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Drizit
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Posted - 2006.03.08 05:29:00 -
[1]
Is there any way to make skills on Sisi instant training? I want to try out a few different ships and loadouts to see if they are suitable for what I want but don't have the skills for them and don't want to train them if the ship isn't going to do what I want.
This is only like RL where I wouldn't want to waste time training for a pilots licence to fly a microlight only to find out I really needed a jet pilots licence for a leerjet.
-- My idea of an OS is one that Operates the System, not a complete package of every piece of software ever written. Computers created "The Paperless Office". But some stupid fool invented a printer |
Copine Callmeknau
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Posted - 2006.03.08 05:31:00 -
[2]
/signed
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With five million sheep in this army I seem to be the only one fit to command
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Zarthanon
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Posted - 2006.03.08 07:57:00 -
[3]
Rahzelk was nice enough to write this program, called "Quickfit", in which you can fit out your ship in any way possible pretty much. Works great IMO.
Originally by: ParMizaN i mayv or may nit abe a bit drunk
Originally by: Buddrow TO THETR DRUMNBS OF WAR WET GHO
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Drizit
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Posted - 2006.03.08 07:59:00 -
[4]
I have that program but what you see on paper doesn't give you a feel for what it can actually do in the field. A bit like seeing the specs for a new car doesn't actually give you the feel of what it's like to drive and how it may perform with your particular driving style.
-- My idea of an OS is one that Operates the System, not a complete package of every piece of software ever written. Computers created "The Paperless Office". But some stupid fool invented a printer |
Steno
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Posted - 2006.03.08 12:35:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Drizit Is there any way to make skills on Sisi instant training?
quite a long time back, when there were many many new skills introduced, a high rate of skill training was introduced. Basically you started training, restarted client and it was finished.
Now, the BH have said that we need to keep testing skill training everyting needs testing. Yes there is the very occasional problem with skill training that might need fixing. Yet their argument fails when no one can fly the ships to test them and when they hit tranq we find huge bugs that would have been found on test server. I dont mean the bugs that invariably leak through but the very serious ones with new items that no one can test because they are not able to skill wise or the item is not shown out of the "wow" factor for release on Tranq.
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2006.03.08 16:42:00 -
[6]
Then why not introduce Singularity-only +50 implants. This way people can train fast for new stuff to test, yet skill training is still tested.
Regular mirrors from TQ would ensure that the balance remains though, so different stuff will always be tested, not only titans.
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Breed Love
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Posted - 2006.03.09 00:09:00 -
[7]
/signed ------
Originally by: Gariuys Breed Love for president.
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memeo2
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Posted - 2006.03.09 16:12:00 -
[8]
one time there was a mirror that gave u all your ship skills to lvl 5. Maybe there are some skills that could be auto set to lvl 5, as they have been around since release, or are known to be stable. I disagee with insta skill training, as it would provide a unrealistic testing enviroment, but a accelerated learning time feature, maybe by setting all skills to rank 1, would help with the more advanced stuff. i.e. capital construction 5 taking 5d instead of 70d ATM, the test server can only be truely used by a few pilots, as the longer skills take weeks to finish, and the next mirror is always just as you finish them
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Outa Rileau
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Posted - 2006.03.09 21:21:00 -
[9]
Originally by: memeo2 one time there was a mirror that gave u all your ship skills to lvl 5. Maybe there are some skills that could be auto set to lvl 5, as they have been around since release, or are known to be stable. I disagee with insta skill training, as it would provide a unrealistic testing enviroment, but a accelerated learning time feature, maybe by setting all skills to rank 1, would help with the more advanced stuff. i.e. capital construction 5 taking 5d instead of 70d ATM, the test server can only be truely used by a few pilots, as the longer skills take weeks to finish, and the next mirror is always just as you finish them
so /signed <.<
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Blind Man
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Posted - 2006.03.09 21:43:00 -
[10]
dunno why they dont do this, patch after patch we go with new ships bugged up from -no- player testing __________
Current Vid |
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Philip Stark
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Posted - 2006.03.10 10:52:00 -
[11]
Aye I agree its going to be hard to test out things if we keep having to retrain. Or if the only people willing to help test dont have teh skills needed to test the untested areas before going to Live. If the Devs want to test skill training one of the 2 suggestions made in this threat have merrit, A make SISI only implants that are like +50 or +75 to stats so time to train is Reduced, which would be easier i think than to recode skills so that a normal skill that takes a month to rain is down to just 30min. So to the powers that be please do something about skill training on SISI so that we can help test out all the ablities so you have a better idea on what needs fixing before going to Live.
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Aurora Tagan
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Posted - 2006.03.10 12:20:00 -
[12]
/signed
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Spartan III
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Posted - 2006.03.10 12:33:00 -
[13]
/signed ******************** Wolven Elite Guard is recruiting - join and lets kick some BoB and .5. butt!
OMFWTFYarrBQPwn3d!!!11eleventy-one |
Phonix
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Posted - 2006.03.10 12:37:00 -
[14]
/signed
Btw bring Sisi back up, can't train because it's always down..
Fate Website & Killboard
CEO of Fate
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Drakxter
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Posted - 2006.03.10 15:01:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Drizit Is there any way to make skills on Sisi instant training? I want to try out a few different ships and loadouts to see if they are suitable for what I want but don't have the skills for them and don't want to train them if the ship isn't going to do what I want.
The problem here, and a thing you forget: Sisi is not a "test my setup safely without having to loose any money on modules or ships I did not need anyway" server.
Sisi is a "test new features in the game to make sure they are bug free on release, test errors you might have seen on TQ so you can file bug reports on them and give all the info you could get and so on" server.
So.. Sisi not "test my setups", but "test for BUGS".. Mkey!! -------------
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Michayel Lyon
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Posted - 2006.03.10 15:38:00 -
[16]
Very very very /signed.
Originally by: Drakxter The problem here, and a thing you forget: Sisi is not a "test my setup safely without having to loose any money on modules or ships I did not need anyway" server.
Sisi is a "test new features in the game to make sure they are bug free on release, test errors you might have seen on TQ so you can file bug reports on them and give all the info you could get and so on" server.
So.. Sisi not "test my setups", but "test for BUGS".. Mkey!!
Hmm... Most players can fly cruisers... On TQ. So most of the bugs should be ironed out. So why should I have to go to SiSi to bug-test a ship I fly everyday on TQ? Or train for 2 months to fly a ship that a bunch of people is already flying?
Yes, the intention of SiSi might not be to let everybody test all kind of ship setups in a totally risk-free environment. But increasing the rate of training will enable a lot more people to actually test the new stuff. If this also brings some more people onto SiSi just because they want to test their setups, so what?
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Strongarm Sally
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Posted - 2006.03.10 15:39:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Strongarm Sally on 10/03/2006 15:39:58
Originally by: Drakxter Sisi is a "test new features in the game to make sure they are bug free on release, test errors you might have seen on TQ so you can file bug reports on them and give all the info you could get and so on" server.
So.. Sisi not "test my setups", but "test for BUGS".. Mkey!!
Very true. However, considering that the test server's usual population is well less than 100 accounts, not everyone can test the 'new features' to any extent due to the skill demands on many of the new items and features.
Take, for example, Carriers. The skills required by these ships are quite good. However, the current population of the game was nowhere near ready to even test these ships and the resulting training time took far longer than the Devs were willing to let RMR sit on SiSi. Same thing goes for many of the items released in RMR. Most of them were riddled with bugs (some still are) that could have, most likely, been weeded out had the players willing to spend time on SiSi been able to test them.
The key here is 'players willing to spend time on SiSi to test'. Many highly skilled players, simply, dont bother with SiSi for whatever reasons (most spend time out in 0.0 in fleet combat). This means that CCP should have some system in place to help those lesser skilled players actually TEST the items that need it.
Personally, I'm quite bored on TQ. There is far too large a portion of the population that is crowded into an area too small to hold them comfortably (won't go there, not the issue), so I spend time on the test server in an attempt to help make TQ more exciting for myself and others.
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Tauge
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Posted - 2006.03.10 15:46:00 -
[18]
Also, an extra bonus to the fact that people are testing new setups in a risk-free environment is that they will also test out new ships and modules, if only just to see what they can do. Sisi, need something to speed up skill training simply because training times for the average new ship are getting longer and longer. And CCP doens't want to wait, and neither should they have to. The +50 implants are a good idea to fix this. Just to get training times down.
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Medici
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Posted - 2006.03.10 19:01:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Medici on 10/03/2006 19:01:09 Just a point here that perhaps the Devs could give all players logging into Sisi Cybernetics 5,and also seed +5 implants,this way al least players could not only speed up their learning times more but also get to use a full set of those oh so tasty Crystal Implants Another thing I remember are supposed Drug Boosters that will be coming in Kali,there are many for all kinds of attributes but also Skill Training. I would think that in TQ the poss scarecity and so cost would make using tons of them prohibitive.This however wouldn't be a problem on Sisi if they were seeded at 100Isk,and so could also be used to significantly boost attribs,without the instatrain many players want.
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Drakxter
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Posted - 2006.03.11 19:20:00 -
[20]
A thing I want to point out to those that replied to me reply..
The auther of the thread, Drizit did not say he wanted to test for bugs, but that he wanted to use it as a safe place for testing setups and ships before deciding if he wanted to get them on TQ.
As I said, Sisi is for bug testing, not just for testing if you like a setup or not before you try it on TQ. -------------
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Drizit
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Posted - 2006.03.11 20:07:00 -
[21]
But as someone else said, Sisi has a very low population anyway. If this sort of testing is done by everyone, it would help with load problems.
If more people had tested the blood patch, CCP would have found the memory leak bug on Sisi and we wouldn't have had to suffer it on TQ. By allowing people to test out setups and ships that they are considering, it would help increase the load on Sisi and help find a few more bugs that would otherwise have been missed in the process.
Also, as it's been pointed out, They introduce new ships but nobody has the skills to fly them. With a lot of people testing different new ships and loadouts, many of the bugs could be found quickly and ironed out before release.
Even setting all skills to rank 1 so it's 5 days to train, you could be facing 15 days or more to train all the skills you need. By that time, the data could have been mirrored again from TQ and you'd be back to the start, having got absolutely nowhere.
Risking it all on TQ is fine if you have all the time in the world and are already doing what you enjoy. I don't want to face training for 90 days or more just to find that I've totally wasted my time because what I trained for isn't even suitable for what I need. I've now got to the stage where I mine a little, I manufacture a little and then I switch off. I am now looking for something more and I can't get it with the skills I have. I want a ship to do something more than mine and haul and run around to stations picking up BPO's and orders. However, what I want, I am not sure and I don't want to waste my time skilling up everything just to find it, that would take too long and I'd eventually give up Eve altogether out of sheer boredom. What I need is a goal and even if it takes 6 months to get there, at least I'd know I would be able to do the things I want at the end of it so it would be an incentive to keep playing. Without that goal, I am looking at an aimless series of tests and no definite time before I can go out and do other things. Therefore, no goal means the boredom level increases to the point where I log off one night never to return.
I like the idea of 50 point implants on Sisi so that it will take a very short time to train anything. Even a couple of days rather than a month to train for something would be a bonus.
-- My idea of an OS is one that Operates the System, not a complete package of every piece of software ever written. Computers created "The Paperless Office". But some stupid fool invented a printer |
Mesasone
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Posted - 2006.03.11 21:45:00 -
[22]
Drakxter is absolutely right and I agree with him: The purpose of the test server isnt to test out new setups simply because you cant use them on TQ and arent willing to train the skills, or are too cheap to buy and try a set up yourself. If you want to try something, then TRY it.
However, there is a flip side to all of this. When these people jump on SiSi to try out new setups or for whatever reason, they will also ineventidbly help discover bugs. The question is though, are these people actually going to examine their set ups hard enough to notice that something isnt working quite right (versus not at all), and will they bug report it?
In anycase, I completely agree with the need for accelerated skill training in some fashion. CCP has been adding alot of higher rank skills, which may require level 5 in some odd skill that nobody had any reason to take to level 5 before. So, few, if any, bother to train and test the skills, and as such the skills go untested anyway :(
Silly mods, sigs are for wabbits. |
Commander Kahn'Alzaor
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Posted - 2006.03.11 23:20:00 -
[23]
Sad but true some people use sisi for testing for personal gain. I did it with pos's
Who cares what they are doing the recent catastrophy on TQ over memroy leaking could have been fixed on sisi if we had 1000 or more people online testing their uber gankeddon.
So what i say is this
- +75 or +50 implants to speed training so we can fly anything we have the urge to fly.
- Allow players to do what they like on the test server normal rules about combat apply.
That way we can create load while those wanting to test the features in patch notes ect can do what they do best.
Btw regular popups on TQ like the 'invaders' messages would probly help get some intrest.
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