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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.13 20:37:00 -
[61]
The collision change has messed up missles ability to track targets horribly..
I'm kind of peeved that missles can now be shot down with turrets.. TomB, if I want to disrupt turrets I need to use multiple modules to do so.. but now to stop missles all you need is a fast target lock and to shoot them?
What's the point of defenders and smartbombs if someone can just point and click missles dead???
Turrets already have many advantages over missles, for instance, turrets ignore collision, they can shoot through a station or asteroid and hit someone.. missles will instead strike the station. No more negatives for missles, please. :)
Cruise missle skill is still broke, does FOF missle damage bonus work? I don't think it does either, will this be in for patch? ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.09.13 20:57:00 -
[62]
its always been possible to shoot down missiles, its just not many people figured it out ;) . ----- Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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TomB
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Posted - 2003.09.14 18:18:00 -
[63]
Quote: The collision change has messed up missles ability to track targets horribly..
There hasn't been any changes with collision, missiles are still as hard to hit with turrets as before patch.
Quote: I'm kind of peeved that missles can now be shot down with turrets.. TomB, if I want to disrupt turrets I need to use multiple modules to do so.. but now to stop missles all you need is a fast target lock and to shoot them?
But to be able to shoot a missile you have to have focus of all targets to be able to target it and then be able to shoot it before it hits you. Using this as a tactic is impossible when many missiles are flying at you, specially when you can't shoot the ship that is blowing you away.
Quote: Cruise missle skill is still broke, does FOF missle damage bonus work? I don't think it does either, will this be in for patch?
All missile skills were broke, we are working on them right now.
"Where is my hat?" |
Scobichevskaya
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Posted - 2003.09.14 18:38:00 -
[64]
Quote: As I stated, Nanofibers have more effect on smaller ships. The effect is not that much for acceleration from min to max speed, but you can notice the effect more of the nanofibers when you go to orbiting, the ships will keep more speed when taking turns.
Doh. I really liked moving fast. It makes the game a lot less boring, makes close combat possible, and much easier to pick up containers after killing a bunch of NPCs. How are battleships going to get close to enemies now? I used afterburners instead of MWD so my shield and cap aren't reduced, but for a BShip that moves so slow, it makes using close-to-medium range weapons difficult to use (if in PvP, you may never catch up to the enemy). I don't think too many people use the nanofibers and I would like it to be a user choice to use them or not as long as they still remain effective. If they get severely nerfed, then they will be nearly useless for BShips.
------------- RUS / RUA RUSSIAN Team
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.09.14 18:48:00 -
[65]
Quote: There hasn't been any changes with collision, missiles are still as hard to hit with turrets as before patch.
he was referring to the missiles that fly to the target, then instead of hitting it and exploding, simply start orbiting it till they run out of flight time (on chaos apparently) . ----- Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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TomB
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Posted - 2003.09.14 19:53:00 -
[66]
Quote: he was referring to the missiles that fly to the target, then instead of hitting it and exploding, simply start orbiting it till they run out of flight time (on chaos apparently)
There have been done no changes with the missiles for quite some time and I'm not able to reproduce this, it could possibly be lag where the bracket for the missile does not dissapear?
"Where is my hat?" |
Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.09.14 19:59:00 -
[67]
Quote: Doh. I really liked moving fast. It makes the game a lot less boring, makes close combat possible, and much easier to pick up containers after killing a bunch of NPCs. How are battleships going to get close to enemies now? I used afterburners instead of MWD so my shield and cap aren't reduced, but for a BShip that moves so slow, it makes using close-to-medium range weapons difficult to use (if in PvP, you may never catch up to the enemy). I don't think too many people use the nanofibers and I would like it to be a user choice to use them or not as long as they still remain effective. If they get severely nerfed, then they will be nearly useless for BShips.
That's why they are making Nanos more efficient on frigates and cruisers. What's the point of making a proportionally equal change to all ship categories? The aim is to get pilots to use Nanos and along with the changes in SignatureRadius, Orbit changes, Tracking speed etc make smaller ships usefull in PvP.
Now if you want a speedy BS you need MWDs. You can't complain about the cap usage though cause that is the cost you pay for 1)being fast 2)being able to deliver lots of damage. Can't have it all without some balance.
Besides you can still use a close range slow BS for cover. If these changes work well you won't have to worry about getting close to other that much since cruisers and frigates will be trying to get close to you. Stay close to the large distance ships in yer gang and provide cover against incoming ships.
I do hope PvP starts to look like this after the changes go in.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Acuna Traos
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Posted - 2003.09.14 23:37:00 -
[68]
Quote: Cruise missle skill is still broke, does FOF missle damage bonus work? I don't think it does either, will this be in for patch?
Quote: All missile skills were broke, we are working on them right now.
Also will the FOF missile damage bonus stack with the cruise missile bonus for a FOF cruise, since it is kinda both. Or are they classed as totaly different missiles?
Oh, is there any particular reason why on chaos the explosive cruise sometimes takes a chunk out of armour as well as shields? while a corp mate can't do it to me but I can to him. The only difference being that I have lvl 3 cruise he has lvl1. Though all the other missiles get totaly absorbed by the shields.
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.09.15 03:56:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Zyrla Bladestorm on 15/09/2003 03:56:50
Quote: There have been done no changes with the missiles for quite some time and I'm not able to reproduce this, it could possibly be lag where the bracket for the missile does not dissapear?
I dont have the foggiest ;) my chaos char wouldnt even have the missile skills .. what I have read from several people now however is that torpedos are managing to miss stationary battleships (and in one case a mobile refinery, though that looked like the refinery had been destroyed, but wasnt dissapearing) and the torps just orbiting the object (big glowing balls :P) untill they expire .. one pic I saw looked like someones christmas deccys floating in space .. pretty ;) . ----- Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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soltys
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Posted - 2003.09.15 21:47:00 -
[70]
Edited by: soltys on 16/09/2003 11:19:43
about orbiting in 1209 build:
Tested with Vigil + 2 afterburners.
Generally, it works pretty nice, after orbit is set up.
But the time requird to set up orbit is quite big and suicidial (in terms of frigate survival). I'll try to describe here what's happening:
1) begin: vigial near the container, unmovable. I order ship to make orbit at 5k. 2) frigate goes away from container until it reaches 5.x km range. Then it makes rapid change of direction, now trying to correct distance and get closer to container. slowing down effectively by a big margin in this process 3) then frigate gets to close and tries to correct orbit again 4) points 2-3 are repeated few times, with diminishing amplitude, of how much of the distance is to be corrected. And in consecutive repeating of points 2-3, frigate actually starts orbiting, albeit beginings are often terribly slow (due to corrections).
Small illustration:
setup problem
change orbit problem
Proposed solution: illustration
At least case when starting orbit from range greater than requested range should be easy to improve... ----------------------------------------------------------
Damage stats: click version v1.1.02 retail. |
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TomB
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Posted - 2003.09.15 22:19:00 -
[71]
Missile skills should now all be working.
"Where is my hat?" |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.15 23:27:00 -
[72]
Quote: Missile skills should now all be working.
Raven ROF bonus with seige launchers is apparently broken. ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.09.16 00:43:00 -
[73]
Quote: Missile skills should now all be working.
So this means the FoF skill and Cruise Missile skill bonuses now work? Cause if so, I've got a real question for you:
What stacking rules apply to FoF Cruise Missiles?
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Valeria
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Posted - 2003.09.16 00:44:00 -
[74]
Pretty sure TomB stated in the missile thread that all missile skills would grant a speed bonus now, which makes sense.
Your 425mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes some nublar, wrecking for 1155.0 damage. |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.16 01:33:00 -
[75]
Quote: Pretty sure TomB stated in the missile thread that all missile skills would grant a speed bonus now, which makes sense.
eh? i dont think he did, he said it was a temp thing but it should be damage.. torps > cruise atm, still.. ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
TomB
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Posted - 2003.09.16 01:47:00 -
[76]
Edited by: TomB on 16/09/2003 01:48:10 Light Missiles: 5% speed Heavy Missiles: 5% speed and flight duration Cruise Missiles: 5% speed and damage Torpedos: 10% blast radius Rockets: 5% damage FoF Missiles: 5% agility
Let me know if anything brakes
"Where is my hat?" |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.16 01:49:00 -
[77]
Quote: Edited by: TomB on 16/09/2003 01:48:10 Light Missiles: 5% speed Heavy Missiles: 5% speed and flight duration Cruise Missiles: 5% speed and damage Torpedos: 10% blast radius Rockets: 5% damage FoF Missiles: 5% agility
Let me know if anything brakes
Copied from my other post, dunno if you read anything outside this thread:
Missles need to ignore line of sight. When targetting at another ship they should ignore all obstacles and fly at their target.
Why? Because if this is not the case they will hit drones, not be able to hit people hiding in the middle of stations.. behind asteroids, cargo containers.. ect..
This is a huge issue, people with turrets can ignore all the line of sight restrictions on missles and blast you from behind any kind of obstacle, yet a missle user is helpeless in these situations.
This is something that should be a high priority to change. ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
ClawHammer III
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Posted - 2003.09.16 02:50:00 -
[78]
Actualy, I'd rather have turrets restricted by line of sight then have missles and turrets unrestricted.
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.16 02:51:00 -
[79]
Quote: Actualy, I'd rather have turrets restricted by line of sight then have missles and turrets unrestricted.
That works too.. ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2003.09.16 10:32:00 -
[80]
cruise missle skill no longer appears to be giving speed bonus as per skill description.. might wanna fix that. ------
ROBBLE ROBBLE |
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soltys
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Posted - 2003.09.16 10:55:00 -
[81]
Edited by: soltys on 16/09/2003 11:20:22 In addition to orbit's "setting up" problem:
I'm not sure what causes it, but even after initial setup phase, it sometimes take insanely a lot of time for ship to get to the nominal speed. It more or less looks like if ships had acceleration of 2m/s^2. Yet I can't find a way to always reproduce it.
So summing it up - when ship orbits something unmovable, it's very nice. But initial setup phase (my previous reply), problem outlined above and any other corrections, when ship tries to orbit something that moves - it's basically suicide if firgate is being attacked. ----------------------------------------------------------
Damage stats: click version v1.1.02 retail. |
Karash Amerius
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Posted - 2003.09.16 15:36:00 -
[82]
The optimal thing to do here is to make turret fire hit objects in the LOS...rocks, gates, etc.
Its one thing to see a lasershot go through a gate, you can rationalize that somehow...but not missiles. (imo)
Splash damage of course should be looked at as far as gates, sentry guns, and stations go.
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soltys
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Posted - 2003.09.16 16:44:00 -
[83]
orbit continued:
Situation, when ships is insanely slowly gaining speed when ordering orbit (mentioned in my post above) - it usually happens in situations, when you start orbit function directly above or below your target, with starting range smaller than requested orbiting range. ----------------------------------------------------------
Damage stats: click version v1.1.02 retail. |
Drutort
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Posted - 2003.09.17 01:20:00 -
[84]
sorry i didnt feel like reading 5+ pages... but is the mining drone ops skill working?
I got the word that it doesnt work right now? Has it been looked at and fixed if its not working?
I mean we need key skills like that to work... and since this is the drone thread i had to ask support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo
my MoBlog |
Tyrrax Thorrk
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Posted - 2003.09.17 03:21:00 -
[85]
Great job TomB, really nice to see devs talking to players
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drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2003.09.17 11:40:00 -
[86]
Quote: sorry i didnt feel like reading 5+ pages... but is the mining drone ops skill working?
I got the word that it doesnt work right now? Has it been looked at and fixed if its not working?
I mean we need key skills like that to work... and since this is the drone thread i had to ask
As far as I could tell it worked before. At lvl 1, my Harveys could pull in 85 plag, now, at level 3, it's about 100.
*golf clap for TomB*
bravo! .
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NoS Dingo
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Posted - 2003.09.18 07:12:00 -
[87]
Since when did going from 5 damage per shot to 4 (20% reduction) for a warrior drone be considered "Beefing Up" drones?
Then again... this matches the rest of the joke considered the current patch.
Playing checkers with my dog is becoming very appealing compared to this utter bull****.
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Bobby Wilson
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Posted - 2003.09.18 15:57:00 -
[88]
Quote: Since when did going from 5 damage per shot to 4 (20% reduction) for a warrior drone be considered "Beefing Up" drones?
Then again... this matches the rest of the joke considered the current patch.
Playing checkers with my dog is becoming very appealing compared to this utter bull****.
It seems to have been more a levelling in terms of damage, shields, armour, etc. As you have obviously noticed, Warriors were the best option for a small drone bay, as they had a lot of shields and did a lot of damage for their size. There seems to have been an effort in this patch to bring damage done by each drone of a certain size closer together. There are still variations in armour and shield strength, but even then they seem closer than they used to be.
Originally by: Selim
Cool, congrats.
Oh, stupid idea by the way.
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NoS Dingo
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Posted - 2003.09.18 22:44:00 -
[89]
OK... so explain the 20% to acolytes.. from 5 to 4 EM.. also 20% nerf.
Acolyte was weak before, now it is useless even against a 1k rat.
Again I question the "Beefing Up" claim.
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Scobichevskaya
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Posted - 2003.09.19 21:25:00 -
[90]
Quote: Since when did going from 5 damage per shot to 4 (20% reduction) for a warrior drone be considered "Beefing Up" drones?
Then again... this matches the rest of the joke considered the current patch.
Playing checkers with my dog is becoming very appealing compared to this utter bull****.
I was disappointed with this change as well.
Also when orbiting, my Scorpion will orbit a moving target properly (counterclockwise). But when I turn on my MWD, my Scorpion turns around and then orbits clockwise. If I turn MWD off, then my Scorp turns around and then orbits counterclockwise. Why is this?
I am also displeased with the nanofiber change. I would rather use two afterburners with nanofibers than use a MWD with different low slots. Four nanofibers doesn't seem to do anything other than give a top speed increase. I like to get close up in the battle and move with agility, but the recent change to nanofibers hinders this possibility (you can't do this with MWD since your cap and shields are cut and you won't turn fast). Fighting has been reduced to the boring standard of lock, shoot, and wait until the enemy dies. I know I'm in an EW ship and I have EW skills, but they are useless against NPCs. A Scorp can't match the firepower of other BShips, therefore I equip my ship for speed and accuracy. Also with the recent changes, my Scorp with 2 afterburners will fly past a container when I approach the container. By the time I open the container (when 1500 m away) I will fly past it and then get a message saying that I have to be within 1500 meters and the container window won't open. I then have to wait a few more seconds for the ship to turn around and then fly toward the container. Also, having to wait for my ship to get aligned to warp takes a lot longer. Flying is such a waste of my time. Right now most of the time playing Eve is just wasted in waiting for the ship to get to a destination. ------------- RUS / RUA RUSSIAN Team
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