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Jav Ozran
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.11.01 17:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
I've recently been trying out PvP, and i am absolutely rubbish at it. I have 1 kill and 6 deaths- a joke on the billboards, making me think about starting a whole new character to get rid of the embarrassment. I've read all the tips, guides and help forums the internet has to offer but i'm either gate camped with no time to run, scanned down in my safe spot, and when after many hours of roaming i find someone i might actually be able to kill, they pop me in less than a minute.
I suck and want to start again for new kill board stats, what do you reccomend? |
Jav Ozran
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.11.01 17:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
I also feel like i'm letting my corp down..... which sucks. This is an alt character to the one who i'm on about btw. |
mxzf
Shovel Bros
87
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Posted - 2011.11.01 18:15:00 -
[3] - Quote
Don't give up. 1:6 isn't actually that bad, finding good fights that you can win in PvP is not easy at all. Just keep with it and give it your best shot, no one can ask anything more of you.
What kind of PvP are you trying to do? How well skilled are you (RL skills and SP)? And are you making sure to fly ships you can lose without it really effecting your cash flow too badly?
The biggest rule of PvP is that you can't be afraid to blow up. Every one dies from time to time, but that's still a learning experience, the only way to lose at PvP in Eve is if it upsets you or makes you give up. |
Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
20
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Posted - 2011.11.01 18:27:00 -
[4] - Quote
Just suck it up and keep on going with the character you have and the loses you have. Endure the teasing you get from corp mates as you will likely hear the same teasing from time to time when you get killed no matter what your PvP record is. The thing is that before you get a feel for things in PvP you will suck at it, make horrible mistakes and you will die a lot. You will propably continue dying a lot even after you learn to do it, since PvP is often a team effort and outside easy ganks some ships are always lost on both sides. You can read all you want about PvP and it does help, but it's like learning to swim by reading a guide about swimming. It will help and give you pointers, but the only way to really get it is to jump in the water and try to swim.
The only thing I would recommend is, that during this learning stage don't use expensive ships and fits and try not to repeat the same mistakes over and over. Expensive fits are great once you know the performance you buy is just the thing you need to do get that extra edge that you need. If you don't have that experience though, you will just waste the potential and make the losses more painful than they need to be. When you do die, try to understand why it happened and think about ways to improve the situation and your performance. Often you can spot at least some areas of improvement, but at times someone had to be the guy to take a hit for the team or the opposition is so far beyond your corps abilities and no amount of piloting or expensive fits would have made a meaningful difference.
Anyway good luck with it and stay the course. |
Karl Planck
Labyrinth Obtaining Chaotic Kangaroos
33
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Posted - 2011.11.01 19:00:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I also feel like i'm letting my corp down..... which sucks. This is an alt character to the one who i'm on about btw.
If you feel this way your corp is letting you down. There are tons of specifics you need to get into when it comes to getting questions answered. A lot of time for explanations from your mates and even more time ironing out the execution (more difficult than it sounds).
If this is getting to you sincerely ask for help from your corp, if they can't help it is probably time to find someone who will. |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
62
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Posted - 2011.11.01 19:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Join a corp that is about shooting people and has good killboard stats. Also make sure the corp you join is focused on PVP in the type of space you intend to live in highsec, lowsec, nullsec whatever.
When you've found a corp to be in that is actually active and helpful make sure you do everything you can on your end to make sure you get everything you can out of it, use voice comms, attend fleet operations, get people to approve your fits before you fly them, train appropriately and make sure to ask questions.
Sit in the recruitment channel until you find an appropriate corp, and if you don't see one ask if there are any PVP corps accepting very new players, someone will pick you up eventually. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
943
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Posted - 2011.11.01 20:03:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I've recently been trying out PvP, and i am absolutely rubbish at it. I have 1 kill and 6 deaths- a joke on the billboards, making me think about starting a whole new character to get rid of the embarrassment. I've read all the tips, guides and help forums the internet has to offer but i'm either gate camped with no time to run, scanned down in my safe spot, and when after many hours of roaming i find someone i might actually be able to kill, they pop me in less than a minute.
I suck and want to start again for new kill board stats, what do you reccomend?
Don't worry too much mate. I'm pretty awful at PvP too, but I've managed to make my way in the game reasonably well. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
186
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Posted - 2011.11.01 20:37:00 -
[8] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I also feel like i'm letting my corp down..... which sucks. This is an alt character to the one who i'm on about btw. Yes killboards are a disease! |
Schmata Bastanold
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
11
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Posted - 2011.11.01 21:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
Forget about killboards and have fun.
I really do not understand people focused on killboards. why does it matter?
it is your game, why do you want to fulfill other people's goals? just try to make Eve like you want it to be not other way around.
and if your corp starts to ***** about your killmails ****'em and join new one or be yourself in npc corp.
during last two weeks I lost 8 or sth like that fight and I really do not give a **** about it, I had fun and I met nice people. statistics are good for corp rats and I do not intend to feed them in Eve, it is enough I have to live with then in real life. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
66
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Posted - 2011.11.01 23:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
Killboards are legitimately important for some types of corporation.
For Mercenary corporations people will often judge whether or not you are worth hiring based on your killboard. For general purpose highsec corproations where most people spend their time missioning or mining your killboard will be what determines whether or not you are an attractive target for wardecs.
Feel free to completely ignore your killboard, but if you die all the time depending on what your corproation does there might be negative consequences for having a bad combat history. |
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Beki 250
Veerhouven Logistics The Veerhouven Group
0
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Posted - 2011.11.02 02:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
I think my record is 4 assists and 42 lost ships/pods.
It's depressing, but I think I can recover.
Consider Tavion Aksmis. Last time I looked she had more than 100 losses, but also more than 6000 kills. She told me in local once that "It's just a job." |
Xi 'xar
Mise en Abyme
2
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Posted - 2011.11.02 08:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
If you are so worried about killboard stats that you are considering biomassing, then you shouldn't be pvping. You will die a lot. Get over it. If your corp complains, I would recommend shooting members of your corp and then laughing at their killboard stats.
Killboards are great for information gathering purposes but are useless for everything else.
http://reduplication.wordpress.com/category/explore-low-sec/
http://reduplication.wordpress.com/category/live-low-sec/
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Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
197
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Posted - 2011.11.02 08:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
Xi 'xar wrote:If you are so worried about killboard stats that you are considering biomassing, then you shouldn't be pvping. You will die a lot. Get over it. If your corp complains, I would recommend shooting members of your corp and then laughing at their killboard stats.
Killboards are great for information gathering purposes but are useless for everything else.
If everyone would think like that I wouldn't be against it.
The sad truth though is that a lot of people, corps, alliances judge potential new members on their kill/loss ratio and even kick you when you lose too many ships if you want to do some roams.
As it is now, EVE could do better without KBs. |
Chiana Moro
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
4
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Posted - 2011.11.02 09:28:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I have 1 kill and 6 deaths- a joke on the billboards, making me think about starting a whole new character to get rid of the embarrassment.
Everyone feels like that when starting out. First rule in PvP - even before "Don't fly what you can't afford to lose" is
Everyone dies.
Shoot a caracal on gate in low sec (*poof*), jump into a gate camp and panic (*poof*), get hot dropped in null (*poof*), **** up in 1v1 in low sec (*poof*), get primaried in fleet battles, forget you are in high sec ...
Every pvp-er dies. Usually a lot. Yes, experienced players have a long kill list, but also a long loss list. It's nothing to be ashamed of, (unless you completely failfit everything) it's the way of life as a pvper.
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Louis deGuerre
Malevolence. Void Alliance
60
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Posted - 2011.11.02 09:49:00 -
[15] - Quote
I died 40 times before I managed to get my first PVP kill
Yet today my killboard is quite respectable. So don't worry.
Best way to get better is to team up and fly in a gang. FIRE FRIENDSHIP TORPEDOES ! |
Aida Nu
Nu Industries
9
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Posted - 2011.11.02 10:20:00 -
[16] - Quote
When new to PVP you can expect to die alot. Thats how you learn. Each death teaches you something. If you learn from your mistakes and start applying your new knowledge you will see that you will start killing more often than you are dying.
If your corp is not helping you out and only laugh at you when you get killed ,find another corp.
Also when you start out as others have said go with frigs. If you are amarr for example buy 10 punishers, fit them cheaply and go loose them all. It will teach you alot more then reading guides all day long. The guides only teaches theory. You need to learn how to apply that in the game.
Learn what you can engage with your current ship and skills, learn to ninja away from camps and how to not get scanned down in your safespot (if you see combat scanner probes on overview when on a safespot gtfo) and you will do alright :) |
darmwand
Repo.
3
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Posted - 2011.11.02 14:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
Quote:If your corp is not helping you out and only laugh at you when you get killed ,find another corp.
^^ this, very much. The same thing goes IMHO if killboard stats are more important to your corp than enjoying the game. darmwand Repossession Agent http://www.repo-corp.net/ Recruitment is OPEN |
Stan Smith
Remenent British Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.11.02 19:22:00 -
[18] - Quote
the thing i tell newer players who wanna get into pvp is, "you're going to blow up... a lot... and more... and again... don't get discouraged" and if you start low with frigates, it won't be as expensive, and you can learn lots of valuable skills for pvp. even with a frigate, you can still be of great use to other players. your opponent cant run if he's tackled |
Cameron Zero
Red Federation
3
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Posted - 2011.11.02 20:15:00 -
[19] - Quote
Couple of suggestions (from someone who's *okay* at pvp at best):
As many people have already said, you will lose ships. You will lose many, Many, MANY ships. You will lose so many ships that you will believe you are horrible at pvp and may even think about giving up the game.
The key, however, is to determine whether you are losing ships the same way each time or not. Whether you could have done something to avoid it, and whether you can put that knowledge to work for you in the future. Message the pilots that blew you up, and see if they have any pointers. Sometimes, there's just nothing you could have done. Other times, you'll find out that, had you done something different, the loss would have been a kill, instead.
Next, killboards don't mean anything to most people. I can have the absolute best looking killboard in the world, and I might not know anything about pvp (buy/sell characters, hey?). My own killboard looks "good" because I only fly frigates, and generally in fleets of larger ships (cruisers, battlecruisers, battleships) so when I lose a 1.5M isk frigate, it's not a big deal. After all, I lost 1.5M isk, but the KMs I'm on show I "killed" a couple hundred million isk. There are plenty of ways to fake out kill boards.
Finally, if you're really into PVP, but your corporation isn't willing to help you learn the ropes, you might consider choosing another corporation until such time as you can be the member they need. There are plenty of PVP corps out there, and you can take your pick. I happen to like Red Vs Blue (it's pretty newb friendly, but it'll only teach you so much), but it's up to you.
Did I mention you'll lose a lot of ships? If I didn't, you will. A lot. More than you expect, in fact. It's a fact of life in this game. Best you can do is shrug it off and move on. "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. GǪ" |
Taurean Eltanin
The Tuskers
10
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Posted - 2011.11.04 14:29:00 -
[20] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I've recently been trying out PvP, and i am absolutely rubbish at it. I have 1 kill and 6 deaths- a joke on the billboards, making me think about starting a whole new character to get rid of the embarrassment. I've read all the tips, guides and help forums the internet has to offer but i'm either gate camped with no time to run, scanned down in my safe spot, and when after many hours of roaming i find someone i might actually be able to kill, they pop me in less than a minute.
I suck and want to start again for new kill board stats, what do you reccomend?
After each fight, write down what happened, and what you could have done to get a different result.
For example, if you were scanned down in your safe spot, you could have been watching your D-scan for combat probes. That would have let you know they were probing you down and you could have got out.
Personally, I took all of these after action reports and put them into my blog so that other people could give me pointers, and that helped a lot. However, even just the act of thinking about what happened and putting it on paper will help you to internalise the skills and habits you need to develop to become decent at pvp. http://flight-of-dragons.blogspot.com/ |
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Othran
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
61
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Posted - 2011.11.04 14:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Personally I view people with very few losses as "risk-averse". There's obviously a point where it becomes obvious you're an alt or useless but you're nowhere near that. Frankly with the right help its very hard to be "useless" at Eve PvP.
When I see someone who has, for example hundreds of kills and losses in single digits I see someone who doesn't fight outside the blob - or gank.
I'd rather have someone who has lost a hundred ships around than someone who has lost 10. People who lose ships push the limit of fights, people who don't lose ships fight in their comfort zone.
Unless you're totally incompetent then losing ships and coming back for more will make decent PvP corps MORE interested in you, not less.
Othran's rule of thumb is that any corp interested in your efficiency is not a corp to join. |
rampro
Imperial Collective
3
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Posted - 2011.11.04 15:06:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jav Ozran wrote:I've recently been trying out PvP, and i am absolutely rubbish at it. I have 1 kill and 6 deaths- a joke on the billboards, making me think about starting a whole new character to get rid of the embarrassment. I've read all the tips, guides and help forums the internet has to offer but i'm either gate camped with no time to run, scanned down in my safe spot, and when after many hours of roaming i find someone i might actually be able to kill, they pop me in less than a minute.
I suck and want to start again for new kill board stats, what do you reccomend?
There is no other way to learn my friend .
Every time you die you should take something from it and improve next time. |
Neriko Hakaari
CryNet Systems
3
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Posted - 2011.11.05 11:14:00 -
[23] - Quote
Don't feel sorry for yourself in situations like these. Just suck it up, buy new ships and go at it again. You can't be a professional PvP'er on your first tries. It takes time, experience and patience. So the best tip I have for you is to just come at people with everything you've got. And when you die, which we all do, sit and think of what you did wrong and how to improve, and just go at it again.
Dare to be bold pilot. |
Barbelo Valentinian
The Scope Gallente Federation
123
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Posted - 2011.11.05 16:20:00 -
[24] - Quote
Yeah, worry not. There are many players in the game who are **** at PvP, and many players who were **** but got better. As some people have said, even people who are very good at PvP now may have died many, many times as part of the learning process to get good.
My kb is laughable, because the only PvP I do is when I get ganked in missions in low sec through being careless, or (very rarely, when I'm drunk ) when I go into a low sec area actually looking for trouble. But so what?
Since I'm "play EVE to relax" type of person, PvP is not a priority for me so it's never something I sought to learn from the start (20 cheap rifters, etc.), but since PvP is unavoidable in EVE, the longer I'm in the game the more I get used to it, and gradually get better at it. These days, I don't get flustered so much, I remember some of the things I have to do, I'm enjoying it more, and managing to get in some decent damage before I get killed. I'll never be as good as a young "pro" PvP-er with great reflexes, but if I can give a decent account of myself, I'm happy.
It's just time and practice. Actually a big chunk of PvP in EVE is about experience and knowing how to pick your fights - getting to know the ships in the game and their typical fittings, getting to know whether you've got the scissors to their paper or whether you should run. I think those who are really good at PvP, particularly solo and small gang, are people who have been in the game long enough so that they can fly most subcap ships in the game, and know what they're like "from the inside", so when they face that ship, they know intimately what sort of tactics their opponent is likely to use in that ship. |
Daisai
Daisai Investments.
0
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Posted - 2011.11.06 20:03:00 -
[25] - Quote
How the hell can you get better or be a bad "pvp'er" in a game which has such passive gameplay?
Just dont ever try to solo pvp in eve online, 9 out of 10 times you are cannonfodder for gatecamps. You have better luck trying to canflip people or annoy missionrunners in high sec. |
Schmata Bastanold
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
17
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Posted - 2011.11.06 22:45:00 -
[26] - Quote
Daisai wrote:How the hell can you get better or be a bad "pvp'er" in a game which has such passive gameplay?
Just dont ever try to solo pvp in eve online, 9 out of 10 times you are cannonfodder for gatecamps. You have better luck trying to canflip people or annoy missionrunners in high sec.
ok, you can't get better, it is all passive gameplay, pvp in eve is dead - you said it in another thread (started by me btw) already. just wipe those big tears off of your face and get back into checkers or sth where you can do solo pvp. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold |
Pinaculus
Aliastra Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2011.11.07 00:13:00 -
[27] - Quote
Schmata Bastanold wrote:Daisai wrote:How the hell can you get better or be a bad "pvp'er" in a game which has such passive gameplay?
Just dont ever try to solo pvp in eve online, 9 out of 10 times you are cannonfodder for gatecamps. You have better luck trying to canflip people or annoy missionrunners in high sec. ok, you can't get better, it is all passive gameplay, pvp in eve is dead - you said it in another thread (started by me btw) already. just wipe those big tears off of your face and get back into checkers or sth where you can do solo pvp.
Don't smack-talk checkers. Classic PVP is best PVP. |
Schmata Bastanold
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
17
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Posted - 2011.11.07 07:53:00 -
[28] - Quote
Pinaculus wrote:Don't smack-talk checkers. Classic PVP is best PVP.
Was not my intention to **** on checkers, used to play a lot with my grandpa when I was a kid and man, he was brutal. He was to me like Goons are to crybabies here - pure mayhem without mercy. You either learn to play and fight back or you lose every time and produce big tears. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold |
Aston Bradley
Through the Looking Glass
34
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Posted - 2011.11.07 08:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
If you are going to make the positive Kill/loss balance of a killboard your obsession, i will suggest that you focus on the die less aspect of your game rather than the kill more.
Some ships give you better chances to survive than other, so trade dps for extra survival tools.
The safest way to do that, is a a stealth bomber.
You will focus on affordable targets like frigates, shuttle, industrial ships, the idea is to decloak, send a volley that will OS your target and recloak.
Think of the stealth bomber as a space sub-marine. It's not the bravest way to make kills, but if played right it's the safest.
Or, you can just stop paying attention to the killboard, and take more risks with other ships. I would just stop paying attention to the Killboard if i was you, though playing a bomber is a lot of fun. FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!
Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again! |
Schmata Bastanold
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
17
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Posted - 2011.11.07 09:03:00 -
[30] - Quote
One thing that can help a lot with minimizing your loses is to learn about ships. When you know what you are flying and you can tell if ships on your overview are from higher or lower or equal class you have more information to consider should you stay or should you run from them.
This is what I am currently working on but for know I get confused a lot of times and have to google almost every ship I meet. But it is always a problem for a new kid on da block and either you study to know who to avoid or you learn it hard way by getting smashed. For example now I know that hurricane is bad for ya if you are in a thrasher :) I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold |
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