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Armageddon vs Apocalypse

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Taradox	Posted - 2006.02.27 21:40:00 - [1] Hi all Im going to purchase one of these ships in the upcomming week or so and would like to know if anyone could seperate the ships in their abilities and strongest roles. I would like to know the strengths and weaknesses of the two ships and how the ships are better or weaker in certain ways. generally im looking for a damage dealing ship with some tanking abilities. Thanks all
Dan Grobag	Posted - 2006.02.27 21:44:00 - [2] armageddon is the king of damage, it's also cheap, but it can tank a lot less than an apoc.
SasRipper	Posted - 2006.02.27 21:51:00 - [3] appoc=tank geddon=gank ------------------------------------------- D!E with Honour mercs for hire msg 4 info.
Toy	Posted - 2006.02.27 22:00:00 - [4] I fly both, and I like both, but each does have their roles... The geddon is cheap and it is just worth 60 mil... It's mostly a throw away ship... The grid is weak if you need to fit a full slot of heavy weapons also... The geddon needs the NOS in the last spot, and the ROF is nice, so even though the APOC can fit 8 lasers, the geddon with the ROF bonus will do more damage. The ROF is a catch 22 as the cap is unsustainable. BUT With the APOC I can fit 8 megapulse II easily, with a full tank, with almost infinite cap... This makes ratting so much easier as you can 'get distracted' and not lose the ship. If you are running 2 accounts or chatting or whatever, the geddon is just too clicky intensive on a tactical level, so I only use it when I can focus. With the apoc, you just point it at a rat bs, fire ab and lasers, then come back a minute later to get the can. For PVP you have the problem of all amarr ships--weak mid spots... You really need cap stuff in the mids, unless you are either throwing away the geddon. Someone else can speak to beams, but a nice thing about these ships with pulse lasers is you can ram someone. It's very fun... You just AB then ram them so they can align. They usually bump out of the way so your pulses at 1000-3000 meters still hit. Another nice thing is a double webber set-up which pretty much pops all small ships as it lets all your pulse lasers hit fast and good. Again with that you don't really need a scrambler since the damage is so insane once both webbers lock. On both set ups you will want an adaptive nano and you will want to train all the new armor skills. After Tuesday you will want the best damage control mod you can afford. Lastly, beware the fitting costs--7-8 megapulse laser II will cost you 35-40 mil ISK. That is just the start for uninsured T2 gear... On a 56 mil geddon, adding 50 mil of uninsurable T2 gear isn't that good of an idea as it really is fragile. Remember ships like ravens and scorps have endless supplies of rat gear like arbalest cruise, arbalest siege, etc... I find that getting good lasers without the T2 price is rather hard.
Taradox	Posted - 2006.02.27 22:45:00 - [5] Thanks all for the help, especially Toy for that large post. Money wise i think the Geddon would be the better ship for me as im not a hugely wealthy character. I also prefer the looks of the geddon, but can see where the Apoc really shines.
hylleX	Posted - 2006.02.27 23:33:00 - [6] Edited by: hylleX on 27/02/2006 23:33:24 Apoc - carebearing geddon - pvp Sure u can use apoc in pvp but geddon does most things better and if u wanna tank ur better of in a dominix/raven which can also do damage at the same time the apoc is just poor on damage. Geddon can pretty much only gank, the rof bonus along with poor cap from start makes tanking in this thing not viable. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well kids you've tried your best and failed miserably, the lesson is: never try
Ryan Seacrest	Posted - 2006.02.28 02:28:00 - [7] I can tank a geddon pretty well thank you. But yes apoc has more cap and is better at tanking in general. Thats what its meant to do...be called primary. Funny thing is that I armor tank all the ships that I can since that leaves my mids free. Also I operate in a small nimble fleet (yes a BS can be nimble...its all relative) so when we focus fire on a target I can afford to have all of my modules running. If you are talking about 1v1, then yer loadout in mid slots should always feature at least 1 20KM scram and a web. Simplicity is best. In an apoc feel free to fit a multispec jammer. It can be your get out of jail free card. In a geddon? well uhhhh kill your target, you do get more drone space than an apoc.
Fiddlestx	Posted - 2006.02.28 04:33:00 - [8] Geddons are not fragile by any means. You can dual plate them and add hardeners along with megapulse and really screw someone over. In my gank setup i can tank another gankageddon for almost a minute, so no it's not fragile by any means. Also in the mids cap relates mods are not as important as ecm, sensor boosters, scrams and webs and tracking disruptors. What it really comes down to is what your going to use it for. PVE go with the apoc. DPS is not as important as a tank against rats and an apoc can tank all day with 2 large reps. For pvp go with the geddon. You can't beat it for the price and in small gangs it really lays the smack down. "To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands... the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." Sun Tsu
Xeenon	Posted - 2006.02.28 07:29:00 - [9] Edited by: Xeenon on 28/02/2006 07:30:36 Apoc is for low-skilled players. Geddon require lots of skills to be fitted properly, but if u have them - geddon become better than apoc in all aspects except tank. Apoc tanks very well, but it have poor dmg. When geddon is tanked it still deal lots of damage. I prefer use geddon to apoc both in pvp&pvm
Rodj Blake	Posted - 2006.02.28 11:11:00 - [10] I prefer the Apoc in PvP, because it's more versatile. It has more grid, more CPU, and the extra mid slot is very handy. Sure, you lose a low slot, but seven is still a lot. If your enemy uses a lot of ECM, the extra three points of radar strength are useful too. If all that you're interested in is damage though, the Armageddon is the ship to go for. Dolce et decorum est pro imperator mori

Nocturnal Avenger	Posted - 2006.02.28 11:46:00 - [11] Originally by: Taradox Hi all Im going to purchase one of these ships in the upcomming week or so and would like to know if anyone could seperate the ships in their abilities and strongest roles. I would like to know the strengths and weaknesses of the two ships and how the ships are better or weaker in certain ways. generally im looking for a damage dealing ship with some tanking abilities. Thanks all Think about this for a bit... If you really have to ask other people for this - how do you expect to perform?
God forbid	Posted - 2006.02.28 12:23:00 - [12] I would say.. Apoc is better for pirating in low empire (Where you have to tank sentrys and use a fastlock.) And I would say Armageddon is better for npc becouse you dont have to tank that much now and Armageddon is better for fleet fights.. But I like them bouth.. :) Quote: 0w9 m4aT 4app3n2ed..
Crellion	Posted - 2006.02.28 13:49:00 - [13] As a non ammar user with average experience in pvp I would say that Apoc is better if you are expecting others to do all the work in your gang and you are just there to make sure you get on killmails (near the bottom) and survive. If your gang has to rely on you however and you want to really make a difference then use a geddon. If you are strating out and joining more expericenced players use the Apoc ... its really cheaper in actual fact.
Oberon Oblique	Posted - 2006.02.28 19:20:00 - [14] Originally by: Xeenon Edited by: Xeenon on 28/02/2006 07:30:36 Apoc is for low-skilled players. Geddon require lots of skills to be fitted properly, but if u have them - geddon become better than apoc in all aspects except tank. Apoc tanks very well, but it have poor dmg. When geddon is tanked it still deal lots of damage. I prefer use geddon to apoc both in pvp&pvm Agreed, Low skill use a poc, maxed a geddon is always best. Maxed= All relevent skills at 5 (All=All in use when your in the ship) Also geddon can run 5x hvy drones and with a drone control mod in the high you can run them out to 65k. Geddon ftw:D -The mind is strong and the flesh is weak, but oh the flesh...
Ruah Piskonit	Posted - 2006.02.28 19:30:00 - [15] Like the good Admiral, I prefer the Apoc. While the Armageddon is a fine ship, the pure tanking power and the decent damage of the Apocalypse provides the nessisary combination to engadge ships well. The Armageddon does not gain nearly enough in firepower to justify the huge loss in surviability the Apocalypse provides. You are not use if you are dead.


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