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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 23 post(s) |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2359
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Posted - 2013.03.27 07:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
brb buying all the railguns
<3
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2359
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Posted - 2013.03.27 09:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
unimatrix0030 wrote:So will a blaster-talos be able to hit a large tower after this nerf? If not there won't be any gallente ship usuable to remove posses from C1 wormholes... .
Rail Talos.
This TE change doesn't really mean much, but the nerd rage of the whinematards is highly amusing. As clueless as ever, they keep equalling ship speed and range to player skill, and go on about complaining that removing OGBs hurt skilled players in the same post.
Furthermore there really aren't that many blaster ships that use TEs and would suffer in any meaningful way from this tweak.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2365
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Posted - 2013.03.27 17:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
So keeping range in a faster ship is "tricky", and trying to catch them with a slower ship is "simple"?
Ok.
Being able to engage larger gangs, get kills and not die is not OP?
Ok.
Nano kiting blasters ships are not broken by design?
Ok.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2366
|
Posted - 2013.03.27 18:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote: It's pretty straightforward when you're fighting one other ship, but have you ever tried maintaining range from a whole bunch of things at once when they're coming at you at different speeds and from different directions? It's not so easy!
Kiting ships are able to engage larger gangs, get kills and not die when the pilots in the opposing gang make mistakes. If they maneuver carefully / intelligently you can't really kill them. You have to let yourself be kited.
Nano kiting blaster ships are absolutely not broken, I don't even know what your'e talking about (coincidentally I don't think you know either!). Blaster setups are generally slower than Minmatar cruisers, do less damage at range and have inferior tracking, so I'm not really sure what you're on about. There's a reason the only commonly-seen blaster kiter is the nano Talos...
If they were faster than you, it would be impossible.
I do agree that you need to be ******** to burn straight towards a faster ship with more range :D
I mean that the whole existence of nano kiting blaster ships is broken, and the single culprit is TE.
Yes, most ships are slower than the fastest cruisers in game, duh. However, post-Retribution Gallente blaster ships are very close in speed, and blasters have in fact the best tracking. This is even more prominent on tracking-bonused hulls.
I'd personally like to see close-range weapons disappear from all kiting ships, but this TE tweak is not that severe to accomplish that.
People currently think that medium LR turrets are bad, but fail to realize that one reason is the comparative goodness of close range turrets with TEs and T2 ammo.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2366
|
Posted - 2013.03.27 18:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Roime wrote:So keeping range in a faster ship is "tricky", and trying to catch them with a slower ship is "simple"?
Ok. People say that its unfair that faster ships should be able to escape because they cannot overcome their speed. I can counter that with. Its completely unfair that ships with more damage should win a fight just because I cannot make more damage then they do! The simple proposition that there is anything wrong with Kiting is beyond stupid! its just blindness! All and any argument you can make against kiting you can make against brute force combat. Always one side will loose! You need to find a way to counter the advantage of the enemy, that is the whole fun of the damm PVP! If we cannot have kiting, then we cannot have ships with more damage then others. Also we cannot have ships with more hitpoitn or tank than others. Maybe we should all fly only mining barges!!!
My point was aimed at the fallacy of "kiting requires more skill", when in reality maintaining range is easier than closing range, I'm not saying speed is unfair.
Nerfing damage projection at long point range makes kiting require more actual skill instead of relying purely on speed advantage. It's evident in this thread that it terrifies many ~Elite PVPers~, just like the thought of OGB nerf.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2366
|
Posted - 2013.03.27 18:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jaangel wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Serenety Steel wrote:If it aint broke, DON'T fix it!
Way to nerf some more stuff, well done ccp.. These are broke, so we're fixing them. Urm no they werent do you play eve? All you have done is make small gang pvp less effective while having little affect on blob warefare. Can you please explain your 'Vision' for pvp because as i see there is going to be flying t1 cruisers and there will be no shinney stuff worth flying.
My 1.2 billion ISK LOLPLATE LOLBRICK LOLBLASTER LOLBRAWLER is still worth flying, just like it's been worth every 0.01 ISK from the first evening I bought one a year ago
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2371
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Posted - 2013.03.27 21:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Here's a thing: Three kiting cruisers using long range ammo, compared: http://i.imgur.com/TSSEdNe.jpgThe two curves for each ship are current fit (T2 TE) vs post-nerf (simulated by substituting T2 TEs for T1). The green bar represents typical kiting ranges (20km at the inboard, 36km (overheated faction point range) at the outboard). Look how hard this nerf fucks blaster ships. Compared to any other turret setup. It's ridiculous. Scorch users lose nothing, AC fits lose ~6% dps, Heavy Neutrons + Null lose 20%... on the weapon system that did the least damage within this range envelope to begin with. The Proteus is worse off under current mechanics ANYWHERE outside 21km, and this nerf only increases the gap. Keep in mind that the engagement envelope is a cold hard fact that is not negotiable-- any closer and you start straying into overheated web range (and exploding). Any farther and you lose points on your target and they just sort of wander off.
Kiting Proteus, that's cool. You fly it like the 1600mm plate torp Vaga?
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2372
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Posted - 2013.03.27 21:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote: Why don't you come find out?
With bonuses it goes almost 3km/s, aligns in 5.5 seconds with the MWD on and it scrams to 30km with heat. Feel free to tell me all about how this makes it a terrible kiting ship.
Medium blasters, and total reliance on hardwires and links. And dies to armor Proteus, which scrams as far but has a web and way more tank.
Happy?
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2375
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Posted - 2013.03.28 09:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
Swifty Blowback wrote:Michael Harari wrote:I like how this nerf does next to nothing to blob nagas and such, but is yet another change that makes small gang pvp more difficult. (Sort of like most of the tiericide changes) ... Pretty much every new thread from fozzie has him saying "I know this makes solo pvp harder but I think its ok"
Yep. The TE nerf is possibly the harshest for solo / small gang PVP in a long time. Viable kiting platforms are being slowly reduced. CCP wants players to be social and play in large corps / blobs because their data says they get more monies when players do that. See last CSM summit write-up for details + see trial account spike after massive blob brawls are publicized. The future of solo PVP has never looked so grim.
You don't have any kills, solo, small gang or blob
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2375
|
Posted - 2013.03.28 09:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mr Bright wrote: You've already destroyed the hurricane so I really hope you stop there.
1#Oracle 56,256 2#Naga 52,642 3#Tornado 51,917 4#Hurricane 48,758 5#Loki 46,526
It's useless
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
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Roime
Shiva Furnace
2376
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Posted - 2013.03.28 10:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Roime wrote:Mr Bright wrote: You've already destroyed the hurricane so I really hope you stop there. 1#Oracle 56,256 2#Naga 52,642 3#Tornado 51,917 4#Hurricane 48,7585#Loki 46,526 It's useless I really laugh whenever anyone bring up the number of ships used in killboard hits as if that was a demonstrator of wich one is superior. That plain stupid and blind. Do you realize the cost of the ship and the fact that people had invested on last few years into the best flavor ships and will nto instantly change because their skills do not allow it, make WAY more impact on those number than the real effective capabilities of those ships? If you could get numbers of usage of ships only from players with 100+ kills on last year, with a wallet over 10 bil isk and with 80M sp or more, then yes you could use those numbers for something.
I really laugh when someone claims that a ship is USELESS!!!1111 and OBSOLOTE!!!111 and NERFED TO GROUND!!111 when it clearly is not
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2377
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Posted - 2013.03.28 11:56:00 -
[12] - Quote
Swifty Blowback wrote: I have many. This alt has none. EvE eh! Damn tricky for some to grasp simple concepts...
No you don't. Damn tricky for some people to accept the truth...
Lina Halid wrote: Faction warfare isn't a solo pvp. Try to fly 30+ jumps in 0.0 and find a good target for your lonely ship and not die - that will be a solo pvp.
Getting solo fights all the time is solo pvp, doing 30+ jumps and dying to a blob is banging your head against a wall.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2377
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Posted - 2013.03.28 11:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:
And I dare you to show where I said that the hurricane is useless. I am just arguing that you are using STUPID and USELESS DATA to make your point, even if your point is not wrong.
I wasn't even talking to you in the first place.
What's stupid and useless about the data, care to explain?
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2381
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Posted - 2013.03.28 12:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
Obviously not, but the fact that people still have very good success with the ship irrefutably proves that it is not useless.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
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