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Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
398
   |
Posted - 2013.08.06 13:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Morrigan LeSante wrote:For the sakes of an open comparison - how long does the Domi take to lock the ares and how much ground can it cover in that lock time?
Also we should consider that, if tackle gets under the sentries, the Domi/$DRONE_BOAT loses nearly all their DPS in it's removal - other hulls have hobgobs as ancillary peelers for things like this at no compromise to main DPS.
Cards on the table I really dont have a dog in this fight, but we should look at all angles for balancing.
Assuming no SeBo's active a normal sheidl MWD ceptor (100m sig) takes around 12 seconds to lock with a Domi, that is with Sig Analysis V. Considering that ceptor should running at least 4,800m/s without heat you are talking 56-58km.
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Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
398
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 13:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:"Happened before, will happen again"
Sentry Domis in the past were already used by some known guys at that time, many changes occurred since then to the point those were not viable anymore but since these new modules addition and Drone ship bonus changes they will quite soon enough replace major alliances fleets doctrines because defensive strategies are quite easy to set and because this setup is very very difficult to counter (Doom portal requires experienced players doing it and the numbers/logistics to achieve it)
All hail drone fleets camping and ganking everything and everyone.
Its not the drones, or even the Domi, its the assist mechanic.
In a small gang where everyone locks everyone annyway, you don't know when you are going to get hit, and in a fleet you STILL don't know when you are going to get hit, you just have to filter the overview looking for fast lockers with long range....otherwise you get hit with 500+ sentries all at once and there aren't time for armor reps to land between volleys. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
398
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 13:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
Yeah it have nothing to do with 90km opti gardes with tracking pwning every large(short range) gun out there.
If you can tank the sentries who cares how the track?
Pro-Tip you thing that is bad, put bouncers and wardens in and see what they actually do.
David Devant wrote:Onictus wrote:
Its not the drones, or even the Domi, its the assist mechanic.
This must be the case really. Immune to ewar, perfect alpha, big ehp. And other sentry boats are really pretty decent as well lets not forget. What's really fun about this is that nobody realised that this was doable earlier. You think everything's been done in this game, and lo and behold an i-win button has been sat there for years.
Not really, PL used Ishtars against us in -A- during XIX's eviction, likewise when CFC was booting NC. out of Tribute, BL used sentry ishtars against a CFC a couple times.
Panic geddons were built with the idea of dropping 5 sentries as well, it wasn't worth it to the point that you were using link augmentors or omnis, but they had a full rack of sentries onboard.
Its not a new idea, its just a LOT more effective. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
398
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 14:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:Onictus wrote:Mina Sebiestar wrote:
Yeah it have nothing to do with 90km opti gardes with tracking pwning every large(short range) gun out there.
If you can tank the sentries who cares how the track? Pro-Tip you thing that is bad, put bouncers and wardens in and see what they actually do. In that case i am all for giving all guns 90k optimals and superior tracking because it don't rly matter right?
Correct it really doesn't.
Of yo know they are bringing 10 domi's, bring smartbombs.
I've spent the last three months nuking sentry fleet after sentry fleet. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
398
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 14:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:well they can always be stupid and allow you get close but ppl being stupid isn't what going on here domi being OP is.
No really park a few geddons with smartbombs on top of the sentry cloud, geddon has a better tank AND drones, AND neuts, and smartbombs. If you have a couple smartbomb BSs in a domi herd, they are effectively neutered, they drop drones...pop, they don't drop drones, they have no DPS.
The best they can do is annoy you with target breakers.....which your drones ignore I may add.
Not to mention there is this nifty thing called a MJD, it says "**** you and the slow battleship approach." |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
399
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 14:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:Onictus wrote:Mina Sebiestar wrote:well they can always be stupid and allow you get close but ppl being stupid isn't what going on here domi being OP is. No really park a few geddons with smartbombs on top of the sentry cloud, geddon has a better tank AND drones, AND neuts, and smartbombs. If you have a couple smartbomb BSs in a domi herd, they are effectively neutered, they drop drones...pop, they don't drop drones, they have no DPS. The best they can do is annoy you with target breakers.....which your drones ignore I may add. Not to mention there is this nifty thing called a MJD, it says "**** you and the slow battleship approach." For reference we just won a war against guys that were using ALL drone doctrines, up to and including slowcats, you think domi's are bad? Go after 150 carriers dropping at least 9 a sentries a pop and spider tanking with capital reps. I have. That is all great and situational and i am not here to discuss that with you..point is domi is bargain for a buck it perform that well you can see it in every aspect of eve to the point that whole meta game is changing. Dominated tourny go to ship for pve numerous usage in pvp for literally no effort nor trade ins. edit I am not saying it doesn't have counter mechanic i am saying it is too easy and usable on everything.
The tounement is not Traquility. Like I said, I've spent the last three month busting up sentry fleets.
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Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
400
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 16:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Buhhdust Princess wrote:Actually I believe this anti-frig sentry option only applies to the ships with Drone Tracking bonuses. I tell you now my Vindi's Curators can't hit a frig.
My old pre-DDA domis had no issue popping frigs, it also had two Omnis on it. The elite frigs might get under them, but that is relatively rare. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
404
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 13:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
GTC Onzo wrote:The only thing broken is the assist command.
It's widely abused for carriers assigning drones to assist in anoms as well while carrier stays relatively safed up.
That is assisting fighters and its considerably different. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
404
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 18:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Phaade wrote:I'm tired of the tards who come into a forum and say "you want something (that is clearly overpowered) nerfed only because you lost!"
DERP
Sentry drone tracking should be in line with large turret tracking. Period. If it can put out close to the same damage as large's, why in the world should it be able to track 10x better. Makes no sense.
Bombs, smart bombs, the only way to reload being to scoop from space....in a battleship mind you, can't move,....need I go on. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
409
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Moon Mare Night wrote:Onictus wrote:GTC Onzo wrote:The only thing broken is the assist command.
It's widely abused for carriers assigning drones to assist in anoms as well while carrier stays relatively safed up. That is assisting fighters and its considerably different. Is it really? I don't see how in the world you could say that since the guy said it was the assist command that was broken, not sentries. Assist command applies to all drones/sentries/fighters. The command itself of assist is stupidly OP. You have to fly certain gimped doctrines that are one twick ponies but it's still an OP command.
Wrong. You can only assign 5 fighters to any pilot. You can assist an entire FLEET of sentries to a pilot.
Plus fighters pretty much suck, this is why we kicked up a riot when they suggested pulling all drones not fighters out of carriers (they did remove all drones from dreads). |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
414
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 21:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Moon Mare Night wrote:Onictus wrote:
Wrong. You can only assign 5 fighters to any pilot. You can assist an entire FLEET of sentries to a pilot.
Plus fighters pretty much suck, this is why we kicked up a riot when they suggested pulling all drones not fighters out of carriers (they did remove all drones from dreads).
Again, this comes down to the ASSIST command being broken. Not Sentries. Not Drones. edit: This whole original topic is stupid to be honest. The fix is easy. Cap out the amount of drones/sentries/fighters a pilot can be assisted by. Gone are the days of fleet pvp being run by 1 assist FC. Cap it out of 1 fleet (5) per pilot.
I told you twice now. Fighters are alrady capped at 5. You can't even put a hold load of (1) carrier's fighters on another pilot.
I even said the assist command needs to go as its currently implemented. Even then its more philosophical, I really don't have an issue with domi herds. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise
Fatal Ascension
414
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 23:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
Moon Mare Night wrote:Onictus wrote:Moon Mare Night wrote:
This whole original topic is stupid to be honest. The fix is easy. Cap out the amount of drones/sentries/fighters a pilot can be assisted by. Gone are the days of fleet pvp being run by 1 assist FC. Cap it out of 1 fleet (5) per pilot.
I told you twice now. Fighters are alrady capped at 5. You can't even put a hold load of (1) carrier's fighters on another pilot. I even said the assist command needs to go as its currently implemented. Even then its more philosophical, I really don't have an issue with domi herds. So out of that whole sentence right there, you decide to single out fighters (again) which I already knew about before you 'told me'? good god. The entire complaint here is that sentries are OP and broken (when they aren't and 1 particular set of sentries are 1 trick ponies) so the easy fix (which applies to all drone types hence the "drones/sentries/fighters") is to just do away with the assist line in its current function. Then you won't have HYDRA crying about OP tactics that aren't really OP at all, but a clear defined set of 1 trick ponies that HYDRA was unable to counter because of picks and bans.
Poor hydra, because a number of domi teams...like Darkside...lost with domi set up, and in REAL eve, the part we play every day sentries are fine.
There are a LOT of counters to sentries, and fighters in no way need to get nerfed. I've seen assigned fighters that I didn't assign to myself ratting all of once in a PvP situation, some TESTicle attached them to a maller and got himself nuked.
....because 5 fighters can't catch a pack of MWD bombers, if we were in BSs we would have just giggled and killed 100mil in fighters for the lols. Its far from overpowered.
The AT is NOT tranquility, different rules apply. |
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