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How useful is medium/small guns mix on a BC?

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Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 05:32:00 - [1] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 05:39:59 I'm getting ready to run a Brutix. Initially I planned to run a rack of Dual 150mms. This yielded some decent DPS, but crappy range. This also allowed me to put a large cap battery on a midslot - which is great so that I can run my tech2 medium repper for 90 seconds (9 cycles) before dropping below 30% cap. I then saw some builds that referred to using 5 medium guns and 2 cruiser guns, ie: 5x 200mm rails 2x 125mm rails This setup can also run the T2 Med Repper for around 90 seconds (9 cycles) before hitting 30% cap. I like the better range of the 200mms there. For a setup like that, I put 1x AB and 3x Eutetic cap rechargers in the mids. My questions are: 1. Is it really that useful to have a couple of frig guns? Considering that there are drones and all that can take care of the frigates - and that I can start hitting frigs at 27km with the medium guns. 2. If it IS worth it, how badly will I need a webber? Will the 125mm rails track frigs well enough? I am hoping to avoid a webber for PVE work if they will track. (Assume a Motion Prediction of level 4) Given those questions, this is how I see the builds: - 7x150mm build: more likely to require a webber, since I would be using medium drones for all frigate killing - 5x200mms, 2x125mms: can kill frigs without using drones, and have the advantage of longer range rails for heavier enemies. Drones can move between lighter and heavier enemies as needed. I am hoping to find that the latter build is viable, because I like the flexibility of the longer range rails. (Btw, yes, this is a low skill setup, and will be completely changed when I hit higher cap skills and reach Advanced Weapons Upgrades) Thanks. EDIT: Oh yeah - running level 3s with this. Probably some ratting too. No PVP in it until I the skills to use it properly.
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:07:00 - [2] Anyone tried this? Is the web necessary to hit/destroy level 3 frigates without a web? The mids are currently: 3x Eutetic cap rechargers 1x AB Using only 2x Eutetic cap rechargers significantly reduces the number of cycles I can run the repper for, since the tank equilibrium (with hardeners and guns running) sits lower this way. And I really don't want to slow boat it unless I put on a tractor beam.
Admiral IceBlock	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:08:00 - [3] killer :P "We brake for nobody"
Admiral IceBlock	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:09:00 - [4] well, 150mm in highs capacitor in meds tank in lows should work fine.. "We brake for nobody"
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:10:00 - [5] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:12:44 Well, I'm wondering if I can get by without a webber - ie. will the 125mms or 150mms (whichever) hit close orbiting level 3 frigs without a web? ... I mean, with the 5x medium, 2x small gun setup.
Admiral IceBlock	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:12:00 - [6] Originally by: Xori Ruscuv Well, I'm wondering if I can get by without a webber - ie. will the 125mms or 150mms (whichever) hit close orbiting level 3 frigs without a web? depends on their speed and type, but if you have drones in your drone bay you should be able to make it. "We brake for nobody"
Audri Fisher	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:24:00 - [7] your problem is defending from 8km to about th 18km range. a pair 75mm tech II's rip through frigs like it is there job. there dps goes to **** though when you push out further than 12 km. you can't use spike ammo in them because you will kill your tracking. I would go with 125 unless you know there are going to be very tight orbiting frigs. most of the tough frigs to kill orbit out of 75mm range. If you are thinking you are going to get mobbed though, out of samrtbomb range, or can't afford the cap to continuoulsy run a pair of smartbombs, go with 75mm tech II's with iridium ammo.
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:28:00 - [8] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:31:19 Originally by: Audri Fisher your problem is defending from 8km to about th 18km range. a pair 75mm tech II's rip through frigs like it is there job. there dps goes to ** though when you push out further than 12 km. you can't use spike ammo in them because you will kill your tracking. I would go with 125 unless you know there are going to be very tight orbiting frigs. most of the tough frigs to kill orbit out of 75mm range. If you are thinking you are going to get mobbed though, out of samrtbomb range, or can't afford the cap to continuoulsy run a pair of smartbombs, go with 75mm tech II's with iridium ammo. Thanks, man... I do definitely like 125s. The problem is - whether they are going to kill tight orbiting frigs without a web**. Do you have any experience using 125s against the frigs without a webber?
Toaster Oven	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:42:00 - [9] For killing frigs: 7 Cruiser guns + web > 5 TII med drones > 2 frig guns It's pointless fitting frig guns on a Brutix to kill frigs. Your cruiser guns will hit frigs just fine with a good web and kill em off the quickest. If you're not fitting a web, you can hold and launch 5 TII med drones which also do quite nicely. If you're just fitting 2 frig guns with no web, you're gonna die of old age waiting for some of the elite frigs to pop.
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:50:00 - [10] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:53:39 Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:50:55 Originally by: Toaster Oven For killing frigs: 7 Cruiser guns + web > 5 TII med drones > 2 frig guns It's pointless fitting frig guns on a Brutix to kill frigs. Your cruiser guns will hit frigs just fine with a good web and kill em off the quickest. If you're not fitting a web, you can hold and launch 5 TII med drones which also do quite nicely. If you're just fitting 2 frig guns with no web, you're gonna die of old age waiting for some of the elite frigs to pop. Thanks TBH, I'm a noob. Low skills. Learning skills have bored a hole in my brain, I need to get out there. I'm going to be training a few weeks as is before jumping into the Brutix, but I'm honestly looking to trim off anything I can. So - I imagine my Tech 1 valks/hammers will do the trick as well? I could also just drop a cap recharger and fit a web - TBH I'm just a bit scared that my tank will SUCK if I do that. (My mechanic skills are fine, just... other skills may be lacking ;))

awwsd	Posted - 2006.03.28 08:57:00 - [11] Originally by: Xori Ruscuv Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:53:39 Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 08:50:55 Originally by: Toaster Oven For killing frigs: 7 Cruiser guns + web > 5 TII med drones > 2 frig guns It's pointless fitting frig guns on a Brutix to kill frigs. Your cruiser guns will hit frigs just fine with a good web and kill em off the quickest. If you're not fitting a web, you can hold and launch 5 TII med drones which also do quite nicely. If you're just fitting 2 frig guns with no web, you're gonna die of old age waiting for some of the elite frigs to pop. Thanks TBH, I'm a noob. Low skills. Learning skills have bored a hole in my brain, I need to get out there. I'm going to be training a few weeks as is before jumping into the Brutix, but I'm honestly looking to trim off anything I can. So - I imagine my Tech 1 valks/hammers will do the trick as well? I could also just drop a cap recharger and fit a web - TBH I'm just a bit scared that my tank will SUCK if I do that. (My mechanic skills are fine, just... other skills may be lacking ;)) Bring some light drones with you, so that if you do get in trouble you have a way out of it.
Toaster Oven	Posted - 2006.03.28 09:02:00 - [12] Originally by: Xori Ruscuv TBH, I'm a noob. Low skills. Learning skills have bored a hole in my brain, I need to get out there. I'm going to be training a few weeks as is before jumping into the Brutix, but I'm honestly looking to trim off anything I can. I understand where you're coming from. But a web is one of the last things I'd want to trim away. Scrambling frigs are gonna be one your biggest dangers as a noob in lvl3 missions. If you find yourself in trouble, you'll need to quickly kill off any scramblers and warp away before you pop. A web is invaluable in this type of situation as you'll be able to focus all the firepower from your guns and drones on any nearby frigs to quickly eliminate any threat. It could very well be the difference between saving or losing your ship. And it also provides a measure of security in case your lose your drones due to lag, CTD, NPC aggro, etc. Quote: So - I imagine my Tech 1 valks/hammers will do the trick as well? Yep, just get Drones, Drone Interfacing, and Combat Drone Operation all to lvl3 or 4 and you'll be ok. Quote: I could also just drop a cap recharger and fit a web - TBH I'm just a bit scared that my tank will SUCK if I do that. Finding out is half the fun
Xori Ruscuv	Posted - 2006.03.28 09:07:00 - [13] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 28/03/2006 09:07:20 Thanks a ton - you have been a tremendous help! As I mentioned, even excluding BC 4, there are a couple weeks of skills I need to train to be viable yet. I may just slowboat it and run a webber until I can guage the situation in 20 or 30 level 3 mission runs. You are right - finding out is half the fun - and here I am trying to figure it all out before I begin! Thanks again.
Slydog Swifthands	Posted - 2006.03.28 16:37:00 - [14] I use the 5 x 200mm and 2 x 125mm setup on my Brutix. I use a webber, but I could probably get away without one. My 125s track well enough to hit most frigates and I use my drones to do most of the damage to them. I personally like using a webber, especially against webbing / scrambling frigates. When they web me, I web them back and then use everything I have on them. Try it without a webber and see how well you hit things. Depending on your optimal range, you might be better off using a tracking enhancer or an extra mag stab. Also, you seem to be interested in maxing your armor repairing so look into using both a MAR II and a SAR II. Run one constantly while pulsing the other.


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