if u want to do them in groups u have to have very adanced ppl with u (BS , Hacs pilots) so if u have any noobs in ur corp they r doomed to mine till after cpl of months they can drive a hac with good setup or a BS.
Amen to that! Shame we cant get an answer. Im not even getting auto replys on 1 of my questions anymore
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IcedBach Jr
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Posted - 2005.08.03 13:18:00 -
[24]
Is there any worthwhile npc activity U can do in empire now? .0 U get bothered and shot at, pirated etc, in empire lv3s ??, not exactly worthwhile. I dont care about the raven, give me working drones.
Praeludium to success |
Zed Nash
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Posted - 2005.08.04 02:41:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Zed Nash on 04/08/2005 02:41:44
 "Drones for Dummies"
1) Never agro a spawn with your drones out, ever.
2) Wait for the ENTIRE spawn to target (yellow flashing boxes) and have lock (solid red boxes) before releasing.
3) On wave missions, scoop on the last ship in a wave, before the next wave spawns.
4) Sic your drones on one target at a time, don't let them run wild on multiple targets.
5) Don't let your drones do all your damage, put some guns on your ship.
6) Keep your drones close, scooping them for 5 seconds will repair shield damage and reset the agro to you.
Drones aren't broken, your tactics are.
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MacMillan
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Posted - 2005.08.04 13:09:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Zed Nash
Edited by: Zed Nash on 04/08/2005 02:41:44
"Drones for Dummies"
1) Never agro a spawn with your drones out, ever.
2) Wait for the ENTIRE spawn to target (yellow flashing boxes) and have lock (solid red boxes) before releasing.
3) On wave missions, scoop on the last ship in a wave, before the next wave spawns.
4) Sic your drones on one target at a time, don't let them run wild on multiple targets.
5) Don't let your drones do all your damage, put some guns on your ship.
6) Keep your drones close, scooping them for 5 seconds will repair shield damage and reset the agro to you.
Drones aren't broken, your tactics are.
As said before that is not so. ALL Targets attacking me i mean ALL in the Deadspace pocket. Let loose the drones and sometimes not allways my drones will be attacked even if the npc's are still firing at me too. Next time it happens i will try to get a screenshot of npc firing at 2 targets.
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Horb
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Posted - 2005.08.04 16:24:00 -
[27]
This target switching issue happens in 0.0 belts as well. I can't quite figure out what is causing them to switch targets . I always wait for them to target me and start shooting before I deploy drones. The real kicker is during some testing I notice the rat "boxes" turning from red to yellow without any drones deployed or anyone else in the belt with me. What gives?
It does seem though that if you can keep the rats aggroing you for at least a minute before you deploy your drones then the rats will not switch targets. When the rats do switch targets its very early in the fight so maybe it's time sensative.
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Bane Lord
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Posted - 2005.08.04 19:31:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Bane Lord on 04/08/2005 19:33:49
Originally by: Zed Nash
Edited by: Zed Nash on 04/08/2005 02:41:44
"Drones for Dummies"
1) Never agro a spawn with your drones out, ever.
2) Wait for the ENTIRE spawn to target (yellow flashing boxes) and have lock (solid red boxes) before releasing.
3) On wave missions, scoop on the last ship in a wave, before the next wave spawns.
4) Sic your drones on one target at a time, don't let them run wild on multiple targets.
5) Don't let your drones do all your damage, put some guns on your ship.
6) Keep your drones close, scooping them for 5 seconds will repair shield damage and reset the agro to you.
Drones aren't broken, your tactics are.
we're not a bunch of half witted drone noobs. this is a real issue. and from what i've seen, its REALLY erratic. sometimes they switch as soon as you launch drones (even when ALL of them were attacking you) other times they can go for several fights without switching targets...
I think its time for a real explination from CCP. as this has done little but diminish their goal of "encouraging" group play - beyond gate camps and gank squads.
EDIT:
Originally by: Haceldema
It seems from the missions i've been doing recently, NPC will not switch to your drones when they are at state B, turret fire. With the recent missile changes and resulting increase in missile ranges, especially for the 'cheating' NPCs, the NPCs engage earlier and it appears to be safe to launch drones.
I've pretty much always had NPCs switch to my drones when they have reached state A, missile fire, but not state B. When I noticed this I made sure to launch drones after they reached state B, within turret range, and I haven't lost a drone since.
thats an interesting assertion.... me thinks its time for a little testing 
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Haceldema
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Posted - 2005.08.04 19:31:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Haceldema on 04/08/2005 19:32:05
I think I know why more people are experiencing NPC's switching targets to drones atm.
From what i've seen so far NPCs have 2 fire/ activation ranges.
A) NPC is in missile range and starts firing missiles, NPC targetting indicator changes from flashing yellow to a red box.
B) NPC is in turret range and commences firing with turrets. (note: targetting indicator is most likely already red here since they are in missile range if they use missiles)
It seems from the missions i've been doing recently, NPC will not switch to your drones when they are at state B, turret fire. With the recent missile changes and resulting increase in missile ranges, especially for the 'cheating' NPCs, the NPCs engage earlier and it appears to be safe to launch drones.
I've pretty much always had NPCs switch to my drones when they have reached state A, missile fire, but not state B. When I noticed this I made sure to launch drones after they reached state B, within turret range, and I haven't lost a drone since.
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Horb
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Posted - 2005.08.04 20:42:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Haceldema
Edited by: Haceldema on 04/08/2005 19:32:05
I think I know why more people are experiencing NPC's switching targets to drones atm.
From what i've seen so far NPCs have 2 fire/ activation ranges.
A) NPC is in missile range and starts firing missiles, NPC targetting indicator changes from flashing yellow to a red box.
B) NPC is in turret range and commences firing with turrets. (note: targetting indicator is most likely already red here since they are in missile range if they use missiles)
It seems from the missions i've been doing recently, NPC will not switch to your drones when they are at state B, turret fire. With the recent missile changes and resulting increase in missile ranges, especially for the 'cheating' NPCs, the NPCs engage earlier and it appears to be safe to launch drones.
I've pretty much always had NPCs switch to my drones when they have reached state A, missile fire, but not state B. When I noticed this I made sure to launch drones after they reached state B, within turret range, and I haven't lost a drone since.
I think you're on to something there. Makes pretty good sense from what I said above.
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