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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Felix Judge
Gallente Volunteer Defense Forces
Tribal Band
0
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Posted - 2013.03.26 13:51:00 -
[31] - Quote
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:[...]
3) GIVE EVERYONE A BUILT IN MINING BOT?!?!
[...] So give people mining bots that will let them mine and
Which actually amounts to just this:
Gallamoth Sickle wrote: [...] In this way you will basically be giving the player a passive ISK income to mach the passive experience they get. [...]
Which in itself is has zero real effect. Due to a phenomenom called inflation.
Giving everyone a passive income will just increase the amount of ISK in the game, which means (added) inflation, meaning that additional money will only be spent on the increased prices everything will cost, which after all means your "added" income will really amount to nothing.
Btw, there is already at least one technique for a "passive" income, and that is Planetary Interaction. Which means you have to invest at least some effort to get that passive income, which I think is more reasonable. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
539
|
Posted - 2013.03.26 14:58:00 -
[32] - Quote
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
Players that can bot sit in high sec and make large amounts of money with no risk, and now that the mining barges have been changed to make them more resistant to suicide ganks that problem has gotten even worse.
Suicide ganks were the problem, driving away carebears and casual gamers from CCP's revenue stream. Stronger tank was a solution, to the problem.
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
There are endless threads about how this game is moving more and more away from low sec and player vs player, to high sec and player vs environment. This statement i think we can all say is true.
I do not agree at all. It is attracting a wider audience, not "moving" players. So, there used to be 200K players, and 50% were in low-null trying to shoot each other in the face. And now,,. 500K players with 25% out in low/null trying to shoot each other in the face. That means there are just as many players in low/null trying to shoot each other in the face.
How would the game be better for you if CCP's revenue stream crashed back to what it was back when there were only 200K people playing the game?
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
2) Nerf the mining output of all ships by a flat percentage as this flat percentage nerf will come into play in next step.
Breaking the mission/mining equilibrium, that has been established since the removal of drone compounds. Carebears park their missioning ships and go mining.
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
Mining is already so boring you can almost feel your brain cells dieing with every cycle of your lasers.
TOO YOU!
If you don't like it, then don't do it. Some of us actually enjoy rolling into a belt, locking up some rocks, turning on the lasers, and then moving large sums of ore from space rock to orca hold.
As for mini-game... it is called scanning the rocks, then cycling your lasers at just the right time to pop the rock without wasting crystal cycles (stopping the laser too soon) or wasted cycle time (going longer on the laser than needed to pop the rock in the last cycle).
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
This is one of the reasons so many people use mining bots. Its not only because they can make money without being there but because to mine and make any decent usable ISK doing so requires un-godly amounts of mind numbing hours.
They bot because they are no good, immoral cheaters.
With 4 accounts, I can pull in 50 million ISK an hour or more. 10 hours a week (1.5 hours a day) pays for the PLEX and another 10 hours a week nets me a couple billion a month positive cash flow.
I don't call that "ungodly amounts of hour". I call that playing a game that I enjoy, in a way that I enjoy it.
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Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens
Viro Mors Non Est
244
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Posted - 2013.03.26 17:13:00 -
[33] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:Giving everyone a mining bot would be horrifically bad.
Part of the reason CCP tries to get rid of bots (aside from ISK sales) is that by being able to operate by themselves for long periods of time without supervision, they are able to collect a lot of ore which skews supply, depressing income from not only mining, but manufacture. In short bots are extremely bad for the in game economy, so giving one to everyone would wreck the economy. Besides, a bot for everyone would not have the effect you seem to want from them. It is not an ISK printing service, since you still have to sell the ore, and all the additional ore that this would cause to show up on the market would cause the price of ore to tank, quickly making said bots of little value to the players and utterly destroying mining as a profession. Hold on... More and more cheaper minerals on the market is bad for players in what way? Ships would be cheaper to buy and use. People would find it easier to do stuff when they don't need to work countless of hours to get the isks for a shiny ship they neeed and so on. How is this a bad thing that prices would come down? They have been going up for the past god know how long now. Plus if everyone had a bot at least everyone would be on the same level. You could not complain that someone is botting cause you could do it also. I'm not saying I totaly agree with this bot idea but at least the op explains him self and has few good points. As I said, it would drive down the cost of minerals, destroying mining as a profession, because it would become impossible rather than just hard to make an honest living off of it. Also, reason prices are going up is due to inflation due to too much injection of ISK into the economy. That's related to NPC related income since it isn't governed by supply and demand, but bots do their share in aggravating the problem |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
2765
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Posted - 2013.03.26 21:55:00 -
[34] - Quote
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:well if you dont like the idea of a game created bot too bad cause your playing a game where everyone with a months supbscription in their bank account has one
This is blatantly false & you know it. No game is designed for the purposes of botting. People who want to bot will always attempt to justify it.
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:if you want to lvl the playing field for all players and eliminate botting all together id like to hear your alternative and better itdea
The current system is working fine within it's limits. CCP are regularly smacking people with bans for botting & they've reduced the 3-strike system down to 2.
Apparently booking your flight & accomodation to Iceland BEFORE you buy the tickets for the convention which is pretty much the only reason you wanted to go there in the first place is popular. |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
2765
|
Posted - 2013.03.26 21:58:00 -
[35] - Quote
That's not proof of botting at all.
Apparently booking your flight & accomodation to Iceland BEFORE you buy the tickets for the convention which is pretty much the only reason you wanted to go there in the first place is popular. |
Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
32
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Posted - 2013.03.26 22:33:00 -
[36] - Quote
No.
I read the post so to each proposal:
1. Nerfing mining ships hurts the non-bot players, so I don't see how that is a good thing.
2. The "mini-game" will probably just result in a work-around or bots will simply accept the less than optimal mining yield. As for real players it sounds like a pain. Sure for a few minutes keeping the optimal range might be amusing, but it will get boring damn fast.
3. Including a bot for every player that mines...sorry but that legitimizes botting. How can CCP ban people for botting when CCP gives everyone a bot?
As to the notion of passive income, why not just reprogram the game so that everyone gets 4 million isk/hour for every hour they are logged in and in space?
There is a reason why passive income is frowned upon in game. It can seriously distort the economy if players can find a way to increase that source of income. Inflation will just runaway and newer players will be made worse of (oh looky Malcanis' Law).
I'm sorry, but all of these proposals should simply be rejected summarily.
Quote:so you are sayng CCP means for mining to be dull, moneyless action that is only viable with multiple accounts?
Of course not. Mining used to be even less lucrative back when I started (when we had to fly around without even ships or pods...barefoot in the snow and uphill...). Back then tritanium was between 2-3 isk/unit. Now it is around 6 for Jita buy orders. And OMG nocxium prices! If I was lucky I'd get 100 isk/unit (IIRC) now it is 800+/unit.
As for dealing with the dull nature of mining, I'd recommend mining in a fleet of friends...on comms like TS so you can talk and pass the time in a more enjoyable fashion. |
Unkind Omen
Stone Circle
W-Space
12
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Posted - 2013.03.27 02:39:00 -
[37] - Quote
Botting cannot be stopped by any kind of programm means. Neither protection mechanics "ingame bots" nor gameplay complexity will not stop people from wanting everything be done for them. The one and only way to deal with this stuff is human control over the environment which includes sanity control by killing bots that do not prepared for the surprise attack or economical selfcorrections made to values of ware provided by bots. However the current security status system in EVE protects bots in high-sec space. That happens because there is a great amount of people in EVE's playerbase that cannot be distinguished from bots from other player's point of view. A typical example of those are high-sec agent runners and miners, null sec anomaly ratters. Why do those people generate wealth infinitely and never spend it? Because they can and want to. The sense of generating some wealth is pleaseing for them. And that is fine. You cant just make people spend what they've earned because you want them to do so.
However you, CCP, can and must separate the wealth that can be generated by playing "Zero-risk EVE" from the rest of the universe to keep it fare. That means that any passive or riskless income should be possible to achive faster with some risk. There also should be unique resources that are not possible to generate by riskless playstyle at all. This means - no pure ISK generation in high sec space. Stop it. ISK is universal resource. Replace it with loot/Minerals/Loyality shop rewards where it is necessary and let the player driven economy solve this equation for you. Another good example of this policy would be a complete removal of 3-5 best minerals from meta 0 reprocessing.
The reason for that ISKcide is the fact that it binds profitability of too many aspects of the EVE universe together. And the brief consequence of having bots in any economy secotr will be the drop of the price on coresponding riskless wares of which only bots care.
PS I am not asking for a high sec NERF. I ask for a fairly compensated rebalance of high-sec resources(minerals, incursions,and agent running). |
Anthar Thebess
REPUBLIKA ORLA
C0VEN
85
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Posted - 2013.03.27 14:42:00 -
[38] - Quote
Giving :
- all players ( not moon mining - as alliance pos block others)
- in sanctioned way
- to get minerals in some passive way
- in smaller quantities than by actively pursuing them
- OUTSIDE OF HIGSEC
- with some costly machinery
- without big ehp / reinforce timers so it must be guarded
Could bring something new.
I'm not saying bot - but some installation.
If we like this or not - all ships are build from minerals that someone have to mine first.
If this action will bring mineral prices down - and with this ship prices i can accept this.
I prefer to loose 5 ships than 1 - because this will mean more fun.
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