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Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.20 19:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
You know what, I just spent 2 hours writing this thing and clicked preview and the whole thing was lost, so I might get around to writing it again, maybe, but probably not until someone fixes the forums to prevent this from happening again. |

Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
182
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Posted - 2011.10.20 19:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
While I agree that the forums have a nasty habit of forgetting what you've written, if you're writing an essay I'd suggest that it pays to write it up in a text editor first, and then take the time to proof-read it once today then once again tomorrow.
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Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.20 20:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yes this is a very good idea. Thank you. As angry as I am with myself and with the forum software for not having a simple timeout handling feature to prevent loss in productivity, I think I will go have dinner, go to class, and then try my hand at it again using your idea of course. This is a very good topic to have and I find myself repeating it often to people in game.
Also note, hoping moderators will read this, this rookie forum has a pop-up description urging veteran pilots to share their knowledge here, yet I could not even post to this on my main account. I had to login to a new rookie account. |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.21 04:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Steps for Maximizing your Skill Training - Part 1 Continued
What are Certificates? Certificates, or certs for short, were introduced a couple of years ago to help pilots better organize their learning queue. Each certificate earned acknowledges a certain level of achievement in the pilots career path. You will have no certificates if you are a new pilot. Certificates can be shown publicly but most people make them private if they know about them. Navigate to Character Sheet -> Certificates and familiarize yourself with this interface. Make a note of the permissions tab. This is where you will make certs private as you obtain them. Certificates are earned after learning the skills outlined therein. Certificates are organized into groups similar to how the skills are organized. Each certificate has four levels of achievement, Basic, Standard, Improved, and Elite.
What is the certification planner? This is the in-game interface where you can see all of the certificates available to you. Navigate to Character Sheet -> Certificates -> Certificates tab -> Open Certification Planner button. Make the resulting window larger so you can see all of the certificate groups on the left. Expand Core to see the levels of completion. Now expand Basic. You will find six different certs. Core Competency covers the other five core areas. Now highlight Core Integrity and click the blue info icon. This opens up the Prerequisites tab, which outlines what skills and their prerequisites needed to obtain the cert. Familiarize yourself with this because you will see it again when you want to know what skills are required to use in-game items.
Now look at the right side of the main planner window. You will see a description of the cert and a map of the primary skills needed to obtain the cert (represented in the middle of the chart). The cert then becomes a prerequisite for the certs indicated on the bottom of the chart. The chart includes colors and colored icons to help you quickly gauge what you have and have not yet learned. A blue box with a blue icon indicates a certificate has been earned but needs to be claimed. Make note of the Claim All Certificates button on the bottom left of this window.
I believe I have provided enough information to move on the next part of my guide. If you still have questions, please ask and I will consider clarifying this section.
Continue to part 2 below. |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.21 04:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
Steps for Maximizing your Skill Training - Part 2 |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.21 06:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Steps for Maximizing your Skill Training - Part 2 Continued
Step 6) To infinity and beyond! When your initial plan is completed, you should have a firm grasp of what you are doing, so go ahead and create a new plan for bigger ships, guns, and industrial skills depending on your interests. You might even consider cross training to other racial ships, it takes only around 12 days to learn to pilot all standard ships for each race. Plan out an entire year and two months and use the attribute suggestion it gives you to remap your attributes. Add or remove skills to or from the end of the plan and keep showing the attribute remap suggestions until it equates to a year of training. Again, do not deviate or you will waste time because you only get one map a year. If you do deviate, make sure you do it in the planner to see if you do lose time. If not, feel free to modify the plan to your hearts content.
Please feel free to reply if you have any questions regarding this. You may also hit me up in game.
Cheers,
-Ba'al |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.21 06:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:While I agree that the forums have a nasty habit of forgetting what you've written, if you're writing an essay I'd suggest that it pays to write it up in a text editor first, and then take the time to proof-read it once today then once again tomorrow.
Your idea worked perfectly. Thank you. Indeed I was angry at myself and at the forum software for lack of timeout handling or whatever it is that caused me to lose this guide the first time I tried to preview it. I was not angry enough to give up. So hopefully people will be happy that I did not. |

Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
185
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Posted - 2011.10.21 10:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
Note that you can fit +3 implants with Cybernetics 1. The next step is Cybernetics 4 for the +3% hardwirings and +4 attribute implants. |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.10.21 16:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Note that you can fit +3 implants with Cybernetics 1. The next step is Cybernetics 4 for the +3% hardwirings and +4 attribute implants.
Good call. I never bothered to use anything less than +4, but that is another 2 days of training. I personally think it is worth it if you plan to stay for the longhaul, but for pilots just checking out the game, it is optional and the +3s get them out on the field faster for the cost of 30 minutes and 20mil isk.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Mecinia Lua
Galactic Express Intrepid Crossing
10
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Posted - 2011.10.21 16:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Good write up :) |

Velicitia
Open Designs
20
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Posted - 2011.10.21 19:25:00 -
[11] - Quote
Good overall guide... but there are a few things I disagree with (or can be done better):
1. the remap right away. Yes, it'll help you learn the core skills faster (which is good), but you will be less able to train "fun" things, like gunnery or new ship skills. The OP's toon is too young to remember the "Train Learning Skills" (I'm assuming this isn't a purpose-built newbie assistance alt) mantra that I started with ... but it's essentially the same idea. Ideally re-mapping helps, but since a new pilot might want to taste a few different things (mining, missioning, PVP, etc) running this first remap within the trial is a waste of a freebie.
2. you don't necessarily need to inject a skill before you train it. I.e. if you buy the Cybernetics skillbook, you can right click it and choose the "Train to Level 1 now" option. Note, that this does push back whatever skill you had training (since cybernetics is now the currently active skill). However, it does help injecting the skill if you have a set plan you want to stick to (e.g. "I want to finish Small Hybrid Turret Level 2 before training Cybernetics")
3. For the core skills, temper what you're doing based on what you fly. If you take Amarr or Gallente, you can straight ignore the shield skills for a little while (you armour tank, get used to the red shield bar). If you fly Caldair, you can straight ignore the armour skills for a little while (you shield tank, if your shields go, armour will melt regardless of skills). If you fly Minmatar you sort of have to do a mix... Keep in mind that real men hull-tank 
Note that there are some exceptions to the general "rule" of what race tanks which way (take the Gallentean Myrmidon battlecruiser for example ... it can shield tank exceptionally well). However, these are exceptions to the rule and not every ship will necessarily be able to tank with an un-intended configuration. Also keep in mind that you should not tank a ship in more than one manner (shield, armour, or hull) -- the additional modules you're fitting will take away from your ability to fit other useful modules (e.g. things that increase damage or cap or resistances...)
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Asana Keikira
New Dawn Initiative
6
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Posted - 2011.10.21 19:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pretty good write up. Only one comment that's a bit unnecessary -
Habba'al Zebul wrote: Step 0) Consider using all 14 or 21 days of your free trial. Everything outlined below can be done on a trial account. Unless you absolutely must activate your account for some reason, why not make use of the free time.
Activating your account at any time during the trial does not eliminate the days remaining on the trial account...the first 30 days are tacked on to the end. For example, a person on a 14-day trial that activates their account ends up with a total of 44 days from when they started until they have to pay for the next 30 days. Plus, it also permits the new player the ability to inject and learn the racial Industrial skill (they receive this along with the basic Industrial ship for free during the tutorials), which for a fledgling miner or hauler, gives them a few more options to explore all the game has to offer, if they so desire.
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Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.10.22 00:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:Good overall guide... but there are a few things I disagree with (or can be done better):
Once again these forums ate my reply to you. The timeout issue is freaking ridiculous and I'm considering just not using them anymore. I hate losing productivity due to bad programming. Here is the short of it.
Velicitia wrote:1. the remap right away.
I will clarify this section to indicate that while deviating is generally not a good idea, it is okay to inject a skill here and there as needed for missions and to try things out, but too much of that can really slow down the goal, which is to reach a maximum set of core skills in the fastest possible time.
Velicitia wrote:2. you don't necessarily need to inject a skill before you train it.
I wanted to teach the students to fish first. They can buy the fish at the market after I'm done teaching. ^_^
Velicitia wrote:3. For the core skills, temper what you're doing based on what you fly.
I agree with your statements. I will look into clarifying this section, but I did mention the shield and armor options twice I believe. I don't agree that one should avoid training up shield operation and management if they intend to armor/hull tank or avoid training up hull upgrades and mechanics if they intend to shield tank. I believe these four core skills provide longevity in a fight, and those precious few seconds more can be enough time for help to arrive.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.10.22 00:38:00 -
[14] - Quote
[quote=Asana Keikira]Pretty good write up. Only one comment that's a bit unnecessary -
Thank you for the clarification. ^_^
If this is true, then I guess I can activate this account now. ^_^
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Asana Keikira
New Dawn Initiative
6
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Posted - 2011.10.22 01:01:00 -
[15] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul wrote:[quote=Asana Keikira]Pretty good write up. Only one comment that's a bit unnecessary -
Thank you for the clarification. ^_^
If this is true, then I guess I can activate this account now. ^_^
Confirmation for you: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=29106#post29106 |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 01:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
I've made some changes to the guide. Hopefully some things will be more clear. Also, thanks for the link.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.22 03:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
There is some confusion about this booster item I received when I purchased 30 days of game time today. It seems others have not received it. I have asked on the other forum and will share the answer here as soon as I get a good one.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |
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CCP Spitfire
C C P C C P Alliance
318

|
Posted - 2011.10.22 13:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul, this is a wonderful guide, thank you so much!
May I suggest adding it to EVElopedia? It might be easier to maintain it there.
Regarding the cerebral accelerator question: I've already answered it in another thread but just to reiterate -- this is a limited time offer and while it's going to be available for some time, you might want to reflect it in the guide.
CCP Spitfire | Russian Community Coordinator @ccp_spitfire |
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Velicitia
Open Designs
21
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Posted - 2011.10.22 14:02:00 -
[19] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul wrote:Velicitia wrote:3. For the core skills, temper what you're doing based on what you fly. I agree with your statements. I will look into clarifying this section, but I did mention the shield and armor options twice I believe. I don't agree that one should avoid training up shield operation and management if they intend to armor/hull tank or avoid training up hull upgrades and mechanics if they intend to shield tank. I believe these four core skills provide longevity in a fight, and those precious few seconds more can be enough time for help to arrive.
Yes, this is correct ... but at the same time, spending 4-5 days to get "Shield Operation" to level 5 on a toon that will primarily only see a red bar in shields is overkill. Now, taking it to 3 (IIRC, what's needed for "Standard" Certificates) will get you that survivability you mentioned in about 4-5 hours. Obviously if you're looking to get all the compensation skills then you'll need L4 in Shield Management.
A key point to mention though, is that the compensation skills are only effective when you have modules fit (or, that's how they used to work anyway) ... so training stuff like armour compensation might not help shield tanks (or vice versa).
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Tuggboat
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
5
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Posted - 2011.10.22 14:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Habba don't give up. Forum needs more good posters not less. Persevere. |

Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2011.10.23 00:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
Velicitia wrote: A key point to mention though, is that the compensation skills are only effective when you have modules fit (or, that's how they used to work anyway) ... so training stuff like armour compensation might not help shield tanks (or vice versa).
This was also mentioned in my guide. Please take the time to read it fully, I think you will see answers to these concerns you've been having.
Thank you again for your feedback.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.23 00:15:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tuggboat wrote:Habba don't give up. Forum needs more good posters not less. Persevere.
I appreciate the kind words. I welcome all feedback, constructive criticism included. ^_^
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.23 00:23:00 -
[23] - Quote
CCP Spitfire wrote: Regarding the cerebral accelerator question: I've already answered it in another thread but just to reiterate -- this is a limited time offer and while it's going to be available for some time, you might want to reflect it in the guide.
Done. And thank you!!
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
8
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Posted - 2011.10.24 20:26:00 -
[24] - Quote
For some reason, I left out Signature Analysis from the core ancillary skills. This grants you faster target locking speed.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Velicitia
Open Designs
21
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Posted - 2011.10.24 20:40:00 -
[25] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul wrote:Velicitia wrote: A key point to mention though, is that the compensation skills are only effective when you have modules fit (or, that's how they used to work anyway) ... so training stuff like armour compensation might not help shield tanks (or vice versa).
This was also mentioned in my guide. Please take the time to read it fully, I think you will see answers to these concerns you've been having. Thank you again for your feedback.
Then I'm not seeing it ... here's the part I'm referencing :
Habba'al Zebul wrote:If you wish to plan ahead further, I recommend adding the following skills which also use Intelligence and Memory. They will give you higher survivability if you fit the right modules. Training these to level 4 will add 18 days to your plan. As a rookie you will likely be piloting either an armor tank or a shield tank, depending on the ship. Veteran pilots usually have both trained.
Resource Efficiency Skills: Shield Upgrades, Electronic Upgrades, Energy Grid Upgrades, Shield Compensation Armor Hardening Skills (req. Hull Upgrades 4): EM Armor Compensation, Explosive Armor Compensation, Kinetic Armor Compensation, Thermic Armor Compensation Shield Hardening Skills (req. Shield Operation 4): EM Shield Compensation, Explosive Shield Compensation, Kinetic Shield Compensation, Thermic Shield Compensation
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Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
8
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Posted - 2011.10.25 03:08:00 -
[26] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:Then I'm not seeing it ... here's the part I'm referencing : Habba'al Zebul wrote:As a rookie you will likely be piloting either an armor tank or a shield tank, depending on the ship. Veteran pilots usually have both trained.
These two sentences are meant to imply you will take one or the other, possibly both later on in your career. I can clarify if need be, but I figured it was clear enough already.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Habba'al Zebul
Federal Defence Union Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.25 04:01:00 -
[27] - Quote
I just modified step 3 and 7 quite a bit, clarifying existing information and adding new information.
Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. |

Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
247
|
Posted - 2011.11.02 00:56:00 -
[28] - Quote
I would clarify that as follows:
As a rookie, you should focus on either shield tanking skills or armour tanking skills, and fly ships and fittings suited to the skills you have trained. More advanced pilots will have extensive shield and armour tanking skills trained, allowing greater flexibility in ship selection and fitting.
But that's just my opinion :)
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Velicitia
Open Designs
41
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Posted - 2011.11.02 12:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul wrote:Velicitia wrote:Then I'm not seeing it ... here's the part I'm referencing : Habba'al Zebul wrote:As a rookie you will likely be piloting either an armor tank or a shield tank, depending on the ship. Veteran pilots usually have both trained.
These two sentences are meant to imply you will take one or the other, possibly both later on in your career. I can clarify if need be, but I figured it was clear enough already.
yeah, your implication that one or the other is fit is OK ... however, the point I was trying to make was with your advice to train all of the compensation skills. This isn't inherently a bad thing, but you should spell out that the compensation skills don't simply make the pilot better able to survive because they have them...
Now, double checking things (and EFT-warrioring) it does seem that the compensation skills will work with a DCU, so a 2-3 levels in the shield compensation skills (for an armour tanker) may provide the extra survivability that you mentioned. I'm not very familiar with shield tanking, though I imagine the same thing may occur for them (although, since they will have huge resist holes ... it might not work in the same manner as getting a few extra shield HP for the armour tanker). |

Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
8
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Posted - 2011.11.13 21:01:00 -
[30] - Quote
Habba'al Zebul wrote:[u] [b]Step 1) Remap your attributes. The first thing you will want to do is decrease the amount of time it will take to learn the core skills every pilot should have. Every rookie pilot is given two remaps. The first one we will use right away and the second one you will save for later. You will receive an additional remap every year.
The skills you will want to learn first have Intelligence as Primary attribute and Memory as Secondary attribute. Navigate to Character Sheet -> Attributes and click Remap Now. Now click the Minus button next to perception, Charisma, and Willpower until there are no green boxes filled. Now click the Plus button next to Intelligence until it is maxed out. Now add the remaining points to Memory. You should end up with 27 in Intelligence and 21 in Memory. Now click save changes.
What I've done, and what I'd recommend any other player to do, a total noor or a 6-year veteran, is to remap evenly for the four useful attributes. Dump CHA to as low as it can go, and distribute all points evenly between the other four attributes (it can't be done exactly evenly; IIRC I put the 2 remainder points in PER and INT, but I'm not sure that's the best choice).
With an even distribution, you never have to worry about remapping again, because you're mapped the way you're gonna be for the entirety of your career. And you can freely choose what to train, when you want to train it, instead of having to squeeze your character development into a remap plan.
It's much less worrysome and much freer. Perfect for everyone, but especially for noobs. Efficiency is way overrated.
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