Camios wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:Nullsec industrial alliances were killed off by the addition of invention and the resulting price rises in prom/dyspro (and later tech). We're hoping that the moon rebalance in Odyssey starts to wind that back a bit, but it's not the whole solution.
Could you please elaborate on that? I don't realize the link between the two things. I mean, why an increase in moon minerals price would stop nullsec industrialists?
Instead I would say (perhaps naively) that the ease of logistics (jump freighters and stuff) killed nullsec industry, since it's far easier to produce in highsec (where lowend ores coming from afk mining are abundant) and move stuff in 0.0 with those overpowered mega caravans than it is to produce locally, with the chronic lack of lowend ores.
Prior to that point, Alliance income was multi-faceted, with collectively owned t2 BPOs and 0.0 ratting/mining (e.g. corp and refinery taxes) at its core. Since most t2 production was used internally to the alliance, it made sense do so at least some of the production in 0.0. Ratting and mining also meant a large portion of the low end (from refined loot) and high end (from mining) minerals were already in place.
After those changes not only did t2 become WAY cheaper (BPOs less profitable, internal (subsidised) alliance production less necessary), but Alliance income became largely relient on holding R64 and later Tech moons, something that industrial players were not capable of beyond the obligitory POS logistics teams (usually less than 20 people for a many thousand person alliance). At the same time, better logistics through cyno-networks, JFs, proliferation of carriers etc made moving large amounts of ships and material from Empire into 0.0 more and more feasible.
What this meant was that there was no point being an industrial alliance - PvP alliances had better income by miles and could buy everything they wanted from their newfound moongold.
I'm not convinced the changes will fix this problem, without some heavy nerfs to logistics to encourage localisation, but they certainly are a GREAT step in the right direction. I trust CCP to follow up on this.