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Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
2401
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:30:00 -
[31] - Quote
Mors Magne wrote:Field Artillery wrote:but why would you propose another newbie ship if you don't want them?
(+ lol i'm sure it will fit into those plexes the 'veterans in high sec' would use this for xDD) It's easy to criticize, but it's more difficult to think of better alternatives. What better alternative would you suggest?
It's real easy to criticize as HE wasn't the one making any suggestions. YOU are, so the burden is on you to convince people your idea is sound.
It is not, btw. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:44:00 -
[32] - Quote
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:Mors Magne wrote:A problem with the Collector's Edition is that the Gnosis Battlecruiser...are newbie ships Confirming all new players should blindly fly the Gnosis. It's got the capacity for practically everything, therefore it's a newbie ship!
No, not for that reason - it's a newbie ship because it's not the best ship for the exploration role (strategic cruisers probably are) and it requires no skill points to pilot. Hence it fits into the category of 'newbie ship'. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:46:00 -
[33] - Quote
ElQuirko wrote:Mors Magne wrote:Uriel (translation of this angel's name: "God is my light" or "leads us to destiny") Two completely different phrases from one word? Son, only the English language is that warped and you know it.
This is what the angel Uriel's name means according to Wikipedia
It's an appropriate name for a scanning ship. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
15683
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:50:00 -
[34] - Quote
Mors Magne wrote:No, not for that reason - it's a newbie ship because it's not the best ship for the exploration role (strategic cruisers probably are) and it requires no skill points to pilot. Hence it fits into the category of 'newbie ship'. Eh no. It's better than strategic cruisers because it can actually do exploration in highsec, and newbies will not be able to make good use of it because they don't have the skills and equipment required. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:51:00 -
[35] - Quote
Xen Solarus wrote:Can't say i support the idea of an exploration battleship, but the general idea of recieving a unique ship that can only be found in the collectors edition (and not simply realised again under a different format at a later date) would certainly go a long way to encourage me to spend cash on it. As it stands, its quite alot of currency for what you actually get.
Exactly. I imagine a lot of people are thinking the same way.
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Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:54:00 -
[36] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mors Magne wrote:No, not for that reason - it's a newbie ship because it's not the best ship for the exploration role (strategic cruisers probably are) and it requires no skill points to pilot. Hence it fits into the category of 'newbie ship'. Eh no. It's better than strategic cruisers because it can actually do exploration in highsec, and newbies will not be able to make good use of it because they don't have the skills and equipment required.
The gnosis doesn't require any skill points to fly. If you recall, a strategic cruiser requires quite a bunch of skill points to level 5 to fly.
http://eve.wikia.com/wiki/Gnosis
But I feel we are digressing here... |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
15683
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 12:57:00 -
[37] - Quote
Mors Magne wrote:The gnosis doesn't require any skill points to fly. GǪand if you fly it without any skill points, it does nothing. To use it as an exploration ship, you need to fit it with exploration equipment for which you need exploration skills, and to find anything, you need to get those skills up.
It's a battlecruiser. Battlecruiser are not newbie ships, no matter how few SP you need in order to activate one. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |

Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
34
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 13:05:00 -
[38] - Quote
I don't think an exploration BS is a good idea. But I do think special items available ingame or otherwise should not be available afterwards or via another release. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 13:13:00 -
[39] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mors Magne wrote:The gnosis doesn't require any skill points to fly. GǪand if you fly it without any skill points, it does nothing. To use it as an exploration ship, you need to fit it with exploration equipment for which you need exploration skills, and to find anything, you need to get those skills up. It's a battlecruiser. Battlecruiser are not newbie ships, no matter how few SP you need in order to activate one.
The problem here is that there is no precise dictionary definition of "newbie".
But it's a moot point because you can fly the Gnosis (to whatever standard) on your first day playing Eve. Whereas it would take a person a few weeks to get the skills to even sit in a strategic cruiser - and even longer to earn the ISK to buy one (most people anyway). |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 13:16:00 -
[40] - Quote
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:I don't think an exploration BS is a good idea. But I do think special items available ingame or otherwise should not be available afterwards or via another release.
I entirely agree with you. However, there needs to be a strong reason for parting with 150 Euros in the first place. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
15688
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 13:17:00 -
[41] - Quote
Mors Magne wrote:But it's a moot point because you can fly the Gnosis (to whatever standard) on your first day playing Eve. Whereas it would take a person a few weeks to get the skills to even sit in a strategic cruiser - and even longer to earn the ISK to buy one (most people anyway). GǪand in doing so, you've transited from a much better (for vets and newbies alike) exploration ship to a much worse one. Fancy that. The only thing that could potentially be worse would be an exploration battleship.
Not that T3 are veteran ships anyway GÇö after all, when they came out, people derided them for the silly low skill requirements.  GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 14:41:00 -
[42] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mors Magne wrote:But it's a moot point because you can fly the Gnosis (to whatever standard) on your first day playing Eve. Whereas it would take a person a few weeks to get the skills to even sit in a strategic cruiser - and even longer to earn the ISK to buy one (most people anyway). GǪand in doing so, you've transited from a much better (for vets and newbies alike) exploration ship to a much worse one. Fancy that. The only thing that could potentially be worse would be an exploration battleship. Not that T3 are veteran ships anyway GÇö after all, when they came out, people derided them for the silly low skill requirements. 
The problem with having this off-topic discussion is that we've lost sight of the original point.
The original point is that having a less powerful Macharial that can scan in the Collector's Edition is that it provides a new experience for people who have played the game for a long time. 
I don't know about you, but I've flown a Thrasher before, and I've flown a Gnosis before, and I've flown much sexier frigates than that hacking Amarrian one. 
BUT I've never flown a battleship with a scanning bonus before. 
It's not an "I win button" - so I was hoping to silence the trolls. But I obviously failed because here am I having a debate with trolls who have never considered buying the Collector's Edition anyway. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 15:27:00 -
[43] - Quote
I've revised my original post because people were missing the main point. |

Livonia Velorea
Banana Corp
2
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 15:55:00 -
[44] - Quote
I would rather have an eve novel/book, store poster or ship key chain, anything physical really. Ingame items if I had to choose though, i'd sooner see more vanity clothes/tats/scars/hairs than ships. Just my opinion of course but to be honest i'm happy with the collectors edition as is. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 16:19:00 -
[45] - Quote
Livonia Velorea wrote:I would rather have an eve novel/book, store poster or ship key chain, anything physical really. Ingame items if I had to choose though, i'd sooner see more vanity clothes/tats/scars/hairs than ships. Just my opinion of course but to be honest i'm happy with the collectors edition as is.
That's a fair comment. The reason I'm suggesting a ship is because it's more do-able in the time remaining - compared to making a physical object.
The devs could change the Macharial's paint job, change its bonuses (so it can fit an extended probe launcher) and it's good to go.
Vanity items are ok, but they are not 'useable' as such. Eve is all about ships, so it seems right to have another collector's ship in the Collector's Edition. |

hellcane
Never Back Down
73
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 16:21:00 -
[46] - Quote
If you don't like what the collectors edition offers, don't buy it instead of coming up with terrible ideas. |

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
2411
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 16:21:00 -
[47] - Quote
Just take a Machariel and rig and fit it for exploration.
Voila! Less powerful Machariel that does exploration.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
41
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 16:27:00 -
[48] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Just take a Machariel and rig and fit it for exploration.
Voila! Less powerful Machariel that does exploration.
In theory, you are right. In practice, the problem is the inordinate amount of time and effort it takes to scan things down without a scan bonus.
The wonderful thing about the Machariel is the sense of freedom (and power) you get because of its maneuverability.
The scan probe bonus should enhance this sense of freedom.
True - the modified Machariel would have less power. However, this can be compensated up to a point by having faction fittings. This would mean that it would be useless as a PvP ship - so it would be a benign presence in the Eve universe. |

Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
585
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 17:45:00 -
[49] - Quote
Sure let's add a ship no one will ever use ebcause it will be the biggest gank bait ever seen. Makes a lot of sense to design a ship with such limited use. |

Mors Magne
Terra Incognita Insidious Empire
42
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 18:05:00 -
[50] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Sure let's add a ship no one will ever use ebcause it will be the biggest gank bait ever seen. Makes a lot of sense to design a ship with such limited use.
It can't be an "I win button" for obvious reasons.
However, it is a unique experience, as behoves a collector's ship.
It also adds to the lore of the Eve universe. There is a good historical reason for why this ship is obsolete. |
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