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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
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Posted - 2011.11.01 15:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
It is common sense (in my opinion) that the short range guy should be the fastest guy, otherwise he will never have a chance to drop any damage. I don't know why this very simple principle is so hard to understand... Take an example from other MMOs, the guy with the sword needs a better tank and a method to get in range, or he will loose every battle vs a long distance fighter.
Now, there are many ways to achieve this with many advantages or disadvanteges: Faster ships, more range for webs, immune to webs, special bonuses for MWD modules etc. But in the end it comes down to the same old problem: if you are slower as a short range fighters there is no way you can win the battle.
And please, don't only look after EFT and numbers. They do not say anything... Fit a Proteus and a Tengu in EFT and compare the numbers, the Proteus doesn't look too bad. Now start a Level 4 mission (I have just done this test with Blockade) and you will see that the Tengu only needs 1/3 of the time that the Proteus needs (my Proteus fit was even with faction and more expensive than the Tengu that was only T2 fitted...). I know this thread is about pvp balancing and my example is a pve example, but it shows the differences very well.
To be honest, in my opinion EVE is very bad balanced in many aspects of the game, not only hybrids. But hopefully CCP will now start to improve this, better too late then never ;) |
Hamox
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Posted - 2011.11.01 15:32:00 -
[2] - Quote
xaja wrote:Hello CCP.. If the changes stand like they are, I think you've just changed Gallente stuff from underpowered to overpowered in one fell swoop. My guess is that Gallente ships will double in price and there will be pure Gallente roaming gangs all around. This would be fine by me, as I'm all trained up for that, but I don't think a new potentially severe imbalance will make the game better.
I think the main problem about giving Blasters too much damage is that every camp will consist of blaster boats then. Funny stuff that the only "Democracy" in the EVE Universum is the largest producer for Pirate boats then |
Hamox
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1
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Posted - 2011.11.01 18:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sizeof Void wrote:[quote=ConXtionS] Jumping in *at any range* is difficult if the target is moving. But this isn't a problem just for blaster boats. If you can't jump within scram/disrupter range in your Minmatar kiting boat, your target may just jump out before you can get within scram range, esp. if he's cruising around on MWD.
But there is one difference: The Blasterboat needs to jump into the right range, otherwise he will loose his ship. If the Minmatar doesn't jump into the right range he only looses an oportunity to kill someone. The only bad thing that could happen to the Minmatar is if he accidently jumpes into the Blasterrange. Then he might get problems. But chances aren't that huge.
So whats the difference? Blastership needs to jump successfully or he will loose his ship, AC ship needs to jump successfully or he will loose the opportunity.
In general, with a Blastership you always have to dive deep into the fire and take all risks to be successfull. |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.01 18:45:00 -
[4] - Quote
Raimo wrote:and the FOTMs need to be changing... Yepp, in reallity every faction would spend huge amounts on developing technologies to get the advantage. Why not make the same real for EVE. Make it an never ending balancing process where the FOTM will change constantly and everybody gets exited what the Amarr answer will be on improved Hybrids and so on.
Fix it up, fix it down, just keep on moving. Everything is better than have for example the Tengu to be the standard ship for PVE and WH activity for ages now ;) |
Hamox
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1
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Posted - 2011.11.01 20:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
Digital Gaidin wrote:Tanya Powers wrote:[quote=Digital Gaidin]
So Amarr are only workable when you get T2 ammunition? Yep, matches my argument above And even then, there would be little point to carry some Imperial Navy Multifrequency with you anymore because you're going to be raped by Hybrid AND Projectiles unless you can somehow maintain range against two races of ships that are faster than you and almost always far more cap-stable... And with only T1 ammo, there would be little point to even sit in an Amarr ship. The nuclear option IS the best option, because the balance of power that exists today between other weapon systems does not need to change to accomodate a new and improved blaster weapon system.
Well, Amarr ships could still be buffed to have very good damage over all ranges and a great tank. The point is, we all know that if they adapt hybrids and Gallente ships, they will have to adapt the other races and ships as a second step. I just hope that CCP will not need 3 years for this second step and in the meantime 3/4 of the players are unsatisfied.
I'm afraid that CCP could go the other way, they will adapt hybrids a little bit, give it more tracking and a bit more damage and leave it so for a few years making 1/4 of the players unsatisfied. |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.01 22:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
OOooole wrote:special function on guns minmatar --without cap-- amar --insta reaload--
galente have what ?
They look nice when they shoot :)
Edit: Don't forgett Caldari Missles also without cap... |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.01 23:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
draconothese wrote:as it is now i fly a proteus with tech 2 neutron blasters fitted with antimatter i can only hit at 5km away and thats with all 4 in gun skills by the time i can get in range im smoking and on fire.
let alone after i can get in range if they get moving just enough i cant hit for nothing
so from what i have been expereincing a damage buff anlong with a big tracking increase would even out blasters a lot.
armor tanks are also part of the issue and some of that comes from the problem of blasters as well from the fact we cant finish off anyone.
after we finaly get in range we have taken to much damage and cant dish enough out to make up for the loss in our tank
sorry for my bad grammer i have issues with english XD
Haha you should compare the Proteus with a Tengu on level 4 or 5 missions, you will start to cry :) The Tengu hits everything up to 90 km and you can easily fit 3 balistic controls on it to improve the damage. I have just done such a test, I fly Proteus and Tengu, and the Tengu needed 1/3 of the time that I needed to finish a mission with a Proteus. Even if you improve the damage on PVE by 500% the Tengu will be faster becouse you loose so much time to fly to your target, especially if you are in dead space and you can not use MWD. The whole idea about hybrids is just unplayable on PVE, you have the choise between no range or no tracking ;)
But lets get back to topic, it is all about pvp balancing, right? |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.02 00:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
Lord Timelord wrote:- Gallente Blaster Boat Racial Bonus... MWD SHUTDOWN IMMUNITY to Warp Scramblers!
This is too much, if you loose the battle you just activate MWD, fly out of scrambler range and warp of... But what about to make the MWD only 70%-80% immune so you still can fly a bit faster but not too fast? Or what about a new module that allowes you to "jump" for 10 Km every 120 seconds? Something like this could work and you could balance the effect through range, cooldown timer and cap usage so people don't jump all the time. |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.02 00:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
lol, ganked, double post, and so on... |
Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.02 21:21:00 -
[10] - Quote
Pattern Clarc wrote:thoth rothschild wrote:The best deimos fix is already on tranquility. it is called adrestia. perfect blaster boat, perfect hybrid fix
now compare adrestia with deimos and it will be clear why it is perfect. Either that or the proteus. 900dps with 180k EHP, or 400dps with 400k ehp. Basically those two ships are the only blaster ships ive flown that work.
Too bad a Proteus costs about 1B and a Hurricane about 25M (but thats just a side note) :P |
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Hamox
Global Economy Experts Stellar Economy Experts
1
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Posted - 2011.11.02 23:01:00 -
[11] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:Hamox wrote:Too bad a Proteus costs about 1B and a Hurricane about 25M (but thats just a side note) :P Proteus fitted is around 1B +/- yes but Canes base T2 fitted at 25M ??? Let me know where I'll buy a few dozens
OK I'm sorry, I overdrawed it a little. Naked Proteus is only about 600M-700M and Cane with T2 fitting is more than 25M (naked cane is around 25M).
Was a stupid answer from my side anyways becouse the question was how to improve die-most, so we should compare die-most with proteus (nevertheless I think the Proteus also needs some rethinking at some aspects) ;) |
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