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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 37 post(s) |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
429
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Posted - 2014.01.16 15:52:00 -
[1] - Quote
How about this:
- Drop the 5% global decrease in bounties and any ability to increase bounties above 100%
- Make the deployable siphon 20% of all bounties across the whole constellation its deployed in (perhaps even make a hauler sized one that does a whole region)
- Have anyone in range able to take all siphoned ISK directly into their wallet
People not watching intel channels might continue to rat. People stuck in anoms or escalations will probably continue to rat. Attackers get some ISK and a fight if they stick around. Defenders have to go fight you or lose multiple systems of ratting space. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
430
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Posted - 2014.01.16 16:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: The other is policing your space. Most nullsec alliances don't bother, as there is nothing out & about that can't get safe quickly, and there is nothing the "small gang raiders" can do to harm your infrastructure. This NEEDs to change! There really should be some **** vulnerable enough for you to police your borders!
Why?
Why should people spend their time in game waiting around for you to arrive? Or more accurately, waiting around for you to jump a scout in, change your mind and run away? |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
431
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Posted - 2014.01.16 16:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Tahnil wrote: They shouldnGÇÿt. They should do whatever they are doing. But IF somebody shows up, there should be some chance for small scale PvP. Currently there is nearly none at all. There might be a gank, and very rarely some locals decide to fight. But this is only once every five or more small gang roamings.
Ratting is almost purely a money making exercise. If dropping an ESS gives you 10% more income over not dropping an ESS then you need 10 people ratting in a system for every 1 person defending. Space in EVE is almost completely porous so you can't reliably defend borders. This means you need at least 1 defender for every ESS you have so any system unable to support 10 or more ratters at the same time is better off without an ESS (hint: this is all of them). |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
432
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Posted - 2014.01.16 17:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
Tahnil wrote: The ratters with the best network would have the best income, because they would get the 5% income buff provided by ESS more often than ratters without this network and good friends, helping each other out.
No, they wouldn't. Because a 5% income buff means you need to have 20 people ratting per ESS in order to make it worthwhile over just not deploying one and putting that many people in one system drops all of their income way below highsec level 4s. At that point they just won't be there. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
438
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Posted - 2014.01.16 17:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Tahnil wrote: CCP has to get it right, but they also have to tackle it. The current iteration of ESS has itGÇÿs flaws, but there has to be some kind of ESS.
CCP need to drop the idea that an ESS is ever going to be something a spaceholder would deploy themselves. You'd need a 50% or more difference in income between a system with and without one in order to make it viable in the vast majority of 0.0 space which means either reducing bounties by 50% across the board or giving the ESS the potential to increase them way too much.
Its also never going to work as purely offensive module if it only affects one system. People don't rat with hostiles in system. An undefended ESS is a dead ESS. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
440
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Posted - 2014.01.16 18:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: If presented with an ESS region and a non-ESS region, I'd probably go to the region with ESS's deployed. At the same time, that means the region with ESS's deployed will have more content defending their space. While many alliances are too nullbear to desire the increased activity, there are plenty of groups out there that would welcome the action. Frankly, I thought goons would be one of those alliances!
Disregarding the fact you aren't going to get this choice (nobody is going to ESS an entire region) you'd still be a moron. If you spend more than 6 minutes an hour dealing with the ESS you might as well have not deployed it, and thats disregarding the cost of the deployable itself. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
442
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Posted - 2014.01.17 00:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: I understand you feel that way, but disagree with you. It is an object anyone can deploy to increase their income. To benefit from it, you must harvest it after ratting for a while. It can be harvested by hostiles, too. So you must defend it or risk losing the isk you invested in it. How is this not a farms and field concept? Just because you won't risk it (because your allies will take advantage of you if you do?) doesn't make change its fundamental nature: A farms and field device that qualifies as a small gang objective.
But it doesn't increase your income. Right now it requires someone to be guarding it 100% of the time for 10% extra bounty. For it to increase anyone's income would require 9 people ratting for every 1 person defending. There isn't a single system in the game that can support 9 people ratting profitably.
And thats assuming only one single attacker who can be beaten off by a single defender. The defensive effort increases with the number of attackers but the time to loot does not. While a single defender could concievably prevent a single interceptor from looting the ESS if you bring 2 or more attackers the defenders now have to have 20+ people ratting in a system to make it worthwhile to deploy (or 4-5 times the number even the best 0.0 system can support). |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
442
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Posted - 2014.01.17 00:38:00 -
[8] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Scenario 1: You are part of a big alliance ratting. Hostiles enter the area and are reported on intel channels. Warp to it and hit share all bounties, and suddenly there isn't very much left in the thing for hostiles to confiscate.
So every time someone reports hostiles in intel I spend 5 minutes warping to my ESS and slowboating through the bubble then slowboating back and warping out again? Sounds like a great way to lose my ratting ship (and waste the 6 minutes of ratting time the 10% bounty bonus has bought me).
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Scenario 2: You are are ratting solo in the system. A hostile enters system, one of you warps to the POS, swaps to an inty, warps to the thing and the hostile has 20 seconds to stop you from hitting share all and reclaiming your bounties. Sure, they may be in an inty that can warp to it too, but they will often fail to hold you as your "button pushing" inty is certainly stabbed.
Again, considering warp time I'm losing 2-3 minutes (or 50% of my bonus for deploying the module) and risking losing my button pushing interceptor.
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Scenario 3: A random solo neut routinely attempts to steal the loot. Next time they come into system, you surprise them with a direct counter to their ship. If they turn out to be a hotdropper, you can setup to hotdrop them back....
And this involves how many accounts not ratting? Sat waiting around for a returning hostile who may never come? Sounds like a great fun thing to do in a computer game.
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Scenario 4: You and 3 others are ratting in a system. One of you puts a noobship alt at zero on the beacon. If a hostile comes into system, he can instantly hit share all if anything lands on grid with the beacon.
Cool, so this account I'm dedicating to sitting on the beacon 100% of the time, theres no way I could use that same account to make more than the 10% extra bounties the 4 of us are hauling?
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Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
445
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Zircon Dasher wrote:Wyn Pharoh wrote: It will take 3 HOURS of uninterrupted ratting, according to the new mechanics, to reach break even with where we are at today.
That is false. Assume current RatBounty = 100k Without ESS: 95k goes into your wallet. TOTAL BOUNTY: 95k Immediately upon ESS activating: 80k goes to wallet 20k goes into ESS TOTAL BOUNTY: 100k Current rat bounty - Activated ESS bounty = 0 SO after the 60sec activation time you break even by comparison to the current system.
No you don't. You have to factor in the cost of the deployable and the time spent flying to and from it to retrieve your bounty. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
445
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: If CCP had not mentioned the 5% nerf to nullsec income in the same dev blog, this module would be a fairly solid success.
No, it wouldn't. Because there would still be no reason for a spaceholder to deploy it themselves. A 5% increase in ratting income is not worth the time, effort and isk required to defend it.
Zircon Dasher wrote: Sounds like a Farm&Fields concept is doomed unless people don't have to defend the Farm.
Defending the farm is fine so long as you can still make more money farming than people still sucking on the teat of highsec missions. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
446
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
Tahnil wrote: As has been pointed out before: even if I accept it as a fact that any given system may only support four to six ratters at the same time, this is not the problem. Because (a) not all people are ratting at once and (b) given that inhabitants have some intel and some more time to react than the suggested 60 seconds, you will be able to have some support from other systems as well.
Those people who aren't ratting are AFK, or doing industry, or doing research, or managing a POS, or logged in from work just to chat. If they are idly defending your ESS then they could be ratting (or doing any of the other things I mentioned) so you need to budget them into your costs. And those costs currently don't break even until there are 10 people ratting in a system.
I'll say it again. CCP need to drop the idea this is ever something a spaceholding alliance would want to deploy themselves and re-work it to be a purely offensive module. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
449
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Posted - 2014.01.21 14:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
CCP SoniClover wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:
An actual good start. The most obvious question is "LP from who"? CONCORD is the most obvious answer, if so prepare you self for HUGE cries of foul from the only other people who get CONCORD LP (Incursion Runners). You should fluff up the CONCORD LP store with some more stuff if you're gonna do this.
If not CONCORD, then who?
Sorry for not mentioning this above. The LP is from the empire navies, so it's based on what ESS was deployed.
Have you factored the time required to convert LP into ISK into your reward calculations? At least with tags you could outsource the shipping for a cut of your profit but with LP you have to fly that exact character all the way into empire and back to claim your reward. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
449
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Posted - 2014.01.21 14:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mah Boobz wrote:Juliette Asanari wrote:Yeep wrote: At least with tags you could outsource the shipping for a cut of your profit but with LP you have to fly that exact character all the way into empire and back to claim your reward. You have heard of Jumpclones? or pod express.
Cool, so my options are blow my jumpclone timer and not do any ratting or pvp tomorrow or spend 30m+ in clone costs. Sounds reasonable. |

Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
449
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 15:11:00 -
[14] - Quote
CCP SoniClover wrote: * With an active ESS in system, bounties pay out LP in addition to normal ISK reward. LP reward starts at 0.15 LP per 1000 ISK and can increase to 0.2 LP per 1000 ISK as the bonus payout increases. As an example, a bounty worth 1 million ISK (total) gives between 150 and 200 LPs, based on payout level. This is to address the risk vs. reward concerns. Thanks to those that suggested using LPs instead of ISK for balance.
Is this "normal ISK reward" 100% of current bounties or still 95%? Is the 20% ISK payout still stored in the ESS? If so is it ISK or LP that is stolen?
CCP SoniClover wrote: * Interacting with the ESS now puts a warp disruption effect on the ship interacting with it. Ships immune to bubbles are not immune to this effect. This is to reduce the feasibility of using ships immune to bubbles for stealing purposes.
Is this instead of or in addition to the disruption bubble?
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Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
450
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Posted - 2014.01.21 21:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
Desmond Strickler wrote: Alliances can ban them, doesn't mean they still can't use them.
What do you mean you won't eat the poop? You asked for sweetcorn look there are a couple of bits in there. Ignore what your mother says I bet the sweetcorn is delicious. |
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