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Kel 'dra
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Posted - 2003.09.11 23:35:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Kel 'dra on 11/09/2003 23:36:17
Due the increasing need for megacyte, our Miner II waiting list will not be reopening again.
Instead we will be offering a "Mega For Miners" program. Here is how it will work.
For every 1000 Megacyte you bring us we will trade you 3 Miner II's.
If you do not have 1000 mega, then we will trade 1 Miner II's for every 334 Megacyte you bring.
This program will be restricted to the number of Miner II's that are available for trade each day.
This program will not start until 9/23.
For more information please come to "techell" channel and and talk with a Techell Rep.
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Mala'ki
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Posted - 2003.09.12 01:34:00 -
[2]
Wait a minute the average price of Megacyte is 9-10k per unit. Your willing to trade 3 miner 2s for 1000 mega. Even at the price of 9k each that works out to 9 mil, not the same price of the miner 2s you were selling at 2.5 mil per miner 2.
So the plan all along was to create demand and then have the people who want them bring mega so you can compete in the builders market. Nice
but im going to wait for the patch. Good luck!
GOD willing you would be dead by now, you just dont know it yet! |
FirstLight
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Posted - 2003.09.12 03:08:00 -
[3]
 Quote:
Wait a minute the average price of Megacyte is 9-10k per unit. Your willing to trade 3 miner 2s for 1000 mega. Even at the price of 9k each that works out to 9 mil, not the same price of the miner 2s you were selling at 2.5 mil per miner 2.
So the plan all along was to create demand and then have the people who want them bring mega so you can compete in the builders market. Nice
but im going to wait for the patch. Good luck!
Wow,
I think I'm finally tired of people complaining about the price of a Miner 2... No wait, I know I am.
Imagine a world where prices go up! Shocking!
Are you really shocked that they are tryin to make money???
Someone tell me what is going to happen next patch? So many people seem willing to wait for the next patch, are miner 2's just gonna start falling from the sky?
Will they be available on the market for 5 million each?
The base ore stats on a miner 2 is 60 where a miner 1 pulls in 40, so that is a 50% increase it would seem to follow that if you can make 1million an hour with your current gear upgrading to miner 2's even at these prices (3 million) would only require 6 hours per miner 2 to break even... Cheap really. When you consider most companies start their prices at 5 million. Even at that rate, though a focused miner with a couple of good haulers could break even quickly.
If you are a miner, like i tend to be, it would seem you would want the best gear to mine with, and as a miner you should be able to use your "skills to pay the bills".
But complaining about the price just makes me tired. But complaining about the price or even an effective "price increase" to the cheapest seller in town, just seems silly, sorry but really!
There seems to be a concept that everyone should have easy access to everything in the game. Miner 2 only cost 50k why are the 2.5 million? Cry Cry!!!! I'll wait for the next patch. Oh BTW when is the next patch going to happen??? Right. By that time those that have bought miner 2's will have made 10's of millions of isk
Go by a local BMW dealership and whine that it costs the same amount to make a Beamer as a Honda, and see if they lower the price "to be fair"
Techell, no good deed goes unpunished! Being the lowest priced retail seller of Miner 2's is your good deed, your punishment? Having to listen to people whine about how you should be even cheaper!
If you think the Miner 2 is too costly then don't buy it! But please stop cluttering up the boards with how they should be cheaper.
It's just not clever.
This is a good deal for miners and corps that are mining mega!
As for me, sign me up!
[My Signature will be out with the next patch, please wait...] |
ACIENTONE
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Posted - 2003.09.12 03:11:00 -
[4]
I dont mind paying alittle more for no waiting!
Your Tachyon Beam Laser II perfectly strikes Guristas Demolisher, wrecking for 1076.8 damage.
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Lucas De'Thal
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Posted - 2003.09.12 04:48:00 -
[5]
firstlight...
i think you sort of missed the point of the previous posters comment.
i'm going to try and elaborate here.
at first glance, it would seem that Techell is doing miner's a favor. sure bring us 1000 mega and get 3 miner 2.
but, they have under priced the current value of mega by about 1.5k AND they normally sell the miner 2 at 2.5mil. so basically it's a price increase of about 1.5mil.
real life example. sort of like companies that sell say, potato chips in a "small package" weighing 12oz. they then change how much they put in say, 11.2oz but keep the original "small package". It's not a very obvious change, but enough to where they make a larger profit margin, hidden from the unweary customers.
anyways. i would think they had recouped the cost of the bp's by now.
and yes, miner 2 drop a lot more frequestly on chaos.
______________________________________________
Hellmar > sorry for the attitude, playing a n00b character through the current state just left me a bit bitter
dev chat: Mar 18, 2004
hellmar> "you lot are just so clever you have a good history for out smarting us :-S "
dev chat: Feb 12, 2004 |
FirstLight
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Posted - 2003.09.12 05:12:00 -
[6]
Thanks Lucas my first post and a response so quickly!
I did catch the points that you eluded to. I even mentioned the price increase in two separate places! I stated 1 million but ok 1.5 million. I still stand by the basic concept of the time value of isk. Trade isk now for better tools to make more isk later.
So at then end of the day... The bag of potato chips is still a good deal in my mind sans the .8 oz...
So what if they have made the cost of the BP back? Is this a game about breaking even???
The market will determine if this price is fair right now. I have a fealing many people would rather start making money now, instead of waiting for a CCP patch that may or may not arrive.
But until some1 can say for sure when the patch with the extra miner 2's from heaven will be put in, I vote to take the risk. I mean how long have you been waiting for this patch? how much could have been made in mining in the meantime?
[My Signature will be out with the next patch, please wait...] |
DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2003.09.12 05:38:00 -
[7]
Your price is 10k per mega, but other people sell for 8k or even less...
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Lucas De'Thal
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Posted - 2003.09.12 07:47:00 -
[8]
firstlight, my post was not to flame u or anything.
it all goes back to why sell mega cheap when u can sell it for a lot more.
same thing all the ship manufacturers complain about. why sell ships for less.
it's a dubious argument at best.
______________________________________________
Hellmar > sorry for the attitude, playing a n00b character through the current state just left me a bit bitter
dev chat: Mar 18, 2004
hellmar> "you lot are just so clever you have a good history for out smarting us :-S "
dev chat: Feb 12, 2004 |
Belle Aelin
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Posted - 2003.09.12 08:45:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Belle Aelin on 12/09/2003 08:45:55
Quote:
The base ore stats on a miner 2 is 60 where a miner 1 pulls in 40, so that is a 50% increase it would seem to follow that if you can make 1million an hour with your current gear upgrading to miner 2's even at these prices (3 million) would only require 6 hours per miner 2 to break even... Cheap really. When you consider most companies start their prices at 5 million. Even at that rate, though a focused miner with a couple of good haulers could break even quickly.
Nice example but you seem to pull 1 million an hour with only one miner 1 ? Wow, what do you mine ?
Let's figure out that you pull your million an hour with 8 miner 1: so upgrading costs you 3x8=24M
50% more efficient mining: 1.5M an hour
Take those 500K gained per hour and you get 48 hours STRAIGHT mining to get your investment back in your pocket.
Uh, less interesting don't you think ? (and by the way, who is eager to pay that price when they have stuff better than miner 1 ?)
I am just wondering if you really think what you said or you just not smart enough when it comes to manage your money 
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Askari
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Posted - 2003.09.12 08:50:00 -
[10]
Im sorry to say this, but Techell just dropped about 10 notches on my respect scale.
This is nothing more than a veiled way of gaining Megacyte below market prices for your BS production and your using the Miner II as a very big lever.
I was waiting for your list to re-open to order some Miner II, but if you think im now going to spend that money on megacyte, to give it to you for less than i paid for it, Especially when a Miner II takes less than 5 Megacyte to make, then your insane.
What is the world coming to when even Techell, one of the fairest manufacturers in the game resorts to this... *shakes head*
----------------
~= Askari =~
Urza's Factory
http://www.mikeward.uk.com/urzas
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Velios
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Posted - 2003.09.12 09:14:00 -
[11]
oh just stop whinging and buy them from someone else then - I got 10 from a dealer called mrcrash, it cost me a little more (3.7 million) and a skadi coolant thrown in but there was none of this relentless crap that we see here. My buying experience was quick and efficient, and the little extra I paid was made back quickly as there was no time consuming haggling and whining.
Stop flaming people for trying to make an isk or two. Tell me if you were in possesion of one of these miner II BP's wouldn't you make excatly the same choices when selling them? or would you sell them for 10k above production cost?
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Dornal
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Posted - 2003.09.12 09:35:00 -
[12]
Not sure how you guys are doing your math, but 1000 megacyte at 10k each is 10 mil. Divide by 3 miner ii's and you get them for 3.33 mil each assuming you're paying 10k per megacyte.
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Abandoned Child
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Posted - 2003.09.12 09:44:00 -
[13]
I believe Techell pays 7000 to 7500 isk per megacyte. That is where they are getting their prices from.
Granted, that's underpriced. But that's what they buy megacyte for.
So, in their mind, they think they're charging you the same amount.
Using their monopoly power in miner ii's (well oligopoly power) to lower prices on battleships. Of course, they sell battleships at the same price as everyone else; which means that they're increasing their profits.
Ingenious way of buffering rising megacyte prices, if you ask me. I'm surprised other corps don't do the same.
Basically, as the price of mega goes up, so will the price of battleships. Maybe Techell will be able to maintain prices at their current level. Thus, the cost of the megacyte is transferred from the battleship buyer to the miner 2 buyer.
Of course, miner 2 buyers are more willing to accept this :) |
Shock
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Posted - 2003.09.12 10:24:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Shock on 12/09/2003 10:34:58
It's an attempt to ensure a steady flow of megacyte.
The choice is either to rise the price of battleships, or to do something different with our miner II production.
You can't blame us for choosing the latter, since there is much, much more competition in the battleship market then the miner II market.
The price for a Miner II is if you buy mega at the local market still only 3,3M which still isn't that much (we had some people who bought miners from us only to resell them for 3.5-5M a piece again).
Customers who catch the early bird won't have to wait on a list for ages and people with access to cheaper mega form alliance territory or go and mine it themselves will still have cheap Miner II.
Also it isn't 23 september yet so it's possible that things can change. One thing won't change though: Techell considers 10k for a piece of megacyte too much and is not willing to pay this kind of money for it.
It's all about opportunities and choices.
edit:
Quote:
Especially when a Miner II takes less than 5 Megacyte to make, then your insane.
Sorry but you dropped just 10 notches on mine too. So tiring to hear people chanting over and over that it would 'only' cost is 50k a piece to build (and even that is incorrect considering our mineral prices).
If you buy miner II on the trade channel you get instant gratification as long as there is a supply AND for a higher price. Forced by the circumstances you can now get the same at Techell. I don't see the problem. And I think you are one of the few that do. The number of people on our list that are actually willing to pay a lot more if they would just get their miners II earlier is enourmous. Problem for them: we weren't willing to do this. Too bad we don't have that choice anymore.
---
soonÖ |
Datsevlu
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Posted - 2003.09.12 12:20:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Datsevlu on 12/09/2003 12:22:16
Just to add a little to this. The miners that we used for this mega for miners is our own internal supply and not the miners that we let out to the public. So our corps members end up either not getting thier miner 2's or in some case's (mine and other core members) we donated our Miner 2's so we could get through a problem time with megacyte.
And for those who flamed us for doing this you have to remember before we bought these BP's and started selling at 2.5 mil everyone was at least at 5 mil per miner witch if you put that kind of price on them then this deal is more then fair. But the other fact is this helps us get mega at more of a fair price current prices on mega are way to high if you are reselling BS's in the amount we do if you buy mega at 10k you would not be able to sell at a price that any of the people who mine mega would buy at.
Techell is still a very Honorable Corp we did this program to get us a quick supply of mega that we were short on at the time.
Just my mind set guys,
-- Datsevlu
Blow'em up we'll build more.
Techell's ingame site |
HitGirl
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Posted - 2003.09.12 12:26:00 -
[16]
I¦ll ingame mail techell and we can work something out!:P
Proud member of the growing NVA!
Chief Executive Officer
Inferno Corp: Where we are ultimate Destruction will follow |
PropanElgen
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Posted - 2003.09.12 12:53:00 -
[17]
WTF are you ppl complaining about?
It doesnt take long to mine the amount of Bistot that produces 1000 mega.
All the angels and the puny men of god looked away...
Frightened to death by the evil that was born on that day!
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Dirty Sanchez
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:09:00 -
[18]
I took part in this deal when they offered it a couple days ago and after getting my miners I was offered 4.5 mil a piece for the miners. from what I see that is over 13k a piece for mega pretty good deal if you take it.
<Thrak> I AM ***
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Kel 'dra
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:13:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Kel 'dra on 12/09/2003 13:16:39
I am going to do something that I rarely do. Whine...
First off... You say 3 miner II's at 2.5 Million is 7.5 Million and 1000 mega at 10k (This is a crazy price!) is 10 million, so we are making extra profits. We by at much lower rates to keep our ship cost down. That benefits everyone. Everyone knows it is possible to resell and some have bought from us and resold them to other people at a higher price thus making profits. We are we the ONLY ones in the game that sell at 2.5 Million and everyone else sells higher but yet everyone holds us to those standards. Do you whine at them and hold them to our standards as well? I doubt it. If you where smart you would look at this as a opportunity to make money.
Lets think about this.
3 Miner II's at say 4 Million is 12 Million. 1000 megacyte at 10K (Which is just crazy!) is only 10 million. You just made 2 million profit. You all act like there is no way this would be a good deal. You all act like it is ok of you to make money but Techell can't? What is wrong with this picture. I grow more and more tired of people blaming us or whining to us just because we are a corp. If you where in our situation I don't doubt that over 50% if not more would never have bought the blueprint that we did and then resold as low as we did. Because most of you are more greedy then we could ever be.
Sorry for complaining. But you know... You not all angels..
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SirOmega
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:19:00 -
[20]
It takes money to make money. No you don't have to buy the Miner II's anymore than you HAVE to buy a Thorax to mine in, but anyone even remotely serious about mining will weigh the cost of any equipment against the potential gain of said item and see the pro's and cons. Also realize that these lasers are targeted at your "Hardcore" miner, not someone in a frigate or casual miner; whom will in all likely events, not realize it's full potential. A Ford and a Ferrari will both get you to the same destination..It's just a question of how FAST you wish to arrive?
"...But I've a rendevouz with Death, at midnight in some flaming town. When spring trips north again this year, and I to my pledged word am true, I shall not fail that rendevouz.." |
Jojin
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:56:00 -
[21]
For those who disagree with the business practices and prices of a vendor, the best way to make a point would be to not purchase their product. Vocalizing oneÆs opinion to the high prices will have little effect upon the demand of the product. By ranting aloud, you may in fact discredit yourself and give others the opinion you are simply unhappy with your current financial state and inability to purchase the high priced items.
Another effective option is to offer a similar product at a lower cost and show how it has a better Return on Investment.
Either way, donÆt assume everyone values items the same way as you might.
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Koda
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Posted - 2003.09.12 14:42:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Koda on 12/09/2003 14:43:07
EVE has a "free market" economy. If you don't like a vendor's pricing structure then BUY from someone else.
--------------
Share the love in the SNIGG Forums
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Ezra
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Posted - 2003.09.12 14:59:00 -
[23]
Quote:
Nice
but im going to wait for the patch. Good luck!
That's what everyone said last patch.
Didn't do much for them.
The Chaos loot table didn't transfer over to TQ last patch - What makes you think it's guaranteed to transfer with this patch?
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Ezra Cornell
pe0n, Xanadu Corporation |
Maud Dib
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Posted - 2003.09.12 15:14:00 -
[24]
I won't be on for about six hours but I am interested in 3 or 4 miner 2. Who should I contact about delivering the mega?
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Dragon Emperor
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Posted - 2003.09.12 15:27:00 -
[25]
Quote:
Thanks Lucas my first post and a response so quickly!
I did catch the points that you eluded to. I even mentioned the price increase in two separate places! I stated 1 million but ok 1.5 million. I still stand by the basic concept of the time value of isk. Trade isk now for better tools to make more isk later.
So at then end of the day... The bag of potato chips is still a good deal in my mind sans the .8 oz...
So what if they have made the cost of the BP back? Is this a game about breaking even???
The market will determine if this price is fair right now. I have a fealing many people would rather start making money now, instead of waiting for a CCP patch that may or may not arrive.
But until some1 can say for sure when the patch with the extra miner 2's from heaven will be put in, I vote to take the risk. I mean how long have you been waiting for this patch? how much could have been made in mining in the meantime?
whine about whining doesn't make you better than original whiner.
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Devil Mann
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Posted - 2003.09.12 15:34:00 -
[26]
just a comment....
"eve is a free market..."
Well that depends...the market it seems would appear very buggy at the best of times and nothing really seems to go for what it should...with certain things way overpriced (no examples as my opinions dont reflect everyones)
And certain things are sold for way below there average price ...which is most fairly obvious in the Battleship market. Apocalypses have dropped to 85 million and megathrons for 90 million. As far as i knew these ships used to be valued at 120 million each....
The markets should be changed to show NPC demanding Certain ships and selling more of the items that never show (harvesters or rare drops)
There needs to be stability in the markets...
Can anyone tell me if there are any other BPs for the Miner2 or does techell own the only 2 unlimited copies?
I know there were limited copies a while ago but i assumed they would have been used by now.
===============================================
Damn roid respawns,CTDS,Stuck systems,lost items,stuck in warp,friends list,broken map(insert more here after patch)... |
Kel 'dra
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Posted - 2003.09.12 15:49:00 -
[27]
Quote:
Can anyone tell me if there are any other BPs for the Miner2 or does techell own the only 2 unlimited copies?
I know there were limited copies a while ago but i assumed they would have been used by now.
No we do not own the only 2 copies in the game, we are just the only ones that openly sell to everyone. The other people either only sell in bulk or keep them for internal use. I.E. Stain Alliance.
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FirstLight
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Posted - 2003.09.12 16:08:00 -
[28]
Quote:
Let's figure out that you pull your million an hour with 8 miner 1: so upgrading costs you 3x8=24M
50% more efficient mining: 1.5M an hour
Take those 500K gained per hour and you get 48 hours STRAIGHT mining to get your investment back in your pocket.
Uh, less interesting don't you think ? (and by the way, who is eager to pay that price when they have stuff better than miner 1 ?)
I am just wondering if you really think what you said or you just not smart enough when it comes to manage your money
Ouch calling the smarts into question oh but wait i guess a makes it ok.
Just call me over zealous man! I did not factor out me drones... I guess.
So I did what any smart person would do I ran a test!
A strapped on 2 miner 1's and mined for 15 minutes in plag and pyro, no drones.
in 15 minutes i pulled 2380 plag and 2751 pyro or 9520 plag and 11004 pyro an hour at 17 and 14 per that would be 161840 and 154056 isk an hour, (as an asided that's about 1.4 million an hour in plag for 8 miner 1's with my skills)
So you are kinda correct, assuming that you are mining pyro, and you view the cost of 333 mega at 3.5 million the time it would take to make back the 3.5million based on the 50% increase is about 45.43 hours
but pyro is the forth cheapest ore, and in most places you can get more for plag. assuming you get the following
pyro: @14 45.43 hours
plag: @17 43.25 hours
If you assume "I'm going to be mining anyway" and you are willing to put all of your revenue toward getting back your costs it would the following. Say you borrowed money from your corp to buy miner 2's that you needed to pay back.
pyro: @14 34.07 hours
plag: @17 32.43 hours
I didn't test kernite or omber, they are both available in .5 space but it would seem as you move up the ore chart the costs in time would fall.
I welcome some1 doing similar testing on high er value ore, bistot would be ideal, but I'm guessing the 50% increase is not linear which would favor the lower value ores.
to realy test it you'd have to have a miner 2 in hand! which i still want.
Shew! Live and Learn
So it's up to each person to decide if they will mine long enough to make up the difference...
Skills for the above test
miner 1
Astrogeology 3
Mining 4
Belle Aelin you were alot less wrong than me!
Thanks for all the comments, it helps!
[My Signature will be out with the next patch, please wait...] |
Gravedancer
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Posted - 2003.09.12 17:38:00 -
[29]
Quote:
but, they have under priced the current value of mega by about 1.5k AND they normally sell the miner 2 at 2.5mil. so basically it's a price increase of about 1.5mil.
1000 megacyte at 10k per unit = 10 mil ISK.
Average price of Miner II lasers = 4.5 - 5 mil each.
3 miner II trade for 1000 mega = average of 3.33 mil per miner II (still well below most other sellers).
Combine that with the fact that Techell is not reopening their waiting list for miner IIs and your options are basically trade 1000 mega for 3 miner II's, or pay 5 mil per miner II. My advice, if you really want Miner II's, would be to take the 1000 mega for 3 miner II offer.
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Gravedancer
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Posted - 2003.09.12 17:41:00 -
[30]
Quote:
firstlight, my post was not to flame u or anything.
it all goes back to why sell mega cheap when u can sell it for a lot more.
Lucas,
Fine, sell your 1000 megacyte for 10 mil ISK. Then you will have to pay 15 mil for 3 miner II's (good luck getting any from techell for 2.5 mil with the waiting list closed permanently). You going to pull the other 5 mil out of your butt ? Would be better to trade the 1000 mega for the 3 miner IIs.
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