Funnily enough some of the most cutthroat pirates are the coolest people too.

And there are quite a few people who will wave at you if you evade their gate camp, will say hi, and still try to kill you.

Then there's people who take this game way too seriously =(

One of my closer friends in EvE (Teki Awong) Started out in eve and played eve for a long time completely Independent without much interaction with other players and was fine with that and moved on to the player corp scene in his own time]

This demonstrates that they care more about their own niche and opinion than they do the continued health and growth of EvE as a whole.

What I found ironic in that 'other' thread was the anti-carebears insisting that the tutorial hand-hold new players through all aspects of the game including Low Sec (a part which would not work at all for obvious reasons).

Most of the fun early on for me was having to figure things out on my own and even find out about them by encountering them, then investigating.

They cry so loudly about not wanting EVE to be a theme-park, but that thread yesterday was about making EVE into anything but a Sandbox.

If you wanna carebear, then go ahead. Suit yourself. But don't poison the newbies before they even have had the chance to experience both sides. Newbs are not going to learn anything by restraining them from day one.

I wonder, if new players started in low- or null-sec, would the post to which the OP refers have complained about newbie over-exposure to Goons...?

Or they simply understand that any attempt to make Eve a game "for everyone" would very quickly make it a game for no one.

well, they will learn to be independently wealthy which is vital for being a member of certain PvP corps and not everyone wants a second boss.

Being a newb id like to share my opinion on the matter. The reason I stayed in this wonderful albeit frightening game was support from other players, vets and other newbs alike. I was confused as hell the first week. In fact I still am on many things.

Why must everyone aspire to wealth?
Do people not realize there are people out there that love flying by the seat of their pants and find acquisition of wealth through mundane task too boring as an entertainment passtime?

Why are you a slave to your wallet if you have such strong feelings about having a "second boss" dictate what when and how you do in a game?

I doubt it. Whether or not you hate em is irrelevant to the fact that Goonswarm and the CFC as a whole look after their noobs. They looked after me when I first started and I haven't scammed anyone ever!

Hmm maybe they did it wrong.

OP please understand that we no longer play eve.. we only keep our accounts going to tell everyone else they are wrong for how they chose to play the game.

Why must everyone aspire to wealth?
Do people not realize there are people out there that love flying by the seat of their pants and find acquisition of wealth through mundane task too boring as an entertainment passtime?

Why are you a slave to your wallet if you have such strong feelings about having a "second boss" dictate what when and how you do in a game?

I'm just saying I enjoy life as a freelancer, not that it's the 'correct' way. I just really hate the idea of being dependent on people for ships. There's corps out there for me, no doubt. I've read their forums, I know what they expect, and you need to pay your own way.

Also an RPG wiohout any grind is just something too radical for my elderly gamer mind to grasp.

Highlighted the important part. Sounds 'correct' (for you) to me.

Too often people get stuck doing something they don't enjoy, because others told them it is required (when it's not) and burn out in the process. And that is the core reason players of all kinds quit - they don't enjoy what they are doing and leave for a pastime they do enjoy.

The best thing you vets can do is offer what guidance you can,either by advice or assets, making our first weeks as easy as you can. If the said player does not want help, always leave the offer on the table in case they reconsider, but never be forceful about it, either in game or in the forums.

Recently read a very volatile post that sadly was locked before I could get my 2 bits in. It was on the subject of what drives new players away from the game. From what I could read, most of these characters accounts being rather old, fell into two camps. The anti carebears believing that newbies are driven away by the insane boredom that can come from being recruited into a high sec corp that only mines and missions (both I agree can be boring but i do them and understand their necessity) and then there is the Other camp which I really don't have a name for because really they were just trying to oppose the OP any way they could. (even though there were voices of reason on both sides of the issue they were kinda got drowned out by everyone else)

Being a newb id like to share my opinion on the matter. The reason I stayed in this wonderful albeit frightening game was support from other players, vets and other newbs alike. I was confused as hell the first week. In fact I still am on many things. But with the friends I made with in the first week of the game I still move onward wanting too learn more and do more. And yet you still have too take into account that every person is different and react differently to things. One of my closer friends in EvE (Teki Awong) Started out in eve and played eve for a long time completely Independent without much interaction with other players and was fine with that and moved on to the player corp scene in his own time, and on the flip side of that coin is another friend (Dark Aries JR) who played eve for three days and told me that the scope of it was just not his style and quit.

I guess what I am trying too say here is do not be on the extreme side (either side -.-) of this issue it helps no one and certainly does not help EvE. There are many reasons why us newbs could leave, boredom being one of them, but you have to remember most of us that sub too this game are grown adults (even if we don't act like it sometimes xD) and can make our own decisions. The best thing you vets can do is offer what guidance you can,either by advice or assets, making our first weeks as easy as you can. If the said player does not want help, always leave the offer on the table in case they reconsider, but never be forceful about it, either in game or in the forums.


Side Note: I hope this post gets locked allot sooner than the last one if this one gets just as out of hand

This character is used to sell things on the market and never had much of a reason to join a player corporation, so I left myself stay in my starting NPC corporation.

The NPC schools are defintely an underused resource. you can often get more sense out of corp chat than rookie help because there will be vets using alts in them like you, or just guys who never bothered leaving 'cos they can do pretty much everything with friends they've made in the NPC corp that they could in a player corp.