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Agartha
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:15:00 -
[1]
Hello all interested,
I am trying to train up an all-out combat character, still young and naieve  , that started with the Amarr but am now also thinking of the Minnies ( their speed, projectiles and the Munnin are a nice far away goal), however, I am a bit troubled which way to go...both have their advantage and things to like really. Its so hard to choose :)!! So..I am honestly saying I rather not choose between the two and like to specialize in both, SOMEHOW...
When I first started playing Eve I heard of the Apocalypse with Artilerry cannons equipped, is this viable..its sounds like a very attractive affiche since it hardly uses cap for its guns and the variation and attributes of the guns are interesting too..Powergrid is a bit high though, but so are the Mega Beam's..
Stories and experiences on this combination of both races and ships/weaponry? Please share if you like
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Chode Rizoum
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:26:00 -
[2]
8 x 1400mm
3 x Multi spec jammers
1 x warp disrupter
dmg mods and stuff in low
lol whould be funny
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Destructor1792
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:27:00 -
[3]
I've been playing for quite a while now & have just stuck with the minny skills. It's been a long hard slog & only now am I starting to see the benefits of having all skills maxed, just to be able to use T2 guns 
Which ever way you go, be prepared to to wait for ages til u get the specialization skills.. and you've probably done this already, but make sure your learning skills are all nicely topped up 
And remember, each BS has specific bonuses assigned, so fitting lasers for example on a tempest, you don't get the 5% damage per Bs lvl 
Hope this helps from the Minny point of view
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jarack
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:29:00 -
[4]
Okay, firstly mate i would go for the apoc, because you can do alot more in the game with that ship then any other, it has the ability to mine with its 8 laser slots, it has the ability to run npc missions because it can tank so well, but it also can pvp very well, the damage it deals out and the damage it can take from enemy ships is immense and i give it 10/10 although i am specialised in amarr ships then any others , but whereas you said about putting projectiles onto an apoc is another story, in PVP you must fit lasers because they so much more versatile on a battlefield, also with the battleship skill bonus it helps the guns to be more powerful and more efficiant, but i have used hybrid guns on the apoc whilst doing missions because the npc rats i was shooting tanked very well for EM and thermal, but it messes your setup so much, rails and amarr ships..... otherwise i would say the apoc is the way to go matey
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Naurhir
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:53:00 -
[5]
I have spent the last month or so researching minmatar and amarr since I planned to pick just one to concentrate on since I have very low sp and have to specialize to ever hope to truly compete. That being said after all the interviews and posts I have made, I decided to just go back to my minmatar roots. Due to the rats I fight i will still fly an apoc for a long while ratting, but for pvp I am going back to minmatar.
As far as your bastardization goes, i have done similar setups for pure tanking, as all cap goes to tank rather than weapons as well. It doesn't do the best damage however, and really wouldn't be as effective as if you just picked a race.
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Agartha
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Posted - 2005.12.04 12:03:00 -
[6]
Thank you so far for the replies( Naurhir,hope you will fare well :) )..I only have the problem of not being able to focus very well ( uhmmm ^^)..I am now training both races to equal cruiser and gun levels to see what I like more, the Maller and Omen were ok but I wasnt feeling "wow~!", bmaybe thats the mediocre skills..
Hope I can make up my mind a bit 
PS: I am not a matey Jarack, I dont sail aboard a ship
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Ras Blumin
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Posted - 2005.12.04 12:33:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Agartha
When I first started playing Eve I heard of the Apocalypse with Artilerry cannons equipped, is this viable..
Yes it is. You'll get a better alpha strike on the apoc if you don't have min bs 5 (afaik).
p - l - u - r |
Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2005.12.04 13:39:00 -
[8]
Ras, you can still train for T2 1400 and large projectile skill. But you loose a lot since the tempest gets a double gun bonus.
I would say to Amarr as over th eyears they are much less nerfed than the Minmatar and the devs seem to have a hardon for them. Minmatar will remain inferior. You can make minmatar work with lots of skills, but skills make other races even better.
If you want the most for your RL time and money, don't choose Minmatar. I am not very please with the road of the Minmatar over the last 1+ years.
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If your not dyin' your not tryin'. |
Ras Blumin
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Posted - 2005.12.04 15:30:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
But you loose a lot since the tempest gets a double gun bonus.
DPS wise, yes, but alpha strike is exactly the same on the apoc as on the tempest with min bs 5.
p - l - u - r |
Agartha
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Posted - 2005.12.04 15:57:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Agartha on 04/12/2005 15:58:12
Originally by: Ras Blumin
Originally by: Imhotep Khem
But you loose a lot since the tempest gets a double gun bonus.
DPS wise, yes, but alpha strike is exactly the same on the apoc as on the tempest with min bs 5.
Further, what can I expect for kind of damage on a Apoc with (6 to 8 turrets?) 1400mm Howitzers, using EMP ammo and with mediocre skills( level 3's and 4's) for example ?
I guess laser weapons like the Megabeam and Megapulse are naturally better in damage but less versatile in damage type and having less range/fallof?
Hope to hear some more experieces
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Agartha
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Posted - 2005.12.04 17:20:00 -
[11]
I was also thinking what the outcome in PvE and PvP was when using projectiles or laser weaponry...this might affect my choices as well
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Drunkeh
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Posted - 2005.12.04 17:27:00 -
[12]
A 1400 II apoc does more dps than a 1400 II tempest unless you have minmatar BS 5. Which is ridiculous.
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Agartha
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Posted - 2005.12.04 20:24:00 -
[13]
Another question came up
With lower skills, what could I best train for on an Apocalypse...Mega Beam 1's( or named) or 1400 1's( or named)??
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TerrorWOLF
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Posted - 2005.12.04 21:37:00 -
[14]
Id say much depends on what you going to do primary with it. The apoc has bonus to its cap and cap use for lasers (named projectiles do not use cap, or even much less ten lasers with BS5). But lasers do not need ammo only 2 or 3 sets of crystals in cargo for range change, levees a lot of cargo room for loot.
May Your Death Be Slow And Painful
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.12.04 21:45:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Wrayeth on 04/12/2005 21:54:49
It all depends on what you want to do. If your combat will be PvE, then go for amarr - lasers don't use ammo, and generally track better than projectiles (with the exception of autocannons  ).
For PvP, though, minmatar all the way. Minmatar are more skill-intensive, but the payoff is worth it. Burst damage from 1400's pops frigs and cruisers like nothing else, and an autocannon tempest will own almost anything if you play your cards right (I pirated an Exuro Mortis crow interceptor at a gate in Sakht last night at point-blank range with an AC tempest; this was an hour or so after I ganked one of their ravens in Delve - payback's a biatch!).
Anyway, I disgress; tempest > apoc for PvP, IMHO. Post-RMR, it's also much better than the 'geddon. And yes, I've flown both the apoc and the 'geddon.
-Wrayeth
Go away. |
Drunkeh
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Posted - 2005.12.04 22:49:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Wrayeth
Anyway, I disgress; tempest > apoc for PvP, IMHO. Post-RMR, it's also much better than the 'geddon. And yes, I've flown both the apoc and the 'geddon.
Completely disagree. Geddon is arguably the best OVERALL pvp ship. Overall counting things like cost. For 60 mil you get a ship that has the second highest dps, a large dronebay, and EIGHT lows for damage mods/tanking. The only thing a tempest does better is EW with its 5 mids.
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2005.12.05 00:04:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Drunkeh
A 1400 II apoc does more dps than a 1400 II tempest unless you have minmatar BS 5. Which is ridiculous.
Because of what, more damage mods, which is moot after RMR?
If Im missing something please tell me.
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Ohnoes, I've been nerfed :( |
Drunkeh
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Posted - 2005.12.05 02:14:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Drunkeh on 05/12/2005 02:15:29
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Originally by: Drunkeh
A 1400 II apoc does more dps than a 1400 II tempest unless you have minmatar BS 5. Which is ridiculous.
Because of what, more damage mods, which is moot after RMR?
If Im missing something please tell me.
Let me spell it out for you. Not only is there the fact that volley damage is a lot more on an apoc than on a pest (even with BS 5 tempest only hits for an effective 7.5 guns while the apoc hits with 8). But theres the fact that in simple DPS, an apoc does more.
Apoc 8 guns
Tempest 6 guns + 2 damage bonuses
As everyone knows, with BS 5 1400 IIs get 2 25% bonuses, effectively making the pest like it has 9 guns.
W/ BS lvl 4
6 guns = 8.4 guns.
I'm fairly sure that an apoc can fit 8 1400 IIs using only 1 RCU II with max fitting skills, so it gets one more damage mod than a pest making them do similar damage. So if you have BS 4 you basically do the same dps as an apoc with 1400 IIs, except it is doing more volley damage.
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