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Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 01:58:00 -
[1]
Hi all,
Just reactivated my account and jumped in my trusty raven fitted out with torpedos and cruise missiles after 6 months away. It also has mega modal pulse lasers fitted and it used to own!!!
Jumped to a belt today and thought id get back to the game shooting simple Rats flying kestrels, etc. Could even kill them with lasers. So I launched a torp - one of these used to wipe out a kestrel in one shot - now nothing!!
Have the Devs completely nerfed lasers and missiles against smaller ships now? Battleships used to be feared 6 months ago - now people can just fly around you and you cant do squat!!! This is truly lame I reckon :( |
infused
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:06:00 -
[2]
www.eve-search.com missile nerf
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Jaabaa Prime
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:06:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Slentus
Hi all,
Just reactivated my account and jumped in my trusty raven fitted out with torpedos and cruise missiles after 6 months away. It also has mega modal pulse lasers fitted and it used to own!!!
Jumped to a belt today and thought id get back to the game shooting simple Rats flying kestrels, etc. Could even kill them with lasers. So I launched a torp - one of these used to wipe out a kestrel in one shot - now nothing!!
Have the Devs completely nerfed lasers and missiles against smaller ships now? Battleships used to be feared 6 months ago - now people can just fly around you and you cant do squat!!! This is truly lame I reckon :(
First thing you SHOULD do after reactivating your account after 6 months is read the "nerf" and "omg" posts made during that time instead of starting a new one like a total n00b months later 
--
Intergalactic Teeth Pullers
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
Albert Einstein |
Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:11:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Slentus
Hi all,
Just reactivated my account and jumped in my trusty raven fitted out with torpedos and cruise missiles after 6 months away. It also has mega modal pulse lasers fitted and it used to own!!!
Jumped to a belt today and thought id get back to the game shooting simple Rats flying kestrels, etc. Could even kill them with lasers. So I launched a torp - one of these used to wipe out a kestrel in one shot - now nothing!!
Have the Devs completely nerfed lasers and missiles against smaller ships now? Battleships used to be feared 6 months ago - now people can just fly around you and you cant do squat!!! This is truly lame I reckon :(
Possiably, but now you have extreamly good RoF, Tech II stuff, Advance Weapon upgrade skills, and ECT to better utilize your missiles vs other Battleships (More damage than before but less vs small signature/speedy ships). You have drones use them for frigs now.
-Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
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Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:24:00 -
[5]
Lol - just been looking at the missile posts. Wish Id looked at this before reactivating the 3 accounts :( I assumed they just added new units/features rather than making existing weapons completely useless.
Is there any way training skills to get torpedos, etc back to what they used to be? The skills descriptions arent too clear and from what I see dont really do much apart from the odd % here and there :(
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Rigsta
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:30:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Rigsta on 26/09/2005 02:30:53
Replace "nerf" with "balancing" and you'll have a more accurate statement imo - nefr makes it sound like some act of spite lol. Having cruise/torps do full damage to frigates and cruisers just made those smaller ships redundant, a mere useless stepping stone on one's way to something worthwhile. EVE begins at Caldari Battleship level 2? no thanks. If everyone's using the same 2 ships then there's a balance issue: it means everyone's identified the proverbial "I win" button.
I much prefer today's EVE to the one that existed in the past. Large ships having trouble hitting things less than 1/10 their size just makes sense. BUT there are new modules & skills you'll have to train to get back (or as close is now possible) to your previous power. You can still hurt them enough to drive them off or destroy them, it just takes a bit longer: Bships were designed to fight other Bships effectively, rather than pwn frigates... I guarantee any frigate or cruiser pilot would still be sweating when faced by a raven's launcher bays with a good set of skills behind them: unlike a gunboat its impossible to get out of their optimal and make them miss. No tracking disruptors either.
Btw, why did you quit? Bet ya got bored of your Raven... ;)
-----------------------------------------------
My Ideas:
Drones wish list <-- 2 years old :O
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Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:37:00 -
[7]
Quit originally as I was playing it too much!! Had other stuff I needed to do!!
Was really looking forward to coming back to play as I used to like the balance. Fair enough, make frigates, etc hard to hit - but I locked down a frigate earlier on so it couldnt move (using engine disrupter field) and I still couldnt kill it!!!! Thats what annoyed me. The fact that even when they are stationaty missiles, lasers and torps are useless.
CCP need to make impact related to speed of the object - not the size. Its silly. Looks like im stuck playing for another month now anyway as Ive paid for a mont - but cant see what I can do really in-game so ive cancelled all the accounts again. Trained for ages in all the missiles skills and now theyre useless!! Cant face having to wait for gunnery skills to get to proper levels and having to switch over to guns 
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Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:39:00 -
[8]
Whats the best skills to learn and equipment to put on the ship to get torps/missiles closer to their former glory?
Target painters?
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infused
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:41:00 -
[9]
Not a missile user but look at all the new missile related skills bought into eve.
Also, use different missiles vs frigs... like lights with skills on full do good damage, or cruise...?
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Rigsta
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Posted - 2005.09.26 02:47:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Rigsta on 26/09/2005 02:49:15
Edited by: Rigsta on 26/09/2005 02:47:23
You don't have to switch to guns, missiles are similar to guns now. The damage is calculated based on the size of the missile, the damage type, the size and speed of the target. Plus with your missiles while the damage is far lower now (on SMALLER TARGETS), they never actually miss and can only be countered by another launcher (torps now take 2 or 3 defenders to knock out). Plus you don't have to worry about optimal/max range or tracking speed - "meh, it's within 100km, they'll hit." Know what would happen if you fitted 425mm rails and webbed a frig (heck even blasters)? It starts with "M" and ends with "iss".
Give it a chance mate, fill your drone bay with heavy drones and train those missile skills. There are alot of them now....
Also look up signature radius and target painters. Face it, a frigate going up against a Bship has slim chances of survival if the bship turns all his weapons against him. It used to be zero, now it's at the giddy heights of slim 
"The Battleship is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile" - Oveur
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My Ideas:
Drones wish list <-- 2 years old :O
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Sonorra Baki
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Posted - 2005.09.26 03:11:00 -
[11]
Also, you might wanna look into using Missiles as your general purpose weapon, instead of all torp.
Cruise missile + targepainte still hurt frigs alot.
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Derron Bel
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Posted - 2005.09.26 03:46:00 -
[12]
Drones are your friends!
-==-
Holy-Jim> as you know, surprise is the key to victory.....surprise!
LooseCannoN> ahh!
LooseCannoN> my plans have been foiled! |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.09.26 03:47:00 -
[13]
We're you looking to come back to "same old - same old" or "new challenges"??
No, the raven is not the "I win" button that it once was. Theres new missile skills to train. If you currently have good missile skills it will take a short amount of time to buff up on the new skills.
Theres the added challenge of tweaking your ship setup, as you noticed, the frigs are hard to pop with the big missiles now. All these interesting puzzles to overcome and you already want to quit
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The GoldenRatio
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Posted - 2005.09.26 03:59:00 -
[14]
I'm curious to know how many SP you have in missils. A gunnery BS pilot who has less than 3 million is plain pathetic. You have to have around 7 million SP in gunnery to be considered an effective BS gunner pilot.
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Sgt Blade
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Posted - 2005.09.26 06:58:00 -
[15]
btw it wasnt a nerf it was a fix to help even missile users to gun users. This fix is the best thing thats happened to missiles as they are better then pre-patch (if u get the skills that is)
Blade - Missile user 
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Troezar
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Posted - 2005.09.26 07:03:00 -
[16]
I'm new to the Raven and fine 6xcruise 2xsmall laser and 6 heavy drones work very well. I'm glad I have a reason to use different equipment for different purposes. I'm sure you'll get used to it and probably enjoy it more
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Jenny Spitfire
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Posted - 2005.09.26 07:11:00 -
[17]
Try getting all new missile skills to lvl 3 or 4, and try cruise missiles with 2 anti frigate guns. Then you will see it is OK. My SP is very low compared to yours, I am sure but I think after the new missile skills, it is OK.
Cruise missiles are more versatile vs cruisers and BSes. Torps are better for BSes, Dreads and structures.
In short (approx.) with all missile skills to lvl 4 or 5,
Short range, light missile, 40km.
Med range, heavy and torp missiles, 80km.
Long range, cruise, 160km
HTH. I love my blue raven! ;D
♥♥♥♥♥
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Elrathias
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Posted - 2005.09.26 08:12:00 -
[18]
i really do miss teh days when you used to say "theres a battleship in that system" and meant dont go there you will die.
now days, you take 2 frigates and go own it. ITS JUST NOT FUN MMKAY?
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 08:27:00 -
[19]
Funny, I don't have the advanced missile skills and still manage to do the lvl3 missions ok.
It's getting real tiresome with this whole que of babies coming on here 'wha-wha my Raven isn't obliterating all in an instant anymore'. We're better off for it.
Reduce the lag and improve the genepool now, don't wait a month.
I'm Danton Marcellus and I approve of this message. |
Ikvar
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Posted - 2005.09.26 08:47:00 -
[20]
I doubt you were ever able to hit moving frig rats well with Mega Pulse.
Originally by: James Lyrus
Complaining about PvP & Pirates in EVE is like complaining about the mines in minesweeper. |
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Teela Belwynn
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Posted - 2005.09.26 09:26:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Ikvar
I doubt you were ever able to hit moving frig rats well with Mega Pulse.
That wasnt the point, the point was the missiles were "nerfed", Ravens were un-automated and that its a bad thing. Thats all you need to concern yourself about. 
♥ WGoE ♥ |
Utgardsloki
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Posted - 2005.09.26 10:46:00 -
[22]
With the Raven being the ultimate close quarters BS of the moment (this title should obviously belong to the Megathron) it would be silly to cry about Torpedos.
I don't want to change the topic, but there's nothing wrong with Torpedos. Far from it, if anything, in regard to BS vs BS combat, they're overpowered!
I'd happily let torp users have better performance from their torps against frigates and cruisers, in exchange for a decrease in overall damage, or maybe a minimum arming range to prevent them muscling in on the Megathrons turf.
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Ikvar
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Posted - 2005.09.26 11:08:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Teela Belwynn
Originally by: Ikvar
I doubt you were ever able to hit moving frig rats well with Mega Pulse.
That wasnt the point
Yes it was.
Originally by: Slentus
Couldnt kill them with lasers which I found odd.
Originally by: Slentus
Have the Devs completely nerfed lasers and missiles against smaller ships now?
Originally by: James Lyrus
Complaining about PvP & Pirates in EVE is like complaining about the mines in minesweeper. |
Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.26 12:42:00 -
[24]
I use 5x cruise and 1x torp in current setup.
I agree that it should be hard to hit a small moving ship flying around with large BS weapons - the point I was saying is that I webbed the person who was just flying around me - they were moving very sloooowly and yet missiles were still in-effective...
Fair enough if theyre far away and flying full speed. But when theyre 5km away just flying around you and you web them - surely thats when they should be able to kill something after 5 salvos?!
What missile skills are there anyway? All I can see are target painters (which take up a mid slot) and one relevant missile skill?
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Quanteeri
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Posted - 2005.09.26 12:59:00 -
[25]
Welcome Back.
I think you'll like the missile skills overall, but yeah, the arbitrary maths they do to justify decreased damaged on smaller targets are fubar. Such as, they now say they count the velocity of the target into the equation, but even if the ship is DITW, you still can't do any real damage. Slightly bogus.
Go Fred! |
Paul Castrin
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Posted - 2005.09.26 14:51:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Slentus
What missile skills are there anyway? All I can see are target painters (which take up a mid slot) and one relevant missile skill?
Cruise Missile Specialization
Guided Missile Precision
Heavy Missile Specialization
Missile Bombardment
Missile Projection
Rapid Launch
Rocket Specialization
Standard Missile Specialization
Target Navigation Prediction
Torpedo Specialization
http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/skillsaccessories/skills/missiles/default.asp
Not that hard to find really.
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Kraven Kor
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Posted - 2005.09.26 19:11:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Paul Castrin
Originally by: Slentus
What missile skills are there anyway? All I can see are target painters (which take up a mid slot) and one relevant missile skill?
Cruise Missile Specialization
Guided Missile Precision
Heavy Missile Specialization
Missile Bombardment
Missile Projection
Rapid Launch
Rocket Specialization
Standard Missile Specialization
Target Navigation Prediction
Torpedo Specialization
http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/skillsaccessories/skills/missiles/default.asp
Not that hard to find really.
You missed Warhead Upgrades.
Spec Skills = Use T2 Launchers, which are nice.
Guided Missile Precision = Reduces influence of target size on damage dealt (do more damage to smaller ships with bigger missiles.) Even at 5 you won't do "full" damage to a frigate but it helps. This does not affect rockets or torpedoes.
Target Navigation Prediction = Reduces influence of target speed on damage dealt. This makes all missiles do more damage to faster targets, and combined with Precision above helps make frigates less impervious to your missiles. Again, even with this and precision at 5 you still won't be annihilating frigates with a single Torp.
Rapid Launch = Speeds up RoF for launchers.
Missile Bombardment = Longer flight time (longer range.)
Missile Projection = Faster missile speed (longer range, might affect damage vs. fast targets? Not sure.)
Warhead Upgrades = More damage on all missiles.
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Slentus
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Posted - 2005.09.27 23:19:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Paul Castrin
Originally by: Slentus
What missile skills are there anyway? All I can see are target painters (which take up a mid slot) and one relevant missile skill?
Cruise Missile Specialization
Guided Missile Precision
Heavy Missile Specialization
Missile Bombardment
Missile Projection
Rapid Launch
Rocket Specialization
Standard Missile Specialization
Target Navigation Prediction
Torpedo Specialization
http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/skillsaccessories/skills/missiles/default.asp
Not that hard to find really.
Not hard to find if you have time to try and find it all out...
Thanks to Kraven Kor though for actually explaining what the skills mean! Now to learn the new skills!! |
mimik
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Posted - 2005.09.27 23:38:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Slentus
Originally by: Paul Castrin
Originally by: Slentus
What missile skills are there anyway? All I can see are target painters (which take up a mid slot) and one relevant missile skill?
Cruise Missile Specialization
Guided Missile Precision
Heavy Missile Specialization
Missile Bombardment
Missile Projection
Rapid Launch
Rocket Specialization
Standard Missile Specialization
Target Navigation Prediction
Torpedo Specialization
http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/skillsaccessories/skills/missiles/default.asp
Not that hard to find really.
Not hard to find if you have time to try and find it all out...
Thanks to Kraven Kor though for actually explaining what the skills mean! Now to learn the new skills!!
must have been really hard to find - they were in the missiles section of the skills menu.
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StealthNet
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Posted - 2005.09.28 02:10:00 -
[30]
A missile or torp of any kind not being able to hit a fast moving / turning ship is one thing. One torp exploding and not rendering a frig equal to dust... well. Another thing, completely different.
imho a torp hitting a frig would not only destroy the fring but insta pod the pilot :p
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