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D'go Jahn
Bearded BattleBears
Brave Collective
11
   |
Posted - 2014.08.09 18:58:00 -
[61] - Quote
Sir Dangler wrote:... Risk vs reward!
What do you think?
I think posting this on the EvE Forums was a mistake bud. The minority of the player-base that visits this portal have long sense run off any opposing viewpoints. Most threads that get positive attention here contain prohibitive amounts of self-affirming pablum. In short, most of the people viewing this thread already know what's best for EvE and have no intention of entertaining other viewpoints.
Pertaining to your suggestion, the larger sec status penalty doesn't effectively inhibit the practice of suicide ganking. As has been stated previously, -10 is a goal for many players, also making it so easily achieved cheapens it for the portion of the player-base that sees it as a badge of piracy. Aside from that, navigating HiSec with -10 is easy.
I agree with your intention, in that Suicide Ganking doesn't track with the rest of EvE as it pertains to Risk vs Reward. The risks taken when ganking are marginal and easily mitigated.
Let's be clear, the question is NOT "How do we make Hi Security space safer?"
The question is "How do we balance the risk for an activity that can easily pay out better than almost any other solo or small group activity in EvE?" This is not easily answered, because the content in an activity like Suicide Ganking is somewhat random and takes preparation and marginal skill to really pay out on a regular basis.
Side note: It would be fun if haulers could place "phantom" items in their cargo that really weren't worth anything, but looked exactly like X module/ship/item when ship scanned. In the spirit of that idea, maybe the answer is in giving the haulers some form of counter-play to make it more interesting from a PvP standpoint. |
Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
297
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Posted - 2014.08.09 19:04:00 -
[62] - Quote
D'go Jahn wrote:
Side note: It would be fun if haulers could place "phantom" items in their cargo that really weren't worth anything, but looked exactly like X module/ship/item when ship scanned. In the spirit of that idea, maybe the answer is in giving the haulers some form of counter-play to make it more interesting from a PvP standpoint.
Like that idea actually. it sometimes happens due to server issues. I was traveling once with a load of a few hundred mil and due to some market issues the estimated values was over 12 bil .. that made me nervous traveling -¦-¦.
the same happens the other way around now with the wheels from the ghost sites. few hundred mil, value = 0. Should not be too difficult to simulate.
Otherwise, when I saw the topic pop up as 1st again, my first thought was 'Suicide gank' and 'Fix' int he same sentence - isn't that an oxymoron ?!
Are you sure your issues aren't elsewhere ?! |
Paranoid Loyd
1270
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Posted - 2014.08.09 19:06:00 -
[63] - Quote
D'go Jahn wrote:
The question is "How do we balance the risk for an activity that can easily pay out better than almost any other solo or small group activity in EvE?"
This is balanced by the fact that the "victim" chooses what to fly and what they are carrying. They make that choice not the gankers if everyone chose wisely there would be no gankers (operating for profit).
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
D'go Jahn
Bearded BattleBears
Brave Collective
11
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Posted - 2014.08.09 20:16:00 -
[64] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote: ... the "victim" chooses what to fly and what they are carrying....
You have a point.
It is true that this can produce greater balance regarding potential rewards, but it still doesn't address the consistent lack of risk for the ganker(s).
Coming at the issue from the angle that the act of ganking should be prohibitive in some way is a slippery slope, but making higher rewards require greater skill (sp and prowess) and organization lines up with the rest of EvE (or at least the mission statement).
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Paranoid Loyd
1273
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Posted - 2014.08.09 20:35:00 -
[65] - Quote
D'go Jahn wrote:but it still doesn't address the consistent lack of risk for the ganker(s).
I would prefer that you had some ganks on your KB before you stated this.
Like everything in eve, once you understand the mechanics and you have practiced to the point that you know what you can and can't do it is easily perceived as "easy" or "no risk"
D'go Jahn wrote:Making higher rewards require greater skill (sp and prowess) and organization lines up with the rest of EvE (or at least the mission statement).
It is already like this, give it a try and you will see.
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
8647
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Posted - 2014.08.09 20:57:00 -
[66] - Quote
D'go Jahn wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote: ... the "victim" chooses what to fly and what they are carrying.... You have a point. It is true that this can produce greater balance regarding potential rewards, but it still doesn't address the consistent lack of risk for the ganker(s). Coming at the issue from the angle that the act of ganking should be prohibitive in some way is a slippery slope, but making higher rewards require greater skill (sp and prowess) and organization lines up with the rest of EvE (or at least the mission statement).
Ganking for profit is a 100% reactionary activity.
It's like gatecamping in that way, your success is determined entirely by the stupidity of other people. If I'm gatecamping in Rancer and some ****** flying a blinged out battleship jumps in, that does NOT mean that gatecamping is too profitable.
It just means that some people are stupid.
Ditto with ganking. Ganking has very little inherent profitability, just like gatecamping. It is the actions of other people that can make it profitable.
This combines with the fact that major requirements for ganking is organizational skill rather than just more skillpoints.
Tl;DR: The rewards for ganking, since they are completely determined by the "victim" and the loot fairy, are appropriate as is.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
3463
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Posted - 2014.08.09 21:11:00 -
[67] - Quote
I didn't read the OP or the rest of the thread but
Doomheim
Sweet, it was for the best
Oh god. |
Kaerakh
Surprisingly Deep Hole
Try Rerolling
410
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Posted - 2014.08.09 21:18:00 -
[68] - Quote
Kaerakh wrote:See Page 22 Section 7-7.2My general thoughts on Carebears trying to create game mechanics to protect them from the mean evil gankers. 1 - 2
Schrodinger's Hot Dropper - The Fate of Forum Alts - Click me! Click me! |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
1739
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 23:39:00 -
[69] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:DHuncan wrote:Markus45 wrote:
High-sec vaginas.
This is the point. The fact that high sec residents are vaginas is the point? We agree then. Am I a vagina if I live in highsec but don't play the victim card?
Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance)
"What if [climate change is] a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?" -comic on Greenmonk |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
8656
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Posted - 2014.08.09 23:49:00 -
[70] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
We agree then.
Am I a vagina if I live in highsec but don't play the victim card?[/quote]
Must... not... link... Team ... America...
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
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Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
1743
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Posted - 2014.08.10 00:54:00 -
[71] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Must... not... link... Team ... America...
link away!
Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance)
"What if [climate change is] a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?" -comic on Greenmonk |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
5843
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Posted - 2014.08.10 01:15:00 -
[72] - Quote
Gaiz!!! Gaiz!!! Dis tread be necromancy!!! Iz frum April!!!
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?" |
Vilma Banks
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.08.16 00:41:00 -
[73] - Quote
CCP should rethink the entire suicide-gank punishment system, and use a new one based on the delta between victim's ship+cargo values minus criminal ship and module costs. If the criminals don't have enough isk in their banks, then take it from other characters on the account (multiple accounts of the same owner if one account isn't enough). And if that still doesn't make up for the difference, then take it out of their skill points on a percentile basis (if 25% short on isk, then take 25% of criminal SP). |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
2428
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Posted - 2014.08.16 01:13:00 -
[74] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Am I a vagina if I live in highsec but don't play the victim card?
I too am eagerly awaiting the answer to this extremely important question.
I'm completely serious. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
1758
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Posted - 2014.08.16 01:21:00 -
[75] - Quote
Vilma Banks wrote:moar punishment for juicier kills YES
Vilma Banks wrote:take ISK for ganks NO
Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance)
"What if [climate change is] a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?" -comic on Greenmonk |
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
2097
|
Posted - 2014.08.16 01:41:00 -
[76] - Quote
Kat-da Killa wrote:ISBox ganking in HS is game breaking. It's griefing, and it should be something CCP does not allow.
ISBox for PVE, whatever, not bad, and for PVP in Low/Null, is fine.
Ganking is game working as intended, but ISBox ganking fleets are something that need to be removed to balance the gameplay.
lol .ya CCP balance teh gaime!
The current problem with suicide ganking is all the multiboxers, bots, and AFKers with all their Skiffs.
~ Professional Forum Alt -á~ |
baltec1
Bat Country
Goonswarm Federation
12712
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Posted - 2014.08.16 04:36:00 -
[77] - Quote
Vilma Banks wrote:CCP should rethink the entire suicide-gank punishment system, and use a new one based on the delta between victim's ship+cargo values minus criminal ship and module costs. If the criminals don't have enough isk in their banks, then take it from other characters on the account (multiple accounts of the same owner if one account isn't enough). And if that still doesn't make up for the difference, then take it out of their skill points on a percentile basis (if 25% short on isk, then take 25% of criminal SP).
I want Concord to charge the "victim" the value of their ship and cargo in fines for services rendered.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
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