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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:39:00 -
[1]
I know the CCP boys and girls work very hard, to some very demanding customers, but hey that's business in the real world, and in the real world one would be expecting a refund on a service that is paid for.
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
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Dr Happy
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:41:00 -
[2]
they've done it for almost everyother patch I don't see how this would be any diffrent
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Virtuozzo
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:41:00 -
[3]
no
Virtuozzo
RECRUITMENT TEASERS. Last words of a Caldari general: "Pull the Ravens back! Full retreat! they've got frigates!" |
Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:43:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Virtuozzo
no
Fair comment, but could you explain why you think no?
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Makree
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:43:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
I know the CCP boys and girls work very hard, to some very demanding customers, but hey that's business in the real world, and in the real world one would be expecting a refund on a service that is paid for.
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
I will forego the refund, time extension or any other restitution if CCP cant stop the whiners from clogging up the forums with useless, redundant freds.
<NotoMM>
Chiile VorseT u sukz0rs
</NotoMM>
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mopheus
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:43:00 -
[6]
Well it could very well be, but they don't owe you.
They made a patch to make ure game better, they gave it out for free. Now they have a little trouble and u want ure money refunded.
Go to the casino, play, lose and ask ure money back. There answer is a good one.
It's normal people think of their money tho and I can understand it, but be friendly to the ones we love and owe so much to, CCP :p
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Zazza Zaa
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:45:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Zazza Zaa on 16/12/2005 22:56:20
Edited by: Zazza Zaa on 16/12/2005 22:52:55
no as loong CCP is CCP I wont demand a pay back not soo close too a Patch day.
"CCP is listning and trying too sort the fact I cant for god grief "not"read the ingame font" they got alot of bonus points too cash in as ccp are what they are and "listen too there custumors"
a Payment back is valid after extended troubles "
" + answers like I go too the casino and I lost cash pfft it's not the same thing way off bs"
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:46:00 -
[8]
Originally by: mopheus
Well it could very well be, but they don't owe you.
They made a patch to make ure game better, they gave it out for free. Now they have a little trouble and u want ure money refunded.
Go to the casino, play, lose and ask ure money back. There answer is a good one.
It's normal people think of their money tho and I can understand it, but be friendly to the ones we love and owe so much to, CCP :p
You misunderstood my question.
I was not looking for a refund. I was asking whether other people thought that a refund was in order.
The use of 'one' rather than 'I'.
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Teblin
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:48:00 -
[9]
I posted earlier in some thread that the EULA says you're not entitled to a refund.
If you would be so kind as to take a peek at the EULA for a moment, you'll see why you aren't entitled to a refund:
Quote:
CCP disclaims all warranties, whether express or implied, including without limitation the warranties of merchantability, fitness for particular purpose and
non-infringement. There is no warranty against interference with your enjoyment of the Game. CCP does not warrant that the operation of the System or
your access to the System, or that your use of the Software, will be uninterrupted or error-free, nor that the System or Software will be compatible with
your hardware and software.
The game service gets interrupted sometimes, sometimes with no notice at all something goes wrong but you are getting exactly what you paid for. Your service was not interrupted, your gameplay was. And you service is defined as one which is not of uninterrupted gameplay.
I hope they do give us a free day, though, just to be kind. But demanding it isn't going to get you anywhere.
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:49:00 -
[10]
I didn't demand.
I asked a question.
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Embattle
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:49:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
I know the CCP boys and girls work very hard, to some very demanding customers, but hey that's business in the real world, and in the real world one would be expecting a refund on a service that is paid for.
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
Technically RMR was a free update....so no.
-----------
I would have a sig but it might break a arm, leg or even worse a rule. |
Tal Oman
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:50:00 -
[12]
No refund is needed. So we lose a few days at the cost of $2US per day. Even if we lost a weeks downtime for this patch, that would be $14 to buy the expansion. RMR would have been sold as an expansion for $30 by many other gaming companies.
They made a very cool expansion and only asked us for patience.
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Teblin
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:53:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
I didn't demand.
I asked a question.
Apologies for that misunderstanding. You see my point, though, right? I'm just trying to explain why you aren't entitled to a refund according to the EULA. I don't know CCP's policy on refunds and can't comment on that but hopefully that will set other people who might come to the thread demanding a refund straight on the issue :).
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:55:00 -
[14]
I'm really looking forward to playing the expansion, honest.
But if it's in the EULA, then so be it.
Interesting distintion between the words 'service' and 'game play'.
As the idea that RMR is from the goodness of CCP's heart is a little hard to swallow. Maybe in part, but attracting new players and mainting the interest of the current user base is what the Eve business is all about, well in my eyes anyhow.
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:55:00 -
[15]
I dunno if we deserve one but it would be a nice christmas present. Especially if the server stays laggy for a week or more.
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:57:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Teblin
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
I didn't demand.
I asked a question.
Apologies for that misunderstanding. You see my point, though, right? I'm just trying to explain why you aren't entitled to a refund according to the EULA. I don't know CCP's policy on refunds and can't comment on that but hopefully that will set other people who might come to the thread demanding a refund straight on the issue :).
I do understand your point. Again, I'm not demanding a refund. I was thinking back to the time with the previous patch when a free day was handed out that's all.
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Sorja
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Posted - 2005.12.16 22:57:00 -
[17]
Give everybody one of the new tech II ships, problem solved 
I'd already be happy with a Caldari Navy Raven, of course, but a Crook(?)/Falcon would be nice.
Pink if possible, thank you 
__________________________________________
Let's force Tuxford flying a MK2 Moa for the rest of his life. |
Locke DieDrake
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:15:00 -
[18]
OK, first of all, most other time based services that offer refunds or free days based on outages are selling a "always up" service. OR if they aren't an always up service, they are afraid you will go to the competitors.
EVE is different in that they are not selling an always up service, nor are there any real competitors in this niche. EvE is unique, not only in concept, but in implementation.
The bottom line is this. Major content updates cause some minor problems. They are minor.
The content update was free. It didn't have to be. They could easily have made it manditory to continue to play, and charged for it.
If, because of the FREE update, you can't play for a while, or your play experiance is not as good as it could be, then you are not entitled to anything but a small rant on the forum. And actually, not even that technically speaking. (see forum rules)
The fact is that CCP has done us ANOTHER wonderfull update, and AGAIN they did it for free.
EVE is the incredible game that it is, because CCP pour their hearts and souls into making it such. And I feel offended on their behalf by amount of petty crap posted on these forums in the last 24 hours.
Is the update perfect? Nope. Was the game perfect to start? Nope. Would any other online game company give you multiple free content updates each year with the SOLE intent of making the game more fun to play? It's never happened except here, with CCP.
So I say NO, you don't get free time, or reimbursements because CCP EARNED the right to a little down time, and a little rough edges. They have EARNED the right to tell you that if you can't handle the free update and the rough edges, then you probably can't handle the awesomeness that is EvE and CCP.
In short,
It's not standard for MMO's to refund for down time. It's not standard for MMO's to release free updates. CCP gives you free updates. They don't (and shouldn't) refund game time.
___________________________________________
The deeper you stick it in your vein, the deeper the thoughts there's no more pain.
___________________________________________ |
Wyke Mossari
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:17:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Teblin
I posted earlier in some thread that the EULA says you're not entitled to a refund.
If you would be so kind as to take a peek at the EULA for a moment, you'll see why you aren't entitled to a refund:
That position is not actually supported by the law.
* The EULA is a Licence not a contract.
* A Licence grants rights.
* A Licence or Contract cannot take away statutory rights.
FWIW, I not demanding anything. I'm pointing out that the suggestion that players don't have a legitimate claim is wrong.
I'm mostly disappointed, this has happened before, was predicted and CCP should have learnt from that experience.
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Wyke Mossari
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:21:00 -
[20]
Technically RMR was a free update....so no.
No, you pay for a service not software.
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Sholleran
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:31:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Sholleran on 16/12/2005 23:32:10
Originally by: Teblin
I'm just trying to explain why you aren't entitled to a refund according to the EULA. I don't know CCP's policy on refunds and can't comment on that but hopefully that will set other people who might come to the thread demanding a refund straight on the issue :).
I respectfully suggest that given your ISD/forum moderator position you should exercise extreme caution on making those sorts of assertions. Especially given the bold part above.
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Lucas Garin
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:38:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Wyke Mossari
That position is not actually supported by the law.
* The EULA is a Licence not a contract.
* A Licence grants rights.
* A Licence or Contract cannot take away statutory rights.
FWIW, I not demanding anything. I'm pointing out that the suggestion that players don't have a legitimate claim is wrong.
I'm mostly disappointed, this has happened before, was predicted and CCP should have learnt from that experience.
Fine. Send me your address and I'll send you the ~$0.53 you're owed for 26 hours of downtime. 
Jeez...
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Gretchen Dawntreader
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:43:00 -
[23]
A huge amount of game content was delivered over a period of a day. A day was needed to get it as right as possible. Would you rather they rush it and the game crash for a week while they toss band-aids on it?
This wasn't just a patch or maintenance. This was a major overhaul of the game and tons of new content. I don't feel owed anything...I feel they just handed us the results of a lot of effort of a lot of people for a long time getting this ready.
Considering how much *could* have gone wrong this was smooth as silk.
If they *do* give a free day it will not be because we are owed one, it will be because they are giving us an extra gift along with all their work.
I'm no fanboi, but yeah, cut em a break. Some of these guys probably haven't relaxed or slept much for the last week or so.
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Zeonick
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:47:00 -
[24]
If you want CCP to refund you FIFTY CENTS TO A DOLLAR because you missed one to two days, then you need to seriously stop and think. At most, they might have cost you 2-3 dollars, but if you had mulitple accounts, what's 2-3 bucks?
Seriously, go use a coupon when you go to the store to buy food. Griping over change is kinda lame.
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Wyke Mossari
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:55:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Lucas Garin
Originally by: Wyke Mossari
That position is not actually supported by the law.
* The EULA is a Licence not a contract.
* A Licence grants rights.
* A Licence or Contract cannot take away statutory rights.
FWIW, I not demanding anything. I'm pointing out that the suggestion that players don't have a legitimate claim is wrong.
I'm mostly disappointed, this has happened before, was predicted and CCP should have learnt from that experience.
Fine. Send me your address and I'll send you the ~$0.53 you're owed for 26 hours of downtime.
Jeez...
Since you seem to have a problem with English comprehension. I've emboldened the relevent sentence to make it clearer for you.
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Sinari Galdrin
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Posted - 2005.12.16 23:58:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Wyke Mossari
That position is not actually supported by the law.
* The EULA is a Licence not a contract.
* A Licence grants rights.
* A Licence or Contract cannot take away statutory rights.
If we are paying for a service, then the legal situation (in the UK) is that we cannot demand a refund, without giving the service provider a 'reasonable' time to resolve any problems. It's different from the situation if we were paying for 'goods', when it's a lot easier to get a refund.
Software licences (and especially something like EVE) are classed as services, not goods.
(IANAL, but I've looked into this for work)
Not that I want a refund, I'm happy (so far). If things are still as bad in a week, I'll be less happy, but I don't expect that to be the case. Especially since things seem so much better after the last reboot.
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Aran Cole
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:04:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Wyke Mossari
Originally by: Teblin
I posted earlier in some thread that the EULA says you're not entitled to a refund.
If you would be so kind as to take a peek at the EULA for a moment, you'll see why you aren't entitled to a refund:
That position is not actually supported by the law.
* The EULA is a Licence not a contract.
* A Licence grants rights.
* A Licence or Contract cannot take away statutory rights.
FWIW, I not demanding anything. I'm pointing out that the suggestion that players don't have a legitimate claim is wrong.
I'm mostly disappointed, this has happened before, was predicted and CCP should have learnt from that experience.
YOUR FACE is not actually supported by the law! And by that I mean "What country do you live in where uninterrupted gameplay is a statutory right?"
_______________________
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TIELKERON
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:06:00 -
[28]
Just make all the "Refund " whinners pay for the patches.. Ill take a free patch or extension any day, even if it means I need to interact with the real world for a day..
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Teblin
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:09:00 -
[29]
Oh dear. I didn't mean to start an argument  .
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Vampire Skull
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:12:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
No
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