Stupid idea is stupid.

It makes a big difference if you speced you char right or not and we are not talking about "slightly faster", we are talking about weeks and months.

It is one source of Balancing so you cant go for Turret ECM Shield Drone Battleship with Energy Neuts and a gazillion Jumpclones, while using Boosters in a couple of weeks.

Please. Yes, it does probably shave weeks and months off over a long term career, but I hardly thing that all skills training without effects of attributes changes is going to somehow break the game. Pick a mid point between the longest time it takes to train a skill and the shortest possible with all attributes for it maxed and fix the skill at that for everyone.

Balance is just as easy to acheive without a unneccesary mechanic.

Please. Yes, it does probably shave weeks and months off over a long term career, but I hardly thing that all skills training without effects of attributes changes is going to somehow break the game. Pick a mid point between the longest time it takes to train a skill and the shortest possible with all attributes for it maxed and fix the skill at that for everyone.

Balance is just as easy to acheive without a unneccesary mechanic.

Be glad Shrew, we used to have training skills that enhanced attributes. Those took week or months to train to max level, and new players were advised to train as many of them as they could stand as early as possible, leading to noobs ship spinning for weeks then quitting when starting the game.

I'm familiar with that era from reading about it. I also know that when they suggested taking them out, there was an outcry about how awful it would be.

If the once yearly (or whenever) mini-game of remapping to shave a week off your training queue is important to people, then so be it. But why not have them affect other aspects of the game. Then they would become much more relevant and dynamic.

You are vastly underestimating what properly specing your attributes does to your training time.

They do, indirectly. I pilot that maps intel/memory and focuses on those skills for a year will have great capacitor, ewar, and tanking ability of the same character that maps per/wil (Gunnery, spaceship command).

Be glad Shrew, we used to have training skills that enhanced attributes. Those took week or months to train to max level, and new players were advised to train as many of them as they could stand as early as possible, leading to noobs ship spinning for weeks then quitting when starting the game.

Now that was a bad design. Thankfully, they removed it and set all the attributes to the same level as maxed learning skills.
So you are already starting out with a much better base then most of the older crowd got when they started.

As to you original idea: No thanks. I and many others enjoy being able to specialize into certain attributes in order to rush though a planned long term skill que.

If you don't, then spit your remaps between all the attributes except Charisma, cause seriously, **** charisma. It's used for very few skills unless you go into training a leadership alt. Then you will have a balanced attribute sheet not too terribly bad at training any one skill type.

Stupid idea is stupid.

It makes a big difference if you speced you char right or not and we are not talking about "slightly faster", we are talking about weeks and months.

It is one source of Balancing so you cant go for Turret ECM Shield Drone Battleship with Energy Neuts and a gazillion Jumpclones, while using Boosters in a couple of weeks.

We've been internally debating the issue for a long time now and we have finally come to the conclusion that attributes are not necessary. They are pretty much an unneeded annoyance, and while they seem to make the game more complex and deeper, they do not contribute to it in an entertaining or useful way.

The problem with attributes has always been that you have to make important choices at the very beginning of the game. However, at that point you usually don't have the slightest idea what they will mean for the future, and you don't even have any chance to make adjustments later on. Obviously this can be a very frustrating experience for our new players.

OP, what you are proposing (at least as far as having secondary affects) is way too complicated to ever really be implemented. The game is in a precarious balance, and all sorts of things can break that, your idea included.

Could it be removed? Maybe, but I don't see any major reason to do it (or not do it, for that matter). FYI the system itself has come a long way, and is a lot simpler than it used to be. Attributes used to be a real cluster ****.

OP never played DnD... Attributes make the world go 'round and some better at something than another by focus and design. bards need their charisma, barbarians their strength, monks their wisdom and etc... same for eve. make it so there is no sense of sacrifice to pursue various avenues robs you of even your own life experiences, devastates your talents... basically turns EvE into the worst public school in America. ******* Socialist Duck. (capitalists are pigs, socialists are ducks and commies are herrings -deal wit it). Created Equal, but thereafter everyone isn't.

I personally do not like attributes. I feel that attributes and attribute implants (attribute implants are another argument all by themselves) do not offer a meaningful, entertaining, and useful choice and consequence over not having them at all. There are many that disagree with me.
To me I think it would make a great deal of sense to remove attributes and attribute implants from Eve. Then allow all training to be done at a 2700SP/hr rate that is deposited in to a capped (1-3 mil SP) free SP pool. To train skills you apply SP selecting the skill, choose how much SP to apply and hit apply. I can explain that system to you in 2 sentences. Try explaining the current attribute/attribute implant/remap system to a noob in 2 sentences in such a way that they will understand. I doubt you really could. A simple elegant system, IMO, is better for Eve than the system we currently possess.

To me I think it would make a great deal of sense to remove attributes and attribute implants from Eve. Then allow all training to be done at a 2700SP/hr rate that is deposited in to a capped (1-3 mil SP) free SP pool. To train skills you apply SP selecting the skill, choose how much SP to apply and hit apply.

I can explain that system to you in 2 sentences. Try explaining the current attribute/attribute implant/remap system to a noob in 2 sentences in such a way that they will understand. I doubt you really could.

Most likely. I haven't even scratched the surface, so I can't say for sure. As someone already stated, though, hardwiring essentially already does what I suggested, but in a more controlled way. I would venture to say, however, that if a reason for keeping something can neither be argued for or against, really, then it's probably worth questioning it's validity. Honestly, to me, it's one of the few mechanics in Eve that seems "tacked on".


As an aside, not all the people on the forums are negative and hostile. Just a lot of them. And besides, it gives you a chance to appreciate when someone is genuinely kind and logical. Don't let the stalkers get you down. :)

Here's an idea, don't know if it's a good one : instead of having just 5 attributes, you have more, like 10. While some of them (the original 5, let's say) are used to boost skill training time, the others just provide different passive bonuses, but don't improve any skills. You can then invest your points in any of these 10 attributes, chosing between less skill training time or more passive bonuses. Slot1-5 implants could give you more points to invest rather than simply boost 1 given attribute. This system would offer a slightly deeper level of customization and give a slight edge to players who feel they don't need to train skills fast and prefer focusing on.

It adds a little spice and rewards players that are able to make long term training plans and commit to them. Delayed gratification is integral to EvE. Any mechanic that reinforces it (via 1 yr remaps), is great.