Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
1148
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 21:32:00 -
[31] - Quote
Anslo has it more or less exactly correct. It's not a question of how well-equipped the hospital ship is, it's not a question of how high-tech the medical transport used to get her onto that ship is. Sometimes, a patient's survival depends upon them being subjected to the absolute minimum of motion and environmental stress. The ATLS unit of a solidly-built hospital in a well-established city in a tectonically stable region on a high-security planet is as good as it gets. There's no insult involved in saying that anything less than that as-good-as-it-gets setting decreases her odds of survival, let alone good recovery An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Hadrian Tivianne
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 21:43:00 -
[32] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote: If she dies and the Republic have been denied access to her...
But they have not been denied access to her. Yes, the Federation has not reached out either. But that doesn't equal denial, and I would would also say that the RSS incident likely didn't help the matter either.
I'd also like pose the question of what happens if she should die whilst being transferred to Republic care? Will the Matari accept responsibility? Call me insensitive but based on what I've seen so far, I doubt it. It seems to me the Federation is going to take heat regardless of the course it chooses. My opinion is that they accept that, and move on with the patient's care in a way that is best for the patient.
|
Caellach Marellus
Aideron Technologies
827
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 21:57:00 -
[33] - Quote
Semantics need to be thrown out the window in this case, the priority goal should be the health and well being of Midular.
While it might be a happy story to have Midular brought back to health by her people, or that they had a hand in it, in truth it is utterly irrelevant. What matters at this moment above all is the patient gets the best care and attention, the emotional concerns of the masses are meaningless in comparison.
Admiral Blake, bluntly but rightly, pointed out the situation as to why she cannot be returned at this time, and the rest of you are playing guessing games as to who does and does not have access. At this point what the people want is irrelevant, no one has the right to risk her life with, what is in the greater scape of things, trivial feel good symbolism. Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
Kazzzi
Heathen Legion Morbid Atrocity
159
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 22:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:If Midular returns to Minmatar space in her current condition, she will die.
Would be for the best really.
Send the appeaser back, preferably in a box. |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
1148
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 22:40:00 -
[35] - Quote
disagreeing with a person's politics is not sufficient reason to wish suffering and death on them, Kazzzi. This kind of vocal hate just makes you look like a psychotic animal. An in-character blog and a video: http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Scherezad
Lai Dai Research Spacelane Security
801
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 22:51:00 -
[36] - Quote
Anslo is quite correct. The lady should not be moved, save under extreme medical duress, and only to a facility better suited to her care, should one exist. Visitors should certainly be allowed - especially those with whom she is familiar. Comforting and familiar voices will be a great salve to her right now, and may help in her recovery. Scents, also, if they are available.
Lai Dai Research Biomedical and Cybernetic will happily provide any expertise or material required by the recovery of Mrs. Midular, should it be asked. |
Makoto Priano
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services
108
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 22:52:00 -
[37] - Quote
To this point, I've seen nothing specifically denying Republic medical crew access to Ms. Midular. Still, the Federation would surely be able to defuse this tension by proactively inviting Republic personnel to observe and assist. It would be a gesture of good will, acknowledging the Republic's perfectly reasonable interest in both the crime and Ms. Midular's health, while maintaining jurisdiction.
My fear is that Mr. Roden was elected to fight a war, and is essentially a war profiteer, not a qualified diplomat. Hopefully some capable senator or Gallente capsuleer will step in. |
Xadiran
Moira. Villore Accords
4
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 22:56:00 -
[38] - Quote
I have never personally had even the slightest relationship with Minmatar officials, or the republic, but I highly respect Karin for her past work and am truly saddened this happened to her. I am personally willing to donate large sums of isk if it will help acquire the kind of medical equipment and nano-technology needed to give her back her life.
Arguing about WHO gives her medical treatment is petty, people. She should get treatment from the best medical professionals available, whatever nationality they may be.
And I am quite serious about the credits. |
Ran Kullervo
Kindred of Scarecrows
1
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 23:03:00 -
[39] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Hostage or no, Ray of Matar has been shot and might die of it. This is a Sebiestor matter and should be handled by the Sebiestor. Federation's utter lack of co-operation, to the extreme of sending a military fleet to stop Republic forces from crossing the border to handle the matter, is outrageous.
Having one mark or another on one's face is just lucking out in an idiotic mystical lottery. She's a woman, same as any other, and lots of women, men and children died in the attack.
**** the Voluval. |
Ava Starfire
Gradient Electus Matari
791
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 23:12:00 -
[40] - Quote
The thoughts and prayers of Clan and kin to all of the victims and families of victims who have been impacted by this event. I would hope that my tribe-siblings would remain calm and do our best to assist in any way we can, without disruption. For now.
However.
I believe I speak for the whole of my Tribe when I say that the Ray of Matar's health and safety is our number one concern. If it is in her best interest to be treated where she is, then she must be treated where she is.
For that reason, I await confirmation that doctors, investigators, and security personnel from the Tribe are being 100% cooperated with and that all records connected with this event are open to them.
Any response other than "yes, absolutely, we're doing this" simply means "we have things to hide from you".
"There is no strength in numbers; have no such misconception."
-Jayka Vofur, "Warfare in the North" |
|
Gosakumori Noh
Viziam Amarr Empire
175
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 00:19:00 -
[41] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Hostage or no, Ray of Matar has been shot and might die of it. This is a Sebiestor matter and should be handled by the Sebiestor. Federation's utter lack of co-operation, to the extreme of sending a military fleet to stop Republic forces from crossing the border to handle the matter, is outrageous.
Elsebeth Rhiannon Sebiestor
"How dare the Federation send ships to protect its own border!" That's a keeper.
Have I mentioned recently that the Sebiestor are a problem? I dare say, a few more came around to recognizing as much from the above-quoted material right there. Why, I couldn't have planned it out better myself if I tried. Hmmm.
"For the Horde," sweet pea! Keep up the good work. |
Seriphyn Inhonores
Destiny Foundation
462
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 00:29:00 -
[42] - Quote
Quote:GÇ£It is appalling that such sensitive details of Chief Midular's condition have been so brazenly shared by her doctors,GÇ¥ the statement read. GÇ£A Ray of Matar has been the victim of a serious attack and the Federation is freely discussing her medical status without any respect to patient-doctor confidentiality. The Federation must transfer her to proper Minmatar care immediately, where our doctors can provide her with appropriate treatment in privacy.GÇ¥
While the Sebiestor Tribe calls it disrespect, the Caille doctors may call it transparency, and even its own form of respect in keeping the billions concerned for her notified.
At least they're not locking her up and saying "Nope, won't tell you what's happening". |
Kazzzi
Heathen Legion Morbid Atrocity
159
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 00:52:00 -
[43] - Quote
Stitcher wrote:disagreeing with a person's politics is not sufficient reason to wish suffering and death on them, Kazzzi. This kind of vocal hate just makes you look like a psychotic animal.
I don't want her to suffer at all. Just a quick clean death, as soon as possible. As she deserves.
Seems I'm not the only one who still feels this way. |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
2449
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 01:02:00 -
[44] - Quote
The woman is close to death and you're arguing over where she should be treated and by whom. The Minmatar either trust us as allies, in which case they trust us to safeguard the lives of their dignitaries, or they don't - in which case they have little enough reason to make demands of us, nor expect us to deliver on them. Mane 614
|
Kyraella Myshtana
Eternal Fortress Endless Renaissance
9
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 01:03:00 -
[45] - Quote
We are aggrieved by this tragedy and I hope for Midular's swift recovery.
I would like to offer the use of one of our Intaki hospital beds. We have several with transcranial neural burning scanners and the capability to transfer consciousness in the event that her body becomes uninhabitable. I can personally attest to their effectiveness. |
BloodBird
Mixed Metaphor
131
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 01:54:00 -
[46] - Quote
Kyraella Myshtana wrote:We are aggrieved by this tragedy and I hope for Midular's swift recovery.
I would like to offer the use of one of our Intaki hospital beds. We have several with transcranial neural burning scanners and the capability to transfer consciousness in the event that her body becomes uninhabitable. I can personally attest to their effectiveness.
I am sure the offer and your concern is appreciated, but it has already been confirmed that this is not an option, sadly.
|
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
1337
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 05:23:00 -
[47] - Quote
Quote:The Federation must transfer her to proper Minmatar care immediately, where our doctors can provide her with appropriate treatment in privacy.GÇ¥
First, Republic medical science > Federation medical science?! Ha! They aren't serious, are they? I wouldn't be surprised if they busted out a jar of leeches. Heck, we Amarrians could learn a thing or two from Federation doctors. They're the best around and I'm not ashamed to say it.
Second, if by "appropriate treatment" they mean a pillow over the head to finish the job then sure.
Makoto Priano wrote:While I fully trust that Gallente medical personnel are giving Ms. Midular the aid she requires, it would still behoove the Federation to allow a Matari medical team to observe and assist. If they deem that she is in a condition that would allow transport, then the Federation should bow to the Matari doctors' wishes.
You want to bring more assassins in? Why? Wasn't one enough? Live Events are neither. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
309
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 07:16:00 -
[48] - Quote
For the record, I have nothing but respect towards the doctors at Caille who are doing their job and I trust doing it well. That is not the issue.
The issue is who gets to decide that it is theirs to do the job. That should be done by Midular's tribe, and no one else. With the doctors advising.
The fact that this thread debates endlessly whether the Ray should be moved, could be moved, etc etc, is living proof about how much the point is missed by outsiders. It is none of your gods-be-damned business. Even if you knew for a fact that what the tribe intends was dangerous, it would still be none of your business. It is our elders' job to decide, and that of other people with the expertise to advice them.
The longer this matter is kept out of tribal hands, the more we risk a conflict where we really do not need one.
|
Caellach Marellus
Aideron Technologies
827
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 11:45:00 -
[49] - Quote
And to those doctors, what you want is irrelevant.
In their care is a woman who needs their help, and they have a duty to do the best they can for her well being. They aren't politicians, or experts on tribal knowledge, they're medical physicians and experts and their goal is not to appease your sentimental needs.
They're to keep her alive and to hopefully get her back to good health, put your pointless stubbornness aside and let them do their job. She is not a piece of meat that you possess to have done as you will with, to be argued over or paraded about with some ideal of ownership to her basic medical rights.
Nor do I believe, considering the severity of the injury, do they have time to sit and twiddle thumb while you work out the best course of action for her, when the best course is going to be the one they're already undertaking without the wasted time of such a stupid delay. Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
Gabriel Darkefyre
Gradient Electus Matari
39
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 11:52:00 -
[50] - Quote
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:Quote:GÇ£It is appalling that such sensitive details of Chief Midular's condition have been so brazenly shared by her doctors,GÇ¥ the statement read. GÇ£A Ray of Matar has been the victim of a serious attack and the Federation is freely discussing her medical status without any respect to patient-doctor confidentiality. The Federation must transfer her to proper Minmatar care immediately, where our doctors can provide her with appropriate treatment in privacy.GÇ¥ While the Sebiestor Tribe calls it disrespect, the Caille doctors may call it transparency, and even its own form of respect in keeping the billions concerned for her notified. At least they're not locking her up and saying "Nope, won't tell you what's happening".
To be frank, the Local Doctor's job is to be providing for the care of the wounded of this attack, of which Karin Midular is one of Hundreds. The only people that they should be informing about the status of any of those wounded is the direct Next of Kin via the Minmatar Embassy if necessary.
The fact that the Doctors considered broadcasting all the details to the entire Cluster via the Scope to be an Appropriate Channel of Communication for this is Disgusting. It should have been up to her own family which Details of her treatment they were comfortable with being publicly released. |
|
Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
764
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 12:08:00 -
[51] - Quote
I am not Matari and so this comment is given only as one from the outside. However, I employ many Vherokior as crew members and even as my crew chief for I have come to appreciate their gifted perceptiveness.
In conversations with Krik, my crew chief, a few things have stood out.
"It is as important where and how we die as where and how we live."
"To save one's life at all costs does not always honor the dignity and value of the person."
I should have been taking notes, because Krik said a lot that made sense outside of the limited capsuleer perspective.
Karin Midular should be returned to her tribe so that whether in life, or just as important in death, she can be appropriately respected, honored, and valued. Let the issue of criminal justice for the accused be debated, but let this woman be home with her people. The Disciples of Ston bid you peace |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
309
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 13:06:00 -
[52] - Quote
It is not the doctor's only duty to save lives at any cost; she also has a duty to listen to and respect the wishes of the patient and their kin. If they make decisions that the doctor considers dangerous, she should make sure they understand the consequences - and then let them do it. At nowhere civilized does the doctor make final calls about treatment. They advice; they do not dictate. |
Caellach Marellus
Aideron Technologies
827
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 14:26:00 -
[53] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:It is not the doctor's only duty to save lives at any cost; she also has a duty to listen to and respect the wishes of the patient and their kin. If they make decisions that the doctor considers dangerous, she should make sure they understand the consequences - and then let them do it. At nowhere civilized does the doctor make final calls about treatment. They advice; they do not dictate.
At nowhere civilised does a Doctor allow reckless action that endangers the patient either. They have a duty of care, and that involves not exposing her to risk of harm.
Perhaps sooner or later the penny will drop that no matter how much noise you make, this isn't about you, this is about one woman's health and everything else is irrelevant to that priority. What can be more important to her tribe than her well being after all? Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
Caellach Marellus
Aideron Technologies
827
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 14:28:00 -
[54] - Quote
Gabriel Darkefyre wrote:To be frank, the Local Doctor's job is to be providing for the care of the wounded of this attack, of which Karin Midular is one of Hundreds. The only people that they should be informing about the status of any of those wounded is the direct Next of Kin via the Minmatar Embassy if necessary.
The fact that the Doctors considered broadcasting all the details to the entire Cluster via the Scope to be an Appropriate Channel of Communication for this is Disgusting. It should have been up to her own family which Details of her treatment they were comfortable with being publicly released.
On this I agree, public details should not have been released by the medical team, that was a matter for others to determine. Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
Kyraella Myshtana
Eternal Fortress Endless Renaissance
9
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 15:38:00 -
[55] - Quote
BloodBird wrote:Kyraella Myshtana wrote:We are aggrieved by this tragedy and I hope for Midular's swift recovery.
I would like to offer the use of one of our Intaki hospital beds. We have several with transcranial neural burning scanners and the capability to transfer consciousness in the event that her body becomes uninhabitable. I can personally attest to their effectiveness. I am sure the offer and your concern is appreciated, but it has already been confirmed that this is not an option, sadly.
I am afraid that I missed this part of the discussion.
Does she lack clones of the body? I am living proof that close relatives' clones are sometimes suitable- if problematic.
I would suggest the new dropclone technology, as there is no need for compatible DNA, but I do not know if her vessel could survive the implantation process. |
Anslo
The Scope Gallente Federation
1393
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 15:40:00 -
[56] - Quote
Current report says her patterns aren't stable enough for mind transfer. Any transfer would be partial or completely failed and the infomorph's structure might collapse before even making it to the clone body.
|
Gosakumori Noh
Viziam Amarr Empire
176
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 17:07:00 -
[57] - Quote
Gabriel Darkefyre wrote:
The fact that the Doctors considered broadcasting all the details to the entire Cluster via the Scope to be an Appropriate Channel of Communication for this is Disgusting. It should have been up to her own family which Details of her treatment they were comfortable with being publicly released.
It isn't just a question of whether Midular lives or dies, but whether your vile little tribe insists that her death should form the basis of (further) Dangerous Acts to Come.
If there is a threat to the citizens of the Federation, its government not only has a right, but in fact a duty, to keep its citizens informed of that threat. Consequently, although you are clearly not bright enough to recognize it, you little rust elves are the very reason the Gallente *must* release details of your precious leader's condition. "For the Horde," sweeties. Should Midular's status worsen, the citizens of the Federation would be well-advised to begin making preparations.
The Empire might have some pointers on that front, but I digress.
At long last, an event has come along to reveal the true nature of the Sebiestor for all to see. Contrary to the marketing hype, you are not a thoughtful or mystic bunch. We Amarr understand these things. You are conniving and feral, and should be removed from your position in the Republic in favor of the Nefantar - or at least the Krusual - at the earliest opportunity.
Hmmm. Perhaps the death of Midular would present such an opportunity.... |
Lyn Farel
Kitzless
462
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 18:27:00 -
[58] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:It is not the doctor's only duty to save lives at any cost; she also has a duty to listen to and respect the wishes of the patient and their kin. If they make decisions that the doctor considers dangerous, she should make sure they understand the consequences - and then let them do it. At nowhere civilized does the doctor make final calls about treatment. They advice; they do not dictate.
The patient is in a coma, thus unable to actually make any wishes.
Her kin, yes, but why should her kin wishes prevail ? They are not her, and they are not medical experts. I am genuinely curious to understand the reasoning behind. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
311
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 19:03:00 -
[59] - Quote
Is it not the next of kin, relatives, family, or similar, that decides on a person's care if they are unable, even among outsiders, even among the Enemy?
Beyond that, I do not think I can explain kinship to you, Captain Farel. I think I recall trying and not being very successful. |
Adreena Madeveda
55
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 19:39:00 -
[60] - Quote
Gosakumori Noh wrote: Smeared her hate of everything Sebiestor, again
Dear Gosakumori, I wish you a long and meaningful life ; I wish you a beautiful daughter, full of spirits and wits. I wish her to meet the space intentionally left blank of her dreams, and I wish you grow fond of the space intentionally left blank she'll chose to share her life with. I wish her, and even if that part of my wish rests on your shoulder I'm confident you'll do your best to make it happen, I wish her a beautiful wedding, on a glorious, gorgeous bright day. I wish a celebration so filled with happiness the family and guests for those few hours, and many months after, keep confidence that sometimes, life just turns out well and things are just fine.
And of course, I wish you, eyes filled with tears of joy, at the front row, while the Shaman bless their union.
http://dignifiednuclearwaste.overblog.com |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |