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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
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mxmus
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:11:00 -
[1]
A new Flash based tracking guide has been added to the Player Guide. It will explain how turrets actually work and how distance, signature radius, signature resolution, transversal velocity and tracking speed affect turrets.
So if you want to gain more understanding of how turrets work then you want to check this out.
EVE TRACKING GUIDE
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Dust Puppy
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:17:00 -
[2]
w00t 
Awesome work
Original Mr Floppyknickers sig |
Avon
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:20:00 -
[3]
Can I make a small suggestion for ease of use?
Duplcate the navigation arrows at the bottom of the screen - save scrolling up to change page on lower resolution displays.
Otherwise, very good.
______________________________________________
Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
Tehel Necrona
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:24:00 -
[4]
yeah, good guide, and i was gonna comment on the nav arrows aswell ( couldn't find them at first :P )
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MadGaz
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:26:00 -
[5]
Very Nice
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Matthew
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Posted - 2005.08.25 09:49:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Tehel Necrona
it's just that a ship turning towards it's target would seem help the turrets, as the turrets base is mounted to the ship, which is turning.
The key to this is the same as why you have trouble tracking when you're orbitting a stationary target, even though the gun pointing shouldn't have to change.
Eve doesn't consider the gun seperately from the ship, and doesn't even consider the orientation of the ship, as far as I can tell.
All it considers is the reletive positions and velocities of your ship. Which means te "boresight" approach isn't as good as it intuitively looks (and theoretically should be). The ideal course is to get yourself moving parallel to the course of the target, and match it's speed. Which means flying side-on to your target, and usually needs some nifty manual piloting. Of course, that's rather tricky to do with a battleship that flies like a brick.
It's one of those cases where eve diverges slightly from proper physics for the sake of server load.
Beware those beyond here, for they cannot see evil. |
Matthew
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Posted - 2005.08.25 10:19:00 -
[7]
In fact, for a clearer picture why approaching a much more maneuverable target doesn't help, check out that flash bit in the guide with the vectors.
The fast frigate will be in a pretty good orbit whatever you do, as it's so much faster and more maneuverable than your battleship. So set the green velocity perpendicular to the pink line, and reletively large.
Now, take the blue battleship. It's a lot slower, so shrink down that velocity vector appropriately. Now, even if we assume you can turn fast enough to keep facing the frigate, you're at most facing, or probably lagging a bit behind. So aim the vector at, or just behind the green blob. Not really helping the transverse, is it.
Now, the frigate is likely to orbit faster than you can turn. To simulate this, rotate the blue vector in a circle. As you can see, it's best to time your shots to coincide with the dip in transverse velocity as the frigate is "overtaking" you in it's orbit.
So, turning doesn't really help if you can't get in a parallel course. Your best chance is actually to fly straight to maximise your velocity, so that you get a lower minimum during that "overtaking" period of the frigate's orbit.
Beware those beyond here, for they cannot see evil. |
Tobiaz
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Posted - 2005.08.25 10:41:00 -
[8]
A 'new' tracking guide?!
I THINK NOT!!!
I hope that this was not simply copied from the original but done with consent of the person made that guide.
Spacerats recruiting! |
Vee Bot
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Posted - 2005.08.25 10:49:00 -
[9]
Wow, yes it may be similer to the other guide as pionted out by Tobiaz but that last calculation thingy is simply amazing, so glad someone took the time to do it properly
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Remember that your Unique, like everyone else. |
FireFoxx80
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Posted - 2005.08.25 11:07:00 -
[10]
Seems very buggy/slow.
Possibly one of the 23 # ex: P-TMC | USAC |
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mxmus
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Posted - 2005.08.25 11:13:00 -
[11]
The Tracking Guide on the EVE sites was actually made for us by the same person (aka Weasel) that created the orginal tracking guide, which is mentioned above.
Some changes have been made to the formulas so it should now be more accurate than before.
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spookz
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Posted - 2005.08.25 11:18:00 -
[12]
Nice 
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The Weasel
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Posted - 2005.08.25 13:38:00 -
[13]
Edited by: The Weasel on 25/08/2005 19:17:00
Edited by: The Weasel on 25/08/2005 13:51:44
Edited by: The Weasel on 25/08/2005 13:42:24
about the guide being a bit slow:
Unfortunately Flash isnt very fast in calculating and displaying grafics so if things move around and formulas need to be calculated then it takes a while depending on your CPU-performance and CPU-usage. If its so bad its not bearable anymore, then make sure you run no other program meanwhile. But actually it worked rather well up tp absolutely smoothly on all CPUs I tested it.
about this guide being a copy:
Its actually based on my old tracking guide. just improved text, added examples and display for a better understanding, improved the chart wiz to compare dmg/s and added a print option.
about the gun position relative to the ship:
afaik that is completely ignored - as already mentioned above. This is ofc a bit unreal, but I guess that makes the calculations much easier for the servers and doesnt really decrease fun of dog-fights imo.
about nav-arrows:
I'll send CCP a version with nav-arrows at the bottom for better usage within the next days
about printing:
we had to remove a background picture to fit it better into this site. This caused that the prints are black font on black background instead of black on white. this will also be updated together with the nav arrows in version 1.01 - so DO NOT PRINT THE GUIDE ATM
best regards,
The Weasel
add:
Printer problem is solved - guide is printable now
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.08.25 13:44:00 -
[14]
Excellent work, Weas and CCP.
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Jaabaa Prime
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Posted - 2005.08.25 13:54:00 -
[15]
Excellent work Weasel, and nice of you CCP guys to have him make an official version for the main site.
Now, this shows how to use the broken (err I meant current) tracking, will the tracking be fixed some day to work correctly and then do we get an updated guide too ? 
--
Intergalactic Teeth Pullers
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
Albert Einstein |
Thuban Draconis
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:08:00 -
[16]
Thanks Weasel.
I was pretty confused about gunnery until I saw your original gunnery pageà Then everything became clear.
This guide should be required reading for all new Eve players.
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solosnake
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:13:00 -
[17]
Any chance of changing the colour scheme please? Printing it on a B&W printer is made very difficult currently. I'm holding 5 almost pure black pages in my hand now and my print cartridge is left low on health
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Avon
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:14:00 -
[18]
Originally by: solosnake
Any chance of changing the colour scheme please? Printing it on a B&W printer is made very difficult currently. I'm holding 5 almost pure black pages in my hand now and my print cartridge is left low on health
FFS, read the thread.
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Pay or pray..er..prey..yeah, pray you aren't prey. Er, just pay. |
Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:28:00 -
[19]
Nice one, although its more fun to hope for a hit against all odds than give up "coz its impossible, I just checked the charts!" ^^
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:28:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Avon
FFS, read the thread.
Sometimes I think you ask too much of this community, Avon.
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MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2005.08.25 15:56:00 -
[21]
Go Go The Weasel \o/ - your original was very useful
MOOrovingian "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
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mxmus
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Posted - 2005.08.25 16:25:00 -
[22]
Weasel acted very fast and has implemented some changes as some of you suggested.
1. Implemented nav-arrows at the bottom of the guide
2. implemented white background to the printed pages so the font on those isnt black on black but black on white again as before we removed the background picture.
Thanks Weasel, great work on this.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.08.25 16:31:00 -
[23]
Edited by: j0sephine on 25/08/2005 16:31:16
A very nice guide... one thing that'd make it even more lovely would be predefined presets for the common turret types, for the wizard thingie? ^^;;
(another would be similar guide explaining the new missile mechanics ;s
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Khaldorn Murino
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Posted - 2005.08.25 16:32:00 -
[24]
Cheers Weasel, Turrets always leave me very confused. Thanks for the help!
-
Just a simple warrior.
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Bottled Brain
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Posted - 2005.08.25 16:44:00 -
[25]
Do you really think that was a good idea?
dual 650mm - ion blaster - mega pulse
transversal 200
transversal 100
transversal 50
*lol
It¦s more a joke, so bear with me if any stats are wrong.
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Vishnej
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Posted - 2005.08.25 17:24:00 -
[26]
Frickin' Awesome!
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Jaabaa Prime
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Posted - 2005.08.25 18:07:00 -
[27]
Having a chart like this in-game as a 5th tab on a weapon show info would just be awesome !
Use the ammo loaded for range stuff and for the target information you could just select a ship type, use base resistances and sig radius, add a transversal velocity slider.
It would be so cool 
--
Intergalactic Teeth Pullers
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
Albert Einstein |
DigitalCommunist
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Posted - 2005.08.25 19:39:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Tehel Necrona
one thing i always wondered about, that i have never bothered to figure out is this:
If a BS being orbitted by a frigate or fast cruiser approaches the orbitting ship so the BS is constantly turning towards the orbitting ship... does that help with the turrets tracking ?
The gun rotates on a base mounted to the ship, it doesn't care where the ship is pointed. But your tracking will work better if you move towards or away from a target if your velocities are similar. Like if a frig orbits a zealot at 15k and the zealot starts mwding in one direction the orbit is going to be long and wide like an oval and it might decrease the transverse enough for the zealot to hit.
In a bs it wouldn't matter unless the frig was webbed and the battleship was using neutrons.
Anyhow, great guide. I had no problems using it.
Perpetually driven, your end is our beginning.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.08.25 19:42:00 -
[29]
What happened to the mystery of Eve? 
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Auraurious
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Posted - 2005.08.25 20:15:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Auraurious on 25/08/2005 20:15:55
one thing im not sure about: Theoretically if you we orbiting around a ship twice as fast as the turret, the turret would have one small window to shoot every two orbits, but if you were to put on a mwd and orbit 10 times as fast, the turret would actually have more chances two hit you. because your moving so fast, the window of opportunity goes by much quicker, but the sig radius bonus of the mwd makes it a much bigger window, essentially negating each others effects. so from what i see here, it looks like theres actually more of a chance to hit an inty or fast frig point blank should they be using an mwd, even if the other ships turrets have a pathetic time tracking you without it. my question: does eve physics coding allow for this two happen, or should i keep my mwd on once i reach a target?
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There are 3,259,687 bunnies left in signatures from all over the world... The rest scored a 9.489 on taste test charts. |
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