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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1038
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 02:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
Yeah, I realize I have as much chance of this as Scarlett Johansson hiring me as her personal masseuse.
I have looked at COAD. A cesspool of propaganda, and inside jokes. I have looked at Dotlan, but that does not really give the full picture. I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better. Same with Kugu and Failheap, which seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
But does anyone have what they consider an up-to-date, impartial source of info on what is going on? I have some friends in null giving me info, but that too will have some inherent bias. |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
564
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 02:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
Then why are you asking when you already have the answer?
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP Fozzie: When Veritas describes a programming challenge as "very hard" I tend to believe him.
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3719
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 02:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
Anyone in a position to comment on the war will have an angle they are trying to sell you. There is no impartiality, so read both EN24 and TMC with the recognition that both are reporting the same war through different eyes. Also, the only way to get impartial reporting is to go there yourself. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Zane Lowe
Friendship is Podding Test Alliance Please Ignore
14
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 03:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
For what it's worth:
The CFC announced an invasion of Fountain. This seemed like a good idea until everyone who had ever been slighted by them decided that letting them get richer would be a bad idea. Currently Test and Tribal Band has allied with:
Northern Coalition Pandemic Legion Black Legion 401k PIZZA (Kinda) Nulli Secunda/N3 Scrap Iron Flotilla
and others I'm probably forgetting to fight the Goons. It's unsure how permanent this coalition is, and things can change in eve at any minute, but right now Test plans to try to turn the invasion around and begin invading CFC soon, and Black Legion/401k have already begun taking CFC space in tribute. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
259
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 03:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
You want an impartial view of the war?
**** gettin' blown up.
Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep Nyratic
364
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 03:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better.
You do realise the irony in this right? They are both pretty biased. I read both regularly: TMC admits the bias (seriously nearly every article has a disclaimer at the start with this article may be biased) while EN24 gets called on bias on a regular basis.
As for the war, CFC invades Fountain. Test and bro's fight back. Ships explode and space has been taken. Mistakes have been made on both sides, and high sec is still as oblivious as ever to anything changing. That's it, just like every war in Eve ever. Bienator II: "You can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose." I play in highsec. |
C DeLeon
Pangalactic Punks n' Playboys HUN Reloaded
142
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
I'm not impartial but I will try to paint a somewhat objective picture of the situation.
CFC:
CFC: With the technerf their incomes got crippled so they have to find alternative ways to fill their assets at rate as they did before Odyssey. With the collapse of HBC invading Fountain became an obvious choice for them. There are lots of R64 moons in fountain and its a good ratting space to organize a renter empire.
Solar: They are not involved directly with the CFC but N3 and PL being deployed to the west they might try to take back the drone regions. We will see how N3 can handle the situation while they aren't in the nearby.
Anti CFC forces:
Test: They wan't to defend their home region and prove themselfs against the goon threat.
BBC (black legion and retirement club): With the cfc deployed to the west, they have a good chance to take moons and even systems in the north. As far as I know only Razor stayed to defend the north and so far they have difficulties alone to be effective as much as they should be to successfully defend the north.
N3/NC./PL: Their participation and goals are similar to the "balance of power" policy by Great Britain during history. With the collapse of HBC test is not a direct threat for N3. On the other hand the CFC dominated 0.0 far too long and this is the perfect situation to put an end to their dominance by preventing them from gathering additional incomes to maintain their power.
Neutral entities (so far):
The dinner squadron and the russian players in Stain have their own conflict in the south so they aren't involved in this war (yet). I know nothing about provi block's plans.
CHANCES:
Financials: CFC have probably really fat wallets from the tech era and their market manipulations but time works against them because the whole reason why they started this war is to get more money income. Test: I don't know if it's just misleading propaganda or there is truth behind it but they seem kinda broke financially. We will see how they will keep up with the war. I wouldn't be surpired if N3 would inject some money into test just to keep them going. We will see. N3/PL: The south came out of the whole moongoo rebalance better and they have huge renter empires so I can say they have better income now then the CFC. The whole purpose of jumping in the war is to suck the CFC wallets dry as much as possible. N3/PL don't really want to win this war. They want it as long and as desperate as possible to cause pain to the CFC.
Numbers: I think the raw numbers are quite even but anti-cfc forces have higher participation numbers so far heated by the hate of the goons. On the other handCFC was passive far too long so they have to get their sh*t together if they don't wanto to fight outnumbered all the time.
Fleet doctrines and supers: People keep saying that CFC became the largest in the numbers of supers but they can't use them if they can't win the subcap fights. PL and NC. super pilots are also a lot more experienced so less chance of devastating huge f*ck ups. And CFC have problems winning on subcap level because their number one tactic (blobbing) won't work this time and probably the main reason why they use kithen sink fleets (caracal) because they have a hard time figuring out hard counters against their enemies. They have to fight too many and too different fleet doctrines.
Summary: CFC have to pull out some tricks (and get more allies) if they want to come out of this war as winners and so far it seems like the odds are against them.
(if I'm wrong somewhere feel free to correct me) |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Daktaklakpak.
2231
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
Here is my impartial view for ya.
Who ******* cares? It's Nullsec, this means a bunch of immature smacktards waving their dicks around at all the other players trying to pretend that they have some sort if influence on the rest of the game.
Impartial view over.
Go join a corp in WH space and have some real fun with some real risk and make some real ISK. Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821 |
Mark Rain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
15
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:07:00 -
[9] - Quote
Looks like a stalemate to me thus far of what I have read and seen.
Sure does add some volatility to the markets though. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
271
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:14:00 -
[10] - Quote
You aren't going to get an impartial view of nullsec through any website. Everyone out here has been shooting each other for years.
If you want to dig though all of the battle reports and sift through dotlan you can get a pretty good idea on your own though. |
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Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
2906
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Considering 'spin' is a major part of the war, good luck getting impartial views. |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
2906
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:22:00 -
[12] - Quote
C DeLeon wrote:wan't (if I'm wrong somewhere feel free to correct me)
*gnashes teeth* |
C DeLeon
Pangalactic Punks n' Playboys HUN Reloaded
142
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:27:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:C DeLeon wrote:wan't (if I'm wrong somewhere feel free to correct me) *gnashes teeth* oops! fixed :) |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1792
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:33:00 -
[14] - Quote
C DeLeon has a pretty good writeup and it isn't far off base. I'd argue that NCDot and PL are more in it for the easy killing than anything else. If the war starts to get boring they will likely wander off to greener pastures. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1038
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:52:00 -
[15] - Quote
C DeLeon wrote:I'm not impartial but I will try to paint a somewhat objective picture of the situation. CFC:CFC: With the technerf their incomes got crippled so they have to find alternative ways to fill their assets at rate as they did before Odyssey. With the collapse of HBC invading Fountain became an obvious choice for them. There are lots of R64 moons in fountain and its a good ratting space to organize a renter empire. Solar: They are not involved directly with the CFC but N3 and PL being deployed to the west they might try to take back the drone regions. We will see how N3 can handle the situation from the other side of new eden. Anti CFC forces:Test: They want to defend their home region and prove themselfs against the goon threat. BBC (black legion and retirement club): With the cfc deployed to the west, they have a good chance to take moons and systems in the north. As far as I know only Razor stayed to defend the north and so far they have difficulties alone to be effective as much as they should be to successfully defend the north. N3/NC./PL: Their participation and goals are similar to the "balance of power" policy by Great Britain during history. With the collapse of HBC test is not a direct threat for N3. On the other hand the CFC dominated 0.0 far too long and this is the perfect situation to put an end to their dominance by preventing them from gathering additional incomes to maintain their full power. Neutral entities (so far):The dinner squadron and the russian players in Stain have their own conflict in the south so they aren't involved in this war (yet). I know nothing about provi block's plans. CHANCES: Financials:CFC have probably really fat wallets from the tech era and their market manipulations but time works against them because the whole reason why they started this war is to get more money income. Test: I don't know if it's just misleading propaganda or there is truth behind it but they seem kinda broke financially. We will see how they will keep up with the war. I wouldn't be surpired if N3 would inject some money into test just to keep them going. We will see. N3/PL: The south came out of the whole moongoo rebalance better and they have huge renter empires so I can say they have better incomes now than the CFC. The whole purpose of jumping in the war is to suck the CFC wallets dry as much as possible. N3/PL don't really want to win this war. They want it as long and desperate as possible to cause pain to the CFC. Numbers:I think the raw numbers are quite even but anti-cfc forces have higher participation numbers so far heated by the hate of the goons. On the other hand CFC was passive far too long so they have to get their sh*t together if they don't want to fight outnumbered all the time. Fleet doctrines and supers:People keep saying that CFC became the largest in the numbers of supers but they can't use them if they can't win the subcap fights. PL and NC. super pilots are also a lot more experienced so less chance of devastating huge f*ck ups. And CFC have problems winning on subcap level because their #1 tactic (blobbing) won't work this time and probably the main reason why they use kitchen sink fleets (caracal) because they have a hard time figuring out hard counters against their enemies. They have to fight against too many and too different fleet doctrines. Summary: CFC have to pull out some tricks (and get more allies) if they want to come out of this war as winners and so far it seems like the odds are against them. (if I'm wrong somewhere feel free to correct me)
Thanks.
That helps filling in on the holes I had (had most of that info already so good to get confirmation). So keeping track of the day to day ebbs and flows in battles and territory swings is going to be a combination of dotlan, kill mails, and some detective work I fear, because I assume there is no easy way to do that, no single source. |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2499
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 04:53:00 -
[16] - Quote
Meh.
Glad I could help...
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Tara Read
The Bastards Shadow Cartel
401
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 07:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
As much as I am loathe to post in a Null politics thread, from a purely objective view having a basic grasp on conflicts and potential targets is always useful. Sewing seeds of chaos on an already crippled and confused enemy is pure bliss |
Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
257
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 07:09:00 -
[18] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Yeah, I realize I have as much chance of this as Scarlett Johansson hiring me as her personal masseuse.
I have looked at COAD. A cesspool of propaganda, and inside jokes. I have looked at Dotlan, but that does not really give the full picture. I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better. Same with Kugu and Failheap, which seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
But does anyone have what they consider an up-to-date, impartial source of info on what is going on? I have some friends in null giving me info, but that too will have some inherent bias.
Whatever Stator or Sham has told you so far is about as impartial as any other source you will find.
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Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
523
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 07:09:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Yeah, I realize I have as much chance of this as Scarlett Johansson hiring me as her personal masseuse.
I have looked at COAD. A cesspool of propaganda, and inside jokes. I have looked at Dotlan, but that does not really give the full picture. I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better. Same with Kugu and Failheap, which seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
But does anyone have what they consider an up-to-date, impartial source of info on what is going on? I have some friends in null giving me info, but that too will have some inherent bias.
isk
See Bio for isk doubling rules. -áIf you didn't read bio, chances are you helped fund those who did. |
Abon
STAHLSTURM Test Alliance Please Ignore
138
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 07:43:00 -
[20] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Here is my impartial view for ya.
Who ******* cares? It's Nullsec, this means a bunch of immature smacktards waving their dicks around at all the other players trying to pretend that they have some sort if influence on the rest of the game.
Impartial view over.
Go join a corp in WH space and have some real fun with some real risk and make some real ISK.
Your reply is certainly a certificate of maturity. *golfclap* |
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Toshiro Ozuwara
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Test Alliance Please Ignore
75
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 07:55:00 -
[21] - Quote
It's hard to give an impartial view, I'm in Test and I definitely have my bias. Also, a lot of the metagame stuff I hear about isn't confirmed, or even possible to confirm.
CFC has invaded Fountain. At the time Test had few reliable allies (basically Tribe and failcascade Raiden). Test had also undergone a bunch of leadership changes recently, which lead some to speculate (and insinuate) that Test was fail cascading. The prelude to this was the NC invasion of Delve/Querious with NC/PL and CFC basically thunderdoming against Test.
CFC invades, has a few strong first few days, although Test reveals allies in PL and NC.
Then BL/401k start attacking Goons in the North. Test is no longer fighting on two fronts, CFC is.
Then N3 Coalition (Nulli, Nexus, Scrap et al) officially deploy to Aridia this weekend.
The last 4 days have seen very little Fountain Sov change hands, and massive losses for CFC in the South and North despite downshipping to Caracals and Wolves from TFIs and Tengus. They still run some Tengu fleets, but they aren't as numerous as they first were.
Black Legion tonight captured a CFC station system in Tribute.
Also, unaffiliated but interested parties in Syndicate and Cloud Ring have taken to attacking CFC POSes there, as the CFC held numerous tech moons in those regions. Those parties are acting independent of Test and friends. Basically taking advantage of the fact the CFC can't be everywhere all the time.
And again, yes I have a bias. I am in Test. I do not like the CFC. But I'd like to think I could admit if we were losing badly, and in our communications, fleets, formups etc, that certainly isn't the mood. It feels like every day the Test/NC/N3/BL side is getting better and better results.
What no one is really talking about, is that the CFC is being invaded in Tribute while they are trying to invade Fountain. There are multiple fronts to this war, not all in Fountain, and not all involving Test. Although it seems NC/N3 like to fly with BL and 401k. Will Fountain be Goonswarm's Waterloo?Read all about it in COAD. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10158
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:02:00 -
[22] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Yeah, I realize I have as much chance of this as Scarlett Johansson hiring me as her personal masseuse.
I have looked at COAD. A cesspool of propaganda, and inside jokes. I have looked at Dotlan, but that does not really give the full picture. I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better. Same with Kugu and Failheap, which seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
But does anyone have what they consider an up-to-date, impartial source of info on what is going on? I have some friends in null giving me info, but that too will have some inherent bias.
It's probably not possible, since by definition anyone involved enough to have the information is involved enough to be impartial.
My view of the affair is that the CFC is on the back foot, but that it's way too soon for anyone to be declaring the end of either side. Personally I hope that this gives us the new Great War that we've needed for years, but there's no way the current momentum can be maintained by either side - the sub losses of both coalitions are staggering, and can't be sustained at that level. But neither side has had a decisive loss yet.
"I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site"
Good call. You might read something that challenges your preconceptions, and maintaining confirmation bias can be pretty tiring.
PS Welcome back. My offer is still open, btw.
1 Kings 12:11
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3699
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:04:00 -
[23] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Yeah, I realize I have as much chance of this as Scarlett Johansson hiring me as her personal masseuse.
I have looked at COAD. A cesspool of propaganda, and inside jokes. I have looked at Dotlan, but that does not really give the full picture. I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site, and EN 24 seems little better. Same with Kugu and Failheap, which seems like monkey's throwing excrement at each other.
But does anyone have what they consider an up-to-date, impartial source of info on what is going on? I have some friends in null giving me info, but that too will have some inherent bias. It's probably not possible, since by definition anyone involved enough to have the information is involved enough to be partial. My view of the affair is that the CFC is on the back foot, but that it's way too soon for anyone to be declaring the end of either side. Personally I hope that this gives us the new Great War that we've needed for years, but there's no way the current momentum can be maintained by either side - the subcap losses of both coalitions are staggering, and can't be sustained at that level. But neither side has had a decisive loss yet. "I won't even bother with goon's Pravda site" Good call. You might read something that challenges your preconceptions, and maintaining confirmation bias can be pretty tiring. PS Welcome back. My offer is still open, btw. It's a sov hellgrind, not unlike a "who can avoid killing themselves after several hours of shooting and repping (different !) sov structures all the time" competition. I am a nullsec zealot. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10161
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:07:00 -
[24] - Quote
From the outside, it looked like there was a pretty high boatviolence:struktura op ratio as sov wars go, but I guess the rate was, as I said, unsustainable.
1 Kings 12:11
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10161
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:08:00 -
[25] - Quote
Incidentally, I see that no one has thanked the CFC for providing this massive boost to the mining community
1 Kings 12:11
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3699
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:13:00 -
[26] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:From the outside, it looked like there was a pretty high boatviolence:struktura op ratio as sov wars go, but I guess the rate was, as I said, unsustainable. As any spy knows, CFC stealth bombers have been spotted shooting TEST SBUs and goodness knows what.
Malcanis wrote:Incidentally, I see that no one has thanked the CFC for providing this massive boost to the mining community Because the mining community hasn't forgotten Hulkageddon.
Never forgive, never forget. The wrecks of exhumers, Revenge.
Also, reference in sig spotted. It matches a move from fighting to sovgrind strategies. I am a nullsec zealot. |
Christopher AET
Segmentum Solar Nulli Legio
454
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:41:00 -
[27] - Quote
Take Mittens. Take Kugu. Take EN24. Mix them in a blender. Take a pinch of salt. Discard that salt. Put all remaining salt in. Then you have something vaguely reliable. I drain ducks of their moisture for sustenance. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3699
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 08:43:00 -
[28] - Quote
Christopher AET wrote:Take Mittens. Take Kugu. Take EN24. Mix them in a blender. Take a pinch of salt. Discard that salt. Put all remaining salt in. Then you have something vaguely reliable. Ah, EN24. I am a nullsec zealot. |
BoBoZoBo
Paragon Fury Tactical Narcotics Team
237
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 15:15:00 -
[29] - Quote
The best you can do is read both sides and deduct form yourself. The fact is that anyone who is partial, is probably not involved and by default, not going to have the good info you want.
Come on down and party with us, find out for yourself. Primary Test Subject GÇó SmackTalker Elite |
Ghazu
597
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 16:43:00 -
[30] - Quote
well i am just glad the op is no longer whining about drones. http://www.minerbumping.com/
lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984 |
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