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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.08 23:26:00 -
[1]
I appresiate getting the name back. But you can't blame the poor GM for following the rule. There rule is there and he was quite right to follow it as it was. It's the rule that need to change wording. Not the GM to get the blame for following it.
SoonÖ
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Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.09 07:17:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Seleene
One thing I find amusing about all of this is that if CCP had done nothing, the name of 4S would still be just one more corp. Now everyone in the game and probably beyond is going to hear about it. In censoring the name, more people than ever have heard of it. Kinda ironic, eh? :roll: 
I don't perticullary care for 4s ingame wise. But I got nothing against them out of game. And I don't think they find that perticullary ironic. More like tragic.
Whit that said. 4s clearly have a symbolic value. As do BoB and SAS. The diffrence between the two might be minute to some. And huge to others.
4S whit it's clear ties to rebublica of serbska militia, I personally feel is in boarderline of what should be allowed in good taste. I can see why ccp chose to do it like this. Sorry to see that the 4s guys come in between that dessision. And I can understand they feel it's unjust. But the link between 4c use in the militia and 4S name ingame. Might be seen from some as a way to justifie what was done by these militias. And I think it's better for CCP to distance themself from that by banning the name than to let them continue using that. It's unfortunate that 4c militia have such a tight link to the 4S slogan. And unfortunate for serbes that try to distance themself from that resent past. I can also understand what that frustration must be like. Serbes want to stay proud even though some of their contrymen have done horrid things.
We often condem all by generalisation. But what is the alternative in this? That ccp don't distance themself from 4C militia and let 4S keep their name? I don't think thats an option, if you step out for a bit and see the larger picture in this.
Some of you might not see the big deal in this. But there are quite serius undertones in this.
To the 4S guys. I don't mind you guys at all. Your good guys even though I don't like the way you play the game. But can you really blame CCP for not wanting to justifie 4C militia actions? I don't think you either want to justifie those. But the symbilic value of 4s is to stronly linked to those actions. The taintment of the few tend to stick to the many.
I suddest you find a name that symbolice the unjustness that serbians have to face every day trough public opinion. Serbs are good ppl. And they have to face a lot of crap in the international community. Quite frankly is much of that crap unjustly. But CCP got no choice in this. They can't allow 4S to continue using the name. On the basis of assosiation.
SoonÖ
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Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.09 07:37:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Marcus Grisbius
Whether SAS lied about their name or not, I can't say, and neither can CCP.
I want to just keep this clear. I use the slogan in the sig. Me as a person. Zinc have never said it was a clear link to sas or never given any assosiation that way either. I personally am quite proud of sas for what they stand for. (Any military soldier have great respect for these guys, even their enemies) I'm not british and I don't think the assosiation is that bad. But I understand others in my corp whould rather be carefull whit that.
You can see me like one of those ppl in BoB that uses it directly linked to easy. Even though the initial reasoning isn't towards Easy company.
SoonÖ
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Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.09 07:44:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Don ZOLA
Edited by: Don ZOLA on 09/11/2005 07:36:30
plz everyone before posting anything related to 4S read my post on top of this page. so we dont hear nonsense all over again. i wrote it to ppl to inform themselves and not look stupid by stating false facts, not cuz i was bored. if u wanna be part of disscussion read what others post too so u can really get good picture of whats going on.
edit : spelling :/
I use the 4C militia losely. It isn't ment as a single force. It's ment as a common acronyme for those groupes that commited horrid acts under the 4C emblem. Or if you like. The serbian coat of arms.
SoonÖ
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Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.09 08:13:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Muthsera on 09/11/2005 08:14:38
Originally by: Baun
The people who did this were just wearing government uniforms with the emblem on it .... they werent the 4C cross terrorists, they were just monsters who worked for the government which used it as a symbol.
We would all be better off if people didn't distort things to this extreme degree.
Like I said. I used the term losely. And yes it's an extreme. But even though that is an extreme comparisent. There is no doubt that ppl did this under the emblem of the 4C. I don't condem all serbs for the action of the few. But when they chose the 4S name. It's still linked to these action to strongly. And it's clear that some have reacted to the use of it. It whould be better for 4S to distance themself from that slogan and that resent history.
This is unfair yes. I agree it is. But can you blame CCP for not justifing these horrid actions that where carried under the symbol of 4C? I think you can understand that yourself. And I can understand you want the 4S slogan to stand for serbian nationality, whitout taintment. But it's so much more symbolic than that. Unfortunatly. You know this to. You cannot just clense the ties just like that. It takes time. And the best way is trough information. I understand the frustration in this. But it's better to let 4S have another name and then inform. Becus right now. 4C/4S is just to loaded. Loaded whit bad memories and bad assosiation. You might feel that blaming an entire nation for the faults of the few. But thats how the world sees it now. They see serbs using nationality and symbolic means to carry out what they wanted to acchive. That is not an accurate account. But only time will change that.
But you cannot denie the fact that some actions where carried out under this emblem. Serbs have taken the stepps to move away and distance themself from those actions. Rightly so. And I support that. I don't belive all serbs should suffer for the actions of the few. But serbs need to realise the pain some ppl feel the assosiation of 4C. Using that to promtly will lead to confrontation. It's just how it is. You see it as unity. Other see it as oppression. 4C is very loaded. Very. It whould be better to use that whit some care. It can still be an honnerable serbian community whitout the 4S name and slogan.
SoonÖ
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Muthsera
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Posted - 2005.11.09 11:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: StOrM ViPeR
Edited by: StOrM ViPeR on 09/11/2005 11:18:15
I've read all pages now , and am still unsure.
What is 4-S ?
I Know SAS intimitly due to various child hood dreams, intensive research and an 6 year stint in the army. but still am clueless after 9 pages of replies as to what 4-S actually is.
Are they the serbian equivalence of the IRA ? or have i got it totally wrong ? Could some one please, IN A NUTSHELL bring me to light.
One thing is for sure, That everyone participating has been wrong in the whole charade. (from CCPs Actions to The Shuttle fiasco)
Serbian slogan.
A slogan that have been used by serbs during the civil war.
And it's tied to the national flag.
It's also a slogan that is tied to the verius acts done in the name of the serbs now standing trail in hague.
SoonÖ
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