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How many scramblers does it take to scramble these days ?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
J909	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:26:00 - [1] Too fekin many, this is getting rediculous now... I mean come on CCP atleast make it so if you fit more than 1 WCS you struggle to fit anything else or something like that... Thank **** for interdictors =p heres to 20 days training to use them now as Drew said a while back :- Quote Getting caught with warp core stabilizers on your kill mail is like having dirty kinckers when you end up in hospitol
Zeke Novak	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:31:00 - [2] Not enough of 'em
The Ratfink	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:36:00 - [3] it takes a interdictor with warp probes now
Filan	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:39:00 - [4] the more scrams used the more stabs used. its common nature for haulers to avoid combat. battleships though should take a hit because they can fight back.
So'Kar	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:45:00 - [5] wcs are fine in travel setups, but if you engage and start shooting someone then wcs should go offline or something.
Quanteeri	Posted - 2006.01.25 21:56:00 - [6] Edited by: Quanteeri on 25/01/2006 21:57:00 Just go get a Scorp with a MWD, 5 scram and 2 webs. Problem SolvEd. * Quanteeri runs away waving his arms wildly in the air screaming "Risk vs. Reward"
Kyle Chimko	Posted - 2006.01.25 22:05:00 - [7] dont you dare touch warp core stabs ccp. they are working perfectly fine. i use as many as i want to stay safe. if ya want to kill somebody who is using lots of wcs then add more warp core disrupters damit. --
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.25 22:16:00 - [8] IMO, stabs should have something like a huge lock time bork, or something else that means they can't be used on a combat setup without severe gimpage no problem with them being used on travel setups, but PvP sets with them on are a bit of a joke IMO and besides, giving them a lock time bork would lead to exotic setups like a stabombathron
Azuriel Talloth	Posted - 2006.01.25 22:23:00 - [9] Don't rely on Interdictors, if the enemy hit the Warp button before the sphere was deployed they will get out no matter how long it takes them to align. -RMR after a month-

Kaemonn	Posted - 2006.01.25 22:53:00 - [10] Q: "How many scrams does it take?" A: 42 forum rules \| [email protected] ~Owner of Imaran~

Deja Thoris	Posted - 2006.01.25 22:59:00 - [11] Total low slots +1
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.25 23:03:00 - [12] Originally by: Kaemonn Q: "How many scrams does it take?" A: 42 you win the forums for today
Lochmar Fiendhiem	Posted - 2006.01.25 23:19:00 - [13] If your going to nerf stabs, why not remove sheilds as well? hell lets all just fly around in pods, remove all ships. for every measure there is a counter-measure. Can't beat the counter-measure? then upgrade your other measures. or just operate in larger groups. OR stop picking on the weak, the ones who are afraid to watch their first 3 weeks of Eve go down the crapper because some douche wants to gate camp (which imho should be considered an exploit).
Rexthor Hammerfists	Posted - 2006.01.25 23:28:00 - [14] let me put it this way: fighting without stabs, especially outnumbered, especially solo in enemie areas requieres playerskill. that means u gotta know, or do a good guess when u can jump or u better shouldnt, when u gotta run, do this and that. sadly many ppl just jump over the learning time to get this playerskill, and fit stabs - with those they dont depend on playerskills anymore and have a Iwin module with that eve has become very very easy. let me tell u that i, and caldari ships can use alot stabs, would b close to uncatchable with the I win buttons. Warp core stabs -> Game is easy. Waro core stabs + playerskills -> GODMODE - Purple Conquered The World, We the Universe.
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2006.01.25 23:41:00 - [15] Originally by: Lochmar Fiendhiem If your going to nerf stabs, why not remove sheilds as well? hell lets all just fly around in pods, remove all ships. for every measure there is a counter-measure. Can't beat the counter-measure? then upgrade your other measures. or just operate in larger groups. OR stop picking on the weak, the ones who are afraid to watch their first 3 weeks of Eve go down the crapper because some douche wants to gate camp (which imho should be considered an exploit). People like you can NEVER be pleased. Attackers adapt and insta gank you then you whine that people only blob. Your idea that gatecamping should be an exploit is laughable. You get a message filling the screen warning you of the dangers before entering lowsec. If you fail to read and comprehend messages like this then you have bigger worries than losing electronic pixels.
Saeris Tal'Urduar	Posted - 2006.01.25 23:47:00 - [16] What happens when you catch that uber-stabbed ship? They die fast very fast for lack of defense..or once you catch them and its a slugging match they are out damaged and die. A person who fit stabs on a combat ship is nerfing his fitting, either in dmg or in defense. As a matter of fact its (if it was a combat ship you were attacking) the reason why that person had to warp away from combat with you, he nerfed his fitting. Now if you killed him or not is another matter, but you did win the fight if you forced him to warp away. Maybe a lock time penalty if a person fits more than two...then again maybe not. I'm of the opinion that stabs nerf a ship for every one fitted and are fine the way they are.
ToxicFire	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:07:00 - [17] Edited by: ToxicFire on 26/01/2006 00:09:26 Originally by: J909 Too fekin many, this is getting rediculous now... I mean come on CCP atleast make it so if you fit more than 1 WCS you struggle to fit anything else or something like that... Thank **** for interdictors =p heres to 20 days training to use them now as Drew said a while back :- Quote Getting caught with warp core stabilizers on your kill mail is like having dirty kinckers when you end up in hospitol simply, your a whiney pirate that can't think of tactics other than camp gates. wc's are there for a reason they work well they are balance, you want wc's to have rediculous req's then your going to have to have your weapons have a similar hike in requirements otherwise the balanced goes out of whack. Go get a second tackler that will jam the pants off anything, you can only fit 8 warp core stablisers max on any ship, with a well thought tackler you can stop anything with 4 disruptors.... heck if your using T2 disruptors you can stop anything with 3 modules and still have a little scramble left over for those eggs. If you can't pvp go mine.
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:11:00 - [18] Originally by: ToxicFire if your using T2 disruptors you can stop anything with 3 modules and still have a little scramble left over for those eggs. If you can't pvp go mine. thank you for proving so comprehensively that you know what you are talking about. /me calls a taxi for ToxicFire
Ezra Vouland	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:21:00 - [19] The solution is... kill faster They call me trash... TrashGUY
Nybbas	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:33:00 - [20] make wcs cause all offensive modules rate of fires, or cycle times to be doubled per wcs oyu have fitted. My only problem with them is when people use them for pvp. But when one of these modules makes your guns rof double, or your nosf take twice as long before its next activation (or makes the cycle time on your ecm to 40 seconds) you are going to think twice to fit these for anything other than traveling.
Nybbas	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:35:00 - [21] Originally by: HippoKing IMO, stabs should have something like a huge lock time bork, or something else that means they can't be used on a combat setup without severe gimpage no problem with them being used on travel setups, but PvP sets with them on are a bit of a joke IMO and besides, giving them a lock time bork would lead to exotic setups like a stabombathron this sounds god too, nerf the locking time, and locking range of the ships by a ton. per stab.
MellaRinn	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:41:00 - [22] Originally by: Saeris Tal'Urduar What happens when you catch that uber-stabbed ship? They die fast very fast for lack of defense..or once you catch them and its a slugging match they are out damaged and die. A person who fit stabs on a combat ship is nerfing his fitting, either in dmg or in defense. As a matter of fact its (if it was a combat ship you were attacking) the reason why that person had to warp away from combat with you, he nerfed his fitting. Now if you killed him or not is another matter, but you did win the fight if you forced him to warp away. Maybe a lock time penalty if a person fits more than two...then again maybe not. I'm of the opinion that stabs nerf a ship for every one fitted and are fine the way they are. That's the way to look at it! --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Isma Barre	Posted - 2006.01.26 00:44:00 - [23] Will people just realise it's part of the game. You don't like it?, tough, learn to deal with it. You know what's worse than WCS, the people who constantly moan about them. (i'm sorry for being blunt, but god dam, give it a rest).
St Dragon	Posted - 2006.01.26 01:51:00 - [24] Edited by: St Dragon on 26/01/2006 01:52:34 Originally by: Isma Barre Edited by: Isma Barre on 26/01/2006 00:48:00 Can people just realise it's part of the game. If you don't like it, i'm sorry but tough banana's, simply learn to deal with it, play smarter, group up do something other than whine about it. You know what's worse than WCS, the people who constantly moan about them and request they be changed, bit tip - Change your tactics, that may help. (i'm sorry for being blunt, but god dam, give it a rest please). I agree with this comment. If i came up against a ship that used lots of WCS id do my best to kill it id adapt if nessasary if he/she got away fare enough it was fare my oponent sacrificed lowslots for safety i didnt so im happy they ran as thats a victory anyway. ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Manet	Posted - 2006.01.26 05:31:00 - [25] Had a Vagabond team hassling us once upon a time...was constantly stabbed up (5 WCS)...typical hit'n'run stuff. They got a few kills, got scared off by larger numbers, couldn't really do much first few times, was frustrating. Until someone undocked a -6 Dominix when they returned later, and blew the living @#$&@^% out of it. I also had my -6 Armor-Tanking Scorp ready, but it never got to play because the Domi beat me to it. It's called adaptation. Stop asking CCP to fight your battles for you. WCS make for excellent hit'n'run style rigs, and allow some interesting, unique and effective tactics. Let's say you've got a Dual HAC gang with 2 Inty support as tacklers. Grab a friend and fit [Anti-Frig Tech I Cruiser of choice] with 2xWCS and a good tank. Warp into the gang, they'll likely engage thinking they have upper hand. Laugh as you barbeque their tacklers and warp back out.
Acheron Cyc	Posted - 2006.01.26 05:40:00 - [26] So, we had carebears whinning about gate camping, now we have pirates whinning about escaping "preys", well, I guess its a cicle. So if we go by phisics, each whine cancels each other(you know, action and opposite reacting). The game is fine as it is. Ohh, almost forgot, do you want some cheese, too? ------------------------------------------ "It is better to be feared than loved, if you cannot be both." Niccolo Machiavelli
Malthros Zenobia	Posted - 2006.01.26 06:30:00 - [27] Stabs simply need to hurt cap recharge/require activation, and/or **up some other stat(s). Make them each give a 5-7.5% penalty to cap recharge, and an agiity penalty. Think about it, if you have someone helping stabilze your warp engines, it's going to need continuous ebergy, just like a MWD does only not as severe. Having 4-5 stabs on your ship should cause some serious gimpage in one or more other areas. It used to affect damage mods, now lows 5-8 dont hold mods. Originally by:** Istvaan Shogaatsu I'm probably one of the biggest Bush fanboys in Eve... This is like, Darth Vader, can't-reach-climax-without-killing-a-puppy evil.
Forsaken Tome	Posted - 2006.01.26 06:33:00 - [28] it don't matter how many i use i still can't scramble any egg's, i guess i just have to have boiled egg's instead
ToxicFire	Posted - 2006.01.27 18:41:00 - [29] Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Stabs simply need to hurt cap recharge/require activation, and/or ****up some other stat(s). Make them each give a 5-7.5% penalty to cap recharge, and an agiity penalty. Think about it, if you have someone helping stabilze your warp engines, it's going to need continuous ebergy, just like a MWD does only not as severe. Having 4-5 stabs on your ship should cause some serious gimpage in one or more other areas. It used to affect damage mods, now lows 5-8 dont hold mods. Frankly that theory is whack think of it like stablisers on a bike do they constantly need energy to keep the bike upright nop, it draws from the powergrid it draws from the cpu already 4-5 wcs stabs does cause major gimpage ie no free low slots how many ships have more than 5 low slots free.... not that many, and having that many ruins an armour tank so they can't engage and survive without warping out. To even consider balancing this out you'd have to increase the cap usage on weapons.
Sebastien LeReparteur	Posted - 2006.01.27 18:44:00 - [30] Originally by: Kaemonn Q: "How many scrams does it take?" A: 42 And Thanks for all the fish!
Gort	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:07:00 - [31] IMO, stabs vs scramblers is not broken, or unbalanced to the point of being broken. Let's have the broken things fixed (there are plenty) instead of wanting to change what isn't broken. Play the game as it is, is my point of view, while filing bug reports on what is really broken. Just because some ships got away doesn't mean the game is unplayable. In fact, they should get away unless you have fit to stop them. We waste developer time on these chronic "issues." Regards, Gort Makeup artist for the dead
jbob2000	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:27:00 - [32] Originally by: ToxicFire Edited by: ToxicFire on 26/01/2006 00:09:26 Originally by: J909 Too fekin many, this is getting rediculous now... I mean come on CCP atleast make it so if you fit more than 1 WCS you struggle to fit anything else or something like that... Thank **** for interdictors =p heres to 20 days training to use them now as Drew said a while back :- Quote Getting caught with warp core stabilizers on your kill mail is like having dirty kinckers when you end up in hospitol simply, your a whiney pirate that can't think of tactics other than camp gates. wc's are there for a reason they work well they are balance, you want wc's to have rediculous req's then your going to have to have your weapons have a similar hike in requirements otherwise the balanced goes out of whack. Go get a second tackler that will jam the pants off anything, you can only fit 8 warp core stablisers max on any ship, with a well thought tackler you can stop anything with 4 disruptors.... heck if your using T2 disruptors you can stop anything with 3 modules and still have a little scramble left over for those eggs. If you can't pvp go mine. You're a joke. KIA corp isnt a pirate corp you silly noob. Even with a second tackler, you still wont hold down a fully stabbed bs. Its not only that. Even if we have a gang of 7 intys, in the time it might take for us to get the bs, he could get away because one of our inties didn't have enough point to counteract 7 stabs. 2 disruptors? Don't exsist. Don't even say anything about a scorpion or multiple midslot ship with tons of jammers. ITS NOT EFFECTIVE WITH FAST MOVING SHIPS! Do you even play the game, noob?
Macro Slasher	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:33:00 - [33] Although I don't like running cowards.. If someone wants to fit himself for running and be useless in everything else, he has paid the price for it already.
Rawthorm	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:39:00 - [34] Edited by: Rawthorm on 27/01/2006 19:39:22 Some people need to stop whining cos their prey gets away and think for a minute. Why exactly is it bad for someone to fit stabs if they want to operate with hit and run tactics? They already sacrifice the use of some tank, damage or other utility to fit it so whats the problem? Hit an run is a way for the small to defeat the large and such a tactic should be encouraged the the point we have a dedicated raiding cruiser, not some silly penilty on stabs simply cos your too incompitant to score a kill or dont have enough friends to have a tackler with you.
Gort	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:41:00 - [35] Let's see.... We don't like to use bubbles because we want to be able to run away on a moment's notice without leaving anything behind (in case someone as strong as us shows up). And Interdictors? Well, who wants to be bothered? We just want to be able to tackle anyone with a T-1 frigate and hold him until the gank squad arrives. What's the problem? What we're asking for is just to make it easier for us to get kills, because we haven't been very good at that lately. Guys. Go find a war. Slap leather with someone who wants to fight and can shoot back. Get over the pulling wings off of flys syndrome. My 2 ISK. Regards, Gort Makeup artist for the dead
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.01.27 19:47:00 - [36] They don't need to apply any penalty to stabs, the penalty is that they are taking up slots that could be used to boost your offense or defense. Thus a ship with stabs is an inferior fighting ship compared to one without stabs. You kids need to get out of your head that needed somones ship or pod to explode = win.... Someone running for thier live = win also. If your a pirate? tough beans pirate life is a tough life... Ie sorry if you want ccp to turn players into npc's you can easily kill it isnt gonna happen, stop whining save us all the grief and just go hunt npc's if that is what you really want.
Tizi	Posted - 2006.01.27 20:09:00 - [37] Easy solution. Get rid of warp core disruptors and whola, everybody will stop fitting warp core stabalizers. If you want a fight you can enjoy then lose the disruptors. Nobody who wants to run away is going to be an enjoyable challenge anyway.
Ayla Vanir	Posted - 2006.01.29 05:37:00 - [38] I saw a 3 point scrambler on Escrow. I don't think I've seen a 3 point WCS. Come to think of it, I'm not positive there are 2 point stabs out there. Anyway, no. WCS doesn't need or even want a nerf. The offensive measure should always cost more in some way/shape/form than the defensive counter-measure. Think it through and you'll understand why that's a 'rule', at least in terms of game design. Escrow Market Revamp
Wee Dave	Posted - 2006.01.29 06:25:00 - [39] Only 1 +2 warp core stab has ever been given out. You can get an inty that can scramble anything but its very expensive. Three +3 scramblers makes the wallet cry.
Xendie	Posted - 2006.01.29 06:26:00 - [40] Originally by: Deja Thoris Total low slots +1 thats not true. ive seen a atuk or was it a shinra raven warp with -9 on him. -------- Originally by: F'nog This would be great, because lag is not at all a problem currently.
Wee Dave	Posted - 2006.01.29 06:33:00 - [41] Now that should be impossible, unless they were using the sole +2 warp core stab. Probably they jammed/Damped a target, or one of the scramblers happened to fail at an inopportune moment.
Nooey	Posted - 2006.01.29 08:19:00 - [42] Originally by: jbob2000 Don't even say anything about a scorpion or multiple midslot ship with tons of jammers. ITS NOT EFFECTIVE WITH FAST MOVING SHIPS! 2x Stiletto fitted with 3x Scramblers and Mwd = -12 Scramble ____________
Lunas Feelgood	Posted - 2006.01.29 10:32:00 - [43] Personally I think warp core stabs is a problem.. Latly i have seen alot more players using stabs in pvp.. 4-5 Stabs on a raven is not uncommen these days.. It kind of spoils the fun factor in pvp when you tacklers dont got enough midslot to scrample the target. However nerfing stabs is also a prop simply becuase then i dont think alot of players will fight unless they are 100% sure they will win.. That means only engage when you got superior numbers.. And that will also spoil the fun factor in pvp...However that trend is alrdy very commen atm. So its difficult warp core stabs is game mode and you can counter it by using disruptors/scramplers.. My suggestion give each ceptor class another medium slot and a sligtly cpu increase. So they can actually do what they are designt todo..
Vole Tanzar	Posted - 2006.01.29 10:48:00 - [44] What`s the deal with Tech 2 Warp Scramblers/Disruptors anyway? They would help alot.
High Sierra	Posted - 2006.01.29 11:13:00 - [45] answer: 1 warp bubble. the solution to multiple WCS exists. now go away.
Ante	Posted - 2006.01.29 11:13:00 - [46] If I pay 40 cpu, 1 grid, 5 cap/s, one mid slot and am limited to 20km range in order to force somebody to fight me, why should somebody be able to pay immensely less to 100% negate my ship? I agree that WCS should not be nerfed very much, but imo something would be nice.
Tommy TenKreds	Posted - 2006.01.29 11:25:00 - [47] Bleat bleat bleat balance. 0 - 1 CCP fix the chat text alignment bug please.
Rawthorm	Posted - 2006.01.29 11:34:00 - [48] Originally by: Lunas Feelgood Personally I think warp core stabs is a problem.. Latly i have seen alot more players using stabs in pvp.. 4-5 Stabs on a raven is not uncommen these days.. It kind of spoils the fun factor in pvp when you tacklers dont got enough midslot to scrample the target. However nerfing stabs is also a prop simply becuase then i dont think alot of players will fight unless they are 100% sure they will win.. That means only engage when you got superior numbers.. And that will also spoil the fun factor in pvp...However that trend is alrdy very commen atm. So its difficult warp core stabs is game mode and you can counter it by using disruptors/scramplers.. My suggestion give each ceptor class another medium slot and a sligtly cpu increase. So they can actually do what they are designt todo.. Aside from the people who are transporting from A to B and dont want to get caught, I think most people are using increasing numbers of stabs so they can engage a superior foe and stand a chance of being able to retreat once having done some damage. Shouldnt this kind of engagement be encouraged? Sure its anoying that you are the superior force dont get your kill every time, but then pvp isnt ment to be a guarenteed kill. I dont agree with ceptors havng another slot due to the fact it can be used for anything. I did have an idea of changing the bonus to increase scramble scrength on ceptors but then your dooming the haulers to 100% chance of death. Perhaps its time for a new class of raiding cruiser? The next level up from the ceptor built for hit and run and tackling. A weak but fast ship with scrambling bonus's and 2 stabs built in like the elite indys have?
Too Kind	Posted - 2006.01.29 11:55:00 - [49] Edited by: Too Kind on 29/01/2006 12:01:32 Originally by: Nooey Originally by: jbob2000 Don't even say anything about a scorpion or multiple midslot ship with tons of jammers. ITS NOT EFFECTIVE WITH FAST MOVING SHIPS! 2x Stiletto fitted with 3x Scramblers and Mwd = -12 Scramble Do these scramblers exist ? The +3 scrambler I once had needed so much grid that it only fits on a BS. Anyway, I've never met a full stabbed bs in a real fight anyway, only as a travel setup and for traveling I use it myself without bad feelings. With my new tempest with t2 guns+ammo I still wonder, if I should fit a single stab, since the stats are imho a lot nicer, if I use the low slots for something different. On the other hand I don't want to lose the ship again due to a single remaining tackler after I've killed already two. I had that once, after I decided to use no stabs at all on my long-range tempest and felt like an idiot, when I was sitting in my pod. edit: alt-post, since people don't have to now the number of wcs I fit.
Adonfff	Posted - 2006.01.29 12:06:00 - [50] lol you guys are fun... You would like be able to scramble ppl without losing med slots :) If there are some +3 scramblers, i want a +3 warp core stab :) "I mean come on CCP atleast make it so if you fit more than 1 WCS you struggle to fit anything else or something like that..." lol so : make it so if you fit more than 1 Srambler you struggle to fit anything else or something like that. Thats what we call game balance ^^
Hellspawn666	Posted - 2006.01.29 14:00:00 - [51] wcs are fine people who say they have no penalty havent seen the damage difference in geddon if u take 2 damage mods off. Just fit scram/disruptor there part of pvp live with it.
Grimpak	Posted - 2006.01.29 14:06:00 - [52] Originally by: Azuriel Talloth Don't rely on Interdictors, if the enemy hit the Warp button before the sphere was deployed they will get out no matter how long it takes them to align. ....and apparently they are bugged atm. ---------------- Originally by: Abdalion Shoot him ingame if you don't like this person. If you do like him, go mine veldspar with him.
MaiLina KaTar	Posted - 2006.01.29 15:09:00 - [53] Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Kaemonn Q: "How many scrams does it take?" A: 42 you win the forums for today Indeed. Mai's Idealog
Tryvus	Posted - 2006.01.29 15:23:00 - [54] So let me get this straight... Wannabe pirates are whiney because they can't gank everything coming through the gate. Genuine PVPers are whiney because creative pilots are using the methods put forth by the game to survive and/or kill them. Yeah I didn't think there was anything meaningful going on here, carry on!
Bazman	Posted - 2006.01.29 15:48:00 - [55] Edited by: Bazman on 29/01/2006 15:48:21 I just tackled a 3 stab sniper and got all his tech 2 loot and ammo. Was very satisfying. The proceding 30 minutes were a complete and utter pain in the ass however and i wouldn't recomment wasting time on trying to catch a stabbed sniper unless you have like 10 people in very, very quick interceptors. Yay for sig. Oh noes, i just described a gank scenario! ----- Hi TomB! All out Do or Die Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks.
Zolofine	Posted - 2006.01.29 16:01:00 - [56] WCS is a type of fitting just like any other. When you are talking about low slots full of WCS you are not talking about a combat setup. Ie you are not talking about an opponent that would present a real challenge if he was forced to stay and fight. Lows full of WCS inevitably rule out any form of decent combat setup. And the ships that rely heavily on their medslots cannot fit that many WCS to start with because they do not have that many low slots. I've seen a lot of pilots who use 1 or 2 WCS in their setup. Usually this means they can warp out of a fleet battle that went sour, or they can get away from a solo engagement that they are losing (debatably, because of those modules in the first place). People who are stabbed up to the rim are in a travel setup and frankly pose no real threat to any combat setup ship, their guns don't really hurt and their tank sucks. The only reason why you would want to kill a stabbed up ship is either because you want to gank him or because you have knowledge of something he is carrying that you want badly. If this is the case, than you can counter with the appropriate tactic. 4 tacklers scramble anything, 1 interdictor scrambles anything, 1 bubble set up in the right place scrambles anything (and pulls them out of warp even). So if it's a matter of finally getting that one annoying bastard, or strategically blowing up an important shipment, the means are there. If it's just about ganking well.. boohoo. It's very hard to get people to fight who do not really have a fighting chance. Unless they are totally stupid or just messing around they will run and hide and change their setups in any way possible to make it easier to run and hide. Ganks are all about baiting and springing traps. Predictability destroys a gank. So be unpredictable, use the right tools for the job and set your trap. Doesn't work 100% of the time, sometimes you mess it up, sometimes the bait ends up in the cloning station and your query runs before you get them. It's all fair game.

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