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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |

Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
371
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Posted - 2013.04.16 16:44:00 -
[31] - Quote
Beside the shield transfer and the warfare link you listed, teh 3 toher are all AFK enabling solution to ganking. The extender is 100% active while AFK, the DCU II is 99,9% AFK because you have to click it once then it will keep cycling. The extremely low cap requirement means it will not remove cap stability from your barge. The warfare link for shield resist only require another AFK account offgrind boosting.
His request is like a shild extender with the fitting requirement of "have a friend with battleship I on grid". If the guy want to sacrifice an account just to tank ONE ship, I think it's a fair tradeoff. Just make the cycle time high so it's not efficient to change your boost target and even add some kind of spoolup time so you cannot just wait for the target to be attacked and then reinforce that tharget. You get a lesser solution in multi ship use but easyer to manage for a single ship protection. |

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
2619
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 17:05:00 -
[32] - Quote
I think there was a STTNG episode where the Enterprise extended its shields around another ship.
But I was probably drunk when I saw it. Disregard. |

Georgina Parmala
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
63
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 17:19:00 -
[33] - Quote
Vincent Gaines wrote: Or, you can just have a friend in an osprey sitting next to you transferring shields.
And by "next to you" you mean 90 KM away. |

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
3110
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 17:25:00 -
[34] - Quote
Haedonism Bot wrote:CCP has already given you all the modules you need to prevent ganks.
I agree, but the problem is that CCP doesnt Pre-fit those already ehp buffed barges/exhumers with those modules.
Why change the way you play a game when you can simply constantly petiton through numerous threads to have have the game change around your playstyle? Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |

Haulie Berry
435
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 17:31:00 -
[35] - Quote
Oh, FFS...
Use a procurer, that's what it's there for.
Frankly, they should roll back the barge changes strictly as a punitive measure against morons who received an inch and are now asking for a mile. |

Thorrahrafn
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
17
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Posted - 2013.04.16 19:50:00 -
[36] - Quote
As has already been said, there is already a highly-effective module for preventing suicide ganks. It has very low fitting requirements and can be mounted on any ship.
It's called The Player. |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3223
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Posted - 2013.04.16 22:44:00 -
[37] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Beside the shield transfer and the warfare link you listed, teh 3 toher are all AFK enabling solution to ganking. The extender is 100% active while AFK, the DCU II is 99,9% AFK because you have to click it once then it will keep cycling. The extremely low cap requirement means it will not remove cap stability from your barge. The warfare link for shield resist only require another AFK account offgrind boosting.
His request is like a shild extender with the fitting requirement of "have a friend with battleship I on grid". If the guy want to sacrifice an account just to tank ONE ship, I think it's a fair tradeoff. Just make the cycle time high so it's not efficient to change your boost target and even add some kind of spoolup time so you cannot just wait for the target to be attacked and then reinforce that tharget. You get a lesser solution in multi ship use but easyer to manage for a single ship protection.
Not one account per ship. Nowhere did he say anything about limiting the number of these modules you could fit a Rokh with nothing but PDUs and LSEIIs and have 58.8k Shield HP to work with.
8 targets get some shield HP (thus EHP). 1 gets 14.7k => ~60k EHP added 2 gets 11.025 3 gets 8.2k 4 gets 6.2k 5 gets 4.6k 6 gets 3.4k 7 gets 2.6k 8 gets 1.96k => ~10k EHP added
For reference, a resist fit 3 MLU Mackinaw makes 15k EHP out of 3.75k HP with 3 MLU IIs, so at worst, you're just about doubling the EHP of 7 Mackinaws with 1 AFK ship in a way that's effective against both the expensive Alpha ganks and the cheaper DPS ganks.
More likely, you're protecting 8 targets because a ganker can't tell which one you activated the module on first. All completely AFK.
Most importantly, this would put the final nail in the coffin for the usefulness of the Procurer/Skiff, which are the ships designed to protect you from suicide ganking through high EHP.
If you want high EHP in a mining vessel, the Procurer/Skiff are the ships for you. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
1389
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 23:06:00 -
[38] - Quote
pussnheels wrote:Do not run missions in a officer fitted faction ship in the most populair misson hubs
Does CONCORD not function inside of missions or something?
Live Events are neither. |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
1326
|
Posted - 2013.04.16 23:24:00 -
[39] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:pussnheels wrote:Do not run missions in a officer fitted faction ship in the most populair misson hubs Does CONCORD not function inside of missions or something? Sure they do. And they'll show up in time to watch your rapidly-cooling corpse finish out-gassing. Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Didn't vote? Then you voted for NulBloc |

Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
373
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Posted - 2013.04.17 00:10:00 -
[40] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Beside the shield transfer and the warfare link you listed, teh 3 toher are all AFK enabling solution to ganking. The extender is 100% active while AFK, the DCU II is 99,9% AFK because you have to click it once then it will keep cycling. The extremely low cap requirement means it will not remove cap stability from your barge. The warfare link for shield resist only require another AFK account offgrind boosting.
His request is like a shild extender with the fitting requirement of "have a friend with battleship I on grid". If the guy want to sacrifice an account just to tank ONE ship, I think it's a fair tradeoff. Just make the cycle time high so it's not efficient to change your boost target and even add some kind of spoolup time so you cannot just wait for the target to be attacked and then reinforce that tharget. You get a lesser solution in multi ship use but easyer to manage for a single ship protection. Not one account per ship. Nowhere did he say anything about limiting the number of these modules you could fit a Rokh with nothing but PDUs and LSEIIs and have 58.8k Shield HP to work with. 8 targets get some shield HP (thus EHP). 1 gets 14.7k => ~60k EHP added 2 gets 11.025 3 gets 8.2k 4 gets 6.2k 5 gets 4.6k 6 gets 3.4k 7 gets 2.6k 8 gets 1.96k => ~10k EHP added For reference, a resist fit 3 MLU Mackinaw makes 15k EHP out of 3.75k HP with 3 MLU IIs, so at worst, you're just about doubling the EHP of 7 Mackinaws with 1 AFK ship in a way that's effective against both the expensive Alpha ganks and the cheaper DPS ganks. More likely, you're protecting 8 targets because a ganker can't tell which one you activated the module on first. All completely AFK. Most importantly, this would put the final nail in the coffin for the usefulness of the Procurer/Skiff, which are the ships designed to protect you from suicide ganking through high EHP. If you want high EHP in a mining vessel, the Procurer/Skiff are the ships for you.
The amount of limitation that can be put on it is pretty large. It does nto ahve to be as strong as you quite nicely illustrate it in this post. |
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RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3230
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 01:07:00 -
[41] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:The amount of limitation that can be put on it is pretty large. It does not have to be as strong as you quite nicely illustrate it in this post.
So long as you can fit more than one and the first boost is enough to make ganking unprofitable, the same effect occurs because you can't tell who you initiate the module on first after the fact.
And the most important objection remains: There is already a ship line designed for use by people who want extra EHP to whether/discourage ganking. The Procurer/Skiff. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7529
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 03:02:00 -
[42] - Quote
nope get owned some more by people who actually play the game mine quotes from my posts at your peril, badposters TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest. Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7530
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 03:19:00 -
[43] - Quote
i mean goddamn you AFK mine in an untanked exhumer (a ship not meant to be in combat) which still has more EHP than an unfit hictor (a ship meant to be in combat) because CCP realized that difficult choices like yield vs. tank are not acceptable for hisec miners, because hisec miners are special snowflakes who cannot be expected to put a single iota of thought into their gameplay
expecting them to put an iota of thought into their gameplay is unacceptable and they will throw tantrums and unsub because nobody else in the game is expected to make decisions like "DPS vs tank" or "DPS vs speed" or "tank vs utility" - forcing the miners to make such calls is unacceptable as mining must be bot-friendly and mindless gameplay mine quotes from my posts at your peril, badposters TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest. Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
2407
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 04:14:00 -
[44] - Quote
Shhh.. Nobody tell him about the exhumer nerf yet.. lol |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7530
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 04:36:00 -
[45] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:Shhh.. Nobody tell him about the exhumer nerf yet.. lol
A change that affects 41 other ships is not an "exhumer nerf" it's a "nerf to resistance bonuses" mine quotes from my posts at your peril, badposters TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest. Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Joan Greywind
I Moan ALOT We Moan ALOT
1
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 08:05:00 -
[46] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Mocam wrote:Closest I've come to an actual deal like this was an armor rig/module that would ping back 1hp damage to the hitting ship. You mean like drones can if you're ATK? Why else do Exhumers and Barges have silly high scan res? (Unfit Hulk locks a Destroyer in under 2s.) Hey, a TD, some ECM, or ECM drones will all get you on their killmails, and could even prevent the gank from succeeding.
But then how will I use minning drones? I want to have kills + take maximum amount of space rock |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3232
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 08:07:00 -
[47] - Quote
Joan Greywind wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Mocam wrote:Closest I've come to an actual deal like this was an armor rig/module that would ping back 1hp damage to the hitting ship. You mean like drones can if you're ATK? Why else do Exhumers and Barges have silly high scan res? (Unfit Hulk locks a Destroyer in under 2s.) Hey, a TD, some ECM, or ECM drones will all get you on their killmails, and could even prevent the gank from succeeding. But then how will I use minning drones? I want to have kills + take maximum amount of space rock
I know it's a joke, but... This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |

Dave Stark
2635
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 08:13:00 -
[48] - Quote
Andski wrote:i mean goddamn you AFK mine in an untanked exhumer (a ship not meant to be in combat) which still has more EHP than an unfit hictor (a ship meant to be in combat) because CCP realized that difficult choices like yield vs. tank are not acceptable for hisec miners, because hisec miners are special snowflakes who cannot be expected to put a single iota of thought into their gameplay
expecting them to put an iota of thought into their gameplay is unacceptable and they will throw tantrums and unsub because nobody else in the game is expected to make decisions like "DPS vs tank" or "DPS vs speed" or "tank vs utility" - forcing the miners to make such calls is unacceptable as mining must be bot-friendly and mindless gameplay
you just pointed out a bunch of "pick 2 of the 3" scenarios. miners don't have 3 things to pick from. they have tank, and they have yield. in your "pick 2 of the 3" logic, having tank AND yield is perfectly acceptable. two were picked. |
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ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
2138

|
Posted - 2013.04.17 10:45:00 -
[49] - Quote
Relocated to the relevant forum. ISD Suvetar Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Velicitia
Nex Exercitus
1385
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 11:41:00 -
[50] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:TheGunslinger42 wrote:so like a remote shield extender?
why not just fit a shield extender (or other tank modules) locally?
or would that interfere with the max-yield fit ... no, because shield modules go in mids and yield module go in lows.
both use PG and CPU though ... 
Though, I think 3% or 5% implants would be enough to fit some tank plus max yield.
As to your other comment about "pick 2 of 3" scenarios, the person you quotes was only comparing two aspects (DPS/Tank or speed/tank or tank/utility). None of these were "pick two of three". However, I will agree that many times they are parts of a "2 out of 3" comparison.
With that said, one "can" fit utility (neut/nos) or webs/points to a barge (other things too), so the statement that miners don't have a choice in their fitting is as true as saying missioners don't have a choice. They most certainly do, but they choose the "best yield" or "best for these rats" fittings, and end up leaving gaping holes in their defenses. Granted, a mining barge is "non-combat", and gaping holes in its defenses are to be expected -- thought they can be patched up (rigs) and mitigated (shield ganglinks, logi) with some teamwork. One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia Malcanis for CSM8 |
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7531
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 15:30:00 -
[51] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:you just pointed out a bunch of "pick 2 of the 3" scenarios. miners don't have 3 things to pick from. they have tank, and they have yield. in your "pick 2 of the 3" logic, having tank AND yield is perfectly acceptable. two were picked.
If you maximize tank, your yield is going to be significantly reduced, if you maximize yield, your tank is going to be significantly reduced, simply because you cannot fit both. Same thing with DPS vs tank, DPS vs speed, speed vs tank, and so on. mine quotes from my posts at your peril, badposters TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest. Malcanis for CSM 8 |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3237
|
Posted - 2013.04.19 01:29:00 -
[52] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:you just pointed out a bunch of "pick 2 of the 3" scenarios. miners don't have 3 things to pick from. they have tank, and they have yield. in your "pick 2 of the 3" logic, having tank AND yield is perfectly acceptable. two were picked.
Sure they do. Tank, Yield, and Ore capacity.
Because of the way the barge buff was implemented, some pairings aren't super possible, but most are. An the better quote is "3 options, pick 2 to be good at, or pick 1 to be great at" This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
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