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Taoist Dragon
Sh1t Happens. And then you die.
920
   |
Posted - 2014.03.21 23:53:00 -
[1] - Quote
Well I'm wondering if it's time for me to start solo'ing in cruisers.
I like the frigs. They are fast, versitile and have a surprisingly decent engagement envelope (depending on wether you are hunting other pvp'er or pve'ers)
But I'm thinking that maybe cruisers might have a bigger engagement profile than frigs but with the loss of mobility.
So I'm asking you the W&T community for hints and tips for moving from frig to cruiser combat. All this will probably be 'true solo' i.e. no booster/scout alts etc as I can't be arse to dual box an stuff.
I have flown cruisers a few times since the rebalances but they were mainly in a cruiser fleet that had a good FC. The only other time of note was when out solo'ing in a stabber I chased off a SFI in a plex then had a fight with 2 Vaga's in another plex and almost killed 1 before his buddy came in and saved him. So I'm thinking that flying like that is the way to go but I'm very interested in any words of wisdom you cruiser jocks may be able to pass alone.
Cheers
Tao o7
Edit. Oh and in case you were wondering I have all racial cruiser skills to V, HAC and recons to 4 as well as all medium wepoan specialisations to 4 so I can fly pretty much all of the combat cruisers and BC for that matter but BC are not solo viable imo.
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Greggles Midboss
The Church of Awesome
Caldari State Capturing
32
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 01:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
Welcome to the dark side muahaha.
You know me ill always jump in a cruiser when I can.
My biggest thing when flying cruisers solo (No booster to scout) is not so much roaming as is setting up in a pocket of a few systems. I find most of my deaths in slower cruisers are jumping through into a gatecamp.
Also one thing I miss from having a good sec status is fights on gates.
Hang about on a gate and look like you are hesitating. E.g dont lock up straight away and drop drones all confident. Because a lot of people in cruisers think they can dunk someone else while tanking gate guns. So even if they do jump a friend in on you gate guns are on your side.
Writing this almost makes me want to go pay for the concord tags.
The other bit of advice I will have is in the FW areas which I assume you will still be in is always fly a cruiser that can track frigs. There is nothing more frustrating than flying a cruiser with no web and having a crow orbit you for 10 mins killing you slowly haha. The only downside to the dual prop SFI with 220's. AB frigs can be a hassle. |
Baron' Soontir Fel
Justified Chaos
136
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 04:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yea just buy a couple and start flying them around. Just remember the weaknesses of the cruiser class and that you can lose to a linked condor/interceptor just as easily as you did in a frigate. |
Starbuck05
Evil Monkey Asylum
Evil Monkeys Asylum
161
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 09:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
I pretty much gave up on cruiser solo roaming ... i dunno maybe im just not good at it ( surely ! ) ..but , i found out that when im roaming solo , hunting , the frigates obviously run away and the only other cruisers i come againts are vexors , and i dunno about the rest of you but when i see a vexor i just freak out , to me that ship is simply to strong to engage in a 1v1 .
And if i try to sit in a plex and w8 out for a fight .. then sure as hell i get blobed cause who wouldnt want a cruiser to ***** on ?
So ye .. maybe im doin it wrong , but one things for sure , you limit yourself from fights up to a point where your that good to take on 4-5 frigs at once and kill 3 of them before you die ... or don't die at all :)
I wish i could give you more information , but its been a good while since i last solo'd in cruisers , wish you good luck though
-á- I am the commanding officer , u should adress me as sir !
-á- But if i call u sir , what would i call your wife then ?? |
Zappity
Stay Frosty.
858
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 10:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'm very interested in this too. But the last solo Vexor I came across died to my frigate - I think they are more of a threat than other cruisers. Even more so after the warp speed changes I'd think.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec. |
Mizhir
Euphoria Released
Triumvirate.
60259
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 13:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cruisers are very fun to fly and are also a great choice for beginning solo pvp. Since you already got experiance with frigs, it should be rather easy for you, but there are a few things you have to bear in mind. First of all, you are alot move vulnerable to gatecamps and blobs. Your GTFO ability is alot smaller so there will be days where everything goes wrong and you die alot.
The fights will be different than frigfights. Unlike frigates where you rarely fight against more than 2 targets, then you can easily end up fighting many smaller targets while flying a cruiser. So good target calling is an important ability to have.
Also, since frigates are very common, you should have some sort of plan on how to deal with them, unless you know what you are doing and intend to avoid them. A flight of warriors is a great tool to deal with frigates, but against good frigate pilots you will lose them unless you manage them well. Neuts are also great to have, but sadly alot of t1 cruisers lost their utility high. If you don't already know how to use your piloting to lower transversal then it is a great idea to look it up and pratice. It can be a huge help to deal with frigs that got an orbit. And lastly, there is the webbing trick. If a frigate is orbiting you tight and you have problems tracking him, you can cycle your web on and off. Since the ingame flight computer is ****, it will cause the frig to change direction each time the speed changes which cause it to drop speed for a bit when turning. With abit of luck you can get some really good hits despite normally have problems tracking it. Just remember that this doesn't work against someone who is manually piloting.
Getting fights in FW space in a cruiser can sometimes be a PITA. Alot of the fighting will happen in small plexes where you obviously can't go. But sometimes it can be worth it to warp to the gate and see if there is targets outside. But yeah, you might not get as many fights as you would in a frigate (atleast I have not figured out to get alot of fights) but I do feel that the fights are alot better when you get some good ones.
Baron' Soontir Fel wrote:Yea just buy a couple and start flying them around. Just remember the weaknesses of the cruiser class and that you can lose to a linked condor/interceptor just as easily as you did in a frigate.
A little trick is to carry a mobile depot in cargo + a few warp stabs. While I normally hate the use of lame tactics, I do feel that they do not deserve to kill my cruiser. So toss down the depot. Wait 1 minute then refit warpstabs, scoop depot and warp out.
One Man Crew - Collective solo pvp |
God's Apples
Aunenen Civil Liberties Union
351
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 14:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
Honestly soloing in t1 cruisers is a pretty bad idea with the exception of maybe a shield omen or stabber if doing 100 dps is your thing. Vanilla t1 cruisers are really awful at killing inties and most kiting frigs in general. The depot trick works (more people say they do it on the forum than they do it in reality), but if it's tackle for a gang you're pretty much screwed. Better to jump straight to navy cruisers like the nomen, nano naug, elite 100mn LML scyfi, etc that are capable of dealing with frigates well.
Really when you're soloing in a cruiser especially without links it's a good idea not to brawl because it leads to a lot of whining and complaining about being blobbed.
Most importantly, unlike frigates, kiting cruisers gain massively from working in a duo. As a pair you not only have twice the damage, but you can peel for each other when tackle is chasing, use fits that aren't viable for solo (such as heavy damage dealers but awful at killing frigs like HAM caracal or rail thorax while your friend uses something that excels at killing frigs like an omen), and apply damage easier while your partner draws all the aggro and ewar.
Oh yes, and t1 cruisers are expensive enough to justify carrying standard drugs around. In active tanked ones exile and blue pill are a must and drop is a 25% tracking increase for turrets and crash for missiles.
tl;dr: solo cruisers have to be picked and fit with killing frigs in mind and lead to a lot of frustration, duo cruisers that work with synergy are some of the most fun in eve. |
Taoist Dragon
Sh1t Happens. And then you die.
922
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 22:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
Yeah all of the point above about the 'issues' soloing in cruiser are pretty much the reason I don't do it very often.
Well I decided to take a stabber out (the same fit as I mentioned in OP) for a wander around. Flew around most of the great wildlands, man that place is bloody empty apart from a small area near the couple of stations in the whole region, Needs more stations imo.
One thing of note for my roam around GW was a bubble camp I ran into near one of the exit systems. It was about 9 people but the ships that caught my eye were 2 vaga's and a cynabal. Not sure about inty's or other tackle (probably should have checked those first  ). I held cloak and checked my location and possible warp out destinations. Luckily I was close to an edge that was off at an odd angle from the camp, problem was though it was also about 90 deg off from the nearest warp out so I had to make a much ground up as possible before trying to warp.
So the plan was simply to OH my MWD (this puts my speed at about 3.5km/s) and hope they were bored and not paying attention. I select and off angle and double click in space. I immediately OH the mwd and shoot off!. I was quickly pointed and I thought that was the end of it but the point dropped and I was gaining distance! after a few seconds I turned to a random warpout and spammed the warp button completely expecting to be pointed at any moment and popped! When I heard Aura's lovely voice announce warp I let out a big sigh and started to think about my exit.
So that was a bit of fun, not from a kill pov, but it definitely got the heart racing a little. After that I just went and roamed low sec hoping to find a decent fight as it turned out I found a procuror mining in an ice belt who wouldn't pay a ransom so I blew him up and a cormorant ratting who also got blown up.
All in all a success from the pov that I got some excitement, a couple of kills and I still have my ship. Does this make me a confirmed cruiser pilot........probably not but I'll be flying them a bit more from now on I think.
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Plato Forko
Of Questionable Lineage
48
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 22:59:00 -
[9] - Quote
It's fun as **** to tank the hell out of a cheap T1 cruiser and go bombing into frig gangs. Kiting cruisers in a Stabber didn't work for me but I might try it again just because it's a surprisingly resilient ship.
My terribad blog where I QQ and rage about Amarr FW |
Mizhir
Euphoria Released
Triumvirate.
60260
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 23:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
You should try the AAR stabber. It's awesome :D
The fit below takes a 3% implant (2% if you got perfect rigging skills):
[Stabber, Nano AAR 2Gyro]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Damage Control II
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Warp Disruptor II
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Projectile Ambit Extension I
Medium Projectile Ambit Extension I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Warrior II x5
For nullsec there is:
[Stabber, Nano AAR Null]
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Damage Control II
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Warp Disruptor II
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Projectile Ambit Extension I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Warrior II x5
One Man Crew - Collective solo pvp |
Taoist Dragon
Sh1t Happens. And then you die.
922
|
Posted - 2014.03.22 23:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Yeah I like the stabber but thats probably because it really just a supersized frig! Hell I can get an AB fit stabber to fly faster and more agile than an AF!
Anyways I might give those a shot and see how I go. I also like the omen as well that is a nice ship.
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Bouh Revetoile
TIPIAKS
552
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 14:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
Taoist Dragon wrote:Yeah I like the stabber but thats probably because it really just a supersized frig! Hell I can get an AB fit stabber to fly faster and more agile than an AF!
Anyways I might give those a shot and see how I go. I also like the omen as well that is a nice ship. I always said the Stabber is a frigate version of the Attack BC : a frigate with oversized weapons ; the difference is that it also have an oversized tank. :D |
Chessur
Amarrian Nublet
Team Amarrica
319
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 21:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
Cruisers were the staple of the meta not too long ago. However, post rlm nerd and with the proliferation of EAF and into blobs, cruisers are struggling in the current pvp meta. Now don't get me wrong- you have some very nice choices when it comes to cruisers but you need to be very careful when flying them solo or in a small gang that is lacking anti-support. Best cruisers as of now:
Nomen
Osprey navy
Omen
Aug navy
CNI is workable but still kind of iffy
Rail thorax / Deimos
Aha and that's about it
Arty vaga / cynabal are ok I guess, but I feel that other cruisers can do the job better.
Anything not listed, is just really **** poor during this frig heavy meta. You can thank rise for the regarded EAF bonuses, warp speed changeds and removal of RLM for the current condition of the pvp landscape. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
924
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 22:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cheers Chessur mate, I was hoping you'd see this topic as you are one of the guy I know uses cruisers a lot.
What are your thoughts on stabber/Fleet stabber and fleet scythe ? They have the speed and arties can put out a decent punch. Are they too easily beaten by the frig hoards?
One thing I like is flying something a bit harder than normal e.g. I flew punishers when everyone flew rifters. I fly rifters now as the general populus think they are crap so I'm ok with flying cruisers in a frig dominated meta  call me crazy or whatever 
And any thoughts you have as I'll be doing this pretty much solo and definitely un-linked.
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
2319
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 03:39:00 -
[15] - Quote
I am a huge fan of the Vexor solo.
It's all fun and games until an Interceptor ruins your day. And then, it's hilarious.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=318489 - Proposal for a new type of tech 2 Destroyer
If you want to mine in highsec, read www.minerbumping.com. |
Greggles Midboss
The Church of Awesome
Caldari State Capturing
37
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 03:47:00 -
[16] - Quote
Yeah the Dual Web Gank Vexor is fun and also the Active rep vexor. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
926
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 04:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Despite their obvious abilities I have never been a big fan of gallente ships other than the incursus. Not 100% sure but there is just something about them that bothers me.
Minmatar, Amarr and a close 3rd caldari. TBH I don't even know why I trained gallente stuff other than frigs. 
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile.
Imperial Outlaws.
1598
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 04:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Dat damage taken....
And
They just keep coming....
I killed four of eight in the last fight. Not very practical but fun for the occasional wtf. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
926
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 04:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
Links don't come up for me. Says no kill id specified 
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile.
Imperial Outlaws.
1598
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 04:58:00 -
[20] - Quote
Humph. Battleclinic Version
The second one doesn't come up on battleclinic. You can find it in my February losses if you so desire. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
927
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 05:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
Zarnak Wulf wrote:Humph. Battleclinic VersionThe second one doesn't come up on battleclinic. You can find it in my February losses if you so desire.
Cheers mate. I have that fit already saved in my database for use of later. Do you think you would have faired better in you had a neut instead of the Hvy Ass missile v that gang of frigs?
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile.
Imperial Outlaws.
1598
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 08:32:00 -
[22] - Quote
Cap won't handle a neut and two reppers. You also need all the DPS you can get in that configuration. The fight started 4 v 1. I killed 4.  . I shot the sheriff but I did not shoot the deputy. |
Chessur
Amarrian Nublet
Team Amarrica
320
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 14:40:00 -
[23] - Quote
Taoist Dragon wrote:Cheers Chessur mate, I was hoping you'd see this topic as you are one of the guy I know uses cruisers a lot. What are your thoughts on stabber/Fleet stabber and fleet scythe ? They have the speed and arties can put out a decent punch. Are they too easily beaten by the frig hoards? One thing I like is flying something a bit harder than normal e.g. I flew punishers when everyone flew rifters. I fly rifters now as the general populus think they are crap so I'm ok with flying cruisers in a frig dominated meta call me crazy or whatever And any thoughts you have as I'll be doing this pretty much solo and definitely un-linked.
The stabber and the fleet stabber are both horrible ships for solo. I will never and have never flown them. Both ships are using a horrible weapon system and frankly can't kite worth a damn.
The scythe fleet, used to be amazing and I flew it extensively. However the RLM nerf happened and I have not really liked the ship afterwards. Like the stabber / fleet stabber it uses auto cannons, however it doesn't have any projection or tracking bonus so really As a ugh ship it's a complete waste. HMLs and HAMs are both complete **** unless the ship using them has an innate velocity / application bonus. Since the scythe fleet also doesn't have that- those two weapon systems are no go. The other option I tried was an lml version. I hated it. Even though I could make silly 100mn + 10mn prop fits, it just had not dpi- but some nice utility though.
If I had to pick a cruiser that is unlinked for solo... Honestly I have no idea. As it stands now, any cruisers going to die to a handful of intys and you are not going to be able to do much about it. Throw in an EAF and you are truly ******. Missile ships are clearly superior for the current high speed into meta, so if I was forced to choose something it would probably be a HAM sprey or HAM CNI. With out links, I would stay away from turret ships because you are not going to have the speed + overheated WMD too burn out and push down transversal and blap frigs. Obviously if you are flying with any missiles, have standard or strong crash with you at all times. It's a life saver.
Best ship for solo / small gang ATM is the heretic- hands down. |
Zappity
Stay Frosty.
865
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 18:14:00 -
[24] - Quote
Heretic for null, yeah? I ran into one in low the other day and it died to my Comet like an expensive Coercer.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec. |
Liam Inkuras
Aunenen Civil Liberties Union
904
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 18:37:00 -
[25] - Quote
Zappity wrote:Heretic for null, yeah? I ran into one in low the other day and it died to my Comet like an expensive Coercer.
A properly fit LML Heretic could finish a Comet, or any T1/Faction frig for that matter, before it gets into scram range.
I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone |
Zappity
Stay Frosty.
865
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 20:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
Liam Inkuras wrote:Zappity wrote:Heretic for null, yeah? I ran into one in low the other day and it died to my Comet like an expensive Coercer. A properly fit LML Heretic could finish a Comet, or any T1/Faction frig for that matter, before it gets into scram range.
Maybe he just failed badly.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
927
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 20:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
Cheers for your thoughts on the stabber and fleet stabber Chessur.
It is still the only cruiser to get on my top 15 most used ships on my KB. Interestingly enough though I did a bit of digging and while the numbers are not high I do not have a single loss of a stabber to a frig/gang of frigs. All my stabber losses have involved cruisers or above often way outclassed by HACs, BC or pirate cruisers.
I think I'll probably still use it for a while unless it proves to be completely useless (Then I'll probably end up flying it even more  )
I have also been doing some Fitter warrior'ing with the Fleet scythe and tbh it doesn't look to bad. I can get to just under 3km/s cold with a 4.7s align time (faster & more agile than AF) it also puts out over 400 dps with arties cold, only has about 17k ehp though but tanks over 200dps with booster running and is cap stable with a small cap booster.
While this is pure fitter warrior these figures would indicate that it it at least feasible to use this in combat as I've success with ships that have way less in the stat department. vOv worth a shot anyways.
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
War Toys Inc
35
|
Posted - 2014.03.24 23:33:00 -
[28] - Quote
In my opinion the most versatile (by this I mean largest engagement profile) is the Navy Omen Issue. Simply because it's fast, the fact you can change the range of what you can hit out to. It can also be fit out with an active armor tank (I've always preferred active tanking over buffer when soloing).
With the current meta of every 3rd pilot flying Crows and Maledictions atm, I think the Nomen can stand up to this the best whilst being able to manage a wider variety of targets at the same time. Also, Falcon alts are still out there and I've always said the counter to ECM is speed or Alpha. So from a soloist perspective, I prefer the speed.
There is a reason why Kovorix pretty much flies the Nomen exclusively. Have a look at the variety of targets he is able to engage.
Yes, I am also currently training to get into this beast........ problem is I'm about 1 month away from being able to fly it "effectively." In my opinion, I think projectile turrets are lacking in terms of damage projection (maybe it's just because of the recent Intie buff and the fact I also get around PvP'ing in Frigates mostly, so it's probably a biased opinion).
One thing I do know though is, if I have as many problems with Crows/Maleds in my Nomen as I currently do when flying in a Frigate, I swear I'm going to throw my PC out the window! lol.
I don't want to say it just yet, but I'm starting to "think" Crows and Maledictions are quiet literally broken atm. But before I say that with 100% confidence, I want to try out the Nomen first. |
Taoist Dragon
Sucker Punch.
927
|
Posted - 2014.03.25 00:18:00 -
[29] - Quote
It must be my TZ or something because I haven't seen the proliferation of inties roaming around that is being suggested
That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything.
http://taoistdragon.blogspot.com.au/ |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
War Toys Inc
35
|
Posted - 2014.03.25 01:01:00 -
[30] - Quote
Taoist Dragon wrote:It must be my TZ or something because I haven't seen the proliferation of inties roaming around that is being suggested
Do you roam around in Null Sec often?
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