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Put Kali on hold - Fix EVE first

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Ikvar	Posted - 2005.08.09 13:15:00 - [31] Originally by: Makhan WHERE IS THE COMET MINEING, HUH? HUH? WHERE IS THE GAS MINEING EHHH? WHERE IS THE FORUM SPELLCHECKER?! __________________ Ikvar & Sons Legal, WE WILL FIGHT FOR YOUR RIGHTS!
DJTheBaron	Posted - 2005.08.09 13:35:00 - [32] Kali is a big content patch, like an expansion right? Well that will need numerous bug fixes, rewriting and so forth. According to oveur content people cant code, so let them content their models, animations, textures, stats and all that fun stuff as much as they want, just dont take any programing away from bugfixing the server, and client and making the eve client more stable and less hungry for resources, since it seems still to be pretty inefficent. __________________________________________________ Scum, your all scum.
Kaylana Syi	Posted - 2005.08.09 13:51:00 - [33] Originally by: MooKids Originally by: BIRDofPREY If the last 2 years are indicative...? Really? I have seen some major improvements from the old days, servers becoming more stable (with a few problem periods aside) and fixes to major bugs. I would say that CCP is doing their job over there working on the major issues for us. POS's buggy? How so? Corp Tax? A minor issue. Client side lag? Maybe the clients need better computers. And have you actually been playing for these past 2 years? I agree. 2 years has gone past since I stepped into EVE and while I was fustrated around January 2004, they have totally regained any and all confidense in the develop of this supernatural game. I even respec tomB's weapon direction. </me wishes she hadn't been so hard on the guy> -------------------- The Nest
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2005.08.09 16:13:00 - [34] Originally by: Drilla Originally by: Makhan we all know that bugfixes will happen but it is true that they will take a long time. a few things that irk me to no end: WHERE IS THE COMET MINEING, HUH? HUH? WHERE IS THE GAS MINEING EHHH? enough with the pvp content, they have enough FOR NOW. Dont forget that not everybody in the game is a pvp maniak with a billion isk. Carebears quit the game everytime there's changes to their perfect little world (missiles changes anyone? Level 4 agent nerfing anyone?) PVP'ers adapt and keep playing. I wonder how is the most loyal customers Figures of players leaving, please, and their self-declared occupation and reasons, too. LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2005.08.09 16:19:00 - [35] Edited by: Joshua Calvert on 09/08/2005 16:20:33 Recent server problems are worrying - nobody sane could say the server problems have been less and less common in the past year. The biggest gripe I have with Eve is that there's still: 1) GUI bugs 2) Parts of the GUI don't fit neatly enough together (I think the buttons/radio buttons look really poor now especially with the lighting/highlights) and doesn't look "solid" (not opaque but well-made). 3) Module iconsare fuzzy (could be my GFX card, I admit) and some ofd them are just plain missing. 4) Inability to delete evemails, argh! 5) Is it me or does putting modules on a ship seem to take longer than ever? Often long delays while a module activates even without any lag issues LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Brolly	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:13:00 - [36] I'm not too excitted about new content or kali tbh, usually there are a load of cool things but most of them don't make it in, those cool things that do make it in are usually not quite as good as they could be and i'm still having fun with what's already in the game :) On reading content notes to come i'll take qauter of the cool things out. I'll then devide that by 2 and see half content as stuff which may never arive and the other half as stuff which doesn't quite cut it
Thyro	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:27:00 - [37] Originally by: BIRDofPREY So I dabbled in the DEV Blogs for a bit and was not pleased with what I read. Sure they are taking some responsiblity for all the problems in July, but now they are talking about new features. CCP - You have had problems with the client, the server, missing items from as far back as beta, some of which you have known about for almost 2 years. Yet you persist in throwing out new stuff that only compounds the problems. POS's are still buggy. Corp tax is barely implemented, Client side lag is making fleet battles impossible. The basic foundation of your game is in danger of rotting out - why don't you put Kali on hold until you get your house in order. Just a note... For long time that CCP adopted the same policy used by Microsoft MS deploy new versions where some unfixed bugs on previous versions are addressed and solved. But at same time, add new features which lead for more bugs, then they patch or fixed on next version The Microsoft excuse is a good one... Whatever you like or not, new software even if bugged generates a good income. If the new features make users dream about the new package, then any user will eat any s*hit given what ever the problems that piece of software has. Same happens with CCP If issues were addressed and not solved with patches. Then adding new versions where some of those critical issues are solved and adding more features (even if are bugged --- lets say --- not properly coded either tested) would shut up most of the players and inclusively will attract more players. Again new versions = $ Core players might remember bugs of previous versions and scream about them. However most of core player are vice already so not much a problem there! For most of players/potential players each feature is like a kid's candy where everyone will one day be proud to have and show to all that reached that point. However and not going of topic with software bugs and new versions. If the above does not happen in CCP then must be this... Must be some new wave of developer mentality to justify their job... fixing bugs and writing new code without quality and not tested enough. I personally hate this new mentality that is writing code on the fly, code that is not tested enough (all aspects and interactions) and rush it into production. Just because some YES manager that has his watch ticking or felt his two OO squeezed by a greedy CEO avid for more $$ I prefer the old school... make things properly on 1st attempt, fully tested to catch potential issues and re-test to make sure that all aspects were covered. Only then deploy into production once insured that doesn't fell apart during the implementation/upgrade/patch. Anyway the above might be ambiguous to someone not in the industry but this is what happens. What ever we like or not; some cases developers are to be blamed. But in most of the cases $$$ speak even lauder overwriting any kind of best practice or anyone that stands on the way.
Thyro	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:33:00 - [38] Originally by: Ikvar Originally by: Makhan WHERE IS THE COMET MINEING, HUH? HUH? WHERE IS THE GAS MINEING EHHH? WHERE IS THE FORUM SPELLCHECKER?! HE WAS TOO EXCITED WRITING THAT POST. Wasn't he?
MaiLina KaTar	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:34:00 - [39] Not gonna say the game hasn't improved or any of that gibberish, but one thing is for sure: If CCP wouldn't promise features prior to every single one of their big updates and then not deliver those features there would be no whining about it in the first place. Personally speaking I find it hard to understand how project management can approve the announcement of feature X when the implementation of that feature is not solid and at least 95% ready for launch. This makes it look like CCP is employing an "eyewash" policy and tbh I don't really think they need any of that. It makes them look unprofessional. Mai's Idealog
Cyleth	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:39:00 - [40] The random colours of overview is most likely the most annoying thing I have ever seen in EVE. And they should finally put in the filtering of neutral ships from overview. my 0,02isk -- Nobody stays behind
Psymon R	Posted - 2005.08.09 17:59:00 - [41] Originally by: Makhan we all know that bugfixes will happen but it is true that they will take a long time. a few things that irk me to no end: WHERE IS THE COMET MINEING, HUH? HUH? WHERE IS THE GAS MINEING EHHH? enough with the pvp content, they have enough FOR NOW. Dont forget that not everybody in the game is a pvp maniak with a billion isk. OK yes, if you look at the Exodus features page they mention comets and gas clouds however they never actually promised them, as the page does also state: Quote: Note : Some of these are conceptual designs that have not gone through thorough playtesting and are all subject to change. CCP reserves all rights to change, in part or completely the designs presented here. I must say though, it might be a good idea on the part of the devs if they were to remove any features given on there that have not made it into exodus (unless I suppose they were planning on putting them in before kali, but as Oveur said there will be no new features I guess this won't be the case!)
Galk	Posted - 2005.08.09 18:56:00 - [42] Originally by: Drilla [ Carebears quit the game everytime there's changes to their perfect little world (missiles changes anyone? Level 4 agent nerfing anyone?) PVP'ers adapt and keep playing. I wonder how is the most loyal customers You know the realy great thing..... There will allways be more 'cearbears' playing this game than the haters You obviously missed the thousand and one whine threads when they have nerfed numerious mods that played a big part in peoples pvp strategy over the last 2 and a bit years.. and the obvious we quit posts from some people that at the time couldn't get over it..... *btw most don't actualy quit... Imho a great thing -------- 23
Fortior	Posted - 2005.08.09 19:13:00 - [43] Originally by: BIRDofPREY Here is a perfect example of CCP knowing what is wrong, but not doing a thing about it... Linkage Ehrm, Birdieboy, did you happen to see the message the Mod left in that thread as he locked it? Or did you happen to see the dates of all the posts? Bringing sound, good arguments is all fine and dandy, raising the dead threads is not. It only serves as a flamebait.
Harisdrop	Posted - 2005.08.09 19:24:00 - [44] I vote lets put Kali in now! We need as many whiners quiting as possible. Cold War was the "I hate the missle changes" patch Kali will be the "R&D agents are too hard please go back to the lottery" -------------------------- Good thing PVP pilots dont do that! They are "initiating strategic military plans of aggression". They are not logging off to avoid an overwhelming fight!
Wraeththu	Posted - 2005.08.09 19:29:00 - [45] The world of Eve is a LOT better than it was even a year ago. It's 10 times better than it was 2 years ago, in both stability, content, player interaction ect. Content and Stability need to go hand in hand. little of this, little of that. The Castor release schedule was far too slow. I prefer their newer tendencies a lot more. I mean, I have some big gripes about Eve, but it's definetly not to do with stability or content vs QA ratio.
danneh	Posted - 2005.08.09 19:39:00 - [46] Id like my overview too work not show my corp members as war targets.
Wraeththu	Posted - 2005.08.09 19:43:00 - [47] Originally by: Thyro Anyway the above might be ambiguous to someone not in the industry but this is what happens. What ever we like or not; some cases developers are to be blamed. But in most of the cases $$$ speak even lauder overwriting any kind of best practice or anyone that stands on the way. Actually if you're in the "industry" then you should know better. I program medical software. If I make a mistake, there's a chance a RL person will die from it. Unsurprisingly, we're quiet careful about our code. (not to mention we have govermental orgs breathing down our throats and 'dropping by for a visit'/audit all the time). As a result, our release schedules are pretty lengthy. Our QA schedule is usually longer than the development schedule (including design, creation, unit testing, and documentation) An adoption by CCP to a zero defect policy (or at least a zero non-acceptable defect policy) would result in release times 2 to 3 times as lengthy. Which would mean we, right now, wouldn't even be up to Shiva. We'd still be rocking Castor code. Who would still be playing this game if we were still back with the castor codeset? I'm betting considerably few. Definetly considerably fewer than we have now with the current release schedule. It's a game, you need to relax some
R Dan	Posted - 2005.08.09 20:07:00 - [48] As Has been said a Gazillion times, its 2 different teams, call them: Projects and Support if you like. they are 2 completely different sets of people.... Bite me....for i taste good :)
Tenashi	Posted - 2005.08.09 20:40:00 - [49] tbh, the last 3-4 months of castor was how eve supposed to work seperated corp mails (now they don`t delete), stable servers, stable clients, less laggy client (mail anyone?) etc etc etc /me waves 2 cancelations at ccp and offline money making bpo researching
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.08.09 20:49:00 - [50] CCP want us to acculmulate hundreds of corp evemails without the CEOs being able to delete - everyone spam em up cause it will lag it andm ake em fix it.
Corey Grim	Posted - 2005.08.10 08:50:00 - [51] ummm.....ummmm... i see only 2 major problems/bugs/whatever in EVE atm. 1. overview still messes colors (altho not so often anymore) but i dont like to accidently shoot my friend down.. 2.CTD¦s: LOT of players have ctd¦s when jumping between win and EVE (alt-tab, or win key) this is the most dangerous and annoying bug. im not whining coz CCP is doing great job fixing things and adding new stuff. but these 2 issues should be their primary atm. imo if they dont fix those before adding kali (and i mean separate hotfix) it MIGHT come HUGE problem after kali is added. lag is one thing to discuss yes but what i have seen CCP is doing something to it all the time. so ppl stop those "my wallet blinks but no transactions has happened" whines

Oveur	Posted - 2005.08.10 11:14:00 - [52] Lets get one thing straight first. Kali - as an expansion - includes not only new features but a number of rewrites in code. Examples are a new Turret system and a new Effects system. Our renderer is getting an overhaul, the sound sub-system will get stabilization work, drones and other high server cpu systems are getting optimization etc. For short, Kali is a new code branch, where we utilize the fact that it gets sufficient testing allowing us to rewrite or do major overhauls to current systems, something which is impossible to do on a regular patch release schedule. Hence, people that are unsatisfied with a number of bugs in EVE should rejoice that we are starting work on the Kali branch, because it means things like 2 of our programmers will start working on the new Turrets and Effects systems. I should probably blog this, this seems to be a common misunderstanding with Kali. _____________________________ I say hey sky, s'other say I won say, I pray to J I get the same ol' same ol.


Eris Discordia	Posted - 2005.08.10 11:16:00 - [53] Fl... Blog It! I ♥ my pink dreadnought of pwnage Mail [email protected] if you have any questions.

DJTheBaron	Posted - 2005.08.10 11:29:00 - [54] thats all well and good, hey kali might be the best content and code soloution evarrrrrrrrrr but its going to take over 6 months, probably well over we dont want to wait that long to have a stable gaming enviroment i'd say that is the main concern __________________________________________________ Scum, your all scum.
Winterblink	Posted - 2005.08.10 12:32:00 - [55] I love how people focus on comet and gas cloud mining. That's two features that didn't make it when what, 20 or so ended up being completed? And that's only the major stuff, Exodus included hundreds of tweaks, enhancements, and improvements. So ok, comets and gas mining aren't in. I'm pretty sure that's for a good reason (balance issues, bugs, etc). ___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie//
Loka	Posted - 2005.08.10 13:03:00 - [56] Originally by: Oveur Examples are a new Turret system and a new Effects system. Dont scare me pls, i just got used to the current Turretsystem ;P Originally by: Oveur Our renderer is getting an overhaul, the sound sub-system will get stabilization work, drones and other high server cpu systems are getting optimization etc. I heared from others, that the sound in EVE is awsome. Sad but true, Sound/Music is off from start, when iam playing EVE and want to play lagfree. :) Dont get me wrong the game is buityfull, but everyone i showed said same. "WOW awsome graphic, but where is the sound?" Me:"Off, i cant play with sound, when fighting :(" Originally by: Oveur For short, Kali is a new code branch, where we utilize the fact that it gets sufficient testing allowing us to rewrite or do major overhauls to current systems, something which is impossible to do on a regular patch release schedule. Hence, people that are unsatisfied with a number of bugs in EVE should rejoice that we are starting work on the Kali branch, because it means things like 2 of our programmers will start working on the new Turrets and Effects systems. I should probably blog this, this seems to be a common misunderstanding with Kali. Iam curious and excited ... give it to me baby ... ah ah ... _____________________________________ Dead or Alive
Eyeshadow	Posted - 2005.08.10 13:18:00 - [57] I think Oveur said a new turret and effect system he meant the graphics & calculations side of it, as in to try and reduce the lag when multiple ships are involved. The ctrl/alt/shift t+e that was brought in was a stop gap til they could rework the way the game calculated everything. He didnt mean a new system as in the sig radius/tracking thing etc etc As for sound, ive played with sound on all the time and have never had any problems with it The GUI works fine for me and looks much better imo, a lot more functional. As for the overview, sort ya priorities out, this fixes the gang members showing as war target. Do it like this: Turn a low priority off (so it doesnt show at all). I used players with bounties for this as im not interested in knowing if they have one Then place war targets underneath that then horrible standing then bad standing then however u see fit after that. After doing this i have NEVER had anything show up incorrectly Forums: Sharks * MC
SpaceDrake Storyteller	Posted - 2005.08.10 13:35:00 - [58] Oveur, I think you misunderstood what some people are saying. Yes, the idea of an overhauled renderer makes me (and everyone else I bet) sexy on the inside. But there are bugs - fairly critical bugs - that need addressing ASAP. The overview comes to mind prominently. Are you saying that we'll need to wait some six months for these issues to be addressed? That's what people are worried about, I think. Oh, and can we get confirmation that Kali's working title is "The Great War"? Please? -------------- What good are actions if there's no one to tell the tale afterward? Player of the character "Lucca Deradi." Former player of "Andre Ricard."
Discorporation	Posted - 2005.08.10 13:36:00 - [59] Originally by: SpaceDrake Storyteller Oveur, I think you misunderstood what some people are saying. Yes, the idea of an overhauled renderer makes me (and everyone else I bet) sexy on the inside. But there are bugs - fairly critical bugs - that need addressing ASAP. The overview comes to mind prominently. Are you saying that we'll need to wait some six months for these issues to be addressed? That's what people are worried about, I think. That's a BugFix. They always have priority [Come to Daddy]
Eyeshadow	Posted - 2005.08.10 14:26:00 - [60] Originally by: SpaceDrake Storyteller Oveur, I think you misunderstood what some people are saying. Yes, the idea of an overhauled renderer makes me (and everyone else I bet) sexy on the inside. But there are bugs - fairly critical bugs - that need addressing ASAP. The overview comes to mind prominently. Are you saying that we'll need to wait some six months for these issues to be addressed? That's what people are worried about, I think. Oh, and can we get confirmation that Kali's working title is "The Great War"? Please? do you just read the DEV's post and ignore every1 elses? I told you, in the post about yours, how to fix the overview Forums: Sharks * MC

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