Originally by: Redblade

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Some ideas could work but im all against any nerf of dmg mods untill wcs have got a stacking penalty that makes sens.

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Note the calculations here. A geddon with 8 damage mods does 2.67 times as much damage as a geddon with zero.

That means a geddon with zero stabs does utterly worthless damage...

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Originally by: mahhy

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Note the calculations here. A geddon with 8 damage mods does 2.67 times as much damage as a geddon with zero.

That means a geddon with zero stabs does utterly worthless damage...

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It still does more damage than an Apoc, assuming the same guns fitted.

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Originally by: Meridius

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Adapt or die.

Full gank setups are just stupid these days with plates anyway, if you still see lows crammed with only heatsinks as a good setup, you suck.

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Originally by: Evil Thug

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Originally by: Meridius

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Adapt or die.

Full gank setups are just stupid these days with plates anyway, if you still see lows crammed with only heatsinks as a good setup, you suck.

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^^

What he said. Gank configs just suck. And if you cant counter it - go cry somewhere else.

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Originally by: mahhy

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Note the calculations here. A geddon with 8 damage mods does 2.67 times as much damage as a geddon with zero.

That means a geddon with zero stabs does utterly worthless damage...

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It still does more damage than an Apoc, assuming the same guns fitted.

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The apoc is only effective because of its tank. It can last while doing damage.

The stabageddon can neither tank NOR deal damage.

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Originally by: Hamatitio

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In anything other than a 1v1 (maybe a 2 v 2) Gank setups own.

The right setup a tank will beat a gank in a 1 v 1, and depending on the amount of plates, they might win the 2 v 2. I cant see 3 tanks winning a 3 v 3 against 3 ganks though.

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Originally by: jukriamrr

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I'd like to see how pilots are supposed to adapt when 7 gankageddons shoot at them from 100+ km...

Now How much would their 'adaptation' last? 2 seconds? Less? Phew.

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Edited by: Dark Shikari on 27/08/2005 14:20:59

1) Make the stacking penalty on all items (damage mods are just the most commonly used) sane. For example, if we're talking damage and each gives 10%, they could give 10%, then 6.5%, then 4.2%, then 2.75%, then 1.78%, etc. This is using a 35% decrease in efficiency each time. Thus, you wouldn't start getting increasing benefits past more than a few. This idea wouldn't change much else, as I don't know any items that are stacked like damage mods. It would also very slightly gimp people using three of the same hardener... though that isn't entirely a bad thing.

2) Make damage mods and such have penalties. For example, a heatsink would decrease tracking. The advantage of this is that it will make gank setups much less effective at shorter ranges. The disadvantage is that it wouldn't stop sniper setups. You might have to add a range decrease as well for that, but that might make the damage mods useless to begin with.

3) Raise fitting requirements on damage mods. This may help, but I would also worry that this would benefit ships with extra CPU too much and gimp those with too little CPU. People would just end up switching to the ships with the most CPU, and using more named guns. Faction weapon upgrades would become more popular, doing even more damage...

4) Limit each player to one damage mod. Too extreme, IMO.

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Originally by: j0sephine

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Edited by: j0sephine on 28/08/2005 11:08:36

"this is like saying scorpion with loads of ew is overpowered and forces every 1 else to use back up arrays. lets nerf how ew works (..)"

They did :s

(people still complain eccm isn't effective enough at the moment btw, and they might be right by the looks of it)

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Originally by: Dark Shikari

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Originally by: Redblade

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Some ideas could work but im all against any nerf of dmg mods untill wcs have got a stacking penalty that makes sens.

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WCS are just fine.

Note the calculations here. A geddon with 8 damage mods does 2.67 times as much damage as a geddon with zero.

That means a geddon with zero stabs does utterly worthless damage...

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Originally by: j0sephine

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"because proj atm need dmg + rof... and the fact that you fit so low ammo... lasers have no ammo... think if you just placed ROF then the frequency at which you have to reload is increased a great deal... making your dps go down a lot more then if you had just the dmg mods..."

maxed skills and tempest bonus against regular resistances.
damage calculations include reload time.

1400 II with no damage mods: 29 dps
1400 II with all-damage mods: 43.70 dps
1400 II with all-rof mods: 44.75 dps

for comparison, 425mm rail mounted on Megathron:

425mm II with no damage mods: 29.98 dps
425mm II with all-damage mods: 45.19 dps
425mm II with all-rof mods: 47.32 dps

the difference between 1400mm artillery and 425mm rail with all-rof modules is ~8%

now compare it with current damage mods:

1400 II: 60.55 dps, 425mm II: 71.31 dps

currently the difference between these guns is 17% or so.

This change not only wouldn't "screw" the projectile users when compared to others, but actually makes the projectiles *better* in comparison, since it narrows the gap between turret types.

Go figure --;;

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Originally by: Jim Raynor

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The whole fact you are missing here is that I am talking about reducing the damage output on all ships. Armageddon is simply the finest example of why stacking damage mods can go horribly wrong as it is by far the biggest damage dealing ship in the game.

Nerfing damage mod stacking nerfs everyone to some degree.

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Originally by: mahhy

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Originally by: Jim Raynor

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The whole fact you are missing here is that I am talking about reducing the damage output on all ships. Armageddon is simply the finest example of why stacking damage mods can go horribly wrong as it is by far the biggest damage dealing ship in the game.

Nerfing damage mod stacking nerfs everyone to some degree.

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Hah, yes I missed that. Thought you were on about the Arma specifically.

My point stands though, about 5 low slots versus 8. Nerf it too much and the Arma loses the only thing its good at.

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Originally by: Meridius

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Station taking is going to be real fun after nerfed dmg mods as well as killing POS eh jim jim :|

It breaks far too much so drop it

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Originally by: j0sephine

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Edited by: j0sephine on 29/08/2005 02:29:06

"because proj atm need dmg + rof... and the fact that you fit so low ammo... lasers have no ammo... think if you just placed ROF then the frequency at which you have to reload is increased a great deal... making your dps go down a lot more then if you had just the dmg mods..."

maxed skills and tempest bonus against regular resistances.
damage calculations include reload time.

1400 II with no damage mods: 29 dps
1400 II with all-damage mods: 43.70 dps
1400 II with all-rof mods: 44.75 dps

for comparison, 425mm rail mounted on Megathron:

425mm II with no damage mods: 29.98 dps
425mm II with all-damage mods: 45.19 dps
425mm II with all-rof mods: 47.32 dps

the difference between 1400mm artillery and 425mm rail with all-rof modules is ~8%

now compare it with current damage mods:

1400 II: 60.55 dps, 425mm II: 71.31 dps

currently the difference between these guns is 17% or so.

This change not only wouldn't "screw" the projectile users when compared to others, but actually makes the projectiles *better* in comparison, since it narrows the gap between turret types.

Go figure --;;

edit: for mega pulses on geddon numbers go like:

mega pulse II, no mods: 40.77
mega pulse II, damage mods: 64.15
mega pulse II, rof mods: 69.10
mega pulse II, current: 108.74

again, the gap is reduced from 54% difference to 46% ... and it works in similar manner for beam lasers. Yeah, would really spank those projectile users hard >>;;

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Originally by: Drutort

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dps is one thing DOT is another...

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