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Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2066
   |
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:07:00 -
[61] - Quote
it's kind of hard to imagine that japan was still was still all about bows and arrows, swords and feudalism less 150 years ago. in just 70 years they went from abolishing the samurai to being the only nation ever to have nukes dropped on them in war lol.
and now, peasants hardly 4 generations removed from rice paddys....are working on robot sex. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
10027
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:18:00 -
[62] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:it's kind of hard to imagine that japan was still was still all about bows and arrows, swords and feudalism less 150 years ago. in just 70 years they went from abolishing the samurai to being the only nation ever to have nukes dropped on them in war lol.
and now, peasants hardly 4 generations removed from rice paddys....are working on robot sex.
And just about 100-ish years ago flight was a wild dream of 2 crazy brothers (actual brothers, not black people)
"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff-á |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2066
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:28:00 -
[63] - Quote
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:it's kind of hard to imagine that japan was still was still all about bows and arrows, swords and feudalism less 150 years ago. in just 70 years they went from abolishing the samurai to being the only nation ever to have nukes dropped on them in war lol.
and now, peasants hardly 4 generations removed from rice paddys....are working on robot sex. And just about 100-ish years ago flight was a wild dream of 2 crazy brothers (actual brothers, not black people)
that's different though. no one was flying.
i'm saying that the technological disparity between japan and the rest of the world was filled in a remarkably short amount of time. what took europe the entirety of the medieval age through the industrial revolution (like 800 years) to accomplish they did in a fraction of the time. a testament to their ingenuity, i think.
|
Kirjava
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
1784
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:32:00 -
[64] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
Actualy the Chinese were using kite gliders to scout enemy formations in around 200BC. Sustained flight was done by the Montgolfier brothers I think he's referring to in 1793.
Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007.
Cardinal Kirjava - Redeclaring the Crusade in the name of the Goddess since 2012. |
Ivy Romanova
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
891
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:41:00 -
[65] - Quote
Kirjava wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
Actualy the Chinese were using kite gliders to scout enemy formations in around 200BC. Sustained flight was done by the Montgolfier brothers I think he's referring to in 1793.
well to be fair , it wasn't until 500AD did the Chinese actually succeed in sustaining unpowered flight , and even then they only did 2.4km , and 5 out of the 6 test pilots died 
(¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à(¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à(¦à_¦à_¦¦¦à-+¦¦¦à-¡-¡-¡-¡-¡a¦¦¦à-Ŧ¦¦ài¦¦¦àj¦¦¦àu¦¦¦àa¦¦¦àn¦¦¦àa¦¦-¡¦à-¡-¡¦à-¡_-¡¦à-¡_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à-¡-¡¦à(-¡)~~-¡~n++ |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2066
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:45:00 -
[66] - Quote
Kirjava wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
Actualy the Chinese were using kite gliders to scout enemy formations in around 200BC. Sustained flight was done by the Montgolfier brothers I think he's referring to in 1793.
i think he means the wright brothers at kitty hawk, north carolina.
|
Kirjava
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
1784
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:46:00 -
[67] - Quote
Ivy Romanova wrote:Kirjava wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
Actualy the Chinese were using kite gliders to scout enemy formations in around 200BC. Sustained flight was done by the Montgolfier brothers I think he's referring to in 1793. well to be fair , it wasn't until 500AD did the Chinese actually succeed in sustaining unpowered flight , and even then they only did 2.4km , and 5 out of the 6 test pilots died
Is still makes me impressed we had that beginnings of the technology that long ago. Similarly the Romans weren't that far off of discovering electricity in retrospect as they were toying with what made fabrics stick together and shock sometimes, they dusted with statically charged amber for instance.
Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007.
Cardinal Kirjava - Redeclaring the Crusade in the name of the Goddess since 2012. |
Ivy Romanova
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
891
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 16:51:00 -
[68] - Quote
Kirjava wrote:Ivy Romanova wrote:Kirjava wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
Actualy the Chinese were using kite gliders to scout enemy formations in around 200BC. Sustained flight was done by the Montgolfier brothers I think he's referring to in 1793. well to be fair , it wasn't until 500AD did the Chinese actually succeed in sustaining unpowered flight , and even then they only did 2.4km , and 5 out of the 6 test pilots died Is still makes me impressed we had that beginnings of the technology that long ago. Similarly the Romans weren't that far off of discovering electricity in retrospect as they were toying with what made fabrics stick together and shock sometimes, they dusted with statically charged amber for instance.
tell me about it ...
The Ionians would have reached where we are today by the 1300s if they were not pooped on by the Greeks for their godless philosophy ...
(Don't get me started on how Christianity destroyed the human civilization back at the dark ages , wasting hundreds of years )
(¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à(¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à(¦à_¦à_¦¦¦à-+¦¦¦à-¡-¡-¡-¡-¡a¦¦¦à-Ŧ¦¦ài¦¦¦àj¦¦¦àu¦¦¦àa¦¦¦àn¦¦¦àa¦¦-¡¦à-¡-¡¦à-¡_-¡¦à-¡_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à-¡-¡¦à(-¡)~~-¡~n++ |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2066
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 17:15:00 -
[69] - Quote
while i have been sick i've spent a lot of time in bed, vegetating out in a rather drugged up state while awaiting to feel better, i watched a lot of tv. on one of the history channels one morning they were talking about an ancient early bronze age race on crete that was super far advanced from everyone else at the time. but they were taken out by a volcano and a tsunami. apparently they had running hot and cold water, street signs, advanced written language. all sorts of nifty things.
i could be misremembering as i was a little "altered" in my state of being but i think they called them the minoans.
i was pretty fascinated by what i could focus on between sneezes, nose blowing and general associated misery. |
Kirjava
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
1789
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 17:20:00 -
[70] - Quote
Still we ended up here, maybe a little later than hypothetically possible but it could be construed the rest was necessary and would happen to any culture until one hit critical mass like the West did. Which I credit to the Church might I add and their curious Monks which developed much of the basis of scientific theory, Mendel for instance was a Churchman who bred beans and noted hereditary strains and applied statistics to his research.
Of course nurtured investigation turned to the schism we are familiar with, but credit where credit is due up till a point in history they were one and the same.
Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007.
Cardinal Kirjava - Redeclaring the Crusade in the name of the Goddess since 2012. |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2066
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 17:29:00 -
[71] - Quote
oh. for sure, religion played a huge role in advancement. for centuries the learning centers were all religious institutions. the muslims, in particular, were far advanced in the sciences and medicine during the medieval ages. definitely trumping europe in those aspects. bested only by the far east at the time, i suppose.
not to imply europe was dropping the balls. they were just focused in other directions. more social and militaristic minded. |
Ivy Romanova
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
891
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 17:43:00 -
[72] - Quote
Hmm.. interesting.
So as much as war and conflict a thing that causes immense suffering , its also a device for human progress.
Look at the WWII for example.
The Germans started an extensive campaign against allied merchants ships using submarines.
The allies started sweeping the sea with Vindicators bombers and Herons.
The Germans then dived deeper and improved their battery life so they can stay submerged longer .
The allies started using Hydrophones and sonar.
The Germans then started to insulate their submarine and change their propeller design to reduce cavitation.
The allies started using even deeper depth charges and improved the sensitivity of accurateness of the magnetic mines.
The germans then dived even deeper and invented periscope depth snorkels for their submarines so they'll NEVER have to resurface again.
War , hate it , love it .
Its good for technological development
(¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à(¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à(¦à_¦à_¦¦¦à-+¦¦¦à-¡-¡-¡-¡-¡a¦¦¦à-Ŧ¦¦ài¦¦¦àj¦¦¦àu¦¦¦àa¦¦¦àn¦¦¦àa¦¦-¡¦à-¡-¡¦à-¡_-¡¦à-¡_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à-¡-¡¦à(-¡)~~-¡~n++ |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2067
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 18:11:00 -
[73] - Quote
i'll tell you one thing war is good for.
the amount of isk in my wallet. |
Zimmy Zeta
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
14341
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 18:48:00 -
[74] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:i'll tell you one thing war is good for.
the amount of isk in my wallet.
Bruce Springsteen disagrees.
Just think of how bad an average post by me is, and then realize half of them are even worse |
Rain6637
Team Evil
852
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 19:02:00 -
[75] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
that's different though. no one was flying.
i'm saying that the technological disparity between japan and the rest of the world was filled in a remarkably short amount of time. what took europe the entirety of the medieval age through the industrial revolution (like 800 years) to accomplish they did in a fraction of the time. a testament to their ingenuity, i think.
studying and working abroad was not just for cultural enrichment--it was also for the technological. 
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
Alara IonStorm
4863
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 20:29:00 -
[76] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
i'm saying that the technological disparity between japan and the rest of the world was filled in a remarkably short amount of time. what took europe the entirety of the medieval age through the industrial revolution (like 800 years) to accomplish they did in a fraction of the time. a testament to their ingenuity, i think.
Yes buying all that industrial equipment from Europe and America and reverse engineering it sure was an ingenious idea. Why didn't Europe think of that 800 before the Industrial Revolution... Oh Wait they didn't have all the blueprints they invented them.
I think it is a testament that without European technology they would still be where they were that fraction of the time ago. |
Rain6637
Team Evil
853
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 20:37:00 -
[77] - Quote
there is a well-known story among the tech/business types in asia...
of a Japanese technology conglomerate CEO who in his budding years, went off to work for a European tech company as a janitor (with his technology background and education). he worked at the company for a year, as a janitor, during which time he became familiar with the company's technology while housekeeping. when he was thoroughly knowledgeable in the company's methods and tech, he quit and returned to his company in Japan.
no one bothered to check who the Japanese janitor was, nor did they discover his father was the CEO of the Japanese technology conglomerate at the time.
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
Alara IonStorm
4863
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 20:43:00 -
[78] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:there is a well-known story among the tech/business types in asia...
of a Japanese technology conglomerate CEO who in his budding years, went off to work for a European tech company as a janitor (with his technology background and education). he worked at the company for a year, as a janitor, during which time he became familiar with the company's technology while housekeeping. when he was thoroughly knowledgeable in the company's methods and tech, he quit and returned to his company in Japan.
no one bothered to check who the Japanese janitor was, nor did they discover his father was the CEO of the Japanese technology conglomerate at the time.
Wow that is sne.... deceptive.
|
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2067
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 22:33:00 -
[79] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
i'm saying that the technological disparity between japan and the rest of the world was filled in a remarkably short amount of time. what took europe the entirety of the medieval age through the industrial revolution (like 800 years) to accomplish they did in a fraction of the time. a testament to their ingenuity, i think.
Yes buying all that industrial equipment from Europe and America and reverse engineering it sure was an ingenious idea. Why didn't Europe think of that 800 before the Industrial Revolution... Oh Wait they didn't have all the blueprints they invented them. I think it is a testament that without European technology they would still be where they were that fraction of the time ago.
i think you are missing the point.
i'm not saying they didn't get a boost. the western powers certainly did sell them old and antiquated tech (at the time) and they certainly did reverse engineer it. they turned an isolationist, horse riding, bow shooting feudal economy that was based off of rice, not even rice...but the promise of future rice into an industrialized imperial super power in two generations. one that has consistently outdone the west ever since "catching up" in technology.
the point is that their accomplishments were impressive.
|
Rain6637
Team Evil
853
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 23:23:00 -
[80] - Quote
buuuuuut they cheated
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
Reiisha
Evolution
The Retirement Club
246
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 23:32:00 -
[81] - Quote
So that professor has never tried looking at his own surroundings?
Japan's work ethic is grueling - At a younger age, work consumes almost your entire life. It's why in the precious free time the Japanese have, they like to "express" themselves in such strange ways. Most younger people are spoonfed the idea that they won't have the time for fun, let alone making babies.
Korea would have been in the same boat if they didn't have such insanely strong family traditions.
If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all... |
Alara IonStorm
4865
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 23:53:00 -
[82] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
i think you are missing the point.
i'm not saying they didn't get a boost. the western powers certainly did sell them old and antiquated tech (at the time) and they certainly did reverse engineer it.
That wasn't "a boost" as you put it, without it they would have had no Industrial Revolution at all in any way.
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
they turned an isolationist, horse riding, bow shooting feudal economy that was based off of rice, not even rice...but the promise of future rice into an industrialized imperial super power in two generations. one that has consistently outdone the west ever since "catching up" in technology.
the point is that their accomplishments were impressive.
That is all correct except for outdoing the West (Everyone outdoes people in certain area's but not all area's) but that isn't what you said, it is what you are saying now.
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
what took europe the entirety of the medieval age through the industrial revolution (like 800 years) to accomplish they did in a fraction of the time.
Saying they accomplished the same in a fraction time is ridiculous when it isn't the same accomplishment. There is a huuuge Grand Canyon sized difference between learning to use an IPhone and inventing the IPhone.
|
Rain6637
Team Evil
853
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 02:38:00 -
[83] - Quote
Eevee is indignant at this point
...and still failing to see Japan's jumps in technology resulted from the world's advances in communications, transportation, science, and manufacturing.
they'd still be feudal if they were left an island
an island, Eevee.
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
Eurydia Vespasian
Nova Insula Mining and Industrial
2070
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 03:06:00 -
[84] - Quote
lol i'm not indignant. i just don't see what the discussion or debate is.  i never said japan reinvented everything and went through an entire industrial revolution from scratch on their own. of course it was dependent on other powers at the time to aid them with techs and markets and stock holding and any number of things essential to a modern nation. they had to! the west didn't go to japan to get rice and samurai swords. in order to have any viable economy to trade with they had to invest in the modernization and infrastructure of the country. that whole meiji restoration thing. thing is they took those ideas and known technologies the west gave them and they made them better. consistently better. across the board. that's what i meant in praising their ingenuity.
i'm just trying to get across that they went through the great societal changes that jump causes at a vastly accelerated rate. that kind of rapid change is a culture shock. no doubt more so for a feudal society. and it was. they fought wars over it. and the old guard ways literally had to get out of the way of the railroad tracks or have the army come destroy them. most of them chose destruction as i recall. there are probably several fine kurosawa films about this very thing.
europe had ages to ease into these changes because, yes, they did all the original legwork and it still caused massive social upheaval at every turn.
maybe i worded it stupidly. idk. if so...my apologies. it made sense to me. idk really what else to say about this lol
Rain6637 wrote:they'd still be feudal if they were left an island
well, maybe. maybe not. someone would have probably just came and conquered them. |
Alara IonStorm
4866
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 04:16:00 -
[85] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
i'm just trying to get across that they went through the great societal changes that jump causes at a vastly accelerated rate. that kind of rapid change is a culture shock. no doubt more so for a feudal society. and it was. they fought wars over it. and the old guard ways literally had to get out of the way of the railroad tracks or have the army come destroy them. most of them chose destruction as i recall. there are probably several fine kurosawa films about this very thing.
It wasn't just internal rebellion. The reason they invaded China in 1932 was for materials as well which led to over 20 million deaths and was debatably the start of World War 2 though some say it wasn't until they launched a full invasion China in 1937. Briton did a lot bloody colonizing as well during their revolution.
There is a proven pattern that nations that Industrialized their Military tended to stomp others into the ground who weren't for cheap materials or dominated them by using local leaders and signing humiliating "friendship treaties" (Give us your stuff.) that got you machine gunned if you disagreed.
"Whatever happens we have got-
-the Maxim Gun and they have not."
White Mans Burden, Asian Co Prosperity Sphere, Manifest Destiny, it all boils down to those that can take from those that can't then proclaim they are helping. Now that Industry is everywhere who has the A Bomb or is good friends with those who do seems to be the new indicator of who gets invaded and metaled with by big Countries.
Though it seems like that is a terrible thing in some places quality of life improved under new leadership, people who were committing massacres were stopped, food got to the hungry, countries were industrialized, education improved, commerce with the Industrial Nation while usually uneven brought money in. Now North Korea has the A-Bomb and stories from their concentration camps are enough to curl your toes while people starve, unless they start a war chances of them being taken over are slim.
Case by case it is hard to tell what was right, what was wrong. A lot of opportunity and prosperity came from greed, meddling and bloodshed a half century down the line and lot hasn't... Iraq and Afghanistan for instance, good for their future in the long run after their dead have been buried or just a waste of life and money? ****** and the Taliban were no picnic for the people that is to be sure. Right or wrong we will find out in the decades to come.
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
maybe i worded it stupidly. idk. if so...my apologies. it made sense to me. idk really what else to say about this lol
I'm sorry for picking, I do that a lot. |
Kirjava
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
1798
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 07:02:00 -
[86] - Quote
If you start later, you have the advantage of capitalizing on knowing what went right already and emulating it. Japans economy was plugged into their advancement, but anyone could have taken a step back and seen they could only advance to the pinnacle and no further at the investment return rates. You could invest $100 into Japan in the 60's and get $1000 out in a few years until Japan became the most advanced, no more pipeline technology to implement and they had to start researching themselves. It was in the late 70's and 80's that Japan started respecting patents more as they had more to lose.
The same is happening with China, they can advance to an advanced tech driven consumer economy like the developed world, but they cannot into space.
Unless they understand where they stand and develop a space program now to create more pipeline technology ahead of time while the West cuts back assuming it is the supreme civilization for all time and the dictator of technological advancement and market demand. Which is partly why we are still in recession. It used to be when the west went into recession, global demand slumped across the board and material costs plummeted till the economy picked up.
China just soaked up everything with its space Dollars.
Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007.
Cardinal Kirjava - Redeclaring the Crusade in the name of the Goddess since 2012. |
rodyas
tie fighters inc
1115
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 07:37:00 -
[87] - Quote
No, I am pretty sure Godzilla scaring them senseless every few 100 years, is what drove their advancement. Good ol' old testament discipline to keep them active.
As well as the Japanese learning if they have less people on the island, most likely Godzilla a true predator will move to other areas that are more well populated.
Also they spent so much time looking up at Godzilla, and just seeing his junk all the time, their society has no standards towards panty shots, even the old people there, think at least that person is wearing underwear, after all the abusive junk they stared at in their younger years.
Signature removed for inappropriate language - CCP Eterne |
Rain6637
Team Evil
856
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 10:04:00 -
[88] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:ok, here's what I'm going to do.
What the Cubans are to Miami, the Indians are to this city near Los Angeles (I'm in Orange County, near-ish to Disneyland)...
tomorrow... about 12 hours from now, I'm going to head to "little india" ... there's a nice coffee shop on a corner with big windows... I'm going to take some pictures of people driving by and maybe walking down the street
this isn't to mock them, I'm not saying Cubans in Miami or Indians in Los Angeles are good or bad--they just are what they are...
but you will see what I mean.
I'm a student, I have Friday-Sun off. I do whatever I feel, and this sounds like fun.
well ****, that didn't happen today. i hope I have better luck tomorrow! ****
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
Ivy Romanova
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
900
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 11:27:00 -
[89] - Quote
WELL!
This is totally not creepy at all
(¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à(¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à¦à(¦à_¦à_¦¦¦à-+¦¦¦à-¡-¡-¡-¡-¡a¦¦¦à-Ŧ¦¦ài¦¦¦àj¦¦¦àu¦¦¦àa¦¦¦àn¦¦¦àa¦¦-¡¦à-¡-¡¦à-¡_-¡¦à-¡_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à-¡-¡¦à(-¡)~~-¡~n++ |
Rain6637
Team Evil
856
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 14:05:00 -
[90] - Quote
pssst: uncanny valley
http://themittani.com/ | http://evenews24.com/ || Vincent Athena-á||-áflycatcher waaaaat |
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