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Gerald Sphinx
The Scope Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2013.10.17 19:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
Last night I was in class and had a discussion with a classmate who is a dedicated World of Warcraft player. Since we were both MMO players in general we often shared tidbits about how things are going in our sides of the MMO worlds. All was fun and good until we started talking about the play style of both games and how good they are in relation to each other. He was even trying to convince me to try WoW for once. I'll take him up on the offer and try the free trial myself just to see first hand how it compares to Eve Online.
Anyways, apparently this guy finds it stupid that there is no leveling system in Eve and that there are only skill books to train up. He also found it completely lame that if you leave your ship unattended in space someone else (who has the skills to pilot it) can hop into it and jack it from right under your nose. He also didn't like the idea that in Eve Online, our culture is basically the equivalent of a Momma Bird kicking the Baby Bird off the nest to see if it flies. Adapt or Die.
When talking about his game, it seems that whatever ride you have (he calls them "mounts") simply disappears into thin air as soon as dismount from it anywhere in the realms. And apparently each realm has their own separate economy that are so isolated that often times WoW players don't bother with transferring assets between realms due to a heavy tax burden or too many restrictions. At the very least, he said that WoW's economy is about as good and healthy as the Eve economy (I almost chuckled).
To counter his point about the economies of both games, I showed him an article posted on Forbes.com that was posted in December of 2012 saying that Eve Online so far has the best economy there is in the MMO market. But then he dismissed the article as "completely false" by looking at how many subscribers are in WoW (about 2 million or so) compared to Eve (500,000+) saying that WoW is better just because it has more subscribers.
It seems to me this guy is closed minded.
I was under the impression that the only reason Eve Online has so few numbers in terms of subscribers in relation to WoW is because the vast majority of MMO players are just too soft or weak minded to handle Eve Online's cut-throat culture. Many newcomers to Eve tend to leave because they are shocked at how violent the universe is over here. You can be scammed out of your hard-earned ISK, suicide ganked in a supposedly safe area of space, suffer at the hands of a monopoly or an oligopoly, get caught in low-sec and ransomed for no reason, and anyone can slap a bounty on you just for making a bad post on the forums, etc. In other words, people die nobody cries. That was the impression I had as to the reason for this.
Yet somehow Eve Online is thriving. Not through subscription numbers but through the community, the economy, and vast flexibility that it offers.
But I guess I should start reserving my opinion on WoW until I try it out for myself for once. This guy is kind enough to offer me help with going through many things in the game and I like to try it out. If I don't like it, I'll be back to Eve before you know it. Even if I do like it, I might not dedicate myself to WoW as much as I do with Eve considering how much I have gotten use to the Eve culture. |
ElQuirko
Jester Syndicate S0UTHERN C0MF0RT
2143
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Posted - 2013.10.17 19:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Your title is going to get you in a looooooooooooooot of trouble. Save the Domi model! Spacewhales should be preserved. |
Gerald Sphinx
The Scope Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2013.10.17 19:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
ElQuirko wrote:Your title is going to get you in a looooooooooooooot of trouble.
As if I didn't run into someone who disagreed with me about anything? |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
3091
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Posted - 2013.10.17 19:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Gerald Sphinx wrote: But I guess I should start reserving my opinion on WoW until I try it out for myself for once. .
In a moment of weakness I tried the WOW trial a few years ago. I made it less than two hours before uninstalling it again.
So my advice to you about giving it a try is don't bother.
Mr Epeen
There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass! |
Amhra Rho
Accujac Elimination
149
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
Eve is a singular experience. There isn't anything else quite like it, and it isn't for everyone. Most of all, it stubbornly defies comparison. There's real reasons why your Eve character doesn't do /dance. |
Malcolm Shinhwa
bad touches
429
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
I played SW:TOR and Guild Wars 2. Haven't played either since about 2 weeks after I started playing Eve. Eve has ruined me for all other non-sandbox MMOs. The only MMO I am remotely excited about is if GTA Online comes to the PC.
I remember very clearly the last time I signed into Guild Wars 2. I was standing in our fort in the World Vs. World area. I had these two long knives, almost machetes. They had rusted barbed wire wrapped around them, I guess to inflict even more serious injuries than a huge knife would do on its own. Occasionally my char would spin them around or something... like she was itching for a fight. And I thought, "Why can't I slip one of these knives into the ribs of the guy I don't even know standing next to me?" The answer, he was on my "team."
Even if you don't want to be the bad guy, Eve is great because bad things can happen to you at any time. You have to prepare in advance for that, and you have to be on your toes at all times. I've never seen another game like it, and grinding raid dungeons will offer little to compare to. Hey CCP, please slush my fund like you did for SOMER Blink. |
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation The Cursed Few
111
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:15:00 -
[7] - Quote
There once was a space game called EVE. Which was harder than you could believe. Fools came from WOW, "I'm quiting!", they'd vow. Can I have your stuffs when you leave? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoavH8xbrPE |
No Means No
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
The difference between them is about 9 million people
That should put things in perspective for you. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
12101
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:17:00 -
[9] - Quote
No Means No wrote:The difference between them is about 9 million people
That should put things in perspective for you.
It's rather less now. WoW is bleeding subs at a very rapid rate.
1 Kings 12:11
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Black Canary Jnr
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance
9
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:19:00 -
[10] - Quote
Your friend doesn't understand the joy of losing.
*personnal story time*
Once upon a time, 10 years ago, we used to play browser based multiplayer games in school. The one i liked most was 'inselkampf', ypu built your island up and built units from resources. It was, of course, a terrible game, but my parents wouldn't let me get a sub for runescape, which was THE shizz. Anyways the game sucked and i played for a few years then smashed my army into someone elses and had the greatest epiphany ever - it was more fun killing stuff and losing stuff than just building stuff.
The lesson is, don't be lame 14 year old me who can't afford like 5 quid a month for a RS sub, be a meglomaniac douche forum troll and have fun losing stuff, because your in game acheivements mean more when you can lose them.
*end storytime*
If that doesn't make your friend cry with realisation, try throwing raw onion at him. Guaranteed results. |
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Skeln Thargensen
Alpha Sperglords
228
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
never played it, can't comment.
repeat after me. freelance space bum |
JuGGy MC'OMG
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
Fear of death, lust for killing, drive your enemy into submission, build, destroy , rebuild, control chaos
or
Sit in front of the auction house in your new mount saying look at me, look at me |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
6331
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:24:00 -
[13] - Quote
Black Canary Jnr wrote:... be a meglomaniac douche forum troll and have fun losing stuff,....
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
2089
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:27:00 -
[14] - Quote
Trolls vs Orcs eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |
Azami Nevinyrall
Carbon Circle Tactical Narcotics Team
1313
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:30:00 -
[15] - Quote
Played both WoW and EVE for years...
Most of us have played WoW, but are ashamed to admit it!
Both games have their merits, but EVE is much...much better and a lot more complicated then WoW will ever be!
Until EVE reaches 1 million subs and CCP grows accustomed to that income... Support my (possibly dumb) Ideas!! Worm Rebalance!!! |
Cierra Royce
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
85
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:30:00 -
[16] - Quote
WoW Gameplay itself is lame and tedious, mainly grinding, grinding, grinding to get the perfect set of yellow pants for my paladins armour set, or running the same stupid random raids to try get tokens or weapons. I've played quite extensively over the years but havent logged on for probably 10 months now, and I doubt I missed anything much.
The only thing I've found makes it tolerable is a really good guild group to both level and Raid with, thankfully as a fully paid up :10Bux: member I get the best of all worlds when I log on, a great guild and plenty of help with any endeavour, if you want to do it, a goon wants to help you do it. |
Amber Kurvora
Turalyon Plus Turalyon Alliance
36
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
I played WoW for a short while, managing to level someone up to lvl 32. It was...Ok, at least until I got so utterly bored of the grind and the repetitive nature of the PvE, that I uninstalled it. I tried it again a few months back and spent a whole two hours before the boredom kicked in again. It's a 'safe' game. Even if you managed to get ganked by wandering into the wrong area, you'll never lose anything. Eve is an MMO with the safety rails off, populated by the sort of people who like to bend you over and shaft you without offering to lube up first. It's an intriguing affair of always being on the edge because you never know what's waiting for you through the next gate.
Sometimes you can feel totally alone in an empty corner of null as you go exploring, and other times you can be cowering in a safe in low, praying that the roaming 20 person fleet doesn't have a combat prober in there somewhere. You can get the ultimate high and adrenaline rush of going toe to toe with another player, and get the horrible lurching feeling as you jump into the mother of all gate camps. Basically the scope of experience within Eve is much large in my opinion, and no two days ever end up alike if you're a regular player. Yes, there's grind elements to it in earning ISK, but even those can be subverted via escalations or going outside your comfort zone to try something new.
WoW? It will forever coddle you, pat you and tell you it's all going to be good. Eve on the other hand will urinate over your cold corpse whilst laughing it's arse off. |
Lykouleon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1105
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
The obvious solution is to now steal all of your classmates things and awox his mode of transportation.
EVE is real. Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER so I can hit them with my sword |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
731
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:38:00 -
[19] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:No Means No wrote:The difference between them is about 9 million people
That should put things in perspective for you. It's rather less now. WoW is bleeding subs at a very rapid rate.
Last investor call said the loss were slowing down linked most likely to the last 2 patches. The one before that was putting the number at 9,6 mill. Even if we make thier slower loss at 3,6 million, it would still be 12 time as big as EVE.
You can't compare the 2 games directly because they are not really similar. All PVP feature in WoW are actaully tacked on feature since release. The game was not meant to be a PVP game. The relevant content in WoW is the PvE experience and that is easyly way ahead of EVE in term of quality.
If the 2 games had the same goal, you could compare them but the very philosophy and core of the games are different.
Red fruits is what I like so apples > oranges. The bias is clear one way or another when people compare both game. |
Bryus Aldent
Ultimos Dragones
1
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:39:00 -
[20] - Quote
I ran into the same situation with a buddy of mine who is a diehard WoW guy. Found it hard trying to explain that you need an IQ to play EVE, and yet he couldn't understand. |
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Digits Kho
Broken Wheel Mercantile and Trading Company Illusion of Solitude
6
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:40:00 -
[21] - Quote
WoW is very shallow compared to EvE, too much npc control in the game, it has a worse community and the way the guilds ( called corps in our game) work there is terrible. Vanilla and TBC was very nice though |
Black Canary Jnr
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance
10
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:41:00 -
[22] - Quote
I actually tried WoW maybe 6 months ago? I've previously played it when i was like 16.
The first time i got up to level 50 as a gnome mage and quit.
The most recent attempt i played a goblin priest, got to level 20ish and quit. It's changed alot since i first played, for instance enjoy being spammed with guild invites every 5 mins because you can 'level up your guilds now'. Gameplay is pretty much the same. Don't roll a goblin cos their intro is lame and feels like it was designed for 10 year olds.
You will play totally solo till level 18 when you unlock LFG, whereby you will just spam look for groups to get blue gear, thereby missing most of the sh*te gather and kill pve wow throws at you. And that's pretty much your game i guess. Never been in a raid but never could be asked to grind to level 80 or whatever it is just to play with other people in a meaningful way. *read as community is wa*k and voice comms none existant till you level cap* Oh people like their mounts too, except they all do the same thing, it's pretty crazy. i wish you could dismember other peoples mounts because that would be ace, 10/10 would join goons for that. Never did 'pet battles' because they offered no benefit. PvP is lame highest level twinkiest wins everytime.
Thing that sums it up. Definitely going downhill in terms of gameplay and subscribers. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4172
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:42:00 -
[23] - Quote
Gerald Sphinx wrote:Anyways, apparently this guy finds it stupid that there is no leveling system in Eve
The "levelling" system in EVE is time-based rather than action based. You train skills, your character grows. In WoW the levelling system is action based: you log in and do stuff, your character gains levels, your character grows. The levelling system in WoW is a little redundant though since the game has changed significantly during the last few expansions to the point where Blizzard actively encourages people to level up as quickly as possible, skip the actual content of the PvE-content-based-game, to get to the "endgame" (a term which raises a chuckle from me, since "end game" in every other game is the few moves before the winner is determined). The "endgame" in WoW is racing through all the levelling content to get to a few instances which you run over and over again to acquire new shiny things. The purpose of acquiring new shiny things is to gain access to the next piece of PvE content access to all of which is gradated on a scale based on what gear you have.
So when you start playing WoW with "friends" the typical thing to do is say hello, join their guild, then spend several tens of hours levelling your character without any interaction with your friends. Just keep hitting that "find random dungeon group" button, running random dungeons, levelling your character until you hit the level cap. Then you set about acquiring the gear you need to gain access to the PvE content that your friends no longer engage in.
As a trial character in WoW you will max out at about level 20, which is in the order of two or three hours of play time. The maximum level is 90. You will be spending a significant portion of your trial time alone.
Gerald Sphinx wrote:I was under the impression that the only reason Eve Online has so few numbers in terms of subscribers in relation to WoW is because the vast majority of MMO players are just too soft or weak minded to handle Eve Online's cut-throat culture. Many newcomers to Eve tend to leave because they are shocked at how violent the universe is over here.
I'm under the impression that EVE is a smaller game than WoW because everything that isn't WoW is much smaller than WoW. In addition, EVE is a spaceship based game in a world full of fantasy games, with always-on PvP and a very harsh penalty for losing PvP engagements. It's not the kind of game that is going to appeal to many people. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
424
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 20:43:00 -
[24] - Quote
WoW was a great game until late 2007 with patch 2.3. While Zul'Aman in patch 2.3 was probably Blizzards best instance ever, the start of easy leveling in patch 2.3 was terrible decision.
While WoW was still grindy to a certain extent in TBC, overall gameplay was really good. It's hard to describe it and the sad route it went down, without posting walls of text and going into details that do not matter here in this forum. But compared to 2007, today's WoW is utter trash. Basically a pet and item collection game.
Temporarily you could find spots of interesting PvE gameplay in Wrath of the Lich King in instances like Ulduar or special hard modes like Sartharion with three drakes. But the best times of the game were gone.
Crafting (professions) and trading was never very interesting or well designed with exception of a very few awesome items that had an impact on gameplay. Also, bots and map hacks could become a terrible nuisance, depending on the server.
When I left WoW in late 2010, it could barely be called an MMO. Phasing had turned huge amounts of non instanced PvE gameplay into a solo experience. If you skipped the instances, you stood a good chance of not seeing a single player for several hours.
Depending on the Server, the community ranged from terrible to really good. Personally I did have an excellent time on the role playing server I chose to Play on and with the people I teamed up with. The decision to leave them behind for good and come to EvE was not an easy one. Remove insurance. |
NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
1061
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:45:00 -
[25] - Quote
I played WOW for about..a year or so i think. Ended up trying it because of a similar discussion, except this was a bet. An EVE player is not able to play a game as complicated as WOW. (Yes, i did laugh, and i still tease the person who proposed the bet once in a while )
As someone mentioned, WOW is "safe". Makes it a very easy game to play since you dont have to really pay attention to what your doing, and if you die you really dont care that much.
The market is..awful to say the least, but as an EVE player it was very easy to manipulate it and make more gold then i would ever need.
Dont even need to say anything about the community.
However, WOW is not all bad. Its great if you need that mental break, or if you just want some mindless fun for a few hours. Maybe because it feels good to see your character advance, knowing that you just need to finish X amount of quests and then you can use *whatever". This is something i have never felt in EVE (and trust me, i dont want EVE to change), and EVE having been my first and only online game until then it caught me by surprise because it seemed so..different (the level system that is).
But its scary addictive. Its been a couple of years since i played and i still catch my self thinking about it once in a while. Honestly if it hadent been for the bad community it would still have been my "EVE break" game. Phoibe Enterprises official recruitment thread The Eve Reader - -áAudio Recordings of Eve Chronicles
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Angelique Duchemin
Alexylva Paradox
648
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Posted - 2013.10.17 20:53:00 -
[26] - Quote
Played both quite a lot.
There's not really any way to win debates like this.
But there's a sure way to lose them and that's to convince yourself that other people have different opinions on what's fun simple because they're dumb.
Or that the same people are apparently so dumb that they don't realise they're not having fun and that if they could only reach your level of enlightenment. Then they too could derive no enjoyment from the same forms of media as you do.
We miss you Saede. In-depth guide on how to safely mine in High Sec |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
424
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Posted - 2013.10.17 21:10:00 -
[27] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:The "levelling" system in EVE is time-based rather than action based. You train skills, your character grows. In WoW the levelling system is action based: you log in and do stuff, your character gains levels, your character grows. The levelling system in WoW is a little redundant though since the game has changed significantly during the last few expansions to the point where Blizzard actively encourages people to level up as quickly as possible, skip the actual content of the PvE-content-based-game, to get to the "endgame" (a term which raises a chuckle from me, since "end game" in every other game is the few moves before the winner is determined). The "endgame" in WoW is racing through all the levelling content to get to a few instances which you run over and over again to acquire new shiny things. The purpose of acquiring new shiny things is to gain access to the next piece of PvE content access to all of which is gradated on a scale based on what gear you have.
So when you start playing WoW with "friends" the typical thing to do is say hello, join their guild, then spend several tens of hours levelling your character without any interaction with your friends. Just keep hitting that "find random dungeon group" button, running random dungeons, levelling your character until you hit the level cap. Then you set about acquiring the gear you need to gain access to the PvE content that your friends no longer engage in.
As a trial character in WoW you will max out at about level 20, which is in the order of two or three hours of play time. The maximum level is 90. You will be spending a significant portion of your trial time alone.
Pretty much this.
Remove insurance. |
Tollen Gallen
Xionworld
1078
|
Posted - 2013.10.17 21:13:00 -
[28] - Quote
WoW i love Battleships Signature |
Xearal
Black Thorne Corporation The Cursed Few
691
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Posted - 2013.10.17 21:16:00 -
[29] - Quote
A long long time ago, I had heard vaguely of Eve Online, as it was an MMO version of Elite. This sounded pretty cool, but I never really checked more on it, as friends had showed me this awesome MMO called World of Warcraft. When I started playing Eve, I kicked myself hard for not having checked it out much sooner.
I played WoW for several years, from Vanilla, Burning crusade, Lich king and even Cataclysm for a short bit when some people got me to return.
As theme park MMO's go, it's pretty nice, but has suffered greatly from the 'lowest common denomiter' problem. The game has been dumbed down so much that anyone can play it, no matter how big of a dumb idiot they are.
In vanilla and BTC, raids were HARD. Not all of them, but the endgame ones were. But since sooo many idiots were whining about how they would never be able to see all the leet content because they lacked the skill/progression/hardcore mentality needed to get there and do these raids successfully, Blizzard made the game easier and easier so everyone would be able to enjoy their shiny new content. Also the new loot mechanics were set up so nobody would feel left out anymore when something refused to drop for a specific group, and everyone just gets their stuff from a store with marks they farm with raiding.
Sadly, this is the way most themepark MMO's have gone, making the game simple and easy so everyone can play. Thus totally devoid of skill, meaning or challenge. This is the very reason I play Eve Online. Eve pits your wits, intellect and skill against both it's environment, and it's other players in every aspect of the game. It's very complexity and myriad of possibilities and choices is what make this game truly 'hard' and wonderful.
If you like being entertained and kept busy in a safe environment where nothing nasty is going to happen to you, games like WoW are your cup of tea, though a better challenge would be nicer I suppose. If you want stuff you do to mean something, you need to come into the sandbox to play and build your sandcastle, or knock other people's castles down.
Quite often these days, when I don't feel like playing something that has me on edge, I don't log into Eve, but log onto Star Trek Online, a nice and friendly theme park mmo. Is it hard? Not at all, but it is quite relaxing to just sit back and do my thing, get myself some more shinies and whatnot, and just basically enjoy myself, without having to look over my shoulder if there's someone there go come and knock my little castle down purely for the fun of it.
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Baggo Hammers
155
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Posted - 2013.10.17 21:23:00 -
[30] - Quote
WoW has become a game for little kids. They consciously lowered the demo age with the fighting pandas expansion. Blizzard crafts excellent games, pretty much all of 'em. I have played and enjoyed most of them. I am too old however to grind for equipment. Too high school.
As far as EVE vs WoW though, it's apples and oranges. If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there. |
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