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JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
9
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Posted - 2011.11.06 01:48:00 -
[1] - Quote
Just an anomoly I have noticed but nobody seems to pimp the Typhoon Fleet Issue. They are 2 and change most places. DPS 1K without drones. And yet I am one of the few people I have run into that fly them. Admittedly they require a wide skill base to use effectively. But at 100M or so more than a Maelstrom and much cheaper than the Mach (albeit without the range) the phoon is a beast. |
Teh Frog
University of Caille Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.11.06 03:00:00 -
[2] - Quote
JitaJane wrote: Just an anomoly I have noticed but nobody seems to pimp the Typhoon Fleet Issue. They are 2 and change most places. DPS 1K without drones. And yet I am one of the few people I have run into that fly them. Admittedly they require a wide skill base to use effectively. But at 100M or so more than a Maelstrom and much cheaper than the Mach (albeit without the range) the phoon is a beast.
wat |
Shivus Tao
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
7
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Posted - 2011.11.06 03:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fleet phoon used to be good when the normal phoon was limited to 4/4 turret/missile slots, it offered a bit more variation in fitting. Anymore though It has little more to offer than increased HP. The draw of the typhoon is that it's both incredibly powerful in the right hands and dirt cheap. The fleet phoon is only incredibly powerful. |
Ruah Piskonit
PIE Inc.
45
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Posted - 2011.11.06 05:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
the eft is strong here. |
Kesshisan
58
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Posted - 2011.11.06 05:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
The thing about the Typhoon is that with low isk and high skills you can make a very powerful ship.
The thing about the Fleet Typhoon is that with high isk and high skills you can make a very very powerful ship.
The high isk cost negates the advantage that the regular Typhoon has over comparable ships. If you were to use your high isk and high skills you could make a much better ship from almost any other comparable faction/pirate BS. . |
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2011.11.06 11:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
No no I get all of that. Like an extra slot and some PG. The Pest Fleet is only a moderate improvement on a standard Pest. I was just noticing that they sell for 2 and change while a Pest is 4 and change. Maybe I should have asked market forum? And yeah I EFTed it. My matar toon does not have drones past Medium (phoon being the only thing they have that would fit a rack of large). |
Slash Harnet
Inner Shadow
0
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Posted - 2011.11.06 12:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
I like the phoon in general, and the fleet issue is great. I fly one because it's practically the only high DPS/High Armor buffer minmatar ship. The extra low is the selling point in my book, and the cheap market prices don't hurt either. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
981
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Posted - 2011.11.06 13:52:00 -
[8] - Quote
JitaJane wrote: Just an anomoly I have noticed but nobody seems to pimp the Typhoon Fleet Issue. They are 2 and change most places. DPS 1K without drones. And yet I am one of the few people I have run into that fly them. Admittedly they require a wide skill base to use effectively. But at 100M or so more than a Maelstrom and much cheaper than the Mach (albeit without the range) the phoon is a beast.
Please to be keeping this quiet.
TYVM Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
981
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Posted - 2011.11.06 13:59:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kesshisan wrote:The thing about the Typhoon is that with low isk and high skills you can make a very powerful ship.
The thing about the Fleet Typhoon is that with high isk and high skills you can make a very very powerful ship.
The high isk cost negates the advantage that the regular Typhoon has over comparable ships. If you were to use your high isk and high skills you could make a much better ship from almost any other comparable faction/pirate BS.
OK, I'll set a budget of 450M ISK for the Fleetphoon to be "undock ready", which I know for a fact is enough to make a very nicely fitted TFI with (assuming gang bonuses) close to 200k EHP and 1k DPS, full tackle, a heavy neut, ECM drones for that GTFO factor, and the speed and sig (although not the agility, alas) of a battlecruiser. (A typhoon with overheated MWD and Skirmish bonuses is shockingly fast.)
Let's see your "much better" ship for the same ISK. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
122
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Posted - 2011.11.06 14:52:00 -
[10] - Quote
ITT: people underestimate fleetphoon.
and I like it being underestimated.
more people to be surprised of when they get a shield fleetphoon up their arses shockingly fast [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
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river Zateki
Dutch Squad Chained Reactions
2
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Posted - 2011.11.06 20:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
Phoon makes a great ship for almost anything, but by the time you get the skills for that youll have isk rolling out your butt for better things. The things great in the fact that it can use missile and turrets AND full flight of sentry drones+extras. Oh and hase damage mods for the weapon systems too and a winner lowslot layout. Oh and it looks like a needle =P |
Nimrod Nemesis
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
42
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Posted - 2011.11.06 21:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
The Typhoon and Fleet Phoon have and will always be a way for sp-heavy pilots to get the most for their isk. It's certainly not a minmatar flagship, but as Malcanis pointed out, it gets everything you need on a budget. If you're concerned about ~iskwar and intend on flying a bs, you can't go wrong with a typhoon (assuming you have the SP for it).
I would also reccomend against newbs training for this beast strait-away. You could quite-easily spend the better part of half a decade training and still find more points to optomize this swiss-army-ship. |
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2011.11.06 21:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
Really just need moar drones. Using mediums and logis ATM. Accidentally got missile skills cross/ training. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
123
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Posted - 2011.11.06 22:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
JitaJane wrote:Really just need moar drones. Using mediums and logis ATM. Accidentally got missile skills cross/ training.
it has the largest dronebay outside gallente lineup. bigger than a megathron's. it can pack 5 heavies or sentries and 5 mediums or 2x5 lights.
giving it even more dronebay would be silly. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2011.11.06 22:37:00 -
[15] - Quote
I meant moar drone skills. The odd bit on the phoon is it is the only Minnie ship that has drone bandwidth for more than mediums. Hence the first time you'd need to train them. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
123
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Posted - 2011.11.06 22:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
ah.
well, then go ahead. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Kesshisan
58
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Posted - 2011.11.07 09:17:00 -
[17] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:OK, I'll set a budget of 450M ISK for the Fleetphoon to be "undock ready", which I know for a fact is enough to make a very nicely fitted TFI with (assuming gang bonuses) close to 200k EHP and 1k DPS, full tackle, a heavy neut, ECM drones for that GTFO factor, and the speed and sig (although not the agility, alas) of a battlecruiser. (A typhoon with overheated MWD and Skirmish bonuses is shockingly fast.)
Let's see your "much better" ship for the same ISK.
I will admit that I cannot EFT warrior a ship better than that with the given price ceiling. However, your post without the fit is suspect. Here are the parts that I feel are the most worrying:
You claim to have the sig of a BC, yet you claim to be using a MWD. You claim to have 200k EHP and 1k DPS at the same time. Vs which resistance, or is this omnitanked? And are you counting your drones as part of your DPS while claiming to have ECM drones available for the GTFO factor, too? You can stick both in the drone bay, but you can't have them both deployed.
The lack of an EFT fit makes me worry that you are just spewing numbers that sound cool but impossible to achieve in reality. But if you can post something reasonable and prove me wrong I will gladly eat crow. . |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
987
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Posted - 2011.11.07 10:01:00 -
[18] - Quote
Kesshisan wrote:Malcanis wrote:OK, I'll set a budget of 450M ISK for the Fleetphoon to be "undock ready", which I know for a fact is enough to make a very nicely fitted TFI with (assuming gang bonuses) close to 200k EHP and 1k DPS, full tackle, a heavy neut, ECM drones for that GTFO factor, and the speed and sig (although not the agility, alas) of a battlecruiser. (A typhoon with overheated MWD and Skirmish bonuses is shockingly fast.)
Let's see your "much better" ship for the same ISK. I will admit that I cannot EFT warrior a ship better than that with the given price ceiling. However, your post without the fit is suspect. Here are the parts that I feel are the most worrying: You claim to have the sig of a BC, yet you claim to be using a MWD. You claim to have 200k EHP and 1k DPS at the same time. Vs which resistance, or is this omnitanked? And are you counting your drones as part of your DPS while claiming to have ECM drones available for the GTFO factor, too? You can stick both in the drone bay, but you can't have them both deployed. The lack of an EFT fit makes me worry that you are just spewing numbers that sound cool but impossible to achieve in reality. But if you can post something reasonable and prove me wrong I will gladly eat crow.
Phoon has a 320m sig, which compares to a tier2 BC. Tier2 BCs experience sig bloom from MWDs just the same as BS. "Close to" 200k EHP, with Legion boost and overheated hardeners. The drones count as part of the DPS; once you're in GTFO mode, you're not applying DPS in any case, you're getting the f out.
As for the fit, start with a faction EANM, 3 faction hardeners, a 1600mm RT, 2 BCUs and a DCU in the lows, add 3 trimarks, a boosting Legion, and overheat those hardners. You get something in the range of 185-195k EHP if memory serves. I'm at work so I can't give you the exact figure, but you can eft it up pretty quick. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Potato IQ
Hedion University Amarr Empire
13
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Posted - 2011.11.07 10:51:00 -
[19] - Quote
I thought the 450m was a high figure, although suspected it must be a faction tank to get the 200k
With the cost of TFIGÇÖs being less that 250m last time I checked, 300m will get you a 150k tank without any boosting/heat with the same DPS, in fact should be around the 1.1k with all VGÇÖs with 2 weapon systems iirc. Take into account you can have a point/web/TP and then a choice of ECCM or prop for your mid utility and have 3 utility high for nuet/cap bounce/RR, unclear what you were smoking when you wrote this
Kesshisan wrote:The high isk cost negates the advantage that the regular Typhoon has over comparable ships. If you were to use your high isk and high skills you could make a much better ship from almost any other comparable faction/pirate BS.
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Kesshisan
58
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Posted - 2011.11.07 11:01:00 -
[20] - Quote
Potato IQ wrote:I thought the 450m was a high figure, although suspected it must be a faction tank to get the 200k With the cost of TFIGÇÖs being less that 250m last time I checked, 300m will get you a 150k tank without any boosting/heat with the same DPS, in fact should be around the 1.1k with all VGÇÖs with 2 weapon systems iirc. Take into account you can have a point/web/TP and then a choice of ECCM or prop for your mid utility and have 3 utility high for nuet/cap bounce/RR, unclear what you were smoking when you wrote this Kesshisan wrote:The high isk cost negates the advantage that the regular Typhoon has over comparable ships. If you were to use your high isk and high skills you could make a much better ship from almost any other comparable faction/pirate BS.
I agree. It's looking more and more like I need to eat crow. The Typhoon Fleet Issue is a much better ship for the isk than I first thought. . |
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Tamiya Sarossa
Hedion University Amarr Empire
56
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Posted - 2011.11.07 16:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
Kesshisan wrote: I agree. It's looking more and more like I need to eat crow. The Typhoon Fleet Issue is a much better ship for the isk than I first thought.
No, it sucks. It's a terrible pointless upgrade for a terrible ship. You'll probably explode as soon as you undock. Don't tell anyone anything else. |
Kesshisan
58
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Posted - 2011.11.07 17:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tamiya Sarossa wrote:Kesshisan wrote: I agree. It's looking more and more like I need to eat crow. The Typhoon Fleet Issue is a much better ship for the isk than I first thought.
No, it sucks. It's a terrible pointless upgrade for a terrible ship. You'll probably explode as soon as you undock. Don't tell anyone anything else.
Not entirely sure why but two quotes here come to mind:
"I thought I was wrong once, but I found out later I was mistaken. " And "I tried to salvage a minmatar wreck for 10 minutes until he started shooting me." . |
Lady Go Diveher
The Independent Troll Society
116
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Posted - 2011.11.07 17:58:00 -
[23] - Quote
Not sure what's not to love:
[Typhoon Fleet Issue, Gank Needle] - 3% grid implant to fit Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Damage Control II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Centii C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating Centii C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating Armor Explosive Hardener II Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Warp Disruptor II Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Stasis Webifier II Quad LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets
Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Torpedo Heavy Energy Neutralizer II Heavy Energy Neutralizer II Heavy Energy Neutralizer II
Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I
Ogre II x5 Vespa EC-600 x5 Warrior II x5
1020 / 1143(OH) DPS 152k EHP before boosts - 230k best single character (slaves & Heat) 1500m/s THREE heavy neuts <350mil (I forget the exact cost)
If you lack a few fitting skills, drop the meta level on the neuts.
You can also fiddle the highs slightly, and use these in with some rep domis to fill their lack of DPS. The only thing it can't do, is operate at large fleet engagement ranges. EDIT: and anything smaller than a BC leads to poor applied DPS. |
Thomas Orca
Intaki Armaments Important Internet Spaceship League
12
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
Lady Go Diveher wrote:Not sure what's not to love:
The only thing it can't do, is operate at large fleet engagement ranges. EDIT: and anything smaller than a BC leads to poor applied DPS. These things. |
Amitious Turkey
TarNec
0
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Posted - 2011.11.07 23:35:00 -
[25] - Quote
After reading this thread, I realized...I need a 'phoon. I like to lick things.
Haunting the forums since 03. |
Songbird
37
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Posted - 2011.11.08 01:18:00 -
[26] - Quote
3 way split of the weap0n systems - it is very very bad.
Remember that time, just after you started the game and you put some ac's and some artillery in your newbie ship just so you can deal with threats that are far away and ones that are close. Remember what the newbie corp smarty pants told you - never ever mix your guns.
Typhoon is basically mixed guns.
now if it was 7/7 or even 8/8 turrets/missile launchers -well that would be a sweet ship - look for example at the new caldari tier 3 - 8 torps 8 hybrids.
As it is now it's crap with very limited and highly specialized uses. |
Lili Lu
18
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Posted - 2011.11.08 01:53:00 -
[27] - Quote
Songbird is a phoon hater
I'm a phoon lover
The fleet phoon can make a good mission ship or pvp ship properly fit and properly skilled (< which is not easy). It is not worth much for incursions. There are some other threads that talk about phoons and fleet phoons, do a search and read those. Just to answer your title, yes there is love for (some lovers of) fleet phoons. |
Potato IQ
Hedion University Amarr Empire
16
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Posted - 2011.11.08 13:23:00 -
[28] - Quote
Lili Lu wrote:Songbird is a phoon hater I'm a phoon lover .
IGÇÖm with you. LetGÇÖs unite and shoot Songbird as he stoopid pottymouth
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JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
14
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Posted - 2011.11.08 13:42:00 -
[29] - Quote
SongBird has written nigh poetically on some of the Mach threads so I vote to spare him... |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
128
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Posted - 2011.11.08 14:39:00 -
[30] - Quote
Songbird wrote:3 way split of the weap0n systems - it is very very bad.
Remember that time, just after you started the game and you put some ac's and some artillery in your newbie ship just so you can deal with threats that are far away and ones that are close. Remember what the newbie corp smarty pants told you - never ever mix your guns.
Typhoon is basically mixed guns.
now if it was 7/7 or even 8/8 turrets/missile launchers -well that would be a sweet ship - look for example at the new caldari tier 3 - 8 torps 8 hybrids.
As it is now it's crap with very limited and highly specialized uses.
thing is, the "highly" specialized use of the 'phoon is being a jack of all trades.
and it works. making the damn thing even more flexible but balanced would be quite hard, specially when you combine the inherent agility and speed of the ship. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
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