Oh look this post again!

Yes, the lottery was ********.
Yes, some people got literally a few hundred billion isk thrown at them by virtue of clicking a research agent a few years ago.
No, you can't get a tech II BPO for free anymore.
Yes, you can still get one.
No, they are not really worth it from a RoI perspective
Yes, you can still build tech II and make ridiculous amounts of isk with invention

Oh, don't be so harsh!

I think the OP has a point: the EULA doesn't state that you have to work / think / do math for your ISK, either.

I'ts a EULA disaster!

I demand that CCP changes the EULA accordingly or I rage quit and close my 621 accounts too ... or not.

Tech II BPO's arent available to the public?

Now, that I'm officially an ass, I can also tell you that your metaphores suck!

Probably just too intelligent for you to understand. I'm sorry. If I have to use another I will be sure to use
one about crayons and eating glue. I'm sure you will understand that one.

All desire for me to give you a detailed explanation of what you want went away when I saw this post of yours.

I will say this; if you think you need a T2 BPO, you don't understand invention.

Maybe my sense of unfairness is heightened lately, probably brought into focus with so much "Occupy" protesting
being in the news as of late. Perhaps its made me a little sensitive to shady practices by businesses.

None the less, what CCP has done isn't fair to their average consumer, and as such the price of the product should
reflect that, and the consumer should be made aware of that before they make the decision to purchase. Really, that
shouldn't be asking for too much. If we can't ask for a fair shake from the people we give our hard earned cash to,
then this economy really is going to ****, along with the rest of the world.

Either you're a bad troll or you're too stupid to understand the role of T2 BPO plays in eve economy...

I got one more ass-question: How many blue pills did you take, dude?

Thanks for the replies everyone, except for Lutz, you're just an ass.

Yes I know some players have BPO's for sale. Do I have billions of ISK at my disposal to buy one? No.

The problem here is that this is a consumer product, a game. It was intended for entertainment purposes.
Let's use another entertainment example. Let's say you go to the movies, and see... Tranformers 3 (I dunno).
Lets say that the movie theatre advertises that you will see the whole movie, all 154 minutes of it. You get your
popcorn and you get your soda, maybe some candy too, and you sit down ready for 154 minutes of entertainment.

Now, the movie is over, and you noticed that you only got 120 minutes of entertainment. You approach the manager
to ask where the other 34 minutes of the movie went, and they kindly explain that the other 34 minutes of the movie
was shown to movie goers a week previously, and there is no way you can watch the rest of the movie now.

Are you going to be happy? No.

Are you going to be upset you paid money to see 4/5 of a movie? Yes.

The problem here is that they advertise this game as being the same for everyone. Everyone has the same opportunity
as everyone else to utilize this consumer product in the same way. But apparently that isn't true!

If CCP doesn't want to let everyone have access to tech II BPO's, that's fine. But they should advertise that they are
selling an incomplete product, and monthly fees should be adjusted to reflect this for those who do not have
access to the whole product.

I am really curious just how CCP has protected themselves from legal action concerning this.

No pill Lutz. It is not unreasonable for me to expect the same treatment and the same product available to every
other subscriber of EVE. After all, we all pay the same price (except people paying in euros, I understand your
frustration). Except I guess the same product isn't available to us all, now is it?

I'm even more curious now. Are there other aspects to EVE that aren't available to the general public? I don't mean
trivial promotional stuff like the 30 day implant for new trial accounts, I mean large game changing exclusions like
tech II BPO's?

I'm even more curious now. Are there other aspects to EVE that aren't available to the general public? I don't mean
trivial promotional stuff like the 30 day implant for new trial accounts, I mean large game changing exclusions like
tech II BPO's?

Ok I know this was probably covered years ago, but I just recently came back to EVE and am just now hearing this:

Tech II BPO's arent available to the public? They were only given out by "lottery" during their introduction?

How is this fair to any new or returning players with a focus on manufacturing? Why is this not listed in the EULA, that
not all game items are available to everyone? I feel cheated to learn just now that I will most likely never get my hands
on a tech II BPO. This is something that should be stated in the EULA, and us consumers should be well informed
before we decide to hand over our hard earned cash to play EVE.

This is like going to an icecream stand and seeing them advertise chocolate sprinkles, but then telling you that
"Oh, we're sorry, those sprinkles were only given out to people four years ago, you cant have any now".

I'm starting to remember why I didnt stick with this game previously. Excuse me while I go contemplate paying a monthly
fee for part of a game....

Either you're a bad troll or you're too stupid to understand the role of T2 BPO plays in eve economy...

Read down til the part where someone said we pay the same price so we should all have the same access to all content. Go **** yourself. If I put in the time and energy to get billions of isk while you just sit on your ass talking to people and not using your in game time efficiently to accomplish something you want, then you shouldnt get the same content as me.

I hate the bastards that think they are entitled to everything someone else has worked their ass off for in real life, I dont want it in my games too. Entertainment is what we pay for, every single one of us has the ability to aquire the same exact assets, if you put forth the effor to get it. If you put in less than someone else, you will get less returned. Simple as that.

The world needs to stop accomodating the lowest common denominator who cries cuz they want to be lazy.

Because T2 BPOs are "game changing"?


If you want to sue CCP, then do it proprely and include how not having a Guardian-Vexor or an Imperial Apocalypse is changing your game experience, and how you don't have fun without them.

Did CCP advertise T2 BPO's somewhere?

If you like RL comparisons: browsing the advertisements for caribbean sea holidays, you will see many photos with luxury yachts with heli landing pad and a bunch of models lieing on the sun deck etc.

Of course this available to YOU, IF you got the money. If you don't have the money, you need to chose the standard package.
The same works in EVE. If you have enough RL money, buy PLEX and convert them to ISK and you can own any of the T2 BPOs available on the market.

Otherwise choose the standard package like 99.99% do.

No thats not my point either. Im not out to sue anyone. I would just stop paying for their service.

As far as it being game changing, Im sure it was for those fortunate enough to have obtained them when they were
handed out.

Guardian-Vexor

You are missing the point entirely. Of course people that work hard in this game should be rewarded with the things they
earn. I am not talking about making money, nor about acquiring any specific tech II ship or part. Not everyone has the
ability to acquire the exact same assets. Under the current policy its IMPOSSIBLE for every single player to have these
BPO's

they do not have any role at all in the eve economy. ccp just doesn't want to make people angry by removing them.

What's a shame is that the T1 BPC's ME/PE level has on influence on the T2 BPC ME/PE level - which would let inventors (who arguably do a lot more work to compete) with the T2 BPO owners.

It would have to be a rather large conversion rate though - maybe the sqrt() or cube root of the input ME to calculate the output ME, or divide the input ME by 10 to get the output ME. Probably square root would work best as it would scale rather badly and you'd never be able to get perfect ME on your T2 BPCs without over-researching your T1 BPO for a few monthsyears.

Output ME = -5 + Int(Sqrt(Input ME))

To get to ME 30 on an output T2 BPC, you'd need a T1 BPC with an ME of 1225. To get an ME of 10 on the T2 BPC, you'd need an ME of 225 on the input BPC. Or the use of a decryptor (which would still be an option).

It would add some spice to the calculations - do you research the BPO to ME 100 and get T2 BPCs with an ME of 5? Or do you go higher and shoot for an ME of 10 on the result?

You are missing the point entirely. stuff. Under the current policy its IMPOSSIBLE for every single player to have these
BPO's.

I would just stop paying for their service.

No thats not my point either. Im not out to sue anyone. I would just stop paying for their service.

I am really curious just how CCP has protected themselves from legal action concerning this.

I am really curious just how CCP has protected themselves from legal action concerning this.

Lets put it this way, they could reset everyone's skillpoints, standings, sov, remove all assets and more tonight and....all you could really do to "combat" this is unsubscribe.

Final example: I (mostly) invent and build Mackinaws. After taking into all the costs to build said ships (including BPCs, Datacores, Decryptor and materials) I make about 24-25 million on a Mack. I build 6-7 of them per day (on average, depending a bit on invention succes rates), so my invention + building makes me about 150-160 million per day. Without a BPO. A BPO owner will be able to build TWO Mackinaws per day. His profit per Mack will be 40% higher because his will be ME 1 or ME 2 while mine is negative (varying on which decryptor gives the best return, which is market dependant and mostly related to the cost of Nanotransistors, but I'm starting to go off-topic now). At 40% higher profit, he will make 80 million a day. That's half what I make.

So ye, sure that takes very little time, no invention, very little effort and only 1 factory slot. However, just selling the BPO for 150 billion or so would actually be a lot better. It would take 5 years for that print to have made 150b isk. I'd rather have 150b NOW than 150b in 5 years.

I dont agree with OP, but this final example is not good imo, because as owner I can have more than just one T2 BPO and run 10 slots of different things. Then I can do much more ISK than inventer.


Another question, why is the price for veld mining crystal II so low?

You do realise that there are like ... MAYBE 10 of any one T2 BPO in the game, right?

Another question, why is the price for veld mining crystal II so low?

You do realise that there are like ... MAYBE 10 of any one T2 BPO in the game, right?

If you have 1 trillion ISK to spend on said 10 BPOs (I know, good BPO are a lot more) then yeah ... you deserve a little bit of a break.

I dont agree with OP, but this final example is not good imo, because as owner I can have more than just one T2 BPO and run 10 slots of different things. Then I can do much more ISK than inventer.

Too much negativity... how about if CCP Did issue a warning it would read something like this:


WARNING

You are about to enter the universe of EVE. As a capsuleer, you may grow to wield awesome power capable of unleashing cataclysmic events.

However, you are not alone in the universe. There are others who have come before you, they have build up empires, plundered worlds, cut swathes of destruction in their way and build up huge industrial complexes in the heart of hostile territory, or learned to push the market forces of entire galaxies in their favour. In so doing they have amassed fortunes beyond reckoning and gathered rare and unique artefacts and knowledge which gives them the power which they now sit on.

Are you strong enough to compete? Know that while you can achieve some measure of success on your own, sooner or later you will come into conflict with your fellows. The fastest path to power is the one in which you steal, buy or destroy the power base of your competitors, and only in this way will you gain some of the power that the ones which have come before you have amassed.

And when you reach the pinnacle of your power, you can rest in the knowledge that right behind you, another generation of power hungry capsuleers is rising... and that they are coveting your wealth with a greed and cunning which may turn out to match your own.

Welcome Capsuleer... and know that once you fly past this point, you will never turn back.

You Have Been Warned.

Yeh. You could theoretically have 10 tech II BPOs, You could also technically have 280 and have 28 characters. That's still besides the point. Yes, winning the lottery, what, FIVE, years ago is making you free isk with little effort. It's still not an awful lot of isk, as tech II BPOs have actually a really bad isk/hour conversion due the the insanely long build times. They might have been amazing when Jita sold, like, 200 Hammerheads II per day and 1 billion isk was A LOT of money, but in a world where thousands of said drones are sold in just one station and Casual-Joe the Mission Runner has 2bil in his wallet it's really not so good anymore.

Yes t2 BPOs obviously have better isk/hr than their invention counterparts, but if you take their auction value into account it-¦s actually really bad. Really, why do so few people actually understand how this works...

Almost of the T2 mining crystals are that way. Mostly because the BPO owners can keep up with demand enough to drive the prices way below what it costs to invent them. Big loss item for an inventor, moderate profit for a BPO owner - and probably too easy to flood the market with over-supply.

My question should be: Why si the price for veld mining crystal II so low when T2 BPOs have no or very low impact on markets (like ppl mentioned here)?
uff my english is bad sorry

My question should be: Why si the price for veld mining crystal II so low when T2 BPOs have no or very low impact on markets (like ppl mentioned here)?
uff my english is bad sorry

My question should be: Why si the price for veld mining crystal II so low when T2 BPOs have no or very low impact on markets (like ppl mentioned here)?
uff my english is bad sorry

OMG I have no problem with T2 BPOs. I just said that your example is bad in my opinion, because it havent cleared anything. You just cant compare 1 slot manufactorer and 10 slots manufactorer together. Do compare owner with 1 account and 1 character and inventer with 1 account and 1 character both same skills, station,....

The butthurt is strong in the OP.

Get over it dude. That's like saying that the state can't pay out lottery winnings unless EVERYONE gets some; it would make it worthless. Do you also complain that you didn't get to fly the pre-nerf versions of several ships that are no longer as good as they were? Think of it as a benefit of being an older player and move on. Life isn't fair, and this game isn't either.