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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.06 17:48:00 -
[1]
the raven used to give it ships bonus to all the missiles.
now it gives bonus to cruise and torp only:
The Raven is the powerhouse of the Caldari
Navy. With its myriad launcher slots and
powerful shields, few ships can rival it in
strength or majesty.
Special Ability: 5% bonus to Cruise and Siege
Launcher Rate Of Fire and 10% bonus to
Cruise Missile and Torpedo Velocity per level.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.09.06 17:51:00 -
[2]
Great.
All other battleships only get bonuses to large weapons. Glad it's been brought in line.
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Bracius
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Posted - 2005.09.06 17:53:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Deja Thoris
Great.
All other battleships only get bonuses to large weapons. Glad it's been brought in line.
To bad i didn't get rof bonus to medium beams on geddon... just brought in line.
I just contributed 0 to this topic :) |
Douglas McCracken
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Posted - 2005.09.06 17:55:00 -
[4]
another step towards ballance, i can safely say ive never fitted a non BS class weapon to a Raven anyway, except perhaps some medium energy beams.
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2005.09.06 17:55:00 -
[5]
this completely ruins my rocket launcher raven setup.. o wait..
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:01:00 -
[6]
Edited by: The Wizz117 on 06/09/2005 18:03:24
did you guyz ever notice u need 6 assult launchers to kill 2 wingmans?
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juduzz
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:02:00 -
[7]
the rocket sniper setup is totaly fubered, now we will have to get into web range instead of outside of 10k :/
----------------------------------------------
My vid(s)
http://www.eve-files.com/media/07/VIDSKIE.wmv |
Bracius
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:03:00 -
[8]
Originally by: The Wizz117
did you guyz ever notice u need 6 assult launchers to kill 2 wingmans?
You ever noticed 1500m3 drone bay?
I just contributed 0 to this topic :) |
The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:08:00 -
[9]
raven special ability are: missiles this is suposed to be the good thing aboud the raven.
just like apoc got good cap and that dominix got goot drones etc.
but missiles are just worse then turrets.
that totaly sucks
caldari are worst 0.0 ( u would need a alt in a badger full of torps if you wanna last there) worst miners and now they suck in missions 2!
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Xelios
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:12:00 -
[10]
Ugh... they suck in missions because they can't take out frigs in one hit now? Well surprise neither can any other battleship! Load up some drones or fit a couple medium turrets like everyone else.
Missile volume should be decreased though.
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Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:13:00 -
[11]
Stealth nerfs 4tl.
---------------------------
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:20:00 -
[12]
yea, why is this not noted in the patch notes?
All my guns just shoot 20% slower they used to...
i use 6x heavy missile.. lvl3 missions.
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Hephaesteus
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:29:00 -
[13]
Wow Raven nerfed again BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
No really, I feel real sorry for ya.  |
LUKEC
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:29:00 -
[14]
Originally by: The Wizz117
yea, why is this not noted in the patch notes?
All my guns just shoot 20% slower they used to...
i use 6x heavy missile.. lvl3 missions.
Just quit this crap. Missiles are fine.
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hattifnatt
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:40:00 -
[15]
raven nerfing 4TW!! 
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:40:00 -
[16]
im just making anote of this stealth nerf
and you tell me to stop whining.
well the whole nerf came becouse of the dudes using turrets whined on the 1e place.
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Hephaesteus
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Posted - 2005.09.06 18:43:00 -
[17]
Funny you "forgot" to mention this.
The capacity of the Cruise Launcher II has been increased to be in-line with other TL2 launchers.
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Dr Tetrahydrocannabinol
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Posted - 2005.09.06 19:32:00 -
[18]
Oh man i use assault lauchers on mine god damn it!!!!!!!
---------------------------------------------
"Taking one for the team one ship at a time."
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Nebuli
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Posted - 2005.09.06 19:36:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Hephaesteus
Funny you "forgot" to mention this.
The capacity of the Cruise Launcher II has been increased to be in-line with other TL2 launchers.
Except it hasnt lol
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Masta Killa
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Posted - 2005.09.06 19:38:00 -
[20]
Awww shucks, now I have to train for cruise missiles and torpedoes. That's like DAYS of training, thanks ALOT ccp.
(seriously, does anyone care about this nerf? My sarcasmic self sure doesn't)
--------------------------------------
Hail Stian Allaince and the emperor who can't spell. ;]
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Nebuli
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Posted - 2005.09.06 19:38:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Nebuli on 06/09/2005 19:38:27
Originally by: Nebuli
Originally by: Hephaesteus
Funny you "forgot" to mention this.
The capacity of the Cruise Launcher II has been increased to be in-line with other TL2 launchers.
Except it hasnt lol
Just likt to also point out what has this got to do with another Raven nerf, other ships use cruise launchers as well you know :)
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.09.06 19:39:00 -
[22]
OMG - and the domi still gets its bonus to ALL drones? 
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Aeesha
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Posted - 2005.09.06 20:19:00 -
[23]
It said so before the patch too (torp/cruise).
Pay attention :-)
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Bracius
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Posted - 2005.09.06 20:24:00 -
[24]
Originally by: HippoKing
OMG - and the domi still gets its bonus to ALL drones?
Try to be drone dependant... it is not really fire and forget. And i don't care, 10 med drones is enough. And 15 heavy 4tw.
Unless you want +1 light drone... that would be lol.
I just contributed 0 to this topic :) |
Vilserx
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Posted - 2005.09.06 20:47:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Masta Killa
Awww shucks, now I have to train for cruise missiles and torpedoes. That's like DAYS of training, thanks ALOT ccp.
(seriously, does anyone care about this nerf? My sarcasmic self sure doesn't)
Well done for completely missing the point of the post.
---------------------------
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Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.09.06 20:54:00 -
[26]
I've got almost 4 million skill points in missiles.
God I regret that now.
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Grey Area
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Posted - 2005.09.06 20:57:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Gungankllr
I've got almost 4 million skill points in missiles.
God I regret that now.
Almost? I have 4,350,000+...and yes, I REALLY regret that, that's why I keep whining to get some redress on the last patch.
=========================================
* I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. *
========================================= |
Antic
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:00:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Antic on 06/09/2005 21:01:49
geez... will there ever be an end to the caldari bashing?
Well on a positive note, i guess people can finaly shut up about us fitting assault and heavy launchers on our ravens when we point out how useless cruise and torps are against cruisers compared to turrets.
And i got torps and cruise trained up + new skills. No amount of skill trianing will fix above mentioned problem. Wheres our tracking computer for missiles?
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Kresko
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:00:00 -
[29]
Omg Omg Omg i must spend more time training....
(seriously does anyone care :/)
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RabbidFerret
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:16:00 -
[30]
cruiser pilot says: Too bad, so sad
All your ferrets are belong to us.
Electronic Warfare- Guns are outdated. |
Sukar
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:50:00 -
[31]
Personally I do a lot of lvl3s in my Raven, and cruises are generally a waste in them (they do less dps than heavies against most rats I face in a lvl 3 mission), not sure whether it is still better to use heavies now that you lose the bonuses. In fact, at this point, if I want to do 99% missions to make my money, should I use a raven at all? I can't solo lvl 4s anymore (the frigates are too tough) and the lvl 3s are probably pretty inefficient now.
For a mission person and someone with a million skill points invested in missiles, should I switch to the ferox for its lesser cost or train up for the cerberus (I'm about 34 days away from a cerberus if I switch towards it) or just stick it out?
Sukar
http://www.dndorks.com |
Motec
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:51:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Gian Bal
ok, now that we have all missiles balanced, when will they get the love they need to get back in line?
why has my tempest a small chance to kill a frig with one shoot and my raven no chance to ever do more than 20 dmg?
What is that stuff that rolls down hill again? Anyways I'm happy with the new missle system I think CCP did well overall. I just want techII dmg mods for missles, implants all these neat things everyone else gets. 
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Antic
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Posted - 2005.09.06 21:53:00 -
[33]
Harpy for lvl3 missions is pretty fun if you want a change. But it wont get your rich in a hurry.
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boogaboob
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:34:00 -
[34]
Edited by: boogaboob on 06/09/2005 22:35:53
I'm a basically all missile user here, with light missile spec and 4 or 5 in every other type, and my response is:
ONOS!!!111 I CANT USE ROCKETZ ON A R4VEN!11%42425! H4X!!!! AND I CANT KILL FR1GZ WITH T0RPS!!!1 CCP H8S MISSILE USERS!!!1111111!
Sorry, I had to get that out of my system. Im fed up with the endless 'CCP hates missiles' threads. Even the thread title, in all caps with the word 'raven' and 'nerfed' next to each other, makes my blood boil.
Put more eloquently, I, personally, think the raven is better than it has ever been, with the exception of the lvl 4 mission soloing thing. Though a few caldari ships got hit a bit, overall we're fine. This doesn't hurt much at all; as some of the other posters stated, its a good step toward a balance between all ships, if not toward diversity. I realize some people may feel differently, and i respect that. But this is my opinion.
Signatures done by me! Evemail me! Anyone? No? Aww...
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Troezar
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:43:00 -
[35]
My Raven works fine, 6 drones and 2 small lasers kills the frigates quite nicely  I'm only at lvl 3 for all missile skills so I expect it will get a lot better too
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Zeb Carter
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:45:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Antic
Harpy for lvl3 missions is pretty fun if you want a change. But it wont get your rich in a hurry.
I dunno, I do all my lvl3s in my Harpy.. I found it to go much much quicker than in the Raven, especially missions like Spy Stash. Extravaganza's only take about 45m to 1h, another 20 for the bonus (but I like to bring a friend along for that part because it takes ages to take the BS down).
_______________________
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Masta Killa
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:50:00 -
[37]
One has a hard time letting go of the fact that once upon a time you could warp into a 9.5 mil officer spawn, shoot half a volley at each intie and solo the spawn with or without warping out for cap.
Also the fact that warping into enemy gangs at 60 and killing every single one of their tacklers and then bailing out was teh 0wn
Frig gangs will own ravens now, unlike the old times when frig gangs were like "ok we'll attack anything except a raven, k?".
--------------------------------------
Hail Stian Allaince and the emperor who can't spell. ;]
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Vishnej
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:53:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Sukar
Personally I do a lot of lvl3s in my Raven, and cruises are generally a waste in them (they do less dps than heavies against most rats I face in a lvl 3 mission), not sure whether it is still better to use heavies now that you lose the bonuses. In fact, at this point, if I want to do 99% missions to make my money, should I use a raven at all? I can't solo lvl 4s anymore (the frigates are too tough) and the lvl 3s are probably pretty inefficient now.
For a mission person and someone with a million skill points invested in missiles, should I switch to the ferox for its lesser cost or train up for the cerberus (I'm about 34 days away from a cerberus if I switch towards it) or just stick it out?
Stick with the raven, but add target painters. YOu don't have to have an incredibly good tank for level 3's. 3 target painter 2's, level 4 in guided missile precision and signature focusing should allow you to do approximately full cruise missile damage vs cruisers.
Picking up cans is another matter entirely, but it's not that much better in a ferox than it is in a BS.
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Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:56:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Masta Killa
One has a hard time letting go of the fact that once upon a time you could warp into a 9.5 mil officer spawn, shoot half a volley at each intie and solo the spawn with or without warping out for cap.
Also the fact that warping into enemy gangs at 60 and killing every single one of their tacklers and then bailing out was teh 0wn
Frig gangs will own ravens now, unlike the old times when frig gangs were like "ok we'll attack anything except a raven, k?".
Just like every other battleship might I add you. So what happens when the Raven is put back down with the other battleships in handling frigs. Lets say it all at once = Balanced.
You still have the same frig counter defenses as we all do = Drones/NoS/Neturilzer/Small Guns/Missiles hit some don't they?
-Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.09.06 22:59:00 -
[40]
"For a mission person and someone with a million skill points invested in missiles, should I switch to the ferox for its lesser cost or train up for the cerberus (I'm about 34 days away from a cerberus if I switch towards it) or just stick it out?"
Ferox is more than enough for lvl.3 missions. Too slow to pick up loot with, but that's what mwd Kestrel with two cargo expanders parked in the system with the agent is for :s
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Arimas Talasko
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Posted - 2005.09.06 23:07:00 -
[41]
lmfao I can't believe people are complaining about this, who in their right mind uses heavy missiles as a raven's primary armament... Who uses a raven to do level 3 missions...
Supremacy Keepin it Real
Originally by: Daniel Jackson
PLEASE TELL US WHY, WHY DO U WANT US TO DIE,
I AM JUST GOING FRIGGEN INSAIGN
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Motec
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Posted - 2005.09.06 23:39:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Motec on 06/09/2005 23:41:26
Originally by: Famine Aligher'ri
Originally by: Masta Killa
One has a hard time letting go of the fact that once upon a time you could warp into a 9.5 mil officer spawn, shoot half a volley at each intie and solo the spawn with or without warping out for cap.
Also the fact that warping into enemy gangs at 60 and killing every single one of their tacklers and then bailing out was teh 0wn
Frig gangs will own ravens now, unlike the old times when frig gangs were like "ok we'll attack anything except a raven, k?".
Just like every other battleship might I add you. So what happens when the Raven is put back down with the other battleships in handling frigs. Lets say it all at once = Balanced.
You still have the same frig counter defenses as we all do = Drones/NoS/Neturilzer/Small Guns/Missiles hit some don't they?
I won't question your gunnery skills Famine Aligher'ri but surely your large turrets hit frigs for full dmg as long as they don't go under falloff. On topic the raven's bonus is 100% sane. 
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Sukar
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Posted - 2005.09.06 23:43:00 -
[43]
Hmm, I haven't tried using more than 1 target painter at a time, I'll give the 3 a try and see how it goes.
As to Arimas: I like using a battleship, I like doing missions. Thus, I like doing missions in a battleship. I "hate" mining, my attempts at being a merchant have as of yet so far only made a few hundred thousand isk per hour (I'm all combat skills, I'm hoping a bit of training in trading skills and indy skills can help that). About 50% of the time I used a caracal for lvl 3 missions, but its so fragile that being distracted at the wrong moment results in a fine layer of dust where my caracal was. I used to solo lvl 4s, now its pretty risky (I still do solo lvl 4s when I want to make quick money and I don't mind concentrating on the battle). I hate pirates and other ragemonkey types, so I'm not about to go that route to make my isk, so thus, lvl 3 missions in a raven. I get to blow things up, if I have to answer a business call (I own 2 businesses, I can get calls at any time of the day) I don't have to worry about losing my ship, and I make several million isk an hour.
Logically, I think it makes sense, but if you have a way for me to make more isk with the skills I have (all combat-missiles), then by all means share, unless its piracy-based (thats all I need, have a surprise business meeting worth thousands right in the middle of a pvp battle. Heck, if it can be done in less than a month, I'd be quite willing to change my skills around (I'm spending a month training up for gallente freighter at the moment, I think mass trading would be good for passive money making during phone calls)
Sukar
http://www.dndorks.com |
Dracolich
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Posted - 2005.09.06 23:56:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Famine Aligher'ri
Originally by: Masta Killa
One has a hard time letting go of the fact that once upon a time you could warp into a 9.5 mil officer spawn, shoot half a volley at each intie and solo the spawn with or without warping out for cap.
Also the fact that warping into enemy gangs at 60 and killing every single one of their tacklers and then bailing out was teh 0wn
Frig gangs will own ravens now, unlike the old times when frig gangs were like "ok we'll attack anything except a raven, k?".
Just like every other battleship might I add you. So what happens when the Raven is put back down with the other battleships in handling frigs. Lets say it all at once = Balanced.
You still have the same frig counter defenses as we all do = Drones/NoS/Neturilzer/Small Guns/Missiles hit some don't they?
To my knowledge a gun-using ship can do more than 20 damage at long-range, dont know if I would call that balanced, but okay, then again, if a gunship is target jammed, its pretty ****** while a missile ship is not.
_______________________________________
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.09.07 02:01:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Kresko
Omg Omg Omg i must spend more time training....
(seriously does anyone care :/)
I do kinda was testing a pure assualt launcher setup against rogue drones...basicly because my drone skills are crap being most cal ships have crapy drone bays in comparsion...in the BS class they are the absloute worst for drone bays.
2 races have a cruiser with no drone bays, and the other (ie the golden children the amarr) have a drone based cruiser...
Raven 150
Scorp 150
Tempest 150
phoon 350
Apoc 150
geddon 250
Domi 750
mega 250
WTF is up with that? Use drones they say, adapt they say. Wake up out the 4 BS that have rap drone bays the caldari have 2 of them small cargo holds and largest m3 size ammo per shot and crapy cargo bays? the only BS that has no weapon related bonus?
I mean come on stop screwing the caldari already...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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slip66
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Posted - 2005.09.07 04:12:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Masta Killa
Frig gangs will own ravens now, unlike the old times when frig gangs were like "ok we'll attack anything except a raven, k?".
exactly
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Citizen Angstrom
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Posted - 2005.09.07 05:17:00 -
[47]
It's really sad to see people jumping up and down on the smashed remnants of the once proud Caldari.
Woe betide anyone who dares to point out a further nerf of the Much Dreaded Raven. Especially if it is a stealth nerf. Very especially if it is a nerf which curtails a method of dealing with the Missile 'Change', which many of these ^^ maniacs have been loudly forcing Raven pilots to try and use...
Can't everyone see, that the Caldari are all evil monsters, that the Raven must be nerfed and nerfed until it is a rubber duck, that missiles must be reduced to sub-peashooter status?
I suggest to the OP and everyone else who disagrees with the baying mob, that they keep quiet. A lynching is always possible, if you aren't careful...
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sidthesexist
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Posted - 2005.09.07 07:29:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Xelios
Ugh... they suck in missions because they can't take out frigs in one hit now? Well surprise neither can any other battleship! Load up some drones or fit a couple medium turrets like everyone else.
Missile volume should be decreased though.
they suck in missions now cos the cant atke out frigs with a dozen hits
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Rafein
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Posted - 2005.09.07 07:34:00 -
[49]
I dunno, CCP confuses me a lot anymore.
One patch, they rework Launchers, so Caldari Cruisers can no longer fit a rack of Heavy missile launchers.
Then next patch, they take the Caldari BS, and remove the bonus for Heavies and lower.
I mean, ifthey wanted to get rid of heavy missiles, would it not have been easier to do it at the beginning?
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Fikia
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Posted - 2005.09.07 09:44:00 -
[50]
They need to give the raven a full rack of launcher hard points so that if one desired, they could mount non-torp/cruiser launchers in the extra two slots..
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Jiggy
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Posted - 2005.09.07 10:18:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Fikia
They need to give the raven a full rack of launcher hard points so that if one desired, they could mount non-torp/cruiser launchers in the extra two slots..
Yes.
Apoc gets 8 turret and 2 Launcher points, Raven gets 6 launcher and 4 turret.
Why not make it 8 launcher 2 turrent? :)
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loxxx
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Posted - 2005.09.07 10:34:00 -
[52]
I feel so bad for training caldari BS lvl5, cruise lvl5, torp lvl5 and all new missile skills lvl5. Why didnt someone tell me that it is going to be a complete waste of time.
I dont hunt NPC-s, so lets skip that. For pvp raven just sucks. (thank god i can use scorp for jamming in fleet battles, bad thing it dies first).
Few things id like to point out.
a)Why the hell guided missile precision only affects light, heavy and cruise? How would gun users feel if motion prediction would only affect only long range guns? (rails, howis etc). rank5
b) Missile bombardment. somehow useful, tho i really dont see any point training this skill to lvl5. What the hell im supposed to do with 250km+ cruise missile range. rank2
c) Missile launcher op and rapid launch. Skills that acctually work. Still i cant understand why gunnery rapid fireing gets 4% instead of 3% like rapid launch gets. rank1 + rank2
d) Missile projection. It should be 20% instead of 10% and it still would take too long before missiles hit anything. Pretty much useless skill for rank4, should be rank1-2
e) target navigation prediction. Trained it to lvl5, didnt see any real damage increase. rank2
f) warhead upgrades. 2% more damage for rank5 skill? why the hell gunnery gets 3% for rank4?
g) all missile spec skills. ROF is nice! or is it? I use more ammo and i need to reload more often (missiles allready cost more than any other ammo)
Caldari BS-s are the slowest BS-s. They got smallest drone bay. Longest lock time. We dont have any t2 damage modes. Ou, we only got low slot damage mod. We got no missile implants. T2 launchers cost way too much (350mm rail 1-2m vs 12-15m cruise launcher).
More t2 launcher bpo-s should be given out for t2 lottery. etcetc
blaah, think whatever you want but caldari has been nerfed way too hard.
It used to suck for pvp and now it sucks even more.
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:10:00 -
[53]
Originally by: loxxx
blaah, think whatever you want but caldari has been nerfed way too hard.
It used to suck for pvp and now it sucks even more.
you forgot to mension that it also sucks most @ mining and since these patches also @ missions.
it cinda sucks on EVRYTING.
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WiseMagic
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:22:00 -
[54]
Guys stop whinning about the Raven its only right that they change the bonus to cruise and torps, if u want to use heavys or assault launchers then do u just don't get the bonus but if ur new missile skills are at high levels then what the deal u will still be effective. I use my Raven for NPC/Agent runnning, I do not consider it as a PvP ship use Amarr ships for that. Raven with full tech2 equip is still a wicked ship. Use Caldari Cruisers/HACS or Battlecruisers if u want to use heavy/assault launchers, CCP was right to do that makes people think abit about there ship choice.
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LVirus
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:30:00 -
[55]
Edited by: LVirus on 07/09/2005 11:34:01
Originally by: WiseMagic
Guys stop whinning about the Raven its only right that they change the bonus to cruise and torps, if u want to use heavys or assault launchers then do u just don't get the bonus but if ur new missile skills are at high levels then what the deal u will still be effective. I use my Raven for NPC/Agent runnning, I do not consider it as a PvP ship use Amarr ships for that. Raven with full tech2 equip is still a wicked ship. Use Caldari Cruisers/HACS or Battlecruisers if u want to use heavy/assault launchers, CCP was right to do that makes people think abit about there ship choice.
aah, now i understand. If i want to pvp then i should learn amarr skills? I must have missed that "never use caldari for pvp" warning when i was creating my char. But tnx for helping me out on this one, ill just go and make another char.
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Bracius
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:39:00 -
[56]
raven is okish. At least a lone hac usually cannot take down decently fitted raven.
I just contributed 0 to this topic :) |
The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:41:00 -
[57]
all those non-raven uses just ignore all the facts and say "stop wining" '
i seriouse think the raven should get +2 launcher HP and -2turret HP
apoc god 8 turret HP and 2 launcher HP
and raven totaly sucks @ evryting olrady
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Ryy Kishin
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:49:00 -
[58]
Originally by: The Wizz117
raven special ability are: missiles this is suposed to be the good thing aboud the raven.
just like apoc got good cap and that dominix got goot drones etc.
but missiles are just worse then turrets.
that totaly sucks
caldari are worst 0.0 ( u would need a alt in a badger full of torps if you wanna last there) worst miners and now they suck in missions 2!
Live Hard Die Young Leave A Good Looking Corpse
There are no bugs in Eve only features.
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Crellion
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Posted - 2005.09.07 11:51:00 -
[59]
Originally by: WiseMagic
Guys stop whinning about the Raven its only right that they change the bonus to cruise and torps, if u want to use heavys or assault launchers then do u just don't get the bonus but if ur new missile skills are at high levels then what the deal u will still be effective. I use my Raven for NPC/Agent runnning, I do not consider it as a PvP ship use Amarr ships for that. Raven with full tech2 equip is still a wicked ship. Use Caldari Cruisers/HACS or Battlecruisers if u want to use heavy/assault launchers, CCP was right to do that makes people think abit about there ship choice.
1) On topic: I agree this changes nothing. Using Ass. or heavy missles was IMO an idiotic concept (for 99% of the situations) - I am open to debate if anybody wants and explain exactly what I mean if somebody is wondering - that was mainly proposed by ignorant (as far as fkying a Raven is concerned) turret users that were trying whatever argument to try and explain away the imbalance of the missle nerf.
2) The missle balancing was necessary. (I was soloing lvl4 missions 2 months in the game -all of them in the 3rd- and that has to be wrong).
3) Still balancing is a tricky business and has to be done very carefully, placing the pendulum at the middle with care. This has not been achieved (to date at least). You dont straighten a crooked painting by slapping it the other way with all ur might. The balance will hopefully be redressed at some point (after all u dont need motion prediction 5 and adv motion prediction 4-5 to hit a cruiser with mega pulses :) ). In the meantime Cardari pilots will need to specialise in a second race as well (those that havent already). Not bcause their ships suck as such but simpy because they are good in very limited & specific roles.
Indeed it seems to me that Caldari were perhaps the most usual example of chars getting good results from a very straightlined skill tree (those that focused on missles only ignoring hybrids gunnery drones etc). One has to wonder if perhaps that wasnt also in the minds of the CCP people... forcing players with Caldari chars to spend more time = RL money skilling up to get to enjoy the game ... hmmm...
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.09.07 15:28:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Dracolich
To my knowledge a gun-using ship can do more than 20 damage at long-range, dont know if I would call that balanced, but okay, then again, if a gunship is target jammed, its pretty ****** while a missile ship is not.
Yeah a gunship *CAN* do more than 20 damage. A missile ship *WILL* do 20 damage each time. If you really want to compare that, you have to do a comparison like this (figures totaly random here, just for the thought, chose figures which makes all balanced, but maybe it's not in this regard):
- missiles hit for 20 each shot
- turrets hit for 100 every 5 shots ('cause they have a bad tracking and thus won't hit a non stupid smaller size ship pilot who will use transversal)
With this figures the overall damage is the same (assuming for simplification that RoF is the same).
So if you guys want to say that missiles sucks now cause you only do 20 damage each time, give all the figures needed for comparison: rof of your missile, damage/rof/chance to hit a target depending on its transversal speed for the different kind of equivalent turrets (proj, hybrid, lasers), take the mathematical expectation of those figures and then compare.
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.09.07 15:39:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Wrayeth on 07/09/2005 15:40:40
The real problem, here, is not frigates - killing frigates is not the raven's role.
The raven's role, like all battleships, is to kill cruisers or other battleships - and this is where it fails. It currently takes too many volleys to kill a cruiser...and if that cruiser is properly tanked, it's even possible to permatank a raven's damage output with one (don't believe me? - fit a tech II med armor rep, hardeners against thermal, kinetic, and explosive, and an armor plate on a thorax and have your raven buddy shoot at you from beyond 20km).
Cruise missiles and torpedos need a boost vs. cruisers.
Vs. battleships and frigates, they're fine.
-Wrayeth
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qyros
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Posted - 2005.09.07 15:42:00 -
[62]
Edited by: qyros on 07/09/2005 15:42:51
Originally by: Trelennen
..
So if you guys want to say that missiles sucks now cause you only do 20 damage each time, give all the figures needed for comparison: rof of your missile, damage/rof/chance to hit a target depending on its transversal speed for the different kind of equivalent turrets (proj, hybrid, lasers), take the mathematical expectation of those figures and then compare.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:31 ] (combat) Your Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery I perfectly strikes Sunder Drone, wrecking for 207.6 damage.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:13 ] (combat) Your Cataclysm Cruise Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 55.6 damage.
Turret damage is dynamic and you can influence it. Missile users cannot do this.
The new missile damage is probably based on the damage the devs call preferable against smaller targets.
But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs.
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Karl Borhman
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Posted - 2005.09.07 16:50:00 -
[63]
Originally by: qyros
But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs.
That's because they cannot be hit in the first place ...
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.09.07 16:53:00 -
[64]
"That's because they cannot be hit in the first place ... "
Yeah, right. Cruisers using medium weapons never ever kill frigates in this game. Never happened, never will.
--;;;
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.09.07 16:54:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Karl Borhman
Originally by: qyros
But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs.
That's because they cannot be hit in the first place ...
That's the problem - cruisers' role is to kill frigs and cruisers. Instead of reducing sig radius to make them harder to hit with battleships, cruisers should be boosted by increasing the tracking/explosion radius/velocity of medium weapons, thus allowing them to fulfill their role as frig-killers.
-Wrayeth
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:04:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Trelennen
Originally by: Dracolich
To my knowledge a gun-using ship can do more than 20 damage at long-range, dont know if I would call that balanced, but okay, then again, if a gunship is target jammed, its pretty ****** while a missile ship is not.
Yeah a gunship *CAN* do more than 20 damage. A missile ship *WILL* do 20 damage each time. If you really want to compare that, you have to do a comparison like this
Sorry but you need to re-examibe your assumptions, A missile ship *CAN* do about 20 damage its not garanteed to do this minimum damage...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Slater Dogstar
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:15:00 -
[67]
Edited by: Slater Dogstar on 07/09/2005 17:15:06
Originally by: qyros
Edited by: qyros on 07/09/2005 15:42:51
Originally by: Trelennen
..
So if you guys want to say that missiles sucks now cause you only do 20 damage each time, give all the figures needed for comparison: rof of your missile, damage/rof/chance to hit a target depending on its transversal speed for the different kind of equivalent turrets (proj, hybrid, lasers), take the mathematical expectation of those figures and then compare.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:31 ] (combat) Your Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery I perfectly strikes Sunder Drone, wrecking for 207.6 damage.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:13 ] (combat) Your Cataclysm Cruise Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 55.6 damage.
Turret damage is dynamic and you can influence it. Missile users cannot do this.
The new missile damage is probably based on the damage the devs call preferable against smaller targets.
But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs.
I note you used a cruise missile to compare against a medum gun against a drone
It would have been better if you used a heavy missile at least that would be of a similar size range.
Also the medium gun you used Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery I gives the largest damage compared to any other equivelent gun. Also artillerie guns have a rate of fire similar to missiles and unlike missiles they can do several things, MISS GLANCE etc.
True in the example you showed it not only hit but did a wrecking hit but that happens only 3% of the time so things are not as unballanced as you make out.
Every Time You Use A Warp Stab Ovyer Kills A Puppy!!! |
000Hunter000
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:48:00 -
[68]
wow, never seen people complain so much, for me missiles are still doing great, i fire lights from my crow doing 140 damage, i fire heavies from my cerb doing 200 to 300 damage, i fire cm's from my raven doing 400+ damage, if i see a frig i nossie and webbie de *cencored* out if it then let my T2 drones return it to it's Maker.
I only agree on 1 thing, stationary and webbied objects should get an increase in damage, if i webbie a cruiser and TP it too it should go up in smoke with a cm or 4 should it not? Well at least i think it should :) (but at least my drones are getting well fed now  )
signature? What signature? ;) |
Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:53:00 -
[69]
I HAVE THE SOLUTION!
Use cruise or siege launchers on the raven 
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:58:00 -
[70]
"I note you used a cruise missile to compare against a medum gun against a drone
It would have been better if you used a heavy missile at least that would be of a similar size range."
This is from my damage log, on the very same kind of drone:
Quote:
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:13 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Widowmaker Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 47.8 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:13 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Havoc Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 23.9 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:23 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Widowmaker Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 38.9 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:25 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Scourge Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 47.0 damage.
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mOrdi
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Posted - 2005.09.07 17:59:00 -
[71]
hello
im caldari, but none of the nerfs have affected me at all
y?
i learnt gal and cal races
and allways saw missiles as a secondary weapon myself..rails being my primary focus..
caldari isnt just all missiles..be flexible
train up some hybrid gun skills to complement them
learn other races ships is another good idea, if u train up rails then gal ships become a great asset
gotta move on chaps .. theres nothing wrong with caldari and theres more to eve than just hopping in an ugly raven and flinging missiles left and right 
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000Hunter000
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:02:00 -
[72]
yes but overkilling a little 2.5k npc with 6 torps was fun though at times 
But he's right, if u can't handle them with missiles, go study guns as well.
signature? What signature? ;) |
Slater Dogstar
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:20:00 -
[73]
Well at least josaphine made a good point I am open to a good point.
Tho i still say missiles are fine after all you have people on this thread saying that missiles are fine now as i dont use missiles myself being gilent i cant give any definate opinions on this matter so if you are saying the truth when you say missiles are fine then please give some detailed Data saying why you think so.
Every Time You Use A Warp Stab Ovyer Kills A Puppy!!! |
Cavy Dan
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:29:00 -
[74]
They only changed the text to this patch. The Raven has been like this since at LEAST the Cold War Patch. You didn't notice?
Hehe. That means you don't use any other missile than Cruise and Torp.
I was confused that the bonus didn't apply to Heavies and lower, but the loss ain't that big.
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:37:00 -
[75]
Originally by: j0sephine
Edited by: j0sephine on 07/09/2005 18:06:01
"I note you used a cruise missile to compare against a medum gun against a drone
It would have been better if you used a heavy missile at least that would be of a similar size range."
This is from my damage log, on the very same kind of drone:
Quote:
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:13 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Widowmaker Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 47.8 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:13 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Havoc Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 23.9 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:23 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Widowmaker Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 38.9 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:23:25 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your Scourge Heavy Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 47.0 damage.
edit: for comparison, here's gun hits:
Quote:
[ 2005.08.22 21:32:06 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 200mm Railgun II hits Sunder Drone, doing 32.0 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:32:09 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 200mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Sunder Drone, inflicting 46.6 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:32:13 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 200mm Railgun II hits Sunder Drone, doing 42.6 damage.
[ 2005.08.22 21:32:14 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 200mm Railgun II barely scratches Sunder Drone, causing 25.7 damage.
The difference? my guns shoot 3x faster than my launchers... and the launchers had 2 damage mods helping the missiles.
oh, and the turrets were using some medium range ammo rather than antimatter, on top of that...
also, you forgot to notice that a raven only has 6 misile launcher hard points, and that is the most in whole eve.
turret ships have way more then 6 turret hard points...
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:41:00 -
[76]
if i read trough this topic, i read that the dudes who agree with me, have way better argumends and proof that the caldari indeed is nerfed to much.
the other dudes just say stop wining train skilz change setup.
wich i tried since the patch but totaly does not work.
i need 2 extra hard points! so i can fit light missile launchers to kill the frigs!
if someone warps into a mission hee sees like : hmm couple of battle ships cruisers ... and NOO A FRIGATE RUN!
that the way it suposed to be? the missiles cost more then the bounty i get from the frig. AND DO NOT SAY YOU SHOULD FIRE LIGHT MISSILES ON FRIGATES BECOUSE I DO ALTOUGH I DONT HAVE THE SLOTS FOR THEM.
----now i would like a reply from one of the DEV team what they think of all this caldari race nerfint and stuff.------
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Slater Dogstar
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Posted - 2005.09.07 18:44:00 -
[77]
Lol this whining is fun to watch
Every Time You Use A Warp Stab Ovyer Kills A Puppy!!! |
nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.09.07 19:07:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Cavy Dan
They only changed the text to this patch. The Raven has been like this since at LEAST the Cold War Patch. You didn't notice?
Hehe. That means you don't use any other missile than Cruise and Torp.
I was confused that the bonus didn't apply to Heavies and lower, but the loss ain't that big.
Wel day before the patch i had a 5 sec ROF with arbie assults...will check what it is now...but it did seem to be effecting the smaller lanchers as well...
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but
why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the
problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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qyros
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Posted - 2005.09.07 19:26:00 -
[79]
Edited by: qyros on 07/09/2005 19:28:49
Edited by: qyros on 07/09/2005 19:27:59
Originally by: Slater Dogstar
...
I note you used a cruise missile to compare against a medum gun against a drone
It would have been better if you used a heavy missile at least that would be of a similar size range.
Also the medium gun you used Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery I gives the largest damage compared to any other equivelent gun. Also artillerie guns have a rate of fire similar to missiles and unlike missiles they can do several things, MISS GLANCE etc.
True in the example you showed it not only hit but did a wrecking hit but that happens only 3% of the time so things are not as unballanced as you make out.
Yes it was an exaggeration. And I was fully aware of that.
Ofc the wrecking hit of a large turret shouldn¦t support the 2/3 damage reduction of heavy missiles (But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs. <-- This one was related to heavy missiles.), but the fact that turret damage is dynamic and a turret user can lower the transversal speed.
To show this I used a high tracking short range large turret with large falloff. You can do this with other guns too, but it¦s much harder and not that effective.
The 2/3 damage reduction of heavy missiles against frigs is simply based on the sig radius difference, no mystery. I only mentioned this to show that heavy missiles have a harsh built-in damage reduction while a large gun still can hit a frig.
Actually a large turret shouldn¦t be able to hit frigs at all, imo.
Finally the ship I used was a typhoon (you know, there are ships out there that have to rely on missiles without any bonus.)
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RyuOniwaKogu
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Posted - 2005.09.07 19:43:00 -
[80]
thank god it was nerfed what dosent kill you makes you stronger
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.09.07 20:15:00 -
[81]
Originally by: RyuOniwaKogu
thank god it was nerfed what dosent kill you makes you stronger
nerfs make u stronger?
someone nerfed your logic...
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Trelennen
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Posted - 2005.09.08 03:02:00 -
[82]
Originally by: qyros
Edited by: qyros on 07/09/2005 15:42:51
Originally by: Trelennen
..
So if you guys want to say that missiles sucks now cause you only do 20 damage each time, give all the figures needed for comparison: rof of your missile, damage/rof/chance to hit a target depending on its transversal speed for the different kind of equivalent turrets (proj, hybrid, lasers), take the mathematical expectation of those figures and then compare.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:31 ] (combat) Your Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery I perfectly strikes Sunder Drone, wrecking for 207.6 damage.
[ 2005.09.04 23:06:13 ] (combat) Your Cataclysm Cruise Missile I hits Sunder Drone, doing 55.6 damage.
Turret damage is dynamic and you can influence it. Missile users cannot do this.
The new missile damage is probably based on the damage the devs call preferable against smaller targets.
But no medium gun gets a 2/3 damage reduction when shooting frigs.
Errr... You quote my post where I say comparing damage on one hit has NO POINT, and that we should consider average damage over time given the high chance to miss with large turrets on moving frig (which means nearly all non AFK frigs), eg. the mathematical expectation. And then all you find to do is showing up a basic damage comparison, like all of your whining friends did above. Maybe you should read what you quote.
Originally by: The Wizz117
if i read trough this topic, i read that the dudes who agree with me, have way better argumends and proof that the caldari indeed is nerfed to much.
the other dudes just say stop wining train skilz change setup.
wich i tried since the patch but totaly does not work.
i need 2 extra hard points! so i can fit light missile launchers to kill the frigs!
if someone warps into a mission hee sees like : hmm couple of battle ships cruisers ... and NOO A FRIGATE RUN!
that the way it suposed to be? the missiles cost more then the bounty i get from the frig. AND DO NOT SAY YOU SHOULD FIRE LIGHT MISSILES ON FRIGATES BECOUSE I DO ALTOUGH I DONT HAVE THE SLOTS FOR THEM.
----now i would like a reply from one of the DEV team what they think of all this caldari race nerfint and stuff.------
Well, what you want is to have a single weapon to fight BS and frigs like you used to? Wow, so let's give large turret the same tracking that small turrets too!
Originally by: qyros
but the fact that turret damage is dynamic and a turret user can lower the transversal speed.
Hum, how a cruiser or BS flying at 500m/s with crapy agility will manage to reduce transversal speed significantly against a frig orbiting over 1km/s outside of web range? Hardly I guess...
Everybody agree (at least all those I read constructive posts from) that missiles should hit with max damage any non moving ship, and I think most agree that sig radius should be less significant regarding damage reduction against missiles and speed more significant.
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Hiram
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Posted - 2005.09.08 07:29:00 -
[83]
So they found time to do this but not fix the bloody mail deletion bug properly? FFS!
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qyros
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Posted - 2005.09.08 08:23:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Trelennen
...
Errr... You quote my post where I say comparing damage on one hit has NO POINT, and that we should consider average damage over time given the high chance to miss with large turrets on moving frig (which means nearly all non AFK frigs), eg. the mathematical expectation. And then all you find to do is showing up a basic damage comparison, like all of your whining friends did above. Maybe you should read what you quote.
I did read what I quoted.
I quoted your post where you suggested a pure mathematical approach and I answered with an example to show that hypothetical approaches are not enough because you can influence the transversal speed.
The basis is sig radius/sig resolution and sig radius/explosion radius. CCP transferred the turets signature system to missiles.
A medium turret has a 2/3 reduced hit chance against a frig with sig radius 40, like a heavy missile has a 2/3 reduced damage.
But the turret has a chance to reduce transversal and the missile can¦t, that¦s why the sig penalty is too high for missiles.
Cruisers can reduce the transversal speed against frigs (ofc not in a close range orbit) and if the frig uses a mwd it has the sig radius of a cruiser anyways.
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.09.09 05:50:00 -
[85]
Quote:
Well, what you want is to have a single weapon to fight BS and frigs like you used to? Wow, so let's give large turret the same tracking that small turrets too!
you are making that up, i did not say that.
please also chek my RAVEN topic in the developmend section.
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Kuolematon
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Posted - 2005.09.09 06:34:00 -
[86]
Originally by: LVirus
aah, now i understand. If i want to pvp then i should learn amarr skills? I must have missed that "never use caldari for pvp" warning when i was creating my char. But tnx for helping me out on this one, ill just go and make another char.
Why thank you. In some weird twisted cosmic way, I snorted my coffee from my nose when I read that. God knows why but I found this very amusing
_______________________________________________
Even Ikvar agrees I'm an alt |
WiseMagic
|
Posted - 2005.09.09 11:09:00 -
[87]
U guys ever think of using drones on the frigs, since the cold war patch drones have become more important when I go rat hunting. My hammerhead II's keep all those frigs of me while I can deal with the bigger rats, in missions I use my drones to rip the deadspace drones to bits. The Raven can hold 15 med drones which is more than enough to help in frig killing.
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Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.09.09 12:09:00 -
[88]
bleh
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The Wizz117
|
Posted - 2005.09.13 15:25:00 -
[89]
Edited by: The Wizz117 on 13/09/2005 15:32:22
Edited by: The Wizz117 on 13/09/2005 15:25:22
wat would be nerfed this patch? any one knows?
i think its the targeting, im trying to lock on a lvl3 drone for aboud 4 mins now, it normaly does not take me more then 1.5
but like all the turret users anc ccp says: ill just adapt and use more drones!
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Andouus La
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Posted - 2005.09.13 20:20:00 -
[90]
OMG!!! Level 3 missions in ravens... Before castor patch those where done in cruisers lol. Have you peeps gone insane. Before Cold war patch i used to do mine in a **** battlecruiser lol. I'll stick to the good old hasty days of pre castor patch and do them in a Moa lol.
Just fit and train those combined skills turrets and missiles and drones and that's it. The glorious days of the raven doing solo in a level 4 mission is over. For mining in 0.0, before or after cold war this is insane to do that solo. Mining ops in 0.0 are done in group period. 0.0 is NOT a walk in the park whatever ship you have.
Skilling more skilling and yes it's not getting better.
I understand some frustrations. Doing a lvl 3 mission in a Moa sounds more challenging then doing it in a tanked raven.
Donno, still puzzled by some stuff here.
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Shaemell Buttleson
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Posted - 2005.09.13 22:06:00 -
[91]
Edited by: Shaemell Buttleson on 13/09/2005 22:06:31
Originally by: 000Hunter000
wow, never seen people complain so much, for me missiles are still doing great, i fire lights from my crow doing 140 damage, i fire heavies from my cerb doing 200 to 300 damage, i fire cm's from my raven doing 400+ damage, if i see a frig i nossie and webbie de *cencored* out if it then let my T2 drones return it to it's Maker.
I only agree on 1 thing, stationary and webbied objects should get an increase in damage, if i webbie a cruiser and TP it too it should go up in smoke with a cm or 4 should it not? Well at least i think it should :) (but at least my drones are getting well fed now )
With all these posts on this subject which should now be in bin this is the only post that has made any real sense so far.
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MrMorph
|
Posted - 2005.09.14 17:28:00 -
[92]
Originally by: nahtoh
Originally by: Kresko
Omg Omg Omg i must spend more time training....
(seriously does anyone care :/)
I do kinda was testing a pure assualt launcher setup against rogue drones...basicly because my drone skills are crap being most cal ships have crapy drone bays in comparsion...in the BS class they are the absloute worst for drone bays.
2 races have a cruiser with no drone bays, and the other (ie the golden children the amarr) have a drone based cruiser...
Raven 150
Scorp 150
Tempest 150
phoon 350
Apoc 150
geddon 250
Domi 750
mega 250
WTF is up with that? Use drones they say, adapt they say. Wake up out the 4 BS that have rap drone bays the caldari have 2 of them small cargo holds and largest m3 size ammo per shot and crapy cargo bays? the only BS that has no weapon related bonus?
I mean come on stop screwing the caldari already...
I seem to remember back when turrets could hit everything no matter what. Then, like 14 months ago, they nerfed tracking, so we couldnt hit ****. Caldari ALWAYS hit, they hit everything, at full possible damage. If you fit a targetpainter, yer damage goes up, and stays up. While us turretppl will keep missing, hitting, scratching, aiming well, and so on and so forth.
Stop whining already.
----------------------------------------------
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MrMorph
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Posted - 2005.09.14 17:35:00 -
[93]
HEY, solution people !!!
Make the torp/cruise launcher shoot 50% faster, make the damage 50% better.
And make each launcher use a base CAP of 70units/shot. In addition, make the
missile able to totally miss the target.
----------------------------------------------
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Tovarishch
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Posted - 2005.09.14 17:35:00 -
[94]
Originally by: MrMorph
I seem to remember back when turrets could hit everything no matter what. Then, like 14 months ago, they nerfed tracking, so we couldnt hit ****. Caldari ALWAYS hit, they hit everything, at full possible damage. If you fit a targetpainter, yer damage goes up, and stays up. While us turretppl will keep missing, hitting, scratching, aiming well, and so on and so forth.
Stop whining already.
I actually laughed out loud upon reading this statement. Seriously, you either know you are lying or you are talking about missiles without ever having fired one since the missile changes.
Why do people insist on making posts containing blatant misinformation?
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Verizana
|
Posted - 2005.09.14 18:19:00 -
[95]
what? do you want rocket launchers over there!
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j0sephine
|
Posted - 2005.09.14 18:43:00 -
[96]
"HEY, solution people !!!
Make the torp/cruise launcher shoot 50% faster, make the damage 50% better.
And make each launcher use a base CAP of 70units/shot. In addition, make the
missile able to totally miss the target."
Somehow i doubt people are going to get very happy about the idea of missile launcher doing 4x the damage of neutron blaster with 90 km range, or 3x neutron blaster damage at up to 250 km... that multiplied by Raven's six missile hardpoints.
well, aside from Caldari, that is ;s
(hey, we could actually kill something with Scorpion then, too...
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