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Jenshae Chiroptera
172
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Posted - 2011.11.12 22:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
By upgrading the freighter hull (as you do with other T2 ships), this ship comes with four modules that can not be replaced or removed.
It can target four other ships and take on their damage. Those other ships will take 25% of damage after the damage has been through their own resistance. It can not use these modules on any ship that is using remote repairers on it.
So for a simply example, my Cyclone has 70% omni tank. A volley of 1000 damage hits me. That is cut to 300 damage by my resists. That 300 damage goes on the tank and I only take 75 points of damage.
Now there is 300 + 75 points of damage done to our fleet. However, four of those ships are really difficult to alpha kill, while the logistics, can focus on repairing the tanks.
Obvious limitations. Freighter is
- easy to web
- very slow
- can not be made to fly faster without using warp to points
- easy to scramble.
- expensive
- module distance limitations
Edit: This ship has no cargo space, the extra damage absorbing pieces and technology running the modules takes up all the space.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
TrollFace TrololMcFluf
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
38
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Posted - 2011.11.13 02:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
why |
Jenshae Chiroptera
176
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Posted - 2011.11.13 07:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
TrollFace TrololMcFluf wrote:why
Suddenly an exhumer, industrial, frigate or cruiser can't be alpha'ed.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources
Tactical Narcotics Team
105
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Posted - 2011.11.13 13:20:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:TrollFace TrololMcFluf wrote:why Suddenly an exhumer, industrial, frigate or cruiser can't be alpha'ed.
Why is this a good thing? |
Jenshae Chiroptera
178
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Posted - 2011.11.13 15:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:
Why is this a good thing?
For example:
You can increase the risk, commit more ships to the project and it then requires a very competent gang of pirates using more strategy than just a few pimped out destroyers.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
The Revenant Order
211
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Posted - 2011.11.13 15:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
****posters gonna ****post.
Terrible idea is terrible.
I'm sure plenty of carebears would much rather sacrifice a Freighter than a Hulk.
I guess your parents didn't stop you from eating lead paint chips as a child. And I'm assuming you also ate a big bowl of **** and stupid for breakfast. Because the idea is to MITIGATE losses, not increase them. Because then you'll just end up with more ISK lost due to Freighters becoming victims of gankers.
Give me all of your stuff and biomass your character.
"War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives." |
Goose99
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
156
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Posted - 2011.11.13 15:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Supported. This will make tards and wannabes that shoot hulks while under concord protection go to lowsec where I can shoot them.  |
Jenshae Chiroptera
181
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Posted - 2011.11.13 17:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
It makes a ship that soaks up the damage and reduces ganking. If the bears sit in a belt too long like that they would just lose everything. It also exposes you to more gang and fleet combat.
So it is basically decreasing your gank chance while increasing your gang and small fleet fighting.
Ideas and CSM stuff
No matter the changes, high sec people chose the safests. Lots of stick and they will leave. Half the problem is the players in null sec; we do not want to be there with you. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
102
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Posted - 2011.12.27 21:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
Whoa whoa, wait... You fly this T2 freighter into combat?! |
Jenshae Chiroptera
296
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Posted - 2011.12.27 21:49:00 -
[10] - Quote
I think people are going to start hating you for filling the first page with my threads soon. 
... and yes. It would act as a damage sink.
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
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Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
102
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Posted - 2011.12.27 21:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:I think people are going to start hating you for filling the first page with my threads soon.
Your fault. I found a central list of a bunch of interesting ideas from someone who is not a complete mouthbreathing idiot, and clicked on them.
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:... and yes. It would act as a damage sink.
I think I want this to happen just so I can kill a badly piloted T2 freighter.
These would have to have really long cycle times, to allow those with quick reactions to swap targets and have some way of avoiding this. I am also concerned as to the way this could effect hit-and-run PvP (e.g. what a Vagabond does when it pops in on an enemy gang to kill their interdictor, then run away laughing). |
tankus2
Endless Destruction
Imperial Ascension
22
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Posted - 2011.12.28 00:44:00 -
[12] - Quote
now, a remote damage sink would be a fun idea, though better placed as a t2, tier 3 battleship (of which all four t1 battleships that these would be based on already have some form of a defensive bonus). I'd imagine that, as how Petrus has stated, that you would need a module that has a long cycle time (30 seconds is plenty long), and perhaps having the modules reduce capacitor recharge time while active so as to make sure that the ship can only remote sink for a few minutes at best.
Also make sure such modules are high-slot utilization and one for each level of health (so there would be a shield damage sink, armor damage sink and a hull damage sink), and you may be on to something. Especially if the ship that can use them has crap for slot layout.
As it is, a freighter having modules doesn't make sense.
Where the science gets done |
Tenris Anis
Schattenengel Clan
4
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Posted - 2011.12.28 02:49:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:By upgrading the freighter hull (as you do with other T2 ships), this ship comes with four modules that can not be replaced or removed. It can target four other ships and take on their damage. Those other ships will take 25% of damage after the damage has been through their own resistance. It can not use these modules on any ship that is using remote repairers on it. So for a simply example, my Cyclone has 70% omni tank. A volley of 1000 damage hits me. That is cut to 300 damage by my resists. That 300 damage goes on the tank and I only take 75 points of damage. Now there is 300 + 75 points of damage done to our fleet. However, four of those ships are really difficult to alpha kill, while the logistics, can focus on repairing the tanks. Obvious limitations. Freighter is
- easy to web
- very slow
- can not be made to fly faster without using warp to points
- easy to scramble.
- expensive
- module distance limitations
Edit: This ship has no cargo space, the extra damage absorbing pieces and technology running the modules takes up all the space.
Would it not be far more easy to give indi ships a shield link module which connects their shield with each other to increase their ehp and encourage large groups of them working together and make fleet protection for them viable? |
De'Veldrin
Element 27
Intrepid Crossing
132
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Posted - 2011.12.28 15:48:00 -
[14] - Quote
Tenris Anis wrote:Would it not be far more easy to give indi ships a shield link module which connects their shield with each other to increase their ehp and encourage large groups of them working together and make fleet protection for them viable?
It would certainly seem a lot less like magic that way.
No thank you. This is one of those ideas that you can't even justify via LOL-RP.
I mean how do you reconcile the following sequence of events:
1. I shoot Bob in the face and the bullet lodges somewhere behind his left eye.
2. Tom dies from my bullet.
It just doesn't make sense, especially for armor and hull damage.
You could, in theory, have a shield extension module that would cause your shields to overlap those of other ships in your fleet with the same module active that are within a certain distance of you, causing all ships to take an equal amount of damage based on the average resists of the group. So you would effectively be raising the EHP of the group without needing to resort to "Wizards did it!" to explain why it works.
It's still a bad idea, but at least this way it's not ridiculous.
Unsub or don't.-á I don't care what your reasons are, and neither does anyone else.-á Just click the button and go away - or don't. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
297
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Posted - 2011.12.28 15:55:00 -
[15] - Quote
tankus2 - title changed and your post is on the first page, so if a developer reads this thread, I am sure they will see your input. For now, leaving it as is as sometimes the evolution of the idea and why it gets to a certain point can be important.
As for, "hurting yourself," I don't know why people bother to make idea thread. They get flamed, trolled, turned into personal attacks and often treated with hostility because the changes often threaten somewhere in someone's mind. So, these certainly are not for myself.
Tenris Anis wrote:...
Would it not be far more easy to give indi ships a shield link module which connects their shield with each other to increase their ehp and encourage large groups of them working together and make fleet protection for them viable?
Interesting idea but two things; won't that make a bigger juicier target with much more loot that still can't defend itself and why do you think this is for industrials only?
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
308
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Posted - 2011.12.29 04:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote:... without needing to resort to "Wizards did it!" to explain why it works.
... but at least this way it's not ridiculous.
I nearly missed your post. 
Anyway, the distances are huge in space, while we and our ships are minute. Additionally, energy rapidly dissipates. Lasers for example are all down to the wizard. Hitting things with projectiles, again down to the wizard (it takes years of planning, programming computing and such, just to make an impact on a comet that is flying in a predictable orbit, not actually trying to avoid being hit.) The wizard stops our ships, we don't have reverse thrusters, there next to nothing to create friction and stop our ships the way they do. The wizard brings us all sorts of sounds. The only things you would hear are your guns firing through the vibrations in your ship and the air inside it and the impacts on your ship, none of the sounds of hitting them or them firing.
By the way, smart missiles that can direct themselves, like miniature space craft are the only real way to deliver a destructive pay load.
Oh, don't forget that the energy of your shields would dissipate and how on earth do you explain those vamps?
The wizard runs down the corridors, hair a mess, he is full of drugs and screaming out words to only songs he can hear. 
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
GavinCapacitor
CaeIum Incognitum
20
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Posted - 2011.12.29 15:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
I had a nice post detailing how awful everything you posted was, but the forums ate it. So here is the condensed version.
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Hitting things with projectiles, again down to the wizard (it takes years of planning, programming computing and such, just to make an impact on a comet that is flying in a predictable orbit, not actually trying to avoid being hit.)
That comet we hit (in the present) was moving at 28,611 or so m/s. That is much faster than any ship in eve, not to mention eve is set in the far future. NASA also didn't have several hundred TeraFlops of power at their disposal in 2005 (like every ship in eve does).
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
By the way, smart missiles that can direct themselves, like miniature space craft are the only real way to deliver a destructive pay load.
You say this as if you are either a.) are an authority on this or b.) have an authoritative source. Spoilers: there is no one on earth that is, because we have yet to have any sort of space based conflict. Feel free to post that alien document on space weapons, it could make eve better!
More on topic: This supposed ship of yours has no way to repair damage, yet it is supposed to take damage for other ships. On top of nigh removing suicide ganking from asteroid belts, actually flying a freighter into a large scale battle? Can you say 'free kills' ?
tl;dr; Idea is awful, you are bad, stop making the forums worse thanks. |
De'Veldrin
Element 27
Intrepid Crossing
366
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Posted - 2011.12.29 19:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
I think you missed the point behind my "Wizards did it" comment.
The items you mention - lazers disappating over distance, tracking targets accurately, are all problems with either physics or engineering. None of them requires us to suspend belief to the point your proposal does.
Just think about what you're asking:
If I shoot a ship and it takes armor damage, that damage is transferred to another ship.
How does that work exactly? Does my bullet just decide to change course mid flight and fire on the wrong ship? And your proposal is even more unfathomable because the damage is somehow split between the two ships. I mean, forget for a minute that it would be wierd for a bullet to hit two targets, how exactly do you get a missile to explode at two places at the same time?
What you're asking for isn't just a simplification of physics or "advanced tech" to facilitate game play. You're asking for something straight out of magic the gathering.
Unsub or don't.-á I don't care what your reasons are, and neither does anyone else.-á Just click the button and go away - or don't. |
Twylla
Blue.Shift
8
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Posted - 2011.12.29 19:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
interesting concept, i'd evolve it a bit.
A ship designed around the use of a module that is almost entirely devoted to shield tanking its companions.. only instead of a remote shield repair module, it provided a 500%+ bonus to shield capacity to 'linked' allies. A penalty to shield regen rates would stop ships from becoming virtually invincible (this isn't to enable massive passive tanking)
The idea is a means to counteract alpha-kill in fleet warfare, if i'm not mistaken.
A different effect was introduced in another game, where it actually capped single-hit damage to a maximum of 10% of the defenders' HP. A similar effect based on EHP would prevent someone from instapopping with less than ~10 people firing.
Carebear: Passive-agressive industralist; Prey.
Gunrunner:-áIndustrialist with a lot of big guns, keeps big friends supplied with big guns, and doesn't take sh*t from anybody. |
Epofhis
StarFckers Inc.
The Jagged Alliance
12
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Posted - 2011.12.29 20:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Yeah, so you've got a T2 freighter and a bunch of piddly little ****. Why bother shooting anything but the freighter?
And if you think freighters (even T2 ones) don't drop like a sack of **** then boy, have I got news for you.
Another thread in which macguffin ships focus their entire existance on mitigating a niche tactic.
-1. Not supported.
Before posting in Features and Ideas, please remember that Eve is in no way obligated to change based on your stupidity, ineptitude, or well honed sense of personal butthurt. |
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Mars Theran
EVE Rogues
EVE Rogues Alliance
14
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Posted - 2011.12.30 07:42:00 -
[21] - Quote
What I can't figure out is how the freighter is going to sink the damage. Why don't you just use a Cap ship with remote rep's? |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
199
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Posted - 2012.01.01 13:42:00 -
[22] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Supported. This will make tards and wannabes that shoot hulks while under concord protection go to lowsec where I can shoot them.
CONCORD is there to punish, not protect.
Which means that you can come to hisec and shoot them too, you just have to be prepared to face CONCORD's retribution for doing so.
There is nothing, however, preventing you from doing so in the first place.
Action <--> consequence.
I are kyute kitten!
I are in ur mishun!
Redoosin' teh lag by ninja'ing ur wrekz!
(CCP: Make wrecks probable, and after 30min., tractorable.) |
Jenshae Chiroptera
398
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Posted - 2012.01.03 14:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote:...
If I shoot a ship and it takes armor damage, that damage is transferred to another ship.
How does that work exactly? Does my bullet just decide to change course mid flight and fire on the wrong ship? ...
Off the top of my head, robots, rip some armour off the freighter, transfer it across to the other ship and use that to patch some of the damage.
Ideas and stuff
EVE - the game of sand castles, either building them or kicking them down. |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
203
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Posted - 2012.01.04 17:41:00 -
[24] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:De'Veldrin wrote:...
If I shoot a ship and it takes armor damage, that damage is transferred to another ship.
How does that work exactly? Does my bullet just decide to change course mid flight and fire on the wrong ship? ... Off the top of my head, robots, rip some armour off the freighter, transfer it across to the other ship and use that to patch some of the damage.
No. Just, no.
I are kyute kitten!
I are in ur mishun!
Redoosin' teh lag by ninja'ing ur wrekz!
(CCP: Make wrecks probable, and after 30min., tractorable.) |
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