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hmm have you guys done something with missiles?

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Hiram	Posted - 2005.10.21 02:07:00 - [1] Seems since the servers come back up me and some of me ccorp mates cant hit as hard with missiles? We tried a;; types. Anyone else had problems?
Sorja	Posted - 2005.10.21 03:58:00 - [2] Since the servers have come back up after the Cold War patch? Yes. Kill mails
Hiroshi	Posted - 2005.10.21 16:03:00 - [3] yes, my missle don't work as well / properly... I asked in the help channela nd they said that missiles were nerfed with cold war. SOmething about signature size and related damage... From what I have seen on my ship.... Widowmaker Heavy Missle vs Cruiser 130-140 Dmg Widowmaker Heavy Missle vs Frigate (Range <30Km) 40-50 Dmg Widowmaker Heavy Missle vs Frigate (Range >30Km) >80 Dmg I dunno what it going on, if they changed the missile balance they messed it up. It's like saying a transport truck will do less damage to a compact car thenm it will to a sedan, because the compact is smaller??? Missiles should do their full damage no matter what they hit (target resistances aside). If heavy missles happen to be hitting a frigate then to bad you are going to die fast. for example I was doing a kill mission and was fighting a Gustaris Kyton (their upgraded Merlin frigate ... bounty was like 20k or 30K isk) My Widowmaker heavy missiles were doing 43-48 damge per hit while his Bloodclaw Light Missiles were doing 80 dmg per hit! Light missile shouldn't be doing more damage then heavy missiles....
KilROCK	Posted - 2005.10.21 16:04:00 - [4] Seems you're around 3 months late for whining..
Hiroshi	Posted - 2005.10.21 16:10:00 - [5] Yeah, I had to take a 6 month break for college. :(
The Wizz117	Posted - 2005.10.21 16:28:00 - [6] they are not nerfed they are WAY TO MUCH OVER NERFED
xPreatorianx	Posted - 2005.10.21 16:33:00 - [7] oooh man look whut uve done now there is gonna be missile nerf whining all over again :/. Anyways if u use caldari hacs and train missile skills the heavys are amazing. damage wise they suck but velocity and rof they rule.
mimik	Posted - 2005.10.21 17:32:00 - [8] Originally by: The Wizz117 they are not nerfed they are WAY TO MUCH OVER NERFED heheh - we should start more threads asking questions about missiles and damge to see if we can make the wizz's head explode
Distran	Posted - 2005.10.21 18:00:00 - [9] I too am a bit confused why larger missiles would do less damage to smaller ships... I can see the arguement that they're less likely to hit simply due to speed and turning radius (someone could manually try and evade a missile), but simply making them do less damage is just silly. Seriously, is there a rational for this? Other than "they do too much damage to small ships", which is fine just make their turning radius larger (slower turn time) or make them go slower. Much more reasonable changes.
mimik	Posted - 2005.10.21 18:07:00 - [10] Originally by: Distran I too am a bit confused why larger missiles would do less damage to smaller ships... I can see the arguement that they're less likely to hit simply due to speed and turning radius (someone could manually try and evade a missile), but simply making them do less damage is just silly. Seriously, is there a rational for this? Other than "they do too much damage to small ships", which is fine just make their turning radius larger (slower turn time) or make them go slower. Much more reasonable changes. making them go slower would then disadvantage use against bigger ships as well. trying to take agility into accout was tried afaik but was likely to cause too many issues with lag.
Hiroshi	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:04:00 - [11] From what I have been reading in the forums, the missle were nerfed because the whinners in frigates and such were complaining that they were getting owned by BCs and BSs.
O'knar	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:05:00 - [12] You just need to train up the new missile skills. I have most of the new skills up to lvl3-4 and I'm outdamaging cruisers with heavies compared to pre-change/nerf. However, it is REALLY disappointing to have to use one or TWO vollies of heavies from my Caracal to destroy frigates.
Diana Merris	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:08:00 - [13] For those who have been away: Look on the market for Missile skills and buy all the ones you don't have, precission, projection, bombardment, warhead upgrades and something else. Train them up and you'll be ok.
xNOSFERATUx	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:19:00 - [14] That's the point. It shouldn't take more missiles to destroy a friagte then a crusier! And if they damage is being nerfed against smaller ships then the damage the smaller ships deal back with their missiles should be less as well. But it isn't though. Look at Hiroshi's post. The light missiles were doing more damage then the heavy missiles. It just doesn't make any sense....
Wrayeth	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:26:00 - [15] Edited by: Wrayeth on 21/10/2005 19:27:10 Originally by: mimik heheh - we should start more threads asking questions about missiles and damge to see if we can make the wizz's head explode Heh...well, I'm not the Wizz, but my head's already exploded thanks to the overnerf - which is why I fly minmatar for everything but ratting, anymore. -Wrayeth
The Wizz117	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:28:00 - [16] there was this battle ship and hit had like a 2.5 milion isk bounty and i could not get his shield lower then 95%, 10 min later when i shot away 70% of my ammo i decided to call help on local. then this amarr frig showed up and i was like, jeeze a frigate just like that could help me break his tanking. then he launched aboud 10 drones and he kiled the friking battle ship in 10 seconds... i was like, CRHIST HOW DEAR THEY TO SAY THAT TORPS DEAL SO MUCH DAMAGE... i was using wrath missiles (knitic damage) vs guirista battle ship. ccp did not change the missiles couse of they where to strong. missiles suck, caldary sucks and ccp is going to nerf em even more just until they all leave jita. so, lets all take all our stuff and moove to amarr space until they nerf the apocs!
Securus	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:41:00 - [17] Originally by: The Wizz117 there was this battle ship and hit had like a 2.5 milion isk bounty and i could not get his shield lower then 95%, 10 min later when i shot away 70% of my ammo i decided to call help on local. then this amarr frig showed up and i was like, jeeze a frigate just like that could help me break his tanking. then he launched aboud 10 drones and he kiled the friking battle ship in 10 seconds... i was like, CRHIST HOW DEAR THEY TO SAY THAT TORPS DEAL SO MUCH DAMAGE... i was using wrath missiles (knitic damage) vs guirista battle ship. ccp did not change the missiles couse of they where to strong. missiles suck, caldary sucks and ccp is going to nerf em even more just until they all leave jita. so, lets all take all our stuff and moove to amarr space until they nerf the apocs! ? "Cluster bombing from B-52s is very, very accurate. From 30,000 feet, every single bomb always hits the ground." - U.S. Air Force ammunition memo.
Denmor Aldase	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:54:00 - [18] Its quite logical why a large high yield missile does less damage to a smaller target. It has to do with explosion radius versus signature radius. Before all missile explosions were point explosions, IE they were about as big as a head of a pin. Now they blow up over a certian area and in space that matters because the energy is dissapated over a larger area. When a ship is as large or larger than this area they take full damage, when they are smaller than this area they take proportionally less damage (its not exactly proportional but you get the idea). Now in the atmosphere a missile exploding over a larger radius can heat up the air around it and cause damage because of that, but in space theres nothing to heat up, the explosion occurs in a vaccum. Is it overnerfed? yes possibly. Did it need to be brought into line in the first place? Most definately. PS: Hammer has alluded to the fact that he will be looking at the damages of the smaller missiles (IE Not Cruise, and Torps) because he feels they were pwned by the nerfbat as a byproduct of balanceing torps. What is a man if he acts like an ape?
The Wizz117	Posted - 2005.10.21 19:58:00 - [19] Originally by: Denmor Aldase Its quite logical why a large high yield missile does less damage to a smaller target. It has to do with explosion radius versus signature radius. Before all missile explosions were point explosions, IE they were about as big as a head of a pin. Now they blow up over a certian area and in space that matters because the energy is dissapated over a larger area. When a ship is as large or larger than this area they take full damage, when they are smaller than this area they take proportionally less damage (its not exactly proportional but you get the idea). Now in the atmosphere a missile exploding over a larger radius can heat up the air around it and cause damage because of that, but in space theres nothing to heat up, the explosion occurs in a vaccum. Is it overnerfed? yes possibly. Did it need to be brought into line in the first place? Most definately. PS: Hammer has alluded to the fact that he will be looking at the damages of the smaller missiles (IE Not Cruise, and Torps) because he feels they were pwned by the nerfbat as a byproduct of balanceing torps. a battle ship i was talking aboud is not a small target. shooting a small target with missiles HAHAHA ... a remote armor repair system would deal more damage even rockets can't kill small things these days and yea. thats quite logic becouse the explo blablablablablabla
Bruchpilot	Posted - 2005.10.21 20:00:00 - [20] Originally by: The Wizz117 they are not nerfed they are WAY TO MUCH OVER NERFED Can't read the same sentence over 100 times, over and over again. Why don't you just shut up and learn how to fight?
Denmor Aldase	Posted - 2005.10.21 20:12:00 - [21] Originally by: Bruchpilot Can't read the same sentence over 100 times, over and over again. Why don't you just shut up and learn how to fight? It does sorta sound to me like you rather like whining about this subject but thats aside. Here let me further spoonfeed the conclusion: There is no shockwave in space because there is no medium in which it to travel so bam, there goes a lot of damage from an earth based weapon. Thermal increase has no medium in which to travel so a thermal increase far out from a ship has no way to get from it. So basically the only damage from your missile would be kinetic damage (if it actually hit) and some thermal damage from what part of the explosion actually hits the ship you're firing at. What is a man if he acts like an ape?
The Wizz117	Posted - 2005.10.21 20:15:00 - [22] Originally by: Bruchpilot Originally by: The Wizz117 they are not nerfed they are WAY TO MUCH OVER NERFED Can't read the same sentence over 100 times, over and over again. Why don't you just shut up and learn how to fight? yea ill just learn how to click my shield booster and how to click on my misisle launchers, geez all that time i must have been clicking the the wrong thing thank you for helping me out! geez.. evry one knows how to setup theyr ships on the hig a mix of cruise and siege, rails/lasers for frigs med 3-4 hardeners XL shield booster (tough i dont see why not just fit a large) and a shield amp on the lows PDU's and if u have good cpu skillz a few ballistic control systems
Desiree Yannon	Posted - 2005.10.21 20:27:00 - [23] Edited by: Desiree Yannon on 21/10/2005 20:41:35 Edited by: Desiree Yannon on 21/10/2005 20:29:54 Originally by: The Wizz117 geez.. evry one knows how to setup theyr ships on the hig a mix of cruise and siege, rails/lasers for frigs med 3-4 hardeners XL shield booster (tough i dont see why not just fit a large) and a shield amp on the lows PDU's and if u have good cpu skillz a few ballistic control systems Honestly, dude, it seems a bit limiting to me to insist that those setups are the only way you can have an effective ship. EVE is all about infinate possiblity. Won't you admit that, with a certain combination of skills and equipment, you could make anything work for any ship? As for the missiles thing, I think you need to admit that CCP is made up of human beings, EVE is a work in progress, and you're completely lacking in a certain adaptability that would make the changes a bit less painful. You're one of those people who get freaked out when their pizza has a mushroom on it by accident, aren't you?
ELECTR0FREAK	Posted - 2005.10.21 21:01:00 - [24] :Points to his sig: -Electrofreak Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula
Bruchpilot	Posted - 2005.10.21 21:39:00 - [25] Wizz you're just ignorant. If you think you should win a fight cause you can hit F1-F8 and activate your shieldtank you should be the last person complaining about missiles. As I said, learn how to fight and come back again when you think you can backup your arguments.
Meridius	Posted - 2005.10.21 22:50:00 - [26] Originally by: The Wizz117 then this amarr frig showed up and i was like, jeeze a frigate just like that could help me break his tanking. then he launched aboud 10 drones and he kiled the friking battle ship in 10 seconds... ________________________________________________________
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.10.21 22:53:00 - [27] Originally by: Bruchpilot Wizz you're just ignorant. If you think you should win a fight cause you can hit F1-F8 and activate your shieldtank you should be the last person complaining about missiles. As I said, learn how to fight and come back again when you think you can backup your arguments. ...and when a Celes pilot is right about this, you REALLY need to examine your PvP skills "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
Bruchpilot	Posted - 2005.10.21 22:54:00 - [28] Originally by: Meridius Originally by: The Wizz117 then this amarr frig showed up and i was like, jeeze a frigate just like that could help me break his tanking. then he launched aboud 10 drones and he kiled the friking battle ship in 10 seconds... bwhahaha, just spewed tea over my screen.
Kayla Feyth	Posted - 2005.10.21 23:41:00 - [29] Something needs to be done to make cruisers less vulnerable to torps, a couple of these and your gone
nahtoh	Posted - 2005.10.22 01:40:00 - [30] Originally by: Kayla Feyth Something needs to be done to make cruisers less vulnerable to torps, a couple of these and your gone You have got to be kidding...they do less damage to the dam things than heavies or lights...heres a free hint turn the MWD off... "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)

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