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[Rubicon discussion] What happened to the SoE battleship?

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Kitty Bear Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance 975	Posted - 2013.11.06 21:41:00 - [31] - Quote heh .. I missed that last part. I got side tracked by the shiny graph, and the lack of Sanctaury Corp LP's on it
Zan Shiro Alternative Enterprises 249	Posted - 2013.11.06 22:15:00 - [32] - Quote Onslaughtor wrote: My feeling is that they will release the Nestor when they rebalanced the Blackops. Likely in the 1.1, 1.2, or the next expansion. I think this is is the case as well. SOE BS witht the current states of blops, redeemer and sin in particular, would just be a balance nightmare. This would limit blops to bridge only details. Thye'd have of trend continued armout bonuses. This is something blops lack and has been asked for in the past. the rationale we get is t2 BS can't get t2 resists or they aren't pure combat vessels. Bring in SOE and we'd go...well wtf is up with this boat then. While we can debate the issues of covert op cloak on blops as well (I happen to be against the idea in current state) we'd also go well wtf is up with this SOE boat as well. But to sum up ccp I think is eyeing blops redo as even now unless you need its bridging most be better off running the tier 1 variety its based on for most everything else. SOE BS would be yet another reason to not fly them. CCP has been here before. Inty's while not crap not great. AF's were lacking a bonus and generally "broken". To this mess ccp introduced dramiel. We were told inty's aren't dps ships in general, thats AF's role.. We were told AF's aren't meant to be high speed tacklers...thats inty's job. Then they gave us dramiel and many said well well now we are jsut confused ccp, this ship did both well. We got the cruiser and the frig I think because all in all these classes are decently squared away. I for example am not seeing any reason to not fly ishtars/gilas anymore after release. SOE has some tricks up it sleeve...but nothing that has me going ishtars are trash ships that will rot on the market since no one will want them anymore.
Mara Rinn Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium 4266	Posted - 2013.11.06 23:37:00 - [33] - Quote Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: Hm, I suppose you may be right. I guess I am just very iffy about a Covert Ops cloak paired with a full flight of damage bonused sentry drones as it might step on the toes of several other ships. (Dominix, Ishtar, Navy Vexor, Navy Dominix, Rattlesnake) So maybe something like this: Role Bonus: 50% bonus to Large Energy Turret optimal range Role Bonus: 37.5% increase Scan Prob Strength Role Bonus: +10 Virus strength for Relic and Data Analyzers Can fit Cover Ops Cloaking devices Amarr Battleship Bonus: 4% bonus to Armor Resists Gallente Battleship Bonus: 7.5% bonus to Drone optimal range and Done tracking speed The Sin is a full-flight-sentry-bonused ship with cloaking ability. The Redeemer is a cloaking laser boat. Both have the ability to use portal generators. If the Sin is balanced to be more like the Dominix (i.e.: drone range/tracking bonus as opposed to the Navy Domi with hybrid bonuses) there's room for another covert/black ops drone boat with combined drone/laser bonuses. I agree with you that having such a vessel capable of using a covert ops cloak would be unbalanced, but only if none of the T2 Black Ops battleships are able to do the same. If all the black ops ships become able to use covert ops cloaks, I think the Nestor would fit in nicely as a pirate black ops ship with combined drone/laser bonuses. The Gila has a full flight of heavy/sentry drones with damage bonuses, but it suffers compared to the Dominix or Eos due to less EHP, less tank and less fitting. The Myrmidon offers 4 heavy/sentry drones and an amazing active tank and so many high slots GÇö a configuration which is happily exploited by solo/small gang PvPers. Sure, there's only a small population of dual rep / ancillary rep Myrm pilots out there, but from what I've read and watched, they're really enjoying that hull. Of course if the Black Ops ships aren't being rebalanced at the same time, we might see the Nestor released as a covert ops drone boat with exploration benefits. It could still be balanced the same way as the Stratios, four large drones, large laser bonuses, etc. effectively providing a cloaky ship somewhere between Recon, T1 battleships and T2 black ops in terms of power & balance. Even that would be an amazing ship to bring along for black ops roams: all we need now is a cloaky ship with a large cargo or fuel hold to carry all the fuel required to take this fleet on tour :)
Antillie Sa'Kan Forging Industries Silent Infinity 151	Posted - 2013.11.07 00:02:00 - [34] - Quote Mara Rinn wrote: The Sin is a full-flight-sentry-bonused ship with cloaking ability. The Redeemer is a cloaking laser boat. Both have the ability to use portal generators. If the Sin is balanced to be more like the Dominix (i.e.: drone range/tracking bonus as opposed to the Navy Domi with hybrid bonuses) there's room for another covert/black ops drone boat with combined drone/laser bonuses. Yes but the Sin has 7.5 effective drones to my proposed SoE battleship's 5 in addition to damage bonused guns making the Sin much more gank oriented. As a trade off it cannot use a Covert Ops cloak but it does get a jump drive and the ability to make covert bridges. So it ends up being a far more specialized ship. This is what I would expect from a T2 hull. I think you could put an SoE battleship similar to the one I proposed into the game without encroaching on the role or natural strengths of the Black Ops battleships. As to how to actually fix Black Ops, I don't really know, but it seems that being able to use the Covert Ops cloak wouldn't do it. I have seen ideas for some kind of bastion style "stealth field generator" kicked around though.
Arthur Aihaken The.VOID 436	Posted - 2013.11.07 06:41:00 - [35] - Quote Probably a Pirate-Black Ops rebalance and a SoE addition in the next update.
Yummy Chocolate Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 2098	Posted - 2013.11.07 07:49:00 - [36] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Am I imagining something? I swear there was meant to be one. Like many others, your imagination is running wild. the SOE BS rumor spawned from the unmodeled GURISTAS BS found on singularity about a month or 2 ago. Speaking of which, I need to update my sisi and check if it's still there and if it has a model yet.
Reiisha Evolution 391	Posted - 2013.11.07 09:01:00 - [37] - Quote Yummy Chocolate wrote: ElQuirko wrote: Am I imagining something? I swear there was meant to be one. Like many others, your imagination is running wild. the SOE BS rumor spawned from the unmodeled GURISTAS BS found on singularity about a month or 2 ago. Speaking of which, I need to update my sisi and check if it's still there and if it has a model yet. BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote: I kinda skimmed the thread but just wanted to add this quote from the recent dev blog. Quote: We hope you guys enjoy the new ships, and make sure to keep your eyes peeled following Rubicon, the Sisters of EVE may not be done giving us new toys quite yetGÇª - CCP Rise Source: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/sisters-of-eve-faction-ships/
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 649	Posted - 2013.11.07 09:46:00 - [38] - Quote Pollux 'Gemini wrote: The Nestor, the theoretical ship in question had a description up on the test server a few builds back, what happened to it though I do not know if anyone knows. In reality it may have just been too difficult to balance a cloaky battleship, which is likely why the Black Ops have taken so long to come to rebalancing as well, my 2 cents. When they eventually re think it. They should not give a covert ops cloak... just that. Give it a speed bonus while usign normal cloak like the black ops have... And MAYBE add specially the capability of jumpign trough bridges.
Randy Wray Filthy Casuals 106	Posted - 2013.11.07 09:56:00 - [39] - Quote Thing with covops battleships is they can hit MJD and then activate cloak, pretty much guarantees they wont be scrammed in time. Should make it so cloak interrupts mjd.
Malcolm Malicious Malware Detected Brave Collective 45	Posted - 2013.11.07 11:19:00 - [40] - Quote Role Bonus: 37.5% increase Scan Prob Strength Role Bonus: +10 Virus strength for Relic and Data Analyzers Role Bonus: 50% increase to Large Energy Turret optimal range Cloak reactivation delay reduced to 10 seconds. 500% increase to cloak velocity. Amarr Cruiser Bonus: 4% bonus to Armor Resists Gallente Cruiser Bonus: 10% bonus to Drone hitpoints and damage, and +1 extra Drone controlled per level. Slot layout: 6H, 6M, 6L; 5 turrets, 0 launchers Defense: blah blah numbers to limit OPness Fitting: same as above Capacitor: same as above Mobilty: Slow speed and good agility like the rest of SoE Drones (bandwidth / bay): 100 / 500 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 65km / 100 / 7 Sensor strength: 28 Signature radius: 420 Cargo Capacity: 750 Now we have a mini carrier that encourages the use of light and medium drones, maintaining dps in the 900-1000 range while increasing damage application to fill a support roll in clearing up anything below a BS. With 6 lows to balance tank/gank options and no covert ops cloak because this design would already be super powerful without a cloak. A drone boat that feels like a drone boat. Benefits: Great support ship for taking out anything sub-capital, even when brick tanked - roughly same amount of DPS with 10 mediums and equal number of DDAs as a 125mbps Drone BS. Bonus to cloak velocity. Presumably very cool-looking. Drawbacks: Unable to use cov ops cloak. Not able to utilize sentries to full potential so maximum drone damage application is delayed by drone speed. Probably just as expensive, if not more than an actual carrier. BS warp speed/acceleration post Rubicon. Why: Because 10 drones on a subcap. Introducing more anti-smaller-ship options will encourage more battleship usage (at least that's the theory). Think of all the High-sec carebears who believe this is the ultimate weapon in high-sec war decs, only to realize they've become a shiny killmail to a brick proteus gate camp. Now everyone can fly their very own Protoss carrier. That's probably what the final Nestor design will look similar to anyway.
Sergeant Acht Scultz School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 1287	Posted - 2013.11.07 13:20:00 - [41] - Quote Schhhhhht What if CCP just put it there to test your faith? Nothing was said about it from CCP guys/galls, just put there, like that. Santa gift or not Santa gift, fake or not fake? Was a good move to show it however.
ElQuirko Jester Syndicate WHY so Seri0Us 2411	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:53:00 - [42] - Quote Reiisha wrote: Yummy Chocolate wrote: ElQuirko wrote: Am I imagining something? I swear there was meant to be one. Like many others, your imagination is running wild. the SOE BS rumor spawned from the unmodeled GURISTAS BS found on singularity about a month or 2 ago. Speaking of which, I need to update my sisi and check if it's still there and if it has a model yet. Source: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/sisters-of-eve-faction-ships/ That, and the description of said "Guristas" battleship explicitly mentioned the Sisters of EVE creating it. Randy Wray wrote: Thing with covops battleships is they can hit MJD and then activate cloak, pretty much guarantees they wont be scrammed in time. Should make it so cloak interrupts mjd. CCP stealthpatched this, it does now. At least I believe I read this in a whine thread. Antillie Sa'Kan - Your ideas are good and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
Antillie Sa'Kan Forging Industries Silent Infinity 152	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:04:00 - [43] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan - Your ideas are good and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter. Thank you for the support. Sorry for being so confrontational earlier. I suppose I just looked at the bonuses on the Stratios and then slapped them on a BS hull in my mind without really thinking about how to balance an SoE BS properly.
ElQuirko Jester Syndicate WHY so Seri0Us 2411	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:16:00 - [44] - Quote Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: Thank you for the support. Sorry for being so confrontational earlier. I suppose I just looked at the bonuses on the Stratios and then slapped them on a BS hull in my mind without really thinking about how to balance an SoE BS properly. 'sfine man, I was hardly nice and sweet about it either
Nikk Narrel Infinite Improbability Inc Insidious Empire 3174	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:29:00 - [45] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: Thank you for the support. Sorry for being so confrontational earlier. I suppose I just looked at the bonuses on the Stratios and then slapped them on a BS hull in my mind without really thinking about how to balance an SoE BS properly. 'sfine man, I was hardly nice and sweet about it either I feel this was well done, by both of you, in resolving so thoughtfully. Now, if only black ops could see such love.
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 3443	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:48:00 - [46] - Quote Nice back and forth with a great finish. Great points on either side. Well played, guys!
ElQuirko Jester Syndicate WHY so Seri0Us 2419	Posted - 2013.11.08 22:14:00 - [47] - Quote Bumping to keep this particular place of discussion regarding the SoE battleship open.
Antillie Sa'Kan Forging Industries Silent Infinity 164	Posted - 2013.11.08 22:47:00 - [48] - Quote I'm a little surprised that CCP hasn't made a comment of some type in this thread. I'm not expecting a confirmation of there being or not being an SoE BS in the works or anything but there hasn't even been a "Hm, that's interesting." or a "We want to see how things work out with the Frigate and Cruiser before we make any decisions about a BS." from them about this.
ElQuirko Jester Syndicate WHY so Seri0Us 2427	Posted - 2013.11.08 22:50:00 - [49] - Quote Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: I'm a little surprised that CCP hasn't made a comment of some type in this thread. I'm not expecting a confirmation of there being or not being an SoE BS in the works or anything but there hasn't even been a "Hm, that's interesting." or a "We want to see how things work out with the Frigate and Cruiser before we make any decisions about a BS." from them about this. CCP seem to have gone relatively dark recently; not just in F&I but GD. Not sure if it's something to do with the recent scandal storm or the fact that the expansion is so close.
Thaddeus Eggeras TwoTenX LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM 120	Posted - 2013.12.01 16:01:00 - [50] - Quote First of the SoE BS is coming deal with it. It would need to sometime anyway, IF for no other reason then ALL the faction pirate races have a frigate, cruiser, and battleship, meanig SoE was missing one of the 3, guess which. Now will it be able to warp cloaked? I highly doubt it. I do think it will have the same resist, drone and laser bonuses, but the others I'm not sure if they will stay or be changed. There is a rumor it will have a med bay and it's suppose to have the least amount of mass of any BS in game. What will it's role be? I think it's going to have something to do with the up coming building jumpgates to be honest, but as CCP has done little but show pictures who knows what this ship will be able to do. It might be like a balckops but T1, or it might be for exploring still but more in wormholes and such, or it might be something completely different. Do we need it YES. You can't have ALL the other faction pirate races have BS and SoE not. Hell now CCP is going to have to make a Cald/Min faction too haha.

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